/ the god delusion

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Erik B - on 21 Dec 2008
holy moly, check this out! utterly stupendous!

http://www.flickr.com/photos/7491393@N03/sets/72157611038348289/

Wee Davie - on 21 Dec 2008
In reply to Erik B:

Saw that. It looks nails. What an effort. Surely worthy of News here?
Erik B - on 21 Dec 2008
In reply to Wee Davie: too right, a world class route and ascent by the looks of it
Alexander123 - on 21 Dec 2008
In reply to Erik B: insane!
French Erick - on 21 Dec 2008
In reply to Wee Davie:
How long were they on it?
I've been twice under that wall now and "holly molly" isn't quite strong enough to describe the sheer steepness of the thing.

Worthy of news- without the shadow of a doubt
real question is more do they want one of this mad reporting like what happened with "team america" (those boys were good BTW, no criticism of them)?
I think not as they seem more understated than your usual climber, including me.

That pair, as far as I am concerned ARE the future of winter climbing, or more likely: the future I would want (my type of ethics...).
Geoffrey Michaels on 21 Dec 2008 - host86-160-241-72.range86-160.btcentralplus.com
In reply to Erik B:

Saw that a few days ago and an amazing achievement. Route of the year so far I'd say.
biped - on 21 Dec 2008
In reply to Erik B:

Balls of steel, and vision to match. Feckin' awesome.

Chapeau!
Sonya Mc on 21 Dec 2008
In reply to Erik B: Pete Benson put a photo on here last week.

All I remember thinking is, 'kin hell that's steep!

http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=104022
Erik B - on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to Donald M: route of the century more like!!

Erick, those two are the present!
AlH - on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to Erik B: A route like that, on that crag, at this time of year. Wow. I have a new definition for commitment now. Al
Erik B - on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to AlH: indeed, looks like they where doing a lot of hard climbing in the dark
Tim Chappell - on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to Erik B:

I thought that this thread would be about an over-hyped and really rather silly book, but it appears to be about an under-hyped and extremely impressive climb

Well done guys :-)
Erik B - on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to Tim Chappell: i see its still not in the UKC news section
drunken monkey - on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to Erik B: Awesome.
Garbh Coire - on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to Erik B: Second that. That is very impressive.
Jim Fraser - on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to Erik B:

Superb piece of work.

Pity about the delusion. There would have to be a god if someone is going to follow the route never mind pull the moves.
Lobby Dosser - on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to Erik B:

Pretty f*ckin' cool!

What I dig about these guys is the way they underplay their achievement.

They climb a nails route, take some snaps and let the madness speak for itself!
Anonymous on 22 Dec 2008 - 82-69-53-65.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk
In reply to Erik B:

I'm not that impressed !

Yeah, dam hard and fine climb, but just a bit "What's the point", A bit of "Hard for hardness sake".

And no I'm not jealeaous one bit, I can't climb anywhere near that grade in Winter but then again I'm not interested in climbing above IV - V as I do now.



French Erick - on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to Erik B:
They are the present!

Aye,
didn't quite express myself well there (no change there then...)

They are, to my mind, what should inspire the hard winter climbers of the future.
Again, it is a question of opinion, but I think what they do epitomizes what adventurous climbing is about.

All ingredients are present: remoteness, length, difficulty...
BTW it does showpiece Scotland so well those pics on Flickr. Next time they went some shots to sell the country to tourists what about this starry night in the coires of Beinn Bhan?
Anonymous on 22 Dec 2008 - 82-69-53-65.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk
In reply to French Erick:

No showpiece in any of the pictures,just average really, infact two are blurred.

"Next time they went some shots to sell the country to tourists what about this starry night in the coires of Beinn Bhan? "

Are you having a laugh ?
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Taba - on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to Erik B:

Superb.

In reply to Anonymous:

Certainly not hardness for hardness sake, you would have more luck applying that phrase to hard sport climbing than wild new routes deep in the Scottish hills.

Stay anonymous mate.
Erik B - on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to Anonymous: whats the point? because they have clearly found a route up one of the fiercest and most improbable and finest winter cliffs in the UK, adventurous onsight groundup climbing at its best, all done in a single push with a lot of climbing done in the dark!
French Erick - on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to Anonymous:
> (In reply to French Erick)

> "Next time they went some shots to sell the country to tourists what about this starry night in the coires of Beinn Bhan? "
>
> Are you having a laugh ?

In all honesty, I am not. Would you rather have some more of that rubbish tat, with highland coos, nessie and two lads in a kilt tossing the cabber in between drams brought to them by two ginger lassies in plaits?

Scotland has something pretty unique in Western Europe, certainly in the UK anyway ... a feeling of remoteness, a beautiful little manned landscape.

To a Continental, what is Scottish winter about?
a) Just a dreary season to avoid... weather is already pish in summer so winter must be Horrendous.

Or b) that shot of Beinn Bhan. Yes the days are short: play the card of being so far North...

But we seem to disagree, so there's no point in arguing endlessly on a very ANONYMOUS website.
john howard 1 - on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to Erik B: Stunning photos, and an amazing route by the looks of it.
Anonymous on 22 Dec 2008 - 82-69-53-65.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk
In reply to Erik B:

So am I meant to be immpressed ?
French Erick - on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to Anonymous:
> (In reply to Erik B)
>
> So am I meant to be immpressed ?

What by, some people lack of vision? Erik's way of putting argument? Or yet another inspiring climb by one of best pair in Scottish winter climbing at the moment?

You are the one to answer these questions.
petestack - on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to French Erick:

DON'T FEED THE TROLL! ;-)
French Erick - on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to petestack:
Why?
It is quite fun... a bit like feeding one of them tamagoshi thingies. You know them gizmos dogs and cats.

Admittedly, cutter than a troll but...
Anonymous on 22 Dec 2008 - 82-69-53-65.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk
In reply to French Erick:

Funny, I express my view (which I'm perfectly entitled to do) then get jumped on by others who much prefer to insult me.

Ah well


petestack - on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to French Erick:

OK, you win. Let's feed the troll!

@Anonymous, 82-69-53-65.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk, you're spineless, bereft of vision, apparently in a minority of one, and probably not as anonymous as you think...

Now either get back under your bridge or give us some decent bait.

(Not the most impressive bit of troll-feeding ever, but it'll have to do for now!)
Anonymous on 22 Dec 2008 - 82-69-53-65.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk
In reply to petestack:

Calm down, as I said I only expressed an opinion, which I'm entitle to do, so why are you getting so up tight with me ?
French Erick - on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to Anonymous:

In a way, you are right, I've answered a bit rashly. However, I'm rather amused by the whole thing.

If one doesn't want to be judged, one is better not to express opinions.
I'm not saying that people shouldn't say what they think, but that they should be ready to take responsibility for what is said.
Now if the thread was called "another unimpressive ascent by..." I would have thought this was the place to go to express you opinion ANONYMOUS (or start the thread yourself).
Unless... and there is a point here, you are game to start some sort of cyber argument. Once started though, you cannot complain of the fact.
petestack - on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to Anonymous:
> (In reply to petestack)
>
> Calm down, as I said I only expressed an opinion, which I'm entitle to do, so why are you getting so up tight with me ?

Largely because you choose to post this anonymously. That's all. So of course you're entitled to express your opinion, but why not put your name (or regular username) to it so we know it's yours?

Anonymous on 22 Dec 2008 - 82-69-53-65.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk
In reply to French Erick:

"If one doesn't want to be judged, one is better not to express opinions."

I don't comment on here to be judged, its a forum not a "court room".

Def:
Forum: a medium in which the public may debate an issue or express opinions, e.g. a magazine, newspaper, internet etc.

I'll not post here again, seems like everyone just wants to say the same thing and agree with each other.

Enjoy your climbing

Alasdair Fulton - on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to Anonymous: Tell me Anon: What is the point in any climb?

It's all pretty pointless, is it not?
yer maw on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to Erik B: looked at the pictures first and it looks amazing, sustained, remote (for Scotland) adventurous, and big. It's the best example of traditional Scottish climbing at its' leading edge that I've seen in a while though what do I know as it is beyond my comprehension.

Holy moly though??? Have you been watching Bat Man and Robin recently?

Bet they're rubbish on dolerite though!
French Erick - on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to Anonymous:
> (In reply to French Erick)
> I'll not post here again, seems like everyone just wants to say the same thing and agree with each other.
>
> Enjoy your climbing

Wise decision it seems.

Anyway, I'll enjoy my climbing when I get to go and I sure hope that you do likewise.

Merry Christmas too (not sarcastically meant).
French Erick - on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to Alasdair Fulton:
You may have a point here :)

Now Pointless... that is a route that makes me think. I cannot decide whether or not I want to do it, which is unusual as most of the time I know right away.

Don't know anybody that's been on it either, and not very sure how often it comes in.

I know, the thread is being a bit diverted but...
yer maw on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to Anonymous: Everyone agrees about you as well. Don't post anonymous, as it's the sanctuary of cowards. Better to have faith in your opinions and be prepared to argue your position than simply say something then run away.
Slugain Howff - on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to Anonymous:
> (In reply to Erik B)
>
> So am I meant to be immpressed ?

If you had ever done any winter climbing at any grade you wouldn't have to ask this question.

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Sonya Mc on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to Anonymous: I find hard grades such as these impressive because I find grade IV and V difficult so something at gradeIX is awe inspiring to me. And it's not *just* the grade, but the route itself. And ok, the pictures themselves arn't of spectacular, amazing, proffessional quality but so what? How could one fail to think this looks amazing

http://www.flickr.com/photos/7491393@N03/3101651331/in/set-72157611038348289/

Or, how could you look at this, and forget the quality, but just how could you *not* think, 'what a beautiful place to be!'

http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=104024

And just imagine, you've climbed on this beautiful cliff, I'll bet with not another soul in sight, you've pushed yourself (and like someone said above, onsight) and you've topped out into the dark and the stars. Just imagine that feeling and tell me you can't think, 'wow!' :o(

What does inspire you?
Anonymous on 22 Dec 2008 - 82-69-53-65.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk
In reply to SonyaD:

Said I wasn't going to reply again,but here's two pics that I feel are inspiring

This one, end of a climb , what a top out this chap must have had
http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=103303

This one, true Scottish climbing conditions
http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=87093
French Erick - on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to Anonymous:

So ANONYMOUS... it's down to the old conditions debate.

Now, I will have to may state the obvious, but because you're ANONYMOUS I don't know if you've climbed loads, in lots of different places.

I'm always quite surprised by sandstone/ quartzite crags in winter. They tend to be really steep and because of that do not retain huge amounts of white when all around is full on winter.
Vegetation is frozen: tick one of winter definition (you can see that on the pics).
It should be easier with axes/ crampons combo. Tick three of winter definition (you would be hard pushed to have any sole sticking to that rock without spikes. Some moves your bares hands could do very uncomfortably but any flat bits will hold snow and therefore be insecure).

So I'm left with my tick two of winter definition: namely it should be white. Now I went to Beinn Bhan recently, possibly a few days before that ascent. Cliffs looked the same and here's a photo of higher up ground in which we were at times thigh to waist deep. It took us an age to get past this "easy ground" because of it

http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=103111

As far as I'm concerned tick two no problem. It is well white.
telemarker - on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to Erik B:

Excellent work, you have to love a scottish adventure.
sg - on 22 Dec 2008
In reply to SonyaD:

quite apart from the climb, which must be dead hard and is obviously an impressive line, those pics of beinn bhann by moonlight are something else. the deep, steeply scooped coires are fantastic anyway but with snow just down to the coire floor, perfectly picking out the terraces and all lit by the moon...
Alasdair Fulton - on 23 Dec 2008
In reply to French Erick: I know what you mean! There's a few routes like that: they terrify me and make me want to do them in equal proportions
Toby S - on 23 Dec 2008
In reply to French Erick:
> (In reply to Anonymous)
> [...]
>
> [...]
>
> In all honesty, I am not. Would you rather have some more of that rubbish tat, with highland coos, nessie and two lads in a kilt tossing the cabber in between drams brought to them by two ginger lassies in plaits?
>
> Scotland has something pretty unique in Western Europe, certainly in the UK anyway ... a feeling of remoteness, a beautiful little manned landscape.
>
> To a Continental, what is Scottish winter about?
> a) Just a dreary season to avoid... weather is already pish in summer so winter must be Horrendous.
>
> Or b) that shot of Beinn Bhan. Yes the days are short: play the card of being so far North...
>
> But we seem to disagree, so there's no point in arguing endlessly on a very ANONYMOUS website.


Those are very, very valid points. Images and stories of events like the 'God Delusion' is EXACTLY the kind of thing we should be shouting from the rafters. If you want to be clinical about it then this is the kind of story that we should be using to attract climbers to Scotland in winter. "look we've got big adventurous routes in some of the best scenery the UK has to offer"

From my point of view I think the route looks fantastic, the pictures don't have to be of a professional standard to tell a great story. It's not the kind of thing I'm ever likely to climb (I got the jitters walking into the base of the crags at Coire an Lochain a few weeks back ffs!) but it's still pretty inspirational.
Erik B - on 23 Dec 2008
In reply to Toby S: still isnt on UKC news section, unbelievable when you consider the utter garbage they regularly present as 'news'.. a world class ascent of a world class route happening in the UK and its not news worthy.. hmmmm
Ian Parnell - on 23 Dec 2008
In reply to Erik B: I believe Jack is doing a early season round up piece so I imagine he is just finishing off his fact checking with the climbers involved. Amazing route though, especially considering the time of year, the fact it needed a 1am start and that conditions only materialised when the pair reached the base of the route, superb.
In reply to Ian Parnell: Yes that's correct Ian, just working on a few other things.

Yes, Erik, it should be on the news page. Got a quote for me?

Jack

Alasdair Fulton - on 23 Dec 2008
In reply to Ian Parnell: Ian, what month's Climb is your epic story going to be in?

I don't normally buy it, but I will do for that!
Ian Parnell - on 23 Dec 2008
In reply to Alasdair Fulton: I think the next issue. It will only be a page with 3 pics in the news, plus theres an awesome pic of the FWA of Heidbanger in the news too. There should also be an article by Mick Fowler, and the stomping grounds piece is Pat Littlejohn in the Lleyn, so a bit of an adventure special.
Sonya Mc on 23 Dec 2008
In reply to sg:
> (In reply to SonyaD)
>
> quite apart from the climb, which must be dead hard and is obviously an impressive line, those pics of beinn bhann by moonlight are something else. the deep, steeply scooped coires are fantastic anyway but with snow just down to the coire floor, perfectly picking out the terraces and all lit by the moon...

Oh I agree with you 100%! I was just trying to discern what is was exactly that anon was finding fault with and was wondering whether it was the picture quality, or the route itself, and I think Erick was wondering if anon had a problem with conditions. I've come to the conclusion though that anon just lacks soul, imagination and a sense of adventure, after all his/her inspiration comes from the most crowded corrie in the whole of Scotland :oD
Geoffrey Michaels on 23 Dec 2008 - host86-158-122-68.range86-158.btcentralplus.com
In reply to Ian Parnell:

I am cancelling my subscription to Climb. Not cos its not good, it is, but because it covers little of what I am interested in. I dont really care about some 10 metre wee crag in Derbyshire but many do.

This is the route of the year and should be front page on Climb with a similar amount of coverage to that of some route in SW England climbed by James Macaffie (I think).
Erik B - on 23 Dec 2008
In reply to Jack Geldard - Editor - UKC: good stuff jack, despite the fact its got a rather excited piece of hyperbole by me in it!
Erik B - on 23 Dec 2008
In reply to Ian Parnell: by the way, im looking at that photo in Jack's piece and cant help but stare at the arete to the left of guy... is that the prominent arete forming the right wall of the top godfather corner I wonder? What a sensational line that would be!!

a route for you Ian?!
In reply to Erik B: Ha HA! Got you!

Looks amazing - great effort by these two, who are clearly at the top of their game.

I'll be trying to get more info about this for the winter round-up. Lots been going on, even down here in Wales!

Apparently that photographer guy - Ian somebody, has been up to a few things too.

Jack
GBriffett on 23 Dec 2008 - proxy1-int.be.jnj.com
In reply to Erik B:
Unbelievebaly impressive for so many reasons: the line, the length, the commitment, the location, the dark...I could go on...

What I'm almost as equally impressed with is the lack of spray and b**lshit. Not a sausage from these two on here, or any other forum, just a few (very, very good - I'm with Monsieur Erick 100% here) photos quietly put up on Pete's own flickr site.

I heard about this route a wee while ago and I'm still gobsmacked and amazed. Bluddy brilliant!
Erik B - on 23 Dec 2008
In reply to GBriff: even more remarkeable is that those two loons hold down fulltime jobs as well
mac fae stirling - on 23 Dec 2008
In reply to yer maw: seems to me if anonymous called himself/herself e.g. 'Bob', it really wouldnt make much odds. i actually agree with the sentiment [in as much that i understand him/her] of anonymous's OP. these sort of routes are so off the scale for the likes of me that i am left feeling a bit non-plussed by it all. other than a 'cor' look at that kind of vibe which passes almost instantly. a bit like watching jugglers, tumblers, trapeze arisits etc, its all very impressive but i am left feeling a bit detached from it.
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Vip1r on 23 Dec 2008 - host213-123-139-102.in-addr.btopenworld.com
In reply to Erik B: Awesome work...the bloody fools! :o)
The brainn - on 23 Dec 2008
In reply to Erik B: Slagged off "The Hurting" for being so short and getting such high grade. Well done Pete and Guy for there commitment and what is definitely a great piece of climbing. Multi-Pitch climbing dawn till dusk that's awesome.
Alasdair Fulton - on 23 Dec 2008
In reply to The brainn: Does anyone else notice a record player?



















Think it might be stuck in a groove......

Simon Richardson - on 23 Dec 2008
In reply to Erik B:
It has been a remarkable winter season, and in terms of challenging new routes probably the best Nov and Dec ever! In my view The God Delusion is the pick of the bunch so far, so hats off the Pete and Guy.

Other highlights (that Im aware of at least) include Heidbanger (VIII,8 Ben Nevis), Yo Bro (VIII,9 Mamores), Hung Drawn and Quartered (VIII,8 Skye), The Cone Gatherers (VIII,7 Ben Nevis), The Great Gig in the Sky (VII,7 Quinag), Gnome Wall Direct (VII,7 Beinn Eighe), Critical Mass (VII,7 - Bidean), Devastation (VII,8 Ben Nevis), A Wall Too Far (VII,8 Lochnagar), Brass Monkey (VII,8 Ben Nevis), Spitfire (VII,8 - Beinn Eighe), Full Frontal (VII,8 Grey Corries) together with early repeats of The Duel, Sioux Wall, The Secret and the second ascent of Cold Play (VIII,8 Ben Nevis).

Phew! Over 20 climbers have contributed to this impressive haul - the number of those involved is something to celebrate in itself?
petestack - on 23 Dec 2008
In reply to mac fae stirling:
> (In reply to yer maw) seems to me if anonymous called himself/herself e.g. 'Bob', it really wouldnt make much odds.

To me, it would make a helluva difference if he/she called him/herself 'Bob' and posted under that on a regular login. So I might still not know who he/she really was, but I'd have a reference point comparable to what I've got for most other contributors rather than a strong feeling that he/she was unwilling to stand up and be counted!
john howard 1 - on 23 Dec 2008
In reply to Alasdair Fulton:
> (In reply to The brainn) Does anyone else notice a record player?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Think it might be stuck in a groove......

http://op-for.com/simpsons_nelson_haha2.jpg
petestack - on 23 Dec 2008
In reply to petestack:

Also, 'anonymous' posting is strongly discouraged by the Posting Guidelines:
http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/info/guidelines.html
jaysus - on 23 Dec 2008
In reply to Simon Richardson:

Let's not forget the first free ascent of Don't Die of Ignorance. A wee bit longer than 35m ;)
In reply to jaysus:

> Let's not forget the first free ascent of Don't Die of Ignorance. A wee bit longer than 35m ;)

I think your news is a little out of date.
WeatherGeek on 23 Dec 2008 - 82-69-53-65.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk
In reply to Erik B:

Bloody hell, that looks hard
nice pic in the moonlight

And here's me thinking I'll get some grade 3s done this season, after being plagued with injury for ages.
Erik B - on 23 Dec 2008
In reply to Simon Richardson: a VII,8 on the grey coires? wow! any details of the line? is this a platinum age we are witnessing?!
Dave McG - on 23 Dec 2008
In reply to Erik B: Hi Erik, it was Tony and Viv, the arete between Serve Chilled and Taliballan.
Erik B - on 23 Dec 2008
In reply to Dave McG: hi Dave, as in right of the wall we had a look at? nice line! could you send me a mail so i can get your email address?
Dave McG - on 23 Dec 2008
In reply to Erik B: That's the one, i'll send you an email now (through ukc).

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