/ Gaia- i decked from the top last saturday.

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jamesp78 - on 22 Sep 2010
This is just a message to personaly thank everyone involved in helping me after the accident.

My belayer Johnny probably saved my life and after i was taken to hospital he continued to keep a cool head and was left with having to organise calls to my girlfriend, gear still in the route (unfortunately not the important bit)vehichle, tents and god knows what else. Thanks mate. All my other friends up for the weekend too. Thanks to you guys too.
Complete strangers Jane and Gareth who i have already e mailed but would like to thank again here.Wrong place at the wrong time or vice versa depending how you look at it!
Obviously i am forever in the debt of the mountain rescue service and the air ambulance crew. I can only remember a man called dave who was amazing but i know there were so many of you there all doing an amazing job.Thanks guys. I will be fund raising when i recover.(6 to 12 weeks)
Everyone at the royal derby hospital too. I cant believe you can break your back and be home in 4 days!
If anyone finds themselves at the derby hospital i can strongly reccomend the morphine and the lemon sponge with custard.
Thanks everyone.Jim.


andyunder - on 22 Sep 2010
In reply to jamesp78: Glade to hear you are ok and back home.
highclimber - on 22 Sep 2010
In reply to jamesp78: I wish you a speedy recovery
but I guess the only question now is would you try it again (Gaia, not the falling bit!)?

jamesp78 - on 22 Sep 2010
In reply to highclimber: I will be climbing again but not gaia. it was never about the grade or whatever, i just wanted to climb it- to have my own gaia experience and i have. I was pissing it on top rope and even on lead-and enjoying it too- but my phone rang just as i popped for the toe hook and i missed it, managed to suck it back in but the bubble was burst and i couldnt sort it out.The cams ripped after taking a good bit of the force out and i think this was because i had placed them on lead which was very blind and difficult. i was going to leave them in after checking them out on top rope and just clip them.should have.
Stash - on 22 Sep 2010
In reply to jamesp78:

Have you told the friend who rang you?
jamesp78 - on 22 Sep 2010
In reply to Stash: ha ha. no.It is my fault for not switching it off.The hardest thing i have found about all this was seeing how many people where affected by my decission making.
highclimber - on 22 Sep 2010
In reply to jamesp78: you lived to tell the story that's all that matters. people and wounds heal (quicker than one might expect I have found)! pride takes just that little bit longer!

all the best
thedatastream on 22 Sep 2010
In reply to jamesp78:

Wishing you a swift recovery from a fellow injured climber.

James
Hardonicus - on 22 Sep 2010
In reply to jamesp78:

You should have put you phone in flight mode...
clochette - on 22 Sep 2010
In reply to jamesp78:

I felt sorry for you until you said your phone rang........... bloody mobiles. I'd ban them from crags if I could. They piss everyone off.

Get well soon anyway.
Skyfall - on 22 Sep 2010
In reply to clochette:

I agree - not about feeling sorry for the poster though ;) I hate it when you're somewhere like Froggatt and all you can hear (apart from students) are bl**dy phones going off. Another reason I try to climb at popular crags in the Peak as little as possible nowadays.
EasyAndy - on 22 Sep 2010
In reply to Hardonicus:
> (In reply to jamesp78)
>
> You should have put you phone in flight mode...

Har!

Johnny_Grunwald on 22 Sep 2010
In reply to jamesp78:

To the OP my sympathy. An honest post which shows great humility. We have all had phone moments. Hope the recovery goes well.

On another note I wonder if this will deter the guy who recently posted on here proposing to lead Gaia, jumping a handful of grades in the process.
Busby - on 22 Sep 2010
In reply to highclimber:
> (In reply to jamesp78) you lived to tell the story that's all that matters. people and wounds heal (quicker than one might expect I have found)! pride takes just that little bit longer!
>
> all the best

You're forgetting the bigger picture though sir, remember, chicks dig scars....

All the best for your recovery sir.


Iain
slacky on 22 Sep 2010
In reply to Hardonicus:
> (In reply to jamesp78)
>
> You should have put you phone in flight mode...

Genius!
Ackbar - on 22 Sep 2010
In reply to jamesp78: When I first heard that someone had fallen off gaia after becoming distracted I assumed the distraction was a relative of the ladybird that nearly got Dawes :-D
Daniel Heath - on 22 Sep 2010
In reply to jamesp78:

great to hear you're ok.

Out of interest James, did you have the second rope out left? I'm just curious, as it's difficult to see how you avoided Jean-minh Trin-Thieu's broken leg if not.

In reply to others, one top rope attempt was enough of "the experience" me and I will probably never touch it again.
Stash - on 22 Sep 2010
In reply to Daniel Heath:

that would be to the right surely?
Daniel Heath - on 22 Sep 2010
In reply to Stash:

Yeah right sorry
sabbott on 22 Sep 2010
In reply to jamesp78:

James - As I per my previous text it is excellent news that you are ok with 'relatively' minor injuries. As you've said your second did a hell of a good job to reduce the impact.

Myself and Colin were first on scene from MR but I think Dave was one of the Air Ambulance Paramedics who were already with you.

We don't often get updates on the outcome of many incidents and its good to feedback to every one who was there and helped, that the outcome was a good one.

As suggested by Juliet in my other post, a lot of time and effort is put in to training by all the MR teams but happy outcomes like this just help feed our enthusiam for more!!

Again mine and the team's best wishes for a full and rapid recovery.

Stuart
DMRT Equip Officer
ads.ukclimbing.com
jon on 22 Sep 2010
In reply to JonC:
> (In reply to clochette)
>
> I agree - not about feeling sorry for the poster though ;) I hate it when you're somewhere like Froggatt and all you can hear (apart from students) are bl**dy phones going off. Another reason I try to climb at popular crags in the Peak as little as possible nowadays.

I was climbing in Switzerland with a mate some time ago who'd recently moved from France to Switzerland. He had two mobiles - one French and one Swiss. As I was negotiating a particularly difficult section of a route, one of the phones rang.... I looked down to see him standing with a phone in each hand, wondering which one to answer. The rope snaking out of the belay device into the rope bag, completely untouched.

csw on 22 Sep 2010
In reply to jamesp78:

Wishing you a speedy recovery
jamesp78 - on 22 Sep 2010
In reply to sabbott: Hi Stuart, Thanks again to you and your team.
I think i remember the name stuart now. I remember a younger looking guy and a man with a beard.Both very nice.I think the morphine at the crag blurred everything somewhat! Your teams professionalism was astounding, it's hard to believe you acheive this without proper funding.It's a shame it often takes direct or indirect experience to make you realise the value of these services and the committment you guys make.We will definetely be organising some fund raising to donate in the near future. Thanks again.Jim.
jamesp78 - on 22 Sep 2010
In reply to Daniel Heath: Hi daniel. I looked at every angle in the process leading up to my attempt on gaia, including the side rope. I saw a couple of vids of people using it and it looked distracting and they both flipped when they fell, but mainly i thought the best approach was full committment and positivity and felt the side rope was a negative way to set off on the route. Also i found a great way to match my feet across where 'the fall' usally happens by crossing my left leg behind my right and then my right through again into a flag before any hand movements and could actually chalk up there.i went for the low runner and the usain bolt belay service offered by johnny(good plan).cheers, jim. (luck also helps here)
stewieatb on 22 Sep 2010
In reply to jamesp78:
> the usain bolt belay service

Poor choice of words?
Ram MkiV - on 22 Sep 2010
In reply to Daniel Heath: there've been a few falls with just one rope and no injuries. Vertical backwards sprinting ability and a decent amount of purchase on final kick off required to get away with it I guess. That and not getting flipped obviously.

@ jamesp78; sounds like a bit of a run of bad luck on the lead go, so unlucky. Glad you're alright and good on you for sharing what happened.
pneame on 22 Sep 2010
In reply to jon:
> (In reply to JonC)
> [...]
>
> one of the phones rang.... I looked down to see him standing with a phone in each hand, wondering which one to answer.

Instruments of the devil.
Oh dear, I've hijacked this into a religious thread... sorry....
But really, the things are a menace. We didn't miss them when we didn't have them.

Nigel R Lewis - on 23 Sep 2010
In reply to pneame:
> (In reply to jon)
> [...]
>
> But really, the things are a menace. We didn't miss them when we didn't have them.

Trouble is, you could say the same for the wheel, aeroplanes, innoculations and the written word. You can only turn some clocks back!!

N

john arran - on 23 Sep 2010
In reply to jamesp78:
> the usain bolt belay service offered by johnny

Is this the first bolt belay on grit?

;-)

wilkie14c - on 23 Sep 2010
In reply to jamesp78:
A Dawes masterpiece, no wonder you wanted it mate. You must have bollox of iron and here's hoping the slight softening is only tempory.
Well done to everyone concerned although it goes without saying.
Hope to see you back on the rock soon.
Simon Caldwell - on 23 Sep 2010
In reply to pneame:
> We didn't miss them when we didn't have them.

but conversely it took much longer to call the emergency services if an accident happened...
PebblePusher - on 23 Sep 2010
In reply to pneame: "But really, the things are a menace."

Yeah it's pretty easy to say that but then again, how do you think mountain rescue were made aware of this situation and how do you think this scenario would have ended if the climbers there to help had nothing but smoke signals to attract attention!

Daft, nonsense comment if you ask me, mobiles save lives, PARTICULARLY for those of us who participate in dangerous hobbies which take us to remote parts of the country.
cha1n on 23 Sep 2010
In reply to jamesp78:

Having climbed it and fallen, what do you think about Alex Honnold soloing it, is he mental?
Daniel Heath - on 23 Sep 2010
In reply to cha1n:

I thought he just flashed it?
He soloed London Wall though :O
cha1n on 23 Sep 2010
In reply to Daniel Heath:

When I watched progression last there was a few second clip of him nonchalantly throwing his foot over for the toehook at the end - with no ropes.

I'm 99.999% sure, but i'll check again when I get home. I know he onsighted it on gear too..
Ewan2010 on 23 Sep 2010 - host86-130-185-160.range86-130.btcentralplus.com
In reply to jamesp78: props for going for it :)
ksjs - on 23 Sep 2010
In reply to jamesp78: this might sound harsh or like im being critical but its / im not, im genuinely intrigued; your profile shows your best onsight efforts as 7a+ and V4 with no mention of trad leading.

i understand you top-roped Gaia but did you not think that a lack of trad onsight experience and an apparent lack of technical and physical (not sure how physical Gaia is) 'buffer', not to mention mental, could present an issue if you got into difficulty on the headpoint?

i know its easy to be wise after the event and im not trying to be but on what basis did you decide that going for the lead on this was the right choice? was it just the phone going off or was it something else that changed your focus? would you make the same decision again?

perhaps your profile isnt up to date so maybe that lot is irrelevant. whatever went on im glad youre around to tell the tale. hope all better soon...
Charlie_Zero on 23 Sep 2010
In reply to cha1n:

Link to UKC video of Alex Honnald climbing Gaia. Awesome viewing!


http://www.ukclimbing.com/news/item.php?id=45444
Fidmark - on 23 Sep 2010
In reply to jamesp78: If its any consolation, I admire you greatly for giving it a go! Excellent effort, hope your climbing again soon.
cha1n on 23 Sep 2010
In reply to jamesp78:

Screen shot that someone took of Honnold soloing Gaia:

http://img31.imageshack.us/img31/1736/vlcsnap2010092323h23m25.png

I never took the screen shot of course (it's at 58 mins in the progression film).

John_Hat - on 24 Sep 2010
In reply to ksjs:

Sorry, yes that sounds like you are being harsh.

Daniel Heath - on 24 Sep 2010
In reply to cha1n:

wow
What a nutter!
Cragrat Rich on 24 Sep 2010
In reply to jamesp78:

Glad you're well and survived.

On a more comical note... have you seen that film, can't remember the name of it, 1990's, about a fanatic Arsenal fan?

You could have had a moment like at the end of that, where you answer your phone and say to the girlfriend....

"can you please, please, please just f*ck off... I'm on the crux of Gaia"

Get well soon dude!
ksjs - on 25 Sep 2010
In reply to John_Hat: yeah, a few mild platitudes are much better than any serious reflection or discussion that might yield some insights
hexcentric - on 25 Sep 2010
In reply to ksjs: Maybe you could have just tried reading the thread for his explanation of why........

"I will be climbing again but not gaia. it was never about the grade or whatever, i just wanted to climb it- to have my own gaia experience and i have. I was pissing it on top rope and even on lead-and enjoying it too- but my phone rang just as i popped for the toe hook and i missed it, managed to suck it back in but the bubble was burst and i couldnt sort it out"

Lot's of people have fluffed Gaia, Jean Minh, Kevin Jorgeson etc. Why you think this guy was any more wrong to get on it than anyone else is beyond me. As far as I can see, he wanted and tried to lead a hard and slightly dicey route and it didn't work out. A chance of falling off is just part of hard (for the individual)headpointing, it doesn't necessarily mean you've made a major mistake.
ksjs - on 25 Sep 2010
In reply to hexcentric: id read that. your examples only serve to underline why the OP's decision to go for the headpoint may not have been the right one.
john arran - on 25 Sep 2010
In reply to ksjs:

Imagine this scenario:

You've worked a scary route extensively. You reckon you can do it 19 times out of 20. You think this risk and potential injury is justified for the experience of the lead and the joy of the accomplishment. You draw the 1/20 chance and fall. Was it a bad decision?

What about if the odds of success were 99/100, or 9999/10000? You simply can't tell from the fact that someone falls how unlikely a result that was, and therefore can't really judge anyone as a result.
hexcentric - on 25 Sep 2010
In reply to ksjs: You do realise headpoint attempts are not guaranteed outcome right?! Just because he fell off it doesn't show he was stupid or did anything wrong at all, it just shows he took a calculated risk (which he felt acceptable), was willing to roll the dice and lost.

Presumably you would also question the descision making behind Jorgesons attempt on Gaia, Dave Mac's on Rhapsody, J Pearsons on Walk of Life etc as thet also all fell off headpoint attempts.....

I would have thought that a strong desire to do a route coupled with the ability to cruise it on top-rope would be enough justification for most people....
shark - on 25 Sep 2010
In reply to jamesp78:

Was it Father Ted on the line ?
ksjs - on 25 Sep 2010
In reply to john arran: im not judging anyone just querying if this was the right decision.

i take your point about odds / the 1 in 20 chance BUT i go back to my original point namely that, based on the OP's profile, there is a significant gap between track record / experience and aspiration on this occasion. does this not have some impact on the odds, wisdom of the decision?

even if the OP had made a clean ascent i would still be surprised, all things considered, that the decision to go for it was made in the first place. we all however approach climbing differently.
ksjs - on 25 Sep 2010
In reply to hexcentric: no, i wouldnt question their attempts as they have the experience and level appropriate to the challenge. and no, cruising on top-rope isnt really a justification as top-roping can be a world away from leading when you cant lace things, reverse moves, sit on the rope and theres very real mental aspects to handle
Cragrat Rich on 25 Sep 2010
In reply to jamesp78:

I think some people are being very unkind in regards to your experience of this route James to be honest.

When a person reaches a stage in their climbing where they are willing to take on a serious serious situation for the goal that they seek, I believe the decision they make to go through with that ascent is always the 'correct' one.
It's very insulting to suggest a person undertook a climb without regard for their safety or capability to succeed.
Personally I like to uphold a 'don't judge, fetch grapes' mentality to these instances.

I think that the outcome itself and consequences are judge of the situation enough, for an individual who has suffered because of failure to complete a task in climbing, for whatever reason.

I hope you make a full and good recovery James and that if and when you return to climbing, you manage to regain all of the spirit and zest for achievement that took you to the top of Gaia on the sharp end of a rope in the first place, regardless of what challenges you choose in future.

R
adamjames27 - on 25 Sep 2010
In reply to jamesp78: never leave gear behind- that is clearly the most important bit
petestack - on 25 Sep 2010
In reply to Cragrat Rich:
> (In reply to jamesp78)
> I hope you make a full and good recovery James and that if and when you return to climbing, you manage to regain all of the spirit and zest for achievement that took you to the top of Gaia on the sharp end of a rope in the first place, regardless of what challenges you choose in future.

Nicely put, Rich, and agreed! :-)
Simon Caldwell - on 25 Sep 2010
In reply to Cragrat Rich:

> Personally I like to uphold a 'don't judge, fetch grapes' mentality to these instances.

Like it :)

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