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If your goal is to climb F8a, when should you first get on one/some? When you are not far from being able to do it or when it still seems a distant prospect? I'd be particularly keen to hear the views of UKCers who have climbed F8a.
My inclination is to get on a few now even though I have done only one F7c, four 7b+s and six 7bs. The idea is to get a sense of what I am up against, including finding one that suits me and getting a sense of the specific weaknesses I have in relation to the project route. There is a potential down side to this, which is that it may be demoralising when faced with the reality of just how much harder it is compared to where I am now. But I'm not easily demoralised and having a long term goal with interim goals (F7c+ project plus ticking 7bs and 7as along the way) is for me fun.
My inclination is to get on a few now even though I have done only one F7c, four 7b+s and six 7bs. The idea is to get a sense of what I am up against, including finding one that suits me and getting a sense of the specific weaknesses I have in relation to the project route. There is a potential down side to this, which is that it may be demoralising when faced with the reality of just how much harder it is compared to where I am now. But I'm not easily demoralised and having a long term goal with interim goals (F7c+ project plus ticking 7bs and 7as along the way) is for me fun.
In reply to ericinbristol:
Similar position to you (1-2-4 rather than 1-4-6).
Sounds to be honest like you've got a strong leaning towards trying one anyway.
Personally I had a very short play on one a few months back, as much because I had run out of inspiring projects at that particular crag than anything else, and found it useful - I'm working to about a 2 year timescale ("before 30"), so like you I've got intermediate goals to achieve first but it's nice to see how near or far from it you are. I won't be back on it for some time I imagine, given the intermediate steps along the way, but it was interesting to check it out.
Similar position to you (1-2-4 rather than 1-4-6).
Sounds to be honest like you've got a strong leaning towards trying one anyway.
Personally I had a very short play on one a few months back, as much because I had run out of inspiring projects at that particular crag than anything else, and found it useful - I'm working to about a 2 year timescale ("before 30"), so like you I've got intermediate goals to achieve first but it's nice to see how near or far from it you are. I won't be back on it for some time I imagine, given the intermediate steps along the way, but it was interesting to check it out.
In reply to ericinbristol:
I flashed/onsighted 7c and fell off a ton of 8a's. Big mental barrier for me. Managed a few boulder traverses at F8a/+. But it's just not the same.
Get on one. You can work routes into submission. The more you try it the better you get at it. I've lost count at the number of projects I've had, where I've worked and worked and worked. It went from being impossible to doable. And then once it's done, I can do it again and again.
I flashed/onsighted 7c and fell off a ton of 8a's. Big mental barrier for me. Managed a few boulder traverses at F8a/+. But it's just not the same.
Get on one. You can work routes into submission. The more you try it the better you get at it. I've lost count at the number of projects I've had, where I've worked and worked and worked. It went from being impossible to doable. And then once it's done, I can do it again and again.
In reply to JimmyKay:
It's also about know when to pull hard. When you first get on a hard route you think f*ck, it's really hard, and you end up pulling really hard for every move. So the more you do it, the more you realise you can get away with pulling less hard because you've sorted the body position better, or you just don't need to pull that hard. This saves you energy for the actual hard bits where you do need to pull hard.
It's also about know when to pull hard. When you first get on a hard route you think f*ck, it's really hard, and you end up pulling really hard for every move. So the more you do it, the more you realise you can get away with pulling less hard because you've sorted the body position better, or you just don't need to pull that hard. This saves you energy for the actual hard bits where you do need to pull hard.
In reply to ericinbristol:
I heard it said (by a climbing coach) that you won't be successful at climbing F7a by climbing lots of F6bs. Better to get on the F7a and keep plugging away or pick a F7b (split into half) and work each half.
I guess you could therefore say that you won't learn to climb F8a by climbing lots of F7bs?
On the other hand, the pyramid system is often espoused:
ie if F8a is the goal, then first tick 16 x F7b, 8 x F7b+, 4 x F7c and 2 x F7c+.
Last year I was trying the second method but I'm going to try the former this year.
I heard it said (by a climbing coach) that you won't be successful at climbing F7a by climbing lots of F6bs. Better to get on the F7a and keep plugging away or pick a F7b (split into half) and work each half.
I guess you could therefore say that you won't learn to climb F8a by climbing lots of F7bs?
On the other hand, the pyramid system is often espoused:
ie if F8a is the goal, then first tick 16 x F7b, 8 x F7b+, 4 x F7c and 2 x F7c+.
Last year I was trying the second method but I'm going to try the former this year.
In reply to JimmyKay:
And if you're still falling off the hard moves, get stronger.
Sorry for the way I've posted should have read before posting a few times. -ve Karma for me.
And if you're still falling off the hard moves, get stronger.
Sorry for the way I've posted should have read before posting a few times. -ve Karma for me.
In reply to ericinbristol: I have done one Fr8a, it took about 6 sessions of working/redpointing.
Before that I'd done:
1 x Fr7c/+
1 x Fr7b+
5 x Fr7b
However, it's a well known soft touch Fr8a, that succumbs well to work (i.e. no stopper moves, but very technical and sequency) and I had bouldered V7/V8 previously, so plenty in the bag.
I would say it's worth getting on them sooner, rather than later. I had been held back from trying for a long time, partly due to none of my regular climbing partners pushing their grade much, and partly by being dissuaded due to indoor grades (I still have never climbed harder than 7b+ indoors...)
When I did it, I was weaker and less fit than before a year's layoff due to injury, but I just got on it and got on with it! It's handy to have a partner who's keen for it too - shared beta/belays/psyche.
Before that I'd done:
1 x Fr7c/+
1 x Fr7b+
5 x Fr7b
However, it's a well known soft touch Fr8a, that succumbs well to work (i.e. no stopper moves, but very technical and sequency) and I had bouldered V7/V8 previously, so plenty in the bag.
I would say it's worth getting on them sooner, rather than later. I had been held back from trying for a long time, partly due to none of my regular climbing partners pushing their grade much, and partly by being dissuaded due to indoor grades (I still have never climbed harder than 7b+ indoors...)
When I did it, I was weaker and less fit than before a year's layoff due to injury, but I just got on it and got on with it! It's handy to have a partner who's keen for it too - shared beta/belays/psyche.
In reply to ericinbristol:
similar position too, 6 7c's done but the 8a's I have tried all seem a long way off, find one that plays to your strengths, prob won't find many 8a's with easier than v6 moves or lots of v5 so ensuring your bouldering strength is above this would make it come quicker I guess.
Tim
similar position too, 6 7c's done but the 8a's I have tried all seem a long way off, find one that plays to your strengths, prob won't find many 8a's with easier than v6 moves or lots of v5 so ensuring your bouldering strength is above this would make it come quicker I guess.
Tim
In reply to all:
Interesting stuff, thanks.
I reckon the main choice is whether to get on an F8a / various F8as intermittently but mainly work on getting stronger by gradually building up to it versus working a specific project F8a fairly often as a major component of the process of getting stronger. My sense of it at the moment is that the latter will be a more rapid route to sending F8a.
Interesting stuff, thanks.
I reckon the main choice is whether to get on an F8a / various F8as intermittently but mainly work on getting stronger by gradually building up to it versus working a specific project F8a fairly often as a major component of the process of getting stronger. My sense of it at the moment is that the latter will be a more rapid route to sending F8a.
Save it for the onsight! mumble mumble armchair 8a climber
In reply to ericinbristol:
As you're not aiming to onsight it and the investment in having a look is fairly minimal I'd say just get on some, see what you think. There's nothing to lose, if it shuts you down hard then try a couple of others. If they all do you need to do more work. If one (or more) feel doable (tricky to judge right but again, not much to lose in getting it wrong) then you have yourself an occasional project, something to dip into between easier routes/projects. At the moment you're guessing.
jk
As you're not aiming to onsight it and the investment in having a look is fairly minimal I'd say just get on some, see what you think. There's nothing to lose, if it shuts you down hard then try a couple of others. If they all do you need to do more work. If one (or more) feel doable (tricky to judge right but again, not much to lose in getting it wrong) then you have yourself an occasional project, something to dip into between easier routes/projects. At the moment you're guessing.
jk
In reply to Stone Muppet:
F8a on sight would be a project extending beyond this lifetime in my case!
F8a on sight would be a project extending beyond this lifetime in my case!
In reply to jkarran:
Sensible input for sure.
Indeed, all part of the fun, and enjoying chatting about tactics and strategy.
Sensible input for sure.
> At the moment you're guessing.
Indeed, all part of the fun, and enjoying chatting about tactics and strategy.
In reply to ericinbristol:
I did my first 8a (Zoolook) after having only done 3 2x7c's (Body Machine and New Dawn) and one soft 7c+ (Wil E Coyote). Zoolook suited me but it was still a protracted siege and the redpoint was done by the skin of my teeth in the winter. The elation was huge but it could have so easily been a failure. Also I didnt manage to get up another 8a for 5 years. In hindsight I don't think it was the best approach in developing my climbing even though I got away with it.
If you bag a first 8a that suits
you without doing a few 7c+'s you then have a lot of backfilling to support getting to 8a+ which can be demoralising. Its more sustainable and progressive to bag a few at the grade before projecting the next level.
I did my first 8a (Zoolook) after having only done 3 2x7c's (Body Machine and New Dawn) and one soft 7c+ (Wil E Coyote). Zoolook suited me but it was still a protracted siege and the redpoint was done by the skin of my teeth in the winter. The elation was huge but it could have so easily been a failure. Also I didnt manage to get up another 8a for 5 years. In hindsight I don't think it was the best approach in developing my climbing even though I got away with it.
If you bag a first 8a that suits
you without doing a few 7c+'s you then have a lot of backfilling to support getting to 8a+ which can be demoralising. Its more sustainable and progressive to bag a few at the grade before projecting the next level.
In reply to shark:
I'd say it's more sustainable and progressive to do something that inspires and motivates you. If you are happy bagging a few at the grade before pressing on to the next then so be it, equally if you're inspired by a target route and can maintain the siege then go for it.
I'm sure we can agree that it is possible to over-reach and equally some people lack ambition to realise their potential. But there is a massive spectrum between those two extremes with different people being idealy suited to different colours of the spectrum.
In response to the OP: Without knowing you and how your abilities and aspirations match up it's hard to give an informed answer to your question. However I'd say get on an 8a that you fancy, what's the worst that could happen?
> (In reply to ericinbristol)
>Its more sustainable and progressive to bag a few at the grade before projecting the next level.I'd say it's more sustainable and progressive to do something that inspires and motivates you. If you are happy bagging a few at the grade before pressing on to the next then so be it, equally if you're inspired by a target route and can maintain the siege then go for it.
I'm sure we can agree that it is possible to over-reach and equally some people lack ambition to realise their potential. But there is a massive spectrum between those two extremes with different people being idealy suited to different colours of the spectrum.
In response to the OP: Without knowing you and how your abilities and aspirations match up it's hard to give an informed answer to your question. However I'd say get on an 8a that you fancy, what's the worst that could happen?
In reply to Nik Jennings:
You rip a huge chunk off rock off, rendering the route unclimbable. Prospective assentionists have a mild dislike of you and after damaging the route of your dreams irreparably you lose focus and drift slowly into mediocrity, spending more and more time on the sofa with a hand down your pants, a shadow of the go-getter you once were.
You rip a huge chunk off rock off, rendering the route unclimbable. Prospective assentionists have a mild dislike of you and after damaging the route of your dreams irreparably you lose focus and drift slowly into mediocrity, spending more and more time on the sofa with a hand down your pants, a shadow of the go-getter you once were.
In reply to Robertostallioni:
Not everybody's like you.
Not everybody's like you.
In reply to shark:
I know what you mean. When trying my first F7c I found myself on the last move much earlier than expected and blew it. I was actually really grateful for blowing it, as if I had just managed it I would have felt that I had got away with it whereas when I got it about five tries later I felt that I had really nailed it and really could climb F7c.
> it was still a protracted siege ... The elation was huge but it could
> have so easily been a failure.
> have so easily been a failure.
I know what you mean. When trying my first F7c I found myself on the last move much earlier than expected and blew it. I was actually really grateful for blowing it, as if I had just managed it I would have felt that I had got away with it whereas when I got it about five tries later I felt that I had really nailed it and really could climb F7c.
In reply to Nik Jennings:
Thanks for posting. I'm not so much looking for someone to offer the answer that's right for me. I'm more interested in getting hearing the perspectives of those who have been through the process in various ways as part of the process of working out what's right for me. No doubt the main way I will find out is to get on some and see how I feel of course. But in between times it's interesting to chat with people about how they see it.
Thanks for posting. I'm not so much looking for someone to offer the answer that's right for me. I'm more interested in getting hearing the perspectives of those who have been through the process in various ways as part of the process of working out what's right for me. No doubt the main way I will find out is to get on some and see how I feel of course. But in between times it's interesting to chat with people about how they see it.
In reply to shark:
Can't say I am or expect to be worried about getting to 8a+. If anything, I would get more fun out of quickly ticking lots of classy 7s using the improved oomph developed while trying to send an 8a.
Can't say I am or expect to be worried about getting to 8a+. If anything, I would get more fun out of quickly ticking lots of classy 7s using the improved oomph developed while trying to send an 8a.
In reply to Nik Jennings: I'd say it's more sustainable and progressive to do something that inspires and motivates you.
I disagree. You end spending spending a lot of time on something that already suits your ability rather than developing weaker aspects and what after? It took me 5 years to just do another 8a that didnt suit me (Raindogs).
Building a narrow pyramid on routes that suit you will make you a specialist within a very narrow range rather than developing to become a more rounded climber.
I disagree. You end spending spending a lot of time on something that already suits your ability rather than developing weaker aspects and what after? It took me 5 years to just do another 8a that didnt suit me (Raindogs).
Building a narrow pyramid on routes that suit you will make you a specialist within a very narrow range rather than developing to become a more rounded climber.
In reply to ericinbristol:
You say that now...
>
> Can't say I am or expect to be worried about getting to 8a+.
> Can't say I am or expect to be worried about getting to 8a+.
You say that now...
In reply to ericinbristol: Dude posting a lot of bull on a forum isnt going to help you climb 8a! You need to just get down the wall and get amongst it! Man-up and crush-it!
In reply to Cathcart_Alpinist:
haha, yeah, like, totally
> (In reply to ericinbristol) Dude posting a lot of bull on a forum isnt going to help you climb 8a! You need to just get down the wall and get amongst it! Man-up and crush-it!
haha, yeah, like, totally
In reply to shark:
I've just started to write a very long reply and the deleted it.
Anyway I don't believe you end up spending a lot of time on something that already suits you.
I said
"it is sustainable and progressive to do something that inspires and motivates you."
I didn't say
"it is sustainable and progressive to do something that suits your abilities."
I'm inspired by massive long routes with no rests, they look amazing I wish I could climb them. Which is why I'm currently working probably the weakest link in my climbing, stamina. I have a route in mind which for practical reasons I haven't been on but were it an option I would certainly have given it a go.
My statement was aiming for brevity and clarity, I think I achieved brevity but I'm not sure whether I missed the clarity bit or you are reading words I didn't write...
Anyway I still think he should get on an 8a if he wants to do 8a, knowledge is power an all that. Gawd this is still quite long isn't it? Nighty-night.
I've just started to write a very long reply and the deleted it.
Anyway I don't believe you end up spending a lot of time on something that already suits you.
I said
"it is sustainable and progressive to do something that inspires and motivates you."
I didn't say
"it is sustainable and progressive to do something that suits your abilities."
I'm inspired by massive long routes with no rests, they look amazing I wish I could climb them. Which is why I'm currently working probably the weakest link in my climbing, stamina. I have a route in mind which for practical reasons I haven't been on but were it an option I would certainly have given it a go.
My statement was aiming for brevity and clarity, I think I achieved brevity but I'm not sure whether I missed the clarity bit or you are reading words I didn't write...
Anyway I still think he should get on an 8a if he wants to do 8a, knowledge is power an all that. Gawd this is still quite long isn't it? Nighty-night.
In reply to shark:
Also just asking to get injured when you start climbing things you're not good at but expect to now be able to do.
Also just asking to get injured when you start climbing things you're not good at but expect to now be able to do.
In reply to shark:
>Building a narrow pyramid on routes that suit you will make you a specialist within a very narrow range rather than developing to become a more rounded climber.
But what if it's that which motivates and inspires you?!
jcm
>Building a narrow pyramid on routes that suit you will make you a specialist within a very narrow range rather than developing to become a more rounded climber.
But what if it's that which motivates and inspires you?!
jcm
In reply to Cathcart_Alpinist:
Naw! Whit? Am scunnert noo. Ah thocht a cud jist hing oot oan ra internet and widnae need tae climb, ken? Guid joab ah did aw they boulderin problems yistirday, n'at 7b ridpoint ra day afore that. Mibbe am naw sic a bampot efter a'.
Naw! Whit? Am scunnert noo. Ah thocht a cud jist hing oot oan ra internet and widnae need tae climb, ken? Guid joab ah did aw they boulderin problems yistirday, n'at 7b ridpoint ra day afore that. Mibbe am naw sic a bampot efter a'.
In reply to Fultonius:
Yup, and I agree on indoor grades: I find them much harder - my hardest indoor grade is a single 7a+.
>
Yup, and I agree on indoor grades: I find them much harder - my hardest indoor grade is a single 7a+.
In reply to JimmyKay:
Injury is the most likely thing to stop me. I have no problem with motivation and have to channel that motivation into not overdoing it. I would train harder sooner if I thought my shoulders, elbows and fingers could take it.
Injury is the most likely thing to stop me. I have no problem with motivation and have to channel that motivation into not overdoing it. I would train harder sooner if I thought my shoulders, elbows and fingers could take it.
It is humbling to report the following from 8a.nu:
"Here is the 8a members that have done the most 8A or harder in 2011 (2010). The progress for Guntram and Anthony are just amazing and actually Gu's 119 is the most any 8a member has recorded in a year. In total, Dave Graham is leading the gang by 426 8A's or harder, out of which some 150 First Ascents!
Guntram Jörg 119 (31)
Anthony Gullsten 82 (40)
James Webb 72 (69)
Adam Ondra 63 (56)
Guillaume Glairon-Mondet 47 (18)
Dave Graham 42 (26)"
Wow.
"Here is the 8a members that have done the most 8A or harder in 2011 (2010). The progress for Guntram and Anthony are just amazing and actually Gu's 119 is the most any 8a member has recorded in a year. In total, Dave Graham is leading the gang by 426 8A's or harder, out of which some 150 First Ascents!
Guntram Jörg 119 (31)
Anthony Gullsten 82 (40)
James Webb 72 (69)
Adam Ondra 63 (56)
Guillaume Glairon-Mondet 47 (18)
Dave Graham 42 (26)"
Wow.
In reply to ericinbristol: As Shark says, if your aim is to be a solid Fr8a climber, then you'd be better off building the pyramid.
If you just want to tick one 8a, then find one that suits you and hit it!
My motivations for jumping ahead were:
1. A major injury put me out of action for a full year, so I thought sport climbing wast the best way to protect the injury (my knee) and quickly get fit. I've always been an "allrounder" and never focussed on one aspect of the sport. This year I chose to focus mainly on sport climbing.
2. A few mates had done the route, so it felt more achievable.
3. It was local, at my favourite bouldering location (dumbarton) so the investment into the route was also an investment into training.
I think that as long as you don't give up all other climbing in pursuit of a narrow minded goal like climbing Fr8a, then it's not going to be a problem. The main thing to keep in mind, is, once you've ticked your 8a, you should probably not start looking around for the next one, but for getting more 7cs and 7c+s done quickly, in good style, on various rock types.
I'll probably have a play on the route next to the one I did this year, which shares the start. But I'm definitely keen on getting some mileage on the upper 7s and getting a lot more trad done next year.
No harm in getting on your route, just don't be too focussed on doing it.
If you just want to tick one 8a, then find one that suits you and hit it!
My motivations for jumping ahead were:
1. A major injury put me out of action for a full year, so I thought sport climbing wast the best way to protect the injury (my knee) and quickly get fit. I've always been an "allrounder" and never focussed on one aspect of the sport. This year I chose to focus mainly on sport climbing.
2. A few mates had done the route, so it felt more achievable.
3. It was local, at my favourite bouldering location (dumbarton) so the investment into the route was also an investment into training.
I think that as long as you don't give up all other climbing in pursuit of a narrow minded goal like climbing Fr8a, then it's not going to be a problem. The main thing to keep in mind, is, once you've ticked your 8a, you should probably not start looking around for the next one, but for getting more 7cs and 7c+s done quickly, in good style, on various rock types.
I'll probably have a play on the route next to the one I did this year, which shares the start. But I'm definitely keen on getting some mileage on the upper 7s and getting a lot more trad done next year.
No harm in getting on your route, just don't be too focussed on doing it.
In reply to Fultonius:
Just ticking one would suit me more than fine I reckon and I can't imagine becoming fixated on trying to tick it to the exclusion of getting on other things and enjoying them along he way. I'll be doing my usual bit of trad, ice and easy sport.
Just ticking one would suit me more than fine I reckon and I can't imagine becoming fixated on trying to tick it to the exclusion of getting on other things and enjoying them along he way. I'll be doing my usual bit of trad, ice and easy sport.
In reply to Fultonius: > (In reply to ericinbristol) As Shark says, if your aim is to be a solid Fr8a climber, then you'd be better off building the pyramid.
And if you are a solid Fr8a climber you have a good chance of ticking an 8a+ that suits you or even potentially an 8b....if that inspires and motivates you
>
And if you are a solid Fr8a climber you have a good chance of ticking an 8a+ that suits you or even potentially an 8b....if that inspires and motivates you
In reply to ericinbristol:
Not an 8a climber, so probably not qualified to answer but I think that as long as you don't let the number fool you into believing you're solid at the grade then why not try it.
I climb with someone who has climbed F7c but is now hitting a wall because his bouldering ability (strength/technique) isn't up to scratch but the only way he found that out was trying harder stuff.
Not an 8a climber, so probably not qualified to answer but I think that as long as you don't let the number fool you into believing you're solid at the grade then why not try it.
I climb with someone who has climbed F7c but is now hitting a wall because his bouldering ability (strength/technique) isn't up to scratch but the only way he found that out was trying harder stuff.
In reply to ericinbristol: Hello Sardine! I'm gonna be in Bath for an exam from June 11 to 15, probably get there a few days early too. Lets head out to Cheddarrr for a few sessions! Max
In reply to ericinbristol:
I have known several very good climbers get to 8a and then practically stop climbing. Seems 8a was such an ambition that drove them (to an extent) that once they got there for a while, the drive fell out of climbing.
This could be for several reasons. I suspect that if you lose fitness, that becoming a relative bimbly might not do it for you - I know I wouldn't be wholley fullfilled just climbing Diffs for example. Or simply maintaining the level of motivation is difficult. Or that in getting to 8a, the amount of climbing and training you do results in burn out - too much of a good thing makes it mundane - I've already done this to one sport.
I think considering motivation to climb a specific milestone which may take a massive investment might have side effects which an asprirant might like to consider before embarking on the long road.
Having said that, it does all depend on how you view things and why you climb. Many folk do just fine too.
From a personal point of view, I have always enjoyed being not so hot a climber as it means every day is a good day - enjoying the routes fail or succeess.
Putting your ambitions on a pinacle often seems to end in bi-polar good and bad days, with the difference being latching a hold on the 10th RP attempt of the day.
I think I am saying, be carefull what you wish for and why. Journey and desination are equally important.
Good luck! and if you find an 8a which suits weak arms, but rewards technique without an excess of despiration and is in the south then let me know!
Kev
I have known several very good climbers get to 8a and then practically stop climbing. Seems 8a was such an ambition that drove them (to an extent) that once they got there for a while, the drive fell out of climbing.
This could be for several reasons. I suspect that if you lose fitness, that becoming a relative bimbly might not do it for you - I know I wouldn't be wholley fullfilled just climbing Diffs for example. Or simply maintaining the level of motivation is difficult. Or that in getting to 8a, the amount of climbing and training you do results in burn out - too much of a good thing makes it mundane - I've already done this to one sport.
I think considering motivation to climb a specific milestone which may take a massive investment might have side effects which an asprirant might like to consider before embarking on the long road.
Having said that, it does all depend on how you view things and why you climb. Many folk do just fine too.
From a personal point of view, I have always enjoyed being not so hot a climber as it means every day is a good day - enjoying the routes fail or succeess.
Putting your ambitions on a pinacle often seems to end in bi-polar good and bad days, with the difference being latching a hold on the 10th RP attempt of the day.
I think I am saying, be carefull what you wish for and why. Journey and desination are equally important.
Good luck! and if you find an 8a which suits weak arms, but rewards technique without an excess of despiration and is in the south then let me know!
Kev
In reply to koalapie:
Hi Max! Hope all's well. Excellent, will be grand to see you and get on some routes. Keep me posted about arrival etc.
Hi Max! Hope all's well. Excellent, will be grand to see you and get on some routes. Keep me posted about arrival etc.
In reply to ericinbristol: Ok mate will do
In reply to ericinbristol:
I have climbed over 30 7b+'s, probably the same or more 7b's, at least 10 7c's and 4 7c+'s, yet have still not managed an 8a dispite getting very close to quite a few. Although I have not really put a sustained effort into any one 8a.
Personally I find it musch more satisfing getting up routes in a couple of goes than getting spanked for weeks on the same route. I am pretty sure that i am a better climber as a result of spending time doing lots of 7b+'s than I would have been had i projected an 8a.
I have climbed over 30 7b+'s, probably the same or more 7b's, at least 10 7c's and 4 7c+'s, yet have still not managed an 8a dispite getting very close to quite a few. Although I have not really put a sustained effort into any one 8a.
Personally I find it musch more satisfing getting up routes in a couple of goes than getting spanked for weeks on the same route. I am pretty sure that i am a better climber as a result of spending time doing lots of 7b+'s than I would have been had i projected an 8a.
In reply to Nik Jennings:
I'd agree with shark here; Zoolook was also my first 8 & more so than anything it was the line/history/reputation/quality that inspired me to choose it as 1st 8a. The JIBE scale of RP'ing may help, it did me, allowing to you determine how feasible a goal it is. Obviously its just a view but basically take your hardest O/S and you should, within a reasonable time scale, be able to RP 4 grades harder. E.G Hardest o/s 7b, add 4 grades (7b+, 7c, 7c+, 8a) = 8a
Obviously, choosing something thats tidal, prone to seepage, in the sun & 1/2 a days drive away will not help your quest.
> (In reply to shark)
> [...]
> >Its more sustainable and progressive to bag a few at the grade before projecting the next level.
>
> I'd say it's more sustainable and progressive to do something that inspires and motivates you.
> [...]
> >Its more sustainable and progressive to bag a few at the grade before projecting the next level.
>
> I'd say it's more sustainable and progressive to do something that inspires and motivates you.
I'd agree with shark here; Zoolook was also my first 8 & more so than anything it was the line/history/reputation/quality that inspired me to choose it as 1st 8a. The JIBE scale of RP'ing may help, it did me, allowing to you determine how feasible a goal it is. Obviously its just a view but basically take your hardest O/S and you should, within a reasonable time scale, be able to RP 4 grades harder. E.G Hardest o/s 7b, add 4 grades (7b+, 7c, 7c+, 8a) = 8a
Obviously, choosing something thats tidal, prone to seepage, in the sun & 1/2 a days drive away will not help your quest.
In reply to Jon Didymus: I dont climb indoors very often at all - probably once in the last 6 months. I have onsighted 7bs indoors so yes, i expect I could redpoint 7c/+.
In reply to to Richard Hall:
You are way ahead of me for sure. Underlines how far I have to go, whether it's getting good at 7s or ticking an 8a
You are way ahead of me for sure. Underlines how far I have to go, whether it's getting good at 7s or ticking an 8a
In reply to Kevster:
I'm pleased to say there is no chance of me getting demoralised after a big tick or big effort. I've been climbing over 20 years and will keep going as long as I can even if it's Mods.
I'm pleased to say there is no chance of me getting demoralised after a big tick or big effort. I've been climbing over 20 years and will keep going as long as I can even if it's Mods.
In reply to ericinbristol: OH yeah, and also - enjoy it!
I really enjoyed the process of learning the intricacies of the route, chatting about alternative sequences, strategies etc. Fairly early on in the process I made it through all the hard climbing on a redpoint attempt, but stupidly fluffed a relatively easy move. This was the point where it changed from a possibility, to an almost foregone conclusion. It was also the point where I stopped enjoying trying!
Fortunately I got it about 4 rps later, but it was really starting to play on my mind and strangely, when I finally topped out I was almost devoid of emotion. Job done. Bit of a shame really!
Ultimately, I like redpointing, but onsighting is really my thing!
I really enjoyed the process of learning the intricacies of the route, chatting about alternative sequences, strategies etc. Fairly early on in the process I made it through all the hard climbing on a redpoint attempt, but stupidly fluffed a relatively easy move. This was the point where it changed from a possibility, to an almost foregone conclusion. It was also the point where I stopped enjoying trying!
Fortunately I got it about 4 rps later, but it was really starting to play on my mind and strangely, when I finally topped out I was almost devoid of emotion. Job done. Bit of a shame really!
Ultimately, I like redpointing, but onsighting is really my thing!
In reply to Kevster:
>I have known several very good climbers get to 8a and then practically stop climbing. Seems 8a was such an ambition that drove them (to an extent) that once they got there for a while, the drive fell out of climbing.
That's another good point. And when I climbed my first v11 I had the same feeling. It took months to do anything hard again. I completely lost the drive. I was so happy when I did that boulder but i lost all drive. I was complacent with just bumbling around classics up to about v5 and 6 cause I'd achieved that life time climbing goal. So I've changed that goal recently to F8c so that should keep my occuppied for a while..... It's at least inspired me to start the ball rolling again in the training department.
>I have known several very good climbers get to 8a and then practically stop climbing. Seems 8a was such an ambition that drove them (to an extent) that once they got there for a while, the drive fell out of climbing.
That's another good point. And when I climbed my first v11 I had the same feeling. It took months to do anything hard again. I completely lost the drive. I was so happy when I did that boulder but i lost all drive. I was complacent with just bumbling around classics up to about v5 and 6 cause I'd achieved that life time climbing goal. So I've changed that goal recently to F8c so that should keep my occuppied for a while..... It's at least inspired me to start the ball rolling again in the training department.
In reply to JimmyKay:
Not sure you need much more training JK.......
Good luck with the 8c, there must be several that suit your boulderer strengths.
I had noticed the likes of ondra and sharma et al do all seem to swing between bouldering and sport or other disciplines. I bet there is significantly more than training benefits to be had by doing this.
Of the 3 people I have known who lost their climbing mojo at 8a, all took to surfing.
K
Not sure you need much more training JK.......
Good luck with the 8c, there must be several that suit your boulderer strengths.
I had noticed the likes of ondra and sharma et al do all seem to swing between bouldering and sport or other disciplines. I bet there is significantly more than training benefits to be had by doing this.
Of the 3 people I have known who lost their climbing mojo at 8a, all took to surfing.
K
In reply to ericinbristol:
Hi Eric, I think you should look at Right Hand Man at cheddar, aside the grade it just looks like great fun (I have seen a few people on it before) I'm well up for projecting it with you. Crimpy and technical... would suit you perfectly.
Hi Eric, I think you should look at Right Hand Man at cheddar, aside the grade it just looks like great fun (I have seen a few people on it before) I'm well up for projecting it with you. Crimpy and technical... would suit you perfectly.
In reply to Vertigo1:
Sounds good. Let's get on it. Am away this weekend then let sector sort something out.
Sounds good. Let's get on it. Am away this weekend then let sector sort something out.
In reply to Rich Kirby:
I'm not sure what point you're making? Your first 8a was Zoolook and you chose it because it inspired you. Which is my point, do something that inspires you. Are you saying you shouldn't have done Zoolook as your first 8a?
Also the OP wants to "tick 8a", if that is the goal then getting on an 8a which inspires/motivates you, finding out if it suits you and what shortcomings you need to address to tick it seems completely sensible. I'm not sure why anybody would think this a bad thing to do?? If the goal was to become a well rounded 8a leader building up to 8a+, and beyond then yes the pyramid of routes that Shark is suggesting is sensible, and probably to an extent inevitable. But that wasn't the question.
I imagine that we all actually agree but are perhaps coming from slightly different interpretations of the OP's question???
> (In reply to Nik Jennings)
> [...]
>
> I'd agree with shark here; Zoolook was also my first 8 & more so than anything it was the line/history/reputation/quality that inspired me to choose it as 1st 8a. The JIBE scale of RP'ing may help, it did me, allowing to you determine how feasible a goal it is. Obviously its just a view but basically take your hardest O/S and you should, within a reasonable time scale, be able to RP 4 grades harder. E.G Hardest o/s 7b, add 4 grades (7b+, 7c, 7c+, 8a) = 8a
>
> Obviously, choosing something thats tidal, prone to seepage, in the sun & 1/2 a days drive away will not help your quest.
> [...]
>
> I'd agree with shark here; Zoolook was also my first 8 & more so than anything it was the line/history/reputation/quality that inspired me to choose it as 1st 8a. The JIBE scale of RP'ing may help, it did me, allowing to you determine how feasible a goal it is. Obviously its just a view but basically take your hardest O/S and you should, within a reasonable time scale, be able to RP 4 grades harder. E.G Hardest o/s 7b, add 4 grades (7b+, 7c, 7c+, 8a) = 8a
>
> Obviously, choosing something thats tidal, prone to seepage, in the sun & 1/2 a days drive away will not help your quest.
I'm not sure what point you're making? Your first 8a was Zoolook and you chose it because it inspired you. Which is my point, do something that inspires you. Are you saying you shouldn't have done Zoolook as your first 8a?
Also the OP wants to "tick 8a", if that is the goal then getting on an 8a which inspires/motivates you, finding out if it suits you and what shortcomings you need to address to tick it seems completely sensible. I'm not sure why anybody would think this a bad thing to do?? If the goal was to become a well rounded 8a leader building up to 8a+, and beyond then yes the pyramid of routes that Shark is suggesting is sensible, and probably to an extent inevitable. But that wasn't the question.
I imagine that we all actually agree but are perhaps coming from slightly different interpretations of the OP's question???
In reply to ericinbristol: As several have alluded to, find one that inspires you, get on it, try the moves. If you get spanked, don't worry. Keep plugging away and things will soon click. Break it down into sections, find boulder problems which replicate the sections (preferably slightly harder ones) and work them. Go for links of increasing length. Take the positives from each session, however small they may be. Above all never give up. The journey is important. A flash is nice but a siege is more satisfying.
Andy F
Andy F
In reply to ericinbristol: Thought I'd throw in my tuppence worth. Although there are probably enough replies here to cover the whole spectrum of answers.
I climbed 8a in 2.5 sessions after having done 4 or 5 7cs in the past. It was at a crag I was really familiar with and the route suited me. Long, steep, mostly in a groove and the crux is only V4, any guesses?
Anyway I would say that i could have got on an 8a a year or two before, but the length of time needed to succeed would probably have been exponential, working backwards, but thats purely speculation.
I would say find one at a familar crag, that frequently has good conditions, that suits your style/ability and above all, one that youre passionate about doing!
Good Luck
I climbed 8a in 2.5 sessions after having done 4 or 5 7cs in the past. It was at a crag I was really familiar with and the route suited me. Long, steep, mostly in a groove and the crux is only V4, any guesses?
Anyway I would say that i could have got on an 8a a year or two before, but the length of time needed to succeed would probably have been exponential, working backwards, but thats purely speculation.
I would say find one at a familar crag, that frequently has good conditions, that suits your style/ability and above all, one that youre passionate about doing!
Good Luck
Something important that I've learned recently, is that there's a definite value in putting a grade on the back burner, dedicating time to being a better climber, and then re-approaching the same goal with the total confidence that it's within your grasp. You can either spend a year working a route and getting the tick, or you could put in a year's training and be cruising every one of that grade (depends on your self-imposed deadline).
By no means, I'm no expert on this (bad habits of throwing myself against the proverbial brick walls), but it seems like one final push and you'll crush every 8a in sight!
By no means, I'm no expert on this (bad habits of throwing myself against the proverbial brick walls), but it seems like one final push and you'll crush every 8a in sight!
In reply to ericinbristol: When ever you want to, simple.
In reply to Alex Mason: The Bulge, Kilnsey?
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