/ Climbers Dragon Den

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Denni on 28 Jan 2013
So then, you have to pitch an idea in the Dragons Den which is not the normal bunch but some famous climbers/mountaineers.

First of all I need you to come up with the 5 "Dragons" and then a half baked, or even a good, idea for something for climbing/mountaineering related.

I'm still thinking so I need someone to start me off :0)
john arran - on 28 Jan 2013
In reply to Denni:

You haven't thought this through at all have you? I can't even tell what your proposal is never mind the lack of business plan or IP protection.

For that reason ... I'm out.

;-)
Denni on 28 Jan 2013
In reply to john arran:

Good point! (starts mumbling about strategies, forecasts and some ice axe that turns into a distress beacon!)
Tom Last - on 28 Jan 2013
In reply to Denni:

You need Stevie Haston as a dragon I think.
Hardonicus - on 28 Jan 2013
In reply to Southern Man: And Norrie Muir
tlm - on 28 Jan 2013
In reply to Denni:

An ice axe, where you can fold the pick down when not in use, so that it is a less awkward shape for packing or carrying.
tlm - on 28 Jan 2013
In reply to Denni:

Some trousers with built in bouldering mat protection in the bottom.
tlm - on 28 Jan 2013
In reply to Denni:

cups filled with warm oil and rotating balls that will massage all those golfers elbows if you stick them in them... (ooo errrr missus)
tlm - on 28 Jan 2013
In reply to Denni:

An add on to a Tom Tom that automatically tells you the way to the nearest dry crag.
tlm - on 28 Jan 2013
In reply to Denni:

A snow shovel like a fan, so it folds up or folds out.
Tom Last - on 28 Jan 2013
In reply to Hardonicus:
> (In reply to Southern Man) And Norrie Muir

Ha! Yes, definitely.

Do we need a good cop to the bad cops? Messner?
Styx - on 28 Jan 2013
For the dragons, can we have:

- Stevie Haston
- Andy Kirkpatrick
- Dave Graham
- Timmy O'Neil
- Will Gadd

I would pay good money to watch that!
Monkey_Alan - on 28 Jan 2013
In reply to tlm:
> (In reply to Denni)
>
> An ice axe, where you can fold the pick down when not in use, so that it is a less awkward shape for packing or carrying.

It's been done!
http://www.climbers-shop.com/9931862/products/climbing_technology_alpico_emergency_axe.aspx
Seems like CT don't make it any more though...
tlm - on 28 Jan 2013
In reply to Monkey_Alan:

cheek! They stole my idea!
tlm - on 28 Jan 2013
In reply to Denni:

How about a rucksac with little wheels on the bottom, so you can pull it along in the airport on your way to Spain, yet lug it about once you are off piste?
tlm - on 28 Jan 2013
In reply to Denni:

and what about customised waterproofs? It wouldn't be that expensive if people put in all their measurements, chose from a range of options like pockets, colours etc, put it all online and it was fed straight to a computer operated coat making machine.
tlm - on 28 Jan 2013
In reply to Denni:

how about a partner matching service? You put in what grades you climb at, where you live, when you are free, what you are looking for (an easy day out, multi pitching, hard, technical moves or whatever) and it pairs you up like a dating site.
Tom Last - on 28 Jan 2013
In reply to Styx:
> For the dragons, can we have:
>
> - Stevie Haston
> - Andy Kirkpatrick
> - Dave Graham
> - Timmy O'Neil
> - Will Gadd
>
> I would pay good money to watch that!


Good, but we need a real old-timer in there. I like the suggestion of Norrie Muir, or Bonners maybe to replace Will Gadd.

Or what about Mark Twight...?

Think I might be taking this a bit too seriously! ;)
Timmd on 28 Jan 2013
In reply to tlm:
> (In reply to Denni)
>
> An ice axe, where you can fold the pick down when not in use, so that it is a less awkward shape for packing or carrying.

<In best baffled and grumpy Yorkshire voice>

''Has tha not got tools woman? Buy an axe tha can tek appart.''

(:-))........(;-))

tlm - on 28 Jan 2013
In reply to Southern Man:

What about throwing in Ken Wilson and one or the other of the Edwards? That would get things going...
tlm - on 28 Jan 2013
In reply to Timmd:

> ''Has tha not got tools woman? Buy an axe tha can tek appart.''

It's the putting it back together that is the issue....


Timmd on 28 Jan 2013
In reply to tlm:

Pat Little John and one of the Edwards could be an interesting mixture?
Timmd on 28 Jan 2013
In reply to tlm:
> (In reply to Timmd)
>
> [...]
>
> It's the putting it back together that is the issue....

Indeed, or the specific kind of axe you're after, I just wanted to pretend to be a baffled and grumpy Yorkshire person.(:-))

It'd be easier to explain it in person I think, i'll stop diverting the thread...
The Norris - on 28 Jan 2013
In reply to Denni:

Similar to the bouldering mat trousers idea i guess, but how about a rucksack you wear that has some sort of motion and proximity detectors, and when rapid descent is detected, a giant air bag envelopes you, softening a ground fall.

Could make lowering your mate of a route quite entertaining!
Timmd on 28 Jan 2013
In reply to The Norris:Heated gloves for digging your way out of an avalance could be handy.
Timmd on 28 Jan 2013
In reply to The Norris:Your idea might help give space in an avalance so if you deflate the air bag there's some air and room to work out which way is up, before digging a way out with the heated gloves. Sorted!
prog99 on 28 Jan 2013
In reply to Denni:

Ideal for those tricky corniced exits? No need to dodge round the side, just tunnel up.
http://www.oakleafmilitaria.com/images/104h3-1.jpg
deepsoup - on 28 Jan 2013
In reply to Mike_Watson_99:

If you're working hard and you get a bit of a dab on, that looks like it should whistle as the steam comes out.
TryfAndy on 28 Jan 2013
In reply to Denni:

Some kind of one-way system for a piss bottle that you can use in your sleeping bag without worrying about it tipping back out again when you 'withdraw' from it post-urination. And a furry cover for said piss bottle so it feels more like a hot water bottle against your feet afterwards.
bouldery bits - on 28 Jan 2013
In reply to Denni:

Something a bit like one of those oxyggen tents Pro cyclists sleep in but instead of giving me a ridiculous V02 I just want it to give me super strong forearms.
ads.ukclimbing.com
Double Knee Bar - on 28 Jan 2013
In reply to tlm:
> (In reply to Denni)
>
> Some trousers with built in bouldering mat protection in the bottom.

Been done

Pilko pump pants.
JIMBO on 29 Jan 2013
In reply to Timmd:
> (In reply to The Norris)Your idea might help give space in an avalance so if you deflate the air bag there's some air and room to work out which way is up, before digging a way out with the heated gloves. Sorted!

Already been done...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DKKqdgvsbf
wilkie14c - on 29 Jan 2013
In reply to Denni:
An ice screw that had some sort of spring arrangement betwix the end of the screw and the crab hanging plate so when you screwed in your 22 cm screw and it bottoms out after 18cm, the spring would push the plate against the ice rather that it being 4cm proud. This would illiminate the need for tying off screws.
Remember you read this here first and I'd prefer it if a British company ripped of my idea...
EeeByGum - on 29 Jan 2013
In reply to Denni:
> So then, you have to pitch an idea in the Dragons Den which is not the normal bunch but some famous climbers/mountaineers.
>
> First of all I need you to come up with the 5 "Dragons" and then a half baked, or even a good, idea for something for climbing/mountaineering related.
>
> I'm still thinking so I need someone to start me off :0)

If you think I am going to invest my children's inheritance in a half baked idea like this...
mkean - on 29 Jan 2013
In reply to Denni:
A few ideas...

What about a lunchbox that is tough enough to keep out the Dewerstone squirrel or perhaps has a few claymore mines built into it to keep the little bugger at bay?

A climbing rope with built in tazer for hurrying up your second.

Water soluble bolt cement for "leave no trace" sport climbers and people who want to narrow down off-widths.
tom_in_edinburgh - on 29 Jan 2013
In reply to Denni:

A deflated balloon connected to a cylinder of compressed helium and clipped to your harness by a short length of rope.

If you get out your depth you just have to scream in terror and the balloon inflates automatically. You then float about gently until your belayer pulls you down with the rope.
mkean - on 29 Jan 2013
In reply to tom_in_edinburgh:
A deflated balloon connected to a cylinder of compressed helium and clipped to your harness by a short length of rope.
If you get out your depth you just have to scream in terror and the balloon inflates automatically. You then float about gently until your belayer pulls you down with the rope.


I think you'll need a rather large balloon and helium tank.

http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=522791&v=1#x7047455

Andy DB - on 29 Jan 2013
In reply to Denni: I'd like the investment to go on a badly planned and poorly thought out expedition which is guaranteed to end badly. I then plan to make a fortune out of writing a book.
tlm - on 29 Jan 2013
In reply to TryfAndy:
> (In reply to Denni)
>
> Some kind of one-way system for a piss bottle that you can use in your sleeping bag without worrying about it tipping back out again when you 'withdraw' from it post-urination.

You might get trapped, like a lobster in a lobster pot!
pebbles - on 29 Jan 2013
In reply to Denni:

Airlie Anderson
Johnny Dawes
Andy K
Chris Tan (of www.kakibusok.plus.com/Equipment/index.htm)
Libby Peter (to be the Voice of Reason)
pebbles - on 29 Jan 2013
In reply to tlm:
> (In reply to Denni)
>
> how about a partner matching service? You put in what grades you climb at, where you live, when you are free, what you are looking for (an easy day out, multi pitching, hard, technical moves or whatever) and it pairs you up like a dating site.

It then matches you up with someone who climbs three grades lower than they wrote on their profile, wants you to lead everything and dropped their last three climbing partners, thus fully reproducing the online dating experience

nniff - on 29 Jan 2013
In reply to Denni:

You'd have to have Cesari Maestri - he'd go for anything with an engine and not care what anyone else thought...
CurlyStevo - on 29 Jan 2013
In reply to blanchie14c:
> (In reply to Denni)
> An ice screw that had some sort of spring arrangement betwix the end of the screw and the crab hanging plate so when you screwed in your 22 cm screw and it bottoms out after 18cm, the spring would push the plate against the ice rather that it being 4cm proud. This would illiminate the need for tying off screws.
> Remember you read this here first and I'd prefer it if a British company ripped of my idea...


The hanger could just be on a screw thread too?
John Rushby - on 29 Jan 2013
In reply to Denni:

How about

A thingy that gets the rope up first

A co2 powered bolt pistol

The self deploying arse parachute

An IPhone app that automatically updates eveything you do on grit

Sat nav upgrade called Crag Finder, with a specific upgrade for the Skoda Octavia

wilkie14c - on 29 Jan 2013
In reply to CurlyStevo:
> (In reply to blanchie14c)
> [...]
>
>
> The hanger could just be on a screw thread too?

Possibly, there would need to be a locking ring so the hanger locked up to enable it to be used as a handle when screwing in/out. Not a bad idea when you think of the advantages is it? :-)
colina - on 29 Jan 2013
In reply to mkean:
> (In reply to tom_in_edinburgh)
> A deflated balloon connected to a cylinder of compressed helium and clipped to your harness by a short length of rope.
> If you get out your depth you just have to scream in terror and the balloon inflates automatically. You then float about gently until your belayer pulls you down with the rope.
>
> I think you'll need a rather large balloon and helium tank.
>
> http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=522791&v=1#x7047455

I like this idea alot,This method could also be used for free climbing or self belaying. ie no need for a belayer or rope.

Coming down could be a problem though as well as being a hazard to low flying aircraft?
you,re on the right lines I think ,the idea just needs fine tuning..
colina - on 29 Jan 2013
In reply to mkean:
> (In reply to tom_in_edinburgh)
> A deflated balloon connected to a cylinder of compressed helium and clipped to your harness by a short length of rope.
> If you get out your depth you just have to scream in terror and the balloon inflates automatically. You then float about gently until your belayer pulls you down with the rope.
>
> I think you'll need a rather large balloon and helium tank.
>
> http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=522791&v=1#x7047455

I like this idea alot,This method could also be used for free climbing or self belaying. ie no need for a belayer or rope.

Coming down could be a problem though as well as being a hazard to low flying aircraft?
you,re on the right lines I think ,the idea just needs fine tuning..
colina - on 29 Jan 2013
In reply to mkean:
> (In reply to tom_in_edinburgh)
> A deflated balloon connected to a cylinder of compressed helium and clipped to your harness by a short length of rope.
> If you get out your depth you just have to scream in terror and the balloon inflates automatically. You then float about gently until your belayer pulls you down with the rope.
>
> I think you'll need a rather large balloon and helium tank.
>
> http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=522791&v=1#x7047455

I like this idea alot,This method could also be used for free climbing or self belaying. ie no need for a belayer or rope.

Coming down could be a problem though as well as being a hazard to low flying aircraft?
you,re on the right lines I think ,the idea just needs fine tuning..
mkean - on 29 Jan 2013
In reply to colina:
Helium will give you about 1kg of lift per m3 of gas...
Average person weighs about 70kg, so needs 70m3 of helium to offset that. Unfortunately you've got to carry the gas in cylinders. A 9m3 cylinder weighs about 85kg so you get 0.5kg of net lift per cylinder. 140 cylinders would be required to make you bouyant and you'd need at least another couple to make any noticable lift...
tom_in_edinburgh - on 29 Jan 2013
In reply to colina:
> (In reply to mkean)
> you,re on the right lines I think ,the idea just needs fine tuning..

First fine tuning. The balloon has a radius of 2.67m and is pre inflated with helium to give sufficient lift to balance an 80kg load. It is clipped to an anchor (or bag full of rocks) on the ground. The main climbing rope is hooked up to the balloon via a mechanism that allows it to pay out as the climber ascends and a second lighter tether rope also tied between the climber and ground anchor.

When the climber thinks they are about to fall they simply scream in terror and the electronics at the anchor releases the balloon which shoots up. When the line to the balloon comes tight the climber's weight is cancelled and they can drift slowly to the ground pulling themselves down to the anchor using the thether rope.

gribble - on 29 Jan 2013
In reply to Denni:

A midge repellant that really works.
tom_in_edinburgh - on 29 Jan 2013
In reply to mkean:
> (In reply to colina)
> Helium will give you about 1kg of lift per m3 of gas...
> Average person weighs about 70kg, so needs 70m3 of helium to offset that. Unfortunately you've got to carry the gas in cylinders. A 9m3 cylinder weighs about 85kg so you get 0.5kg of net lift per cylinder. 140 cylinders would be required to make you bouyant and you'd need at least another couple to make any noticable lift...

So the first fine tuning where the balloon and cylinders stay on the ground and the balloon is tied to the climber avoid the cylinder weight issue. To get 80kg of lift only 9 cylinders are needed.

Second fine tuning. Rather than try and cancel all the climbers weight and have them float down the system just aims to reduce the fall force enough so they can land safely. The air resistance as the climber drags the large balloon down will also have a parachute effect. So maybe it only needs 30 or 40kg of lift instead of 80, which would be 4 or 5 cylinders.

Still not quite there though....

deepsoup - on 29 Jan 2013
In reply to gribble:
> A midge repellant that really works.

There's always someone who ruins a thread like this by coming up with something *way* too far fetched. ;o)
colina - on 29 Jan 2013
In reply to mkean:
> (In reply to colina)
> . 140 cylinders would be required to make you bouyant and you'd need at least another couple to make any noticable lift...

I'm gonna invest in something else.
Tom youre idea is crap.


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