/ Lakes Conditions

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adamleedsuk - on 01 Feb 2013
Hi,

Given the recent thaw can anyone give me an idea on any routes that are in OK condition - grade ii/iii. We were in central gully 2 weeks ago and the ice in parts was in good condition (20cm screws) so I'm wondering how much is still there.....

Also has the snow now calmed down or is still a bit volatile in gully's?
CurlyStevo - on 01 Feb 2013
CurlyStevo - on 01 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
Lots of snow forecast today on strong west veering northerly winds so you may want to avoid gullies/slopes in general especially NE -> E -> S -> SW
adamleedsuk - on 01 Feb 2013
In reply to CurlyStevo: Thanks, where are you getting the 'lots of snow forecast for today'? Checking the met forecast and it doesn't read like that. I may have missed something though.
CurlyStevo - on 01 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
OK should have said threat of lots of snow forecast for today.

http://www.mwis.org.uk/uajcibjgsayrazhy/LD.PDF
CurlyStevo - on 01 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
met mountain seems more certain of snow for the lakes
http://www.metoffice.gov.uk/loutdoor/mountainsafety/lakedistrict/lakedistrict_latest_pressure.html

"Showers becoming more frequent and widespread for a time by midday,"
adamleedsuk - on 01 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Back to the original point does anyone know what conditions winter routes are in the lakes? Complete thaw, thaw re freeze? Good ice in places.....

And can anyone recommend anything for tomorrow that may be in OK condition.
Wesley Orvis - on 01 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Just my opinion but most high up gullies facing north and east should be in, with the low temps forecast for Saturday and the remaining snow refreezing it should be blue skies, bullet hard neve, cloud inversions and the coves to yourself, maybe not, but did i say i was an optimist. My opinion any remaining snow which there is lots will be consolidated, i haven't been out since last Sunday so is just my opinion.
a lakeland climber on 01 Feb 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis:

Hmm, hardening existing snowpack with new snowfall ....

After you

ALC
Wesley Orvis - on 01 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

That's in grade I/II range don't know about ice in the harder gullies but judging off the Weatherline pics of Red Tarn looking semi frozen, i think there will be something left high up defo worth the walk in anyways.
Wesley Orvis - on 01 Feb 2013
In reply to a lakeland climber:

I did say my opinion, i which i am entitled to even if it is wrong. The gullies on Browncove had hardened up nicely last Sunday from slushy in the morning to a fairly decent crust good for climbing for the afternoon, i can't see all of this old snow having thawed and i didn't think there has really been a lot of fresh snow since then so i am still sticking to my above opinion.
adamleedsuk - on 01 Feb 2013
In reply to a lakeland climber:

Yes all depends on how much new snow falls I guess.

I'm thinking we might take a look at Gable Crag.
Wesley Orvis - on 01 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

What i am fed up of is people on here telling everyone else that nothing is in so they can have the crags to themselves, i have heard you at it and then seen you up there, busted, you know who you are.....
adamleedsuk - on 01 Feb 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis:

I was starting to get that feeling myself! It's my first post on here and I refrained from posting as it's rare to see people publishing route conditions.

And no one apart from yourself answered the question of what maybe in or not. I understand the risks of new snow on top of wind slab / compact and will take that into account, but that wasn't the question....
LakesWinter on 01 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Well if you look at the weatherline photo from yesterday quite a few routes look in on the Red Tarn Face, but I've not been out myself since Sunday so no personal reports sorry
a lakeland climber on 01 Feb 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis:

Looking at the BBC forecast for Ambleside - Saturday looks good, Sunday looks as if there will be snowfall (dunno how much) at higher levels early in the day so there could well be a few avalanches. The wind direction is also going to shift a lot. Depending on how hard the existing pack is the new snow could stick enough to build up. Then again it may slough off continously.

I'm not saying that there won't be anything in condition, just that on Sunday gullies do not look the safest bet at the moment.

ALC
rdrjones - on 01 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
> (In reply to a lakeland climber)
>
> Yes all depends on how much new snow falls I guess.
>
> I'm thinking we might take a look at Gable Crag.

Gable has a tend to strip very quickly with the type of weather we've just had.
adamleedsuk - on 01 Feb 2013
In reply to rdrjones:

Thanks, great advice, haven't done much stuff up Gable. When people refer to the north side of Helvellyn range where are they generally referring to? I've done stuff on the N side of Fairfield and the south side of striding edge but nothing on the other side.
Simon Caldwell - on 01 Feb 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis:
> What i am fed up of is people on here telling everyone else that nothing is in so they can have the crags to themselves

Makes a change from those who climb routes in marginal condition and then post to say how fantastic conditions are :)
mmjohn - on 01 Feb 2013
Anyone been down Riggindale...to blea water area. Wondered if the gullies were washed out or in condition there?
rdrjones - on 01 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
> (In reply to rdrjones)
>
> Thanks, great advice, haven't done much stuff up Gable. When people refer to the north side of Helvellyn range where are they generally referring to? I've done stuff on the N side of Fairfield and the south side of striding edge but nothing on the other side.

Generally the Red Tarn area, between Striding edge and Swirral edge.
Have a good day.

LakesWinter on 01 Feb 2013
In reply to mmjohn: Based on what I saw last Sunday then I reckon that Racecourse Gully will be in but it's only 50m long! The other icefalls are unlikely based on the state they were in on sunday
A Mountain Journey - on 01 Feb 2013
In reply to LakesWinter:
Been out into Brown Cove Crags and over Raise this afternoon. Although the snow is patchy, what's there is feeling pretty solid (although I didn't dig any pits to test bonding).
Some cornicing going on at the top of Brown Cove Crags, hard to see how big due to low cloud. A few photos here: http://mark-mountainjourneys.blogspot.co.uk/2013/02/a-winters-afternoon-on-brown-cove-crag.html

It was raining by the time I got back into the valley (5pm), likely that'll be falling as snow higher up.

Mark
andreadawn on 01 Feb 2013
I'm a walker rather than a climber, but was out on the Scafells & Gable yesterday. Even on the tops of the Scafells snow cover was patchy. A couple of hard patches on the Pike but most of it had the consistency of damp granulated sugar. Some snow in the gullies of Great End still although it looked a bit thin in places with a bare patch half way up. Gable had virtually no snow at all except for a few small soggy patches near the summit. Don't know if that helps anyone.

Andrea Collins
redsonja - on 01 Feb 2013
In reply to andreadawn: it helps me plan my tuesday off andrea- thanks
stuart58 - on 01 Feb 2013
In reply to heidi123: is great end worth a look
A Mountain Journey - on 02 Feb 2013
In reply to heidi123: Been out on Helvellyn today. Wind scoured summit plateau, but some accumulations in hollows and on lee slopes. A few photos from today here: http://mark-mountainjourneys.blogspot.co.uk/2013/02/an-icy-day-around-helvellyn-saturday.html

Mark
Etak - on 02 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: out running on Scafell today - the snow that is left is in very good shape - bullet hard neve- met some folks who had had a good trip up custs gully on great end. Looks like the north facing gullys are holding snow - but not much else is - was ice about today - but again not sure what the conditions we like. No rain / or snow so far tonight in wasedale
Wesley Orvis - on 02 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Had a great day on Browncove Crags today, bullet hard neve and fully frozen turf, did Left Parallel Gully which was complete and neve bottom to top and a variant of Stepped Ridge, missing the icey bits out as the ice wasn't climbable, so just picked out frozen turf, snow patches and rock up the central butress to the top. Great day, blue skies and about minus 5 on top. Not as much snow left in the other gullies as i expected, the thaw has been quite substantial on Browncove Crags but Red Tarn Face looked to have held onto a lot more but was a lot more popular too.
stuart58 - on 02 Feb 2013
In reply to Wesle
On great end today did central right hand branch more like 3/4 left hand looked in. The midddle litch up to the amperpheatre is a good 2/3 mixed the routes are well above their grades
Wont b there much longer.

Fantastic day out sun all day
adamleedsuk - on 02 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: well well well, brown cove crags was in exactly the conditions Wesley described!!! Good to see you up there by the way, sorry for beating you to the queue for it :-).

Certainly not perfect ice but good enough for a great day out with blue skis and not a sniff of snow or dangerous conditions - in fact the complete opposite. If it does snow heavy the pack is extremely compacted so bear in mind.
Ste_b1978 - on 02 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Nethermost cove was in good nick today, did nethermost gully which was in great condition with an easy top out as the main cornice was avoidable, red tarn area in good nick too.
Mitch1990 - on 02 Feb 2013
Would brown cove be a good idea tomorrow from the conditions seen today? looks like its warming up though to :(
MB
Wesley Orvis - on 02 Feb 2013
In reply to mitchellbowen1990:

If you get there well early before the thaw kicks in i imagine it will be exactly the same as it was today, also depends how much snow falls tonight aswell, if i hadn't been up there five days in the last ten i would give it another shot, but i have decided to have a snoop around Angle Tarn Gully and the Bowfell area, very early, before the temps are due to rise.
adamleedsuk - on 02 Feb 2013
In reply to mitchellbowen1990: From what we did today which was grade II it should be fine tomorrow, havent seen the forecast but unless there is heavy snow I can't see it being much different.

As ever double check the forecasts and re-evaluate conditions :-).
Wesley Orvis - on 02 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Hi Adam, yes nice to have crack with you today, we ended up finding a nice route up the central Buttress a slightly different version of the Stepped Ridge, some of the people on here giving advice haven't left their arm chair for the last 20 years yet alone climbed anything lately. Was Left Branch any good in the end? we couldn't be bothered queueing, but was very happy with the two routes we did.
LakesWinter on 02 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Ok, here's a report from Great End today. The depth of snow in the higher parts of the gullies is very good. Some of the ice pitches are thin. South East Gully is not complete. The steep mixed climbs are not really rimed, although the Chimney finish to Central is pretty verglassed.

We climbed Central Middle way, probably tech 4 for 2 moves atm but good belays. We also climbed the upper icefall finish to Window Gully after deciding the Wall and Groove finish was too thin and brittle. Some ice in Window was very brittle and platey, although as a whole the normal route on Window is well banked out atm. We came down Custs and Branch gullies, both of which had lots of good neve in them.
adamleedsuk - on 02 Feb 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis: It was Neve top to bottom in the gully but very good considering!!!There was a couple of ice sections which took 20cm Screws. All in all a great day!!!
dougyt26 - on 02 Feb 2013
In reply to Ste_b1978: Ste_b1978 i think i might have seen u climb up it i was 30 mins behind you did you cut across from the end of striding edge.
grate conditions consolidated snow top out was easy to just traversed right to miss out the dodgy bit of the cornice.
Tom W - on 02 Feb 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis:

We were also at Brown Cove this afternoon - hello Wesley! It was my friends first winter climbing (via Ambleside to buy boots!). We soloed the far left gully which was fun and easy grade 1, then climbed Central Gully. The bottom ice pitch was interesting, then bomber neve to the top with a few short icy slabs that would be covered in snowier conditions. Steep exit. Grade 2 overall. Unsure how it'll fare tomorrow. Mwis forecast is quite warm, and very windy.
Wesley Orvis - on 02 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Hi Tom nice talking to you today, he seemed to fare well on the descent gully for a first climb, great day on the crag and the conditions look pretty good for the long term too......happy climbing!
Wesley Orvis - on 03 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

It's all over now, was plus 8 on top of Stoneycove Pike today, went for a big hike and even Helvellyn east face looked stripped by the end of the day, we need another big dump of snow to survive the predicted freeze/thaws.
paraffin on 03 Feb 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis:

> It's all over now

There is still enough of a snow pack around - enough to ski on.
sse:
http://www.winterhighland.info/publicreports/index.php?50,3256

The forecast is for it to cool down Sunday night to +3 in the valleys with a further cooling on Monday night. A predicted 20 cm snow on higher ground is due. Winter is far from over, if you really know what you are talking about in specific terms.
Petarghh - on 03 Feb 2013
In reply to parafinn: Definitely could get interesting this week with a dumping forecast tomorrow up high, with strong W through N winds into next week.

maybe not much good for gullys or ice... but the mixed should come good

A good week to have off work :)

Pete.
Petarghh - on 03 Feb 2013
Ste_b1978 - on 04 Feb 2013
In reply to dougyt26: Hi No we walked up from Grisedale, it was good though eh?
dougyt26 - on 04 Feb 2013
In reply to Ste_b1978: Thats the way we came in too must have been some one else when we started there was no one in sight every one must have bin in Brown cove.
paraffin on 05 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

After Sunday night's (almost) devastating thaw. By Monday the freezing level dropped to c. 650 m. Any remaining snow patches - mainly on N & NE have had a layer of graple onto a hard icey surface, followed on Tuesday by heavy wet snow. So care will be required on N & NE slopes which have the underlying old snow.
Otherwise shaping up for some really good sport on the fells.

Davie
paraffin on 05 Feb 2013
bump
jowzed - on 05 Feb 2013
There was a small amount of wet snow in Keswick this morning. Got up to Brown Cove Crags just as it started to snow and went up Left Branch. We exited the gully 3/4 of the way up due to the snow filling in the gully. More snow down at Thirlmere when we returned but none in Keswick.
Jerry67 - on 05 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Plenty of snow in Red Tarn Cove, in places new snow on top of old consolidated snow. Visibility was not great, so I had a bit of difficulty finding Red Tarn crag! Eventually ended up on Swirral Edge which was good fun.
J
Tom the tall on 06 Feb 2013
In reply to Jerry67: climbed Central Gully on Brown Cove crags today. There is new snow from yesterday, but the northerly wind has scoured the north facing gullies of the crag, leaving refrozen old snow, some new, powdery snow in places, and lean conditions. However, it is cold, the initial entry to the gully is a short water ice step and the turf is frozen high up where needed due to lack of snow. Very strong northerly wind today, and strong west wind when the snow was falling yesterday. Suspect east aspects will be loaded with wind slab but wind prevented us venturing over the top to red tarn area for a ready. Worth the trip up.
Tom the tall on 06 Feb 2013
In reply to Tom the tall: 'ready' should have been reccy, bloody auto fill!
kyaizawa - on 06 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Anyone had a look at the Western Lakes?? Wasdale/Scafell direction?? Heading that way at the weekend.
BnB - on 06 Feb 2013
In reply to Tom the tall:

Were you one of a pair on Central Gully I waved to? I walked 200m past and solo-ed the ridge between the two parallel gullys (Parallel Ridge??). It was a delicate II thanks to the unconsolidated powder resting on negatively inclined strata. And very windy in the top half. But a satisfying route.

I went on over Helvellyn and did Swirral and Striding Edges in the company of a team (James, Robert?) whom I'd seen on Stepped Ridge earlier. The aretes were in sporting nick with a mix of plastic ice and soft snow. The cornice, though substantial, seemed well bonded today, but the exit ramp above Striding Edge was obscured by drifts and offered an unappetising descent so we did the round clockwise and took the nastier ramp uphill.

Lakes looked wonderful. Snow down to about 300m everywhere. Great views. Plenty of exercise. All in all a cracking day.
Jonny Nick - on 06 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Anybody any thoughts on Saturday / Sunday. Looks like could be warming up a little, but any suggestions for what could be in would be much appreciated. Cheers
rockandroad - on 06 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
Was up on Pavey Ark and Pike of Stickle area today, only walking, lots of fresh snow about. Had a play around in the snow and about a meter of snow in some gullies on the remnants of previous compacted snow. Snow pack slipped whilst digging test pit, lots of slab (not a surprise). All very scenic and everything covered as far as we could see, scafell, great end, great gable etc. Will it still be there on my next day off in 12 days...
Ksop - on 08 Feb 2013
I'm looking to head to great end this weekend, has and one been up in the past couple of days?

Thanks
Tom W - on 08 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Went for a mid-morning post night shift mooch to Low Water Crag today. Unsurprisingly, Low Water Beck is just that, a beck. I went to look at Percy's Passage - generally good ice. Turf mixed, snow mixed. I was solo so skirted the crux as a fall would have been very interesting, but I was happy on the rest of it. Obviously, no need to place screws so can't comment on that. It was mild today, although the wind was nippy, beautiful sunshine, clouds above the summits. Dow was black, didn't bother with a closer inspection as the gullies looked fairly empty and incomplete, and I was short of time. Central fells looked much whiter, but my eyesights appalling. A drop of a few degrees will make the climbing there excellent. Road to Walna Scar car park was fine at 11am. Cafe in town does excellent tiffin.
A Mountain Journey - on 08 Feb 2013
In reply to Tom W:
Been at Brown Cove Crag most of the day, excellent conditions. The link has a few photos and brief description:
http://mark-mountainjourneys.blogspot.co.uk/2013/02/fresh-air-learning-in-winter-wonderland.html

Have a great weekend

Mark
tripehound - on 08 Feb 2013
In reply to A Mountain Journey:
Did Window Gully on Great End on Thursday. Good conditions with plenty of ice. Central gully looked complete and had some ice. SE gully looked complete but the ice pitch although centainly doable looked a tad thin.
Looks Ok for the weekend weather permitting
Petarghh - on 08 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: DId Thrash corner on Dollywaggon yesterday. very good conditions, with good neve and bomber turf. Pleasantly surprised by the conditions in general as I wasnt expecting much! I would expect the whole helvellyn range to be in decent nick (if you pick the right routes), V - corner, gully lines etc should be a go if it stays cold.
Djhartley - on 08 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Went for a wander up onto Helvelyn today, ascended via The Tongue onto Dollywagon this route gets little traffic but is a pleasent way of ascending up to the plateau area, plenty of snow, both new and old, wind has played a big part in shifting the recent stuff so plenty of slab however easily recognisable and avoidable, noted raised footsteps in a few areas on the paths. Dropped down Swirral and climbed No1 Gully, narrows is well filled in and route is well scoured from top to bottom. An enjoyable day with good weather.
Ksop - on 09 Feb 2013
In reply to tripehound: Thanks for that, going to have a walk up in the morning and see how the wether is.
stuart58 - on 09 Feb 2013
In reply to Petarghh: did 1pitch on great end today mates did window gully fantastic conditions. Gone soft niw the snow
goose299 - on 09 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
Anyone else been out today? Heading up to dollywagon tomorrow
A Mountain Journey - on 09 Feb 2013
In reply to goose299: Was at the base of Brown cove crag today. Plenty teams on the routes, buttress climbs & gullies. Conditions on the snow slopes at the base were very good, although the snow was getting damp as the day wore on. The gully lines all looked fine too. There's some fresh snow about, must've fallen last night / early hours. V light rain at 700m this afternoon, quite a warm day too.
lithos on 09 Feb 2013
In reply to goose299:

did dolly chimney toady. Its very doable but the snow isnt great wet snow 4 in deep sitting on neve (wont slide though). Ice higher up but melting (and raining - very very lightly but not snow). Turf is mixed some great some other not so great.

A good day out but nows what tomorrow will bring !
chris smith - on 09 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: did south east gully on great end today the middle ice pitch was fully formed but the temperature was at 4 degrees and there was certainly thawing taking place as the day wore in. Still in nick tho and worth a go.
Dave Richards - on 10 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
I did left parallel gully on Brown Cove Crags and Gully 2 on Red Tarn yesterday. Both were in good nick with a dusting of fresh snow on top of good neve. Top of Gully 2 had some ice hidden under the snow which spiced things up slightly.
goose299 - on 10 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
went up to dollywagon today, bomber turf but visibilty was awful (20-30mtrs) at best and one hell of a wind. Snowing up high for most of the day so a lot of fresh unconsolidated snow kicking around.
threepeaks - on 10 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: New blog post on our trip into Scrubby yesterday:
http://wp.me/p14X6I-Al

Dave
crowberry gully - on 10 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Intended to climb on High Crag but looking at the descent from the ridge in the white out with spindrift blasting in on the East wind put us off, so went up Helvellyn (no one else up there) and descended to Browncove Crags which was sometimes sheltered and had 8 folk climbing. Climbed Right Buttress Crack, conditions were excellent: ice, neve, bomber turf, spindrift to make it full conditions.
masa-alpin - on 11 Feb 2013
We climbed in Scafell Crag on Saturday. The condition in the morning was excellent, however by the time we topped out at 4pm the turfs were softened badly (the temperature stayed slightly above freezing (+1-2 deg) all day in Scafell crag). In rained all night on Saturday and in the Sunday morning the crag looked more black than Saturday from Wasdale. Hardknott Pass was passable at Sunday midday, but its extention to Langdale was covered with snow high up (hence impassable without snow equipment on the car). The difference was staggering. #lakeswinter
The Blue Bucket - on 11 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Did V corner above Red Tarn Helvellyn on Saturday, excellent condition until later in the day when it was starting to soften a little, plenty ice (enough to place screws) should be even better this week if the forecast is to be believed.
LakesCameraAction - on 11 Feb 2013
In reply to crowberry gully:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fEKuMK5ROgc Brown Cove crags yesterday. Things looking a bit more welcoming today. There's even some blue sky over Ambleside. Things looking good for the next couple of days.
mook456 - on 11 Feb 2013
im looking to head to the dollywagon area this wednesday, any reports on how the gullies are looking at the moment? cheers
kyaizawa - on 11 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Was at Scafell Crag too both Saturday and Sunday. Saturday was as described above - ok conditions in the morning, thawing through the day and we watched the ice smear on Bottrill's Slab visibly disappear before our eyes. Sunday, there was a bit of fresh powder around and the turf had reconsolidated, but snow through the day meant that by the evening, everything was just choked in deep, soft and unstable powder (made coming down Deep Ghyll interesting)!!
pistol on 11 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
Up at Brown Cove Crag today; Left Branch (I think, the topo in my guide is confusing) which was fun.
The thaw on Saturday has turned to very nice snow/ice.

Though snow is blowing around a lot no dangerous wind slab in the gully or cornice.

First time I've ever felt I needed my axes to stop myself blowing away mind.
goose299 - on 11 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
Anyone been up great end way today?
goose299 - on 11 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
Really? No-one?
j.kinnear - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to goose299: Planning on heading that way on friday. I you get there before then - let me know how it was for you!
In reply to adamleedsuk:
Good neve conditions today Red Tarn area of Helvellyn. No. 2 gully has a good pitch.
Bad news- weather going down hill tomorrow with thaw forecast day after.
In reply to Last Thursday:
Sorry, I meant Gully 1 left of Viking Buttress
goose299 - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to j.kinnear:
Fantastic conditions on Great End today
paddy cave - on 13 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Some good mixed conditions on Gable and Green Gable yesterday. Engineers Slab area wasn't there but looked close, could be changing with fresh snow falling now though?!

see - http://www.mountaincircles.blogspot.co.uk/
j.kinnear - on 13 Feb 2013
In reply to goose299: Thanks for the info. I guess conditions will be different on friday but there will be snow of some variety.
goose299 - on 13 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
Snowing pretty hard in Ambleside this morning
peas65 - on 13 Feb 2013
In reply to goose299:

Well the snow is about 4 inch deep just outside KEndal, must be putting a lot down in the lakes, could be some interesting conditions around tomorrow.
Andy Can - on 13 Feb 2013
In keswick it's washing away fast...on the hills around here it's also thinning out quickly. Hopefully on the highest ground there'll be some conditions left tomorrow.
ads.ukclimbing.com
Etak - on 13 Feb 2013
In reply to Andy Can: been snowing all day here in kendal - but just turning to rain...
oldcheese - on 14 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: How are conditions up there? Is there any point in bringing my axes and crampons for the week. It looks cold enough but is there enough snow to last?

Can someone help?
bullybones - on 14 Feb 2013
In reply to oldcheese:
Plenty of snow left on the tops and in gullies, but it was thawing like mad today on Red Screes. Just about frozen on top, but below 600m melting quick and soggy as f. Night-time freezes needed!
Andy Syme - on 15 Feb 2013
In reply to bullybones: I'm planning on coming up tomorrow (Sat) for the day. Is it still ok higher up or is everything going fast?
Wesley Orvis - on 15 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Still loads of snow just need a re-freeze.
Andy Syme - on 15 Feb 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis: OK, fingers will be firmly crossed for clear cold skies tonight. Thinking/hoping I'll find something to play on round Helvellyn (Brown Cove, Red Tarn etc)
Darren Jackson - on 15 Feb 2013
In reply to somebody, anybody:

Is Sarah Nelson's still open in Grasmere?
Wesley Orvis - on 15 Feb 2013
In reply to Andy Syme:

Same, see you there!
gear boy - on 15 Feb 2013
In reply to Darren Jackson: Gingerbread, yes, dont forget to ask for broken bits as its cheaper and pick up a bag of crumbs for your cheesecakes and crumbles to add a little flavour!
kyaizawa - on 15 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Anyone got any idea about conditions around the Langdale, especially up on the Pikes - winter climbing, summer scrambling or generally neither?? Going to be in the area tomorrow and trying to decide what to take/expect!!
A Mountain Journey - on 15 Feb 2013
In reply to kyaizawa: Snow is melting, Pavey Ark looking black this afternoon. No doubt there'll be snow around but not be good for climbing, been about 7C and sunny in Ambleside today
Paluchi - on 15 Feb 2013
In reply to Andy Syme: Was up at Great End today, plenty of snow still about. It was stupidly mild today with snow and ice thawing rapidly at all levels. Met a couple of lads trying to swim thier way up south east gully, they bailed on it. Climbed window gully, lots of ice still about, bit delicate in places. Tho the right hand exit was fat and even took a few screws. It will freeze overnight (currently 2c in ambleside) but it will soon warm up during the day tomorrow, so if your planning on going out start EARLY. Oh and all the gullies on great end today had huge fracture lines running across them in several places, bit sketchy tbh. Wet slides are a real possibly if its as warm again tomorrow..
DSM - on 16 Feb 2013
Jusy been for a run up Dow Crag (was on top @ 16:00/Sat). There's still lots of patchy snow about but its sopping wet all the way down to the wet turf underneath. Temperature probably 5 or 6 degrees both on the tops & on the valley floor with everything shrouded in drizzly mist. Quite fun for running through but no climbing without a hard frost.

DSM
Wesley Orvis - on 16 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Did parallel gully rib on Browncove Crags today started early and turf was frozen and snow semi hard, freezing level rose to the summit just as we topped out:-) Gullies still loaded with fracture lines at the top and fairly big cornices, just waiting to go, still saw people going up them though:-(
sbc_10 - on 16 Feb 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis:

Re: parallel gully rib...Brown Cove Crags.
I looked at it last Winter as I was descending into the top end of Helvellyn Gill from Whiteside. Looks like an interesting line if the gullies are busy or mobile.

How did you find it? Is grade II a fair description?
Wesley Orvis - on 16 Feb 2013
In reply to sbc_10:

Yes felt a hard grade II today with all the fun at the top and an unprotected snow arete in the middle, snow wasn't perfect but turf was ok.
joe.91 - on 17 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: cold weather is forecast from wednesday, much snow left up there to freeze for next weekend or is it all gone?
BnB - on 17 Feb 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis:
> (In reply to sbc_10)
>
> Yes felt a hard grade II today with all the fun at the top and an unprotected snow arete in the middle, snow wasn't perfect but turf was ok.

In many ways the snow arete is the crux. Not exactly confidence-inspiring under loose snow.
kyaizawa - on 17 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Was (walking) in Langdale yesterday - plenty of snow still left above 700ish on Crinkle Crags and Bowfell. North-facing gullies holding reasonably firm snow but fracture lines visible and a bit wet/melting on top surface. Turf definitely not in at all. A good cold spell would bring many routes back into (good) condition after this recent thaw.
Ross McGibbon - on 17 Feb 2013
In reply to sbc_10:
II is a fair description. I've done it twice and it is a pleasant way up the cove. The top wall looks big as you approach but is small.
Wesley Orvis - on 17 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Went up Bowfell today freezing level at about 800m, had a look up South Gully snow pretty firm on top but loose underneath, fracture lines all over the place on every slope and angle, so walked around to Angle Tarn and had a look up Angle Tarn Gully same crack there, the area around Angle Tarn is absolutely loaded with snow and lots of ice all over the place, all we need is a good freeze, there is stil plenty of snow all over the mountains above 700m not just on norh facing crags either and it's still deep, ended up walking up Ore Gap and my hesitation in climbing the gullies proved correct witnessed the aftermath of a massive avalanche on the right side of Ore Gap from the cove on Esk Pike, 4ft deep crown wall and about 100m long, small car size blocks, unbeleavable for the Lakes not seen out like it apart from the North Face of the Ben avalanches. Beautiful day in the Lakes with cloud inversions, views for miles, blue skies, dry rock and felt very Alpine (i imagine as never been).
sbc_10 - on 18 Feb 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis and Ross :

Here is a conditions picture of Brown Cove crags from Sunday 17th Feb.
Snow had firmed up overnight and the gully routes were straightforward.
There was a bit of strength in the Sun today and so things did start to soften if exposed.
http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=213658

A team were in Central Gully at about two'ish in the afternoon.
adamr - on 18 Feb 2013
any body been over gable crag way,any info on that area in particular would be great thanks.
joe.91 - on 18 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: anybody been over to dollywagon on Tarn Crag?
paulh.0776 - on 18 Feb 2013
In reply to adamr: Hi Adam, We were over on Great End yesterday (Sun 17th)and went up Skew Gill, Custs and One Pitch Gully, the snow was firm all the way and got better with height. Most ice that we saw had water running under it, but a group on Window Gully did the Icefall finish ok. THere is quite a bit of the white stuff up there so I'm sure you'll have a great time. Great Gable looked a bit short of snow (not surprisingly) on its south side. images at http://paulhorsmanphotographer.blogspot.co.uk
A Mountain Journey - on 18 Feb 2013
In reply to adamr: Was on Green Gable yesterday afternoon. Gable crag was black
mook456 - on 18 Feb 2013
Anyone been up brown cove crags today? Looking to head there or dollywagon area on Wednesday hopefully. Any update on conditions most appreciated. Cheers
terragait - on 19 Feb 2013
In reply to markymark31:

This may help, upon Helvellyn Sunday, Langdale Pikes Monday, have been some freezing o/night snow with firm crust in gullies
https://picasaweb.google.com/106857179766850608653/Stock?authkey=Gv1sRgCNWn2_qDzcHUWA#58466870679734...
BnB - on 19 Feb 2013
In reply to terragait: Looks like Pinnacle Ridge is out then...
A Mountain Journey - on 19 Feb 2013
ads.ukclimbing.com
MFB - on 19 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Bowfell from Gimmer, monday afternoon
http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=213760
Wesley Orvis - on 20 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Kilnshaw Chimney on red Scree in fine condition this evening, the snow pack has firmed up nicely, the main danger now seem to be from crevasses where the snowpack has seperated from the mountain, some hollow sounding areas that are easy to fall through.
A Mountain Journey - on 21 Feb 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis: Skew ghyll was sounding a bit hollow in places on tuesday. Brown cove crag was in excellent condition yesterday though, and quite a few folk about too. Couple of photos from the day here: http://mark-mountainjourneys.blogspot.co.uk/2013/02/perfect-winter-conditions-at-brown-cove.html

Mark
Jontro - on 21 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Went up brown cove crag today did central gully and then on to Helvellyn and did gully 1 both in good condition. Central gully had mostly steps but there was enough room to play on some clean snow, good and compact. I should think these conditions are going to stay good for this weekend.
Mountain Llama - on 21 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Climbed central gully left hand at great end today. Other parties stayed right. Everyone reporting v good conditions but cool breeze.

Custs gully also climbed and looked in similar good nick.

Many thanks to the team from ambleside and london that let me sneak past!
Greenbanks - on 21 Feb 2013
In reply to Mountain Llama:

Anything on St Sunday? Greenhow End?
Mountain Llama - on 21 Feb 2013
In reply to Greenbanks: hard to tell what conditions like in patterdale, someone posted a pic of red tarn cove which looked ok
In reply to A Mountain Journey:
Was there myself today,excellent. Point I want to make is the alarming number of family parties attempting to get up and down an extensive snowslope just below the top of Brown Crag on the popular path down to Swirl How without crampons and axes. Most just had bendy boots and the odd stick between them.
I put my crampons back on to descend the slope , others just sat down and shuffled down best they could. Luckily nobody slipped, but there was a good run out onto exposed rocks at the bottom of the slope.
threepeaks - on 22 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: I've been up and around in Langdale the last couple of days. You can check out our conditions blog here: http://wp.me/p14X6I-AT
DANNYdjb on 22 Feb 2013
In reply to Last Thursday:
We watched somebody fall there a few weeks ago for the very reason you mention.
They looked like a spinning starfish until they hit the rocks.
luckily nothing broken but very shuck up with cuts and bruises.
MAD.

dan
professionalwreckhead - on 22 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Are the lower crags at Langdale (e.g. Scouts Crag, Raven Crag) free of snow and ice?

Down in the Lakes from this evening and fancied a bit of cold finger rock stuf.

Full moon addict - on 22 Feb 2013
In reply to professionalwreckhead: yes
professionalwreckhead - on 22 Feb 2013
In reply to Full moon addict:

brilliant, thanks
A Mountain Journey - on 22 Feb 2013
In reply to professionalwreckhead: The Langdale valley rock has been getting climbed this week, even looked warm in the sun!
Exile - on 22 Feb 2013
In reply to professionalwreckhead:

Much of the higher rock in Langdale is also free of snow - just with a wintery approach.
MFB - on 22 Feb 2013
In reply to Exile: climbed on gimmer, monday - stay in the sun - baltic and icy in shade
Radioactiveman - on 22 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Climbed at Raven Crag ( walthwaite ) today rock was good and dry on the whole
.Still a bit of ice on the lines that were seeping,dont know which ones they where but plenty to go at.

crowberry gully - on 22 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: On Dollywaggon North today. Very cold, snow was lovely neve, most routes were in good nick and there is a even small ice flow near Thrash Corner - a micro version of Ben Nevis ice. Good to meet NMM of this parish. Easy gullies on Tarn Crag were also being climbed but High Crag and Jogebar were quite black. Coniston and Scafell looked much whiter than hills further north.
Exile - on 22 Feb 2013
In reply to crowberry gully:

What did you / NMM get done?
crowberry gully - on 22 Feb 2013
In reply to Exile: South Gully, Ramp It Up, Solo Symphony, Thrash Corner
martinph78 on 23 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: I'm not climbing, but was going to do my first Fell run in the Langdales/Elterwater tomorrow. We've got a good few inches of snow on the ground this-morning and it is still falling here in the North East.

Just wondering what the ground was like over there at the moment of anyone can help. If there is deep snow and the paths are iced over I'll not bother, it will be above my level at the moment.

Thanks, Martin
Full moon addict - on 23 Feb 2013
In reply to Martin1978: at that height there's no snow. you'll be fine. :-)
martinph78 on 23 Feb 2013
In reply to Full moon addict: Great, that's what I needed to hear. Thanks.
DSM - on 23 Feb 2013
Just back from a morning trip to Great End.
Approached via Skew Ghyll in Wasdale which was banked out with snow all the way (does not happen that often).
Soloed Central Gully LH which was in fine form.
Soloed SE Gully which was rather thin & a little trickier than usual.
Soloed Window Gully which was in fine form.
Descent via Custs Gully which was also banked out.
Off the crag by 11AM before the crouds hit & back home for lunch.

DSM
Michael Griffith - on 23 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: I was thinking of a walk up Striding Edge next week. Can anybody tell me how much snow there is on it please ?
Mountain Llama - on 23 Feb 2013
In reply to Michael Griffith: There are usually pics on the lakes weather line site along with a conditions report
IainFP on 23 Feb 2013
In reply to Mountain Llama: Trip onto Scafell Pike via Long Gully. Absolutely superb neve, possibly amongst the best I've climbed on!
Teams on C Gully, looked good, A and B don't look complete.
Also, a pair on the Shamrock.
Sadly very few seemed to be carrying axes and I'd guess no crampons either. Beyond Hollowstones it was neve/ice all the way to the summit, the big red and grey taxi was in the valley, hope all was well but could imagine it'd be a day for "slips".
Petarghh - on 23 Feb 2013
In reply to IainFP: Was up on Great end today and also saw maybe 50% of people with no axe or crampons.
joe.91 - on 23 Feb 2013
In reply to DSM: How was the upper icefall finish on window gully?

Just got back from Tarn/Falcon crag and managed to do a (rare?) ascent of chock gully in great conditions. Plenty of ice up until the capstone then mixed moves to the slope above. Then never with na few turd steps until the top, great day out.
DSM - on 23 Feb 2013
In reply to joe.91:
Window Gully upper icefall looked fully formed. But it's only short!

DSM
ads.ukclimbing.com
Simon Theobald - on 23 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
We were on Direct Route, Scafell Shamrock, today which was in great condition. We witnessed two accidents today, one which needed the RAF helicopter, and both of which appeared to caused by lack of crampons. I do hope both have a speedy recovery
joe.91 - on 23 Feb 2013
In reply to DSM: excellent, after an easy day tomorrow. Today was pretty full on.
Wesley Orvis - on 23 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Did Gully no.2 and Gully no.3 on Tarn Crag Helvellyn today, neve all the way bottom to top and nice steep snow leading up to the gully's as well, top pitch of gully no.3 felt like hard II, gully no.2 was an easy snow plod. Fresh snow falling down to about 500m all day and ice on the path from Dumail Raise upwards, met lots of nice people on the hill great conditions, great atmosphere, cracking day!!!!!!
stuart58 - on 23 Feb 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis: is dollywaggon gully in?
Wesley Orvis - on 23 Feb 2013
In reply to stuart58:
> (In reply to Wesley Orvis) is dollywaggon gully in?

Yes a team said it was in perfect condition and easy III today



Wesley Orvis - on 23 Feb 2013
In reply to DSM:
> Just back from a morning trip to Great End.
> Approached via Skew Ghyll in Wasdale which was banked out with snow all the way (does not happen that often).
> Soloed Central Gully LH which was in fine form.
> Soloed SE Gully which was rather thin & a little trickier than usual.
> Soloed Window Gully which was in fine form.
> Descent via Custs Gully which was also banked out.
> Off the crag by 11AM before the crouds hit & back home for lunch.
>
> DSM

What did you have for breakfast?
Tom the tall on 23 Feb 2013
In reply to Simon Theobald: keswick mrt report 5 incidents dealt with today across the lakes of people slipping on high mountain paths. They were dealing with one on the third mere side of Helvellyn, link: http://www.keswickmrt.org.uk/rescues/2013.htm#latest
jas wood - on 23 Feb 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis: had the exact day stated a few weeks back and was amazed at how quick they go when moving. Cracking day it was.
IainFP on 23 Feb 2013
In reply to Simon Theobald:
> (In reply to adamleedsuk)
> We were on Direct Route, Scafell Shamrock, today which was in great condition. We witnessed two accidents today, one which needed the RAF helicopter, and both of which appeared to caused by lack of crampons. I do hope both have a speedy recovery

Could see you, and hear, you from Pikes Crag ;0)
Amazing how few seemed equipped for the conditions.
bullybones - on 23 Feb 2013
In reply to DSM:
I can add that the sweep of buttress between Central and Window gullies, heading up to Central Gully RH Arete, was in great go-anywhere condition (on Thursday) if crowd-avoidance tactics are needed.

On Blencathra, Foule Crag Gully was in yesterday - good snow with a couple of interesting steps thrown in. Sharp edge was icy here and there, mostly avoidably so.
paddy cave - on 23 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:


Some good ice up around Blea Water... some photos on here -

http://mountaincircles.blogspot.co.uk/2013/02/lakes-conditions-blea-water-23-02-13.html
McDuck on 24 Feb 2013
In reply to DSM: How much was in Skew Ghyll please? Recall someone earlier this week describing the steep exit slope as mixed because the snow had slumped off it? Cheers.
paulh.0776 - on 24 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

We did a recce to South Gully, Bowfell Buttress and North Gully yesterday. The snow was ok but there was powder under a thick crust.Hmmm... quite a lot of ice around on the crags, there were areas of solid neve which was nice but also areas of soft sugar. We intended to clmb North Gully but as the second pitch was playing hard to get (lack of snow to stand on under the chockstone) and as the time was getting on we retreated.

images of Bowfell Buttress, North Buttress, South Gully, and North Gully at

http://paulhorsmanphotographer.blogspot.co.uk
Mountain Llama - on 24 Feb 2013
DSM - on 24 Feb 2013
"mixed" is not a word I'd usually use to describe Skew Ghyll!
There was a section of a couple of metres of scrambley rock near the top I suppose. I did the whole thing in fell running shoes & it was basically a walk.

DSM
DSM - on 24 Feb 2013
Sunday report from Coniston fells:
Low Water Beck not yet climbable - but its only a few days away if the temperatures stay cold enough. Soloed Summit Route on Coniston Old Man in fell running shoes (for the umpteenth time!) which was quite a challenge due to having to kick steps in the hard neve all the way up.

DSM
Wesley Orvis - on 24 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Went up Zero Gully on Crinkle Crags today, easy snow plod with steep cornice finish, managed to get on steep snow next to Crinkle Gill at about 500m. Was a mixture of mainly neve with sugary patches here and there, blue skies most of the day and good views out west, ice forming all over the place just very thin at the moment, need another week of cold weather.
A Mountain Journey - on 24 Feb 2013
In reply to McDuck: The snow had indeed slumped from the exit slopes and I had described it as 'mixed'. This was a little tongue in cheek. However it was not at all straightforward and both crampons & axe was on rock for a few steep steps. I'd suspect it'll be similar
Exile - on 24 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Did the direct finish to Raven Crag Gully on Red Screes this morning. There was a little less ice than when I have done it previously, but still IV by the easiest line. There seems to be a lot of water ice around - Kirkstone Quarry ice falls looked like they were in. I don't know for sure but I suspect that there is quite a lot of water ice 'in' around the Lakes, this may be the week for Cold Climb classics for those with the time to go looking.
DSM - on 24 Feb 2013
I do agree about the amount of water ice about. The direct finish to Great Gully on Wasdale Screes looked almost complete from the road yesterday. I've no idea what things were like lower down though - I suspect soggy & wet...

DSM
Exile - on 24 Feb 2013
In reply to DSM:

To be fair though DSM, the direct finish to Great Gully isn't that high, nor the ice I climbed and saw today. I really don't know, but for those willing to look I think Raven Crag Gully, (Borrowdale) / Dove Crag Gully / Inaccesable Gully may be in given what I saw today and the fact that Chock Gully has been climbed.
stuart58 - on 24 Feb 2013
In reply to Exile: did dollywaggan gully today fantastic conditions although top a bit cruddy
Exile - on 24 Feb 2013
In reply to stuart58:

Did you look into Chock Gully?
climber34neil - on 24 Feb 2013
In reply to Exile: was in borrowdale yesterday, sourmilk gill was frozen although not sure how fat it was
joe.91 - on 24 Feb 2013
In reply to Exile: I was up chock gully yesterday, great conditions. Good ice to just beneath the capstone then tricky moves until the slope above. Then good a few turf/ice steps till the top, turf fully frozen.
In reply to Exile:
Innaccessible gully had no ice on it when I drove past on friday. It gets the sun too much. Black Crag icefall also had only a sliver of ice extending 2/3 of the way down. DCG will have more though...

NMM
Jim Haydock - on 25 Feb 2013
In reply to paddy cave:
Hey Paddy, thanks for that. Am off out tomorrow on the strength of the weather.
Hope you had a great time at the CIC - we certainly did. Awesome conditions and bet the film crew enjoyed it !! (think he did ) We certainly did - wish we were still there.
Good to watch you on the (thin) curtain - awesome.
Jim H (frcc)
Exile - on 25 Feb 2013
In reply to Northern Mountain Monkey:

Thanks NMM, good to know.
In reply to DSM:

Is there any snow left in the gullies on Wasdale screes?

Thanks

NMM
IainFP on 25 Feb 2013
In reply to Northern Mountain Monkey: No.
Scafell, Pikes crag, would guess Broad crag as well.
DSM - on 25 Feb 2013
On Saturday there was no snow at all visible in the screes gulles - just ice high up. Given the warm temperatures low down I doubt there's anything going.

DSM
In reply to DSM:
Yeah, that's what I was tending to think. It's just so tempting!!! It has had harder frosts in the W Lakes though...

Anybody been past Honister? Or seen the crags above Buttermere? Eagle's claw looks immense (more like Scottish VI?)

NMM
neil0968 on 25 Feb 2013
In reply to Northern Mountain Monkey: was up at honister Sunday nothing in at all its all been stripped freezing level was rising fast today forecast to be plus 2 at 900 meters tomorrow thought you should be be okay early on north and East aspects are best above 600 metres . was up at great end today very good conditions.
In reply to neil0968:
Yeah, that's what I suspected. Thanks for saving the drive though! Was there much ice build up on the grooves to the left of SE gully?

NMM
David Cowley - on 25 Feb 2013
In reply to Northern Mountain Monkey: none of the the climbs on the buttress to the left of SE gully were in on Friday, zero snow or ice so wouldn't have thought much will have changed today. red tarn cove was in decent condition today unfortunately back to work tomorrow :-(
LakesWinter on 26 Feb 2013
In reply to David Cowley: More good info, thanks.
paddy cave - on 26 Feb 2013
Jim Haydock - on 26 Feb 2013
In reply to neil0968:
Great end is still hanging in there.
Today at least.
Left finish of central gully had lots of good ice in it today, as did window gully.
Don't know how long it will last in the warm (7 deg) temperatures though ?
Fingers crossed.
JH.
thegoatstroker - on 26 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: some good ice above angle tarn. Did cambridge crag climb after which was complete but a bit sugary in the afternoon.
paulh.0776 - on 27 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
I climbed Central Gully on Brown Cove Crags and Gully No.2 Red Tarn Cove Helvellyn yesterday (tues 26th). Everthing is in lovely condition, but with the warmer weather coming fast, its not going to last forever. The cold nights will help a lot, though any slopes that catch a hint of sun during the day will quickly loose any cover.

images at
http://paulhorsmanphotographer.blogspot.co.uk
3414peterk - on 27 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Central gully on great end was a treat today! Good snow, good ice. Other teams were enjoying the crag as well. It was very warm in the sun, so how long it will last in the gully, who knows..
Kelcat - on 27 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: just in from Red Tarn Cove.The gullys were great, as was the approach Catyscam Gully. As previously said though, anything touched by the sun is going to be gone fast.
This thread helped make today a better day, thanks to everyone who's contributed.
Jim Haydock - on 27 Feb 2013
In reply to Kelcat:
Catstycam gully ? - is that a new one ? Never heard of it and it isn't in the new winter lakes guide ?
simondgee - on 27 Feb 2013
In reply to Jim Haydock:
Tis the obvious 20' wide gully on the north facing side of CSC...grade I...but a great way to jump over to red tarn...
Crofty - on 27 Feb 2013
In reply to Jim Haydock: Its in the Logbook section and I think the official name is the NE Gully, I have known about it a while, but only got around to doing it on Sunday. Not in my guide either. A good approach to the routes on Helvellyn, you finish just East of Catstyecam's summit, leaving a short walk to the end of Swirral Edge, from where an easy traverse/descent can be made to the routes or tarn. Often quiet when the circus is in full swing over the other side, I counted nearly forty people in and around the tarn and was happy to be on my way back to the car having started early. Its worth a star or maybe two.
Kelcat - on 27 Feb 2013
In reply to Jim Haydock: what they said, beat me to it!
Makes for a more fun approach & a good warm up.
woodsy - on 28 Feb 2013
In reply to Kelcat:
Any chance of there still being snow/ ice at the weekend with this warmer weather?
jon59 - on 28 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Had a great day on Greatend today, the snow was stepped out but in great condition. I climbed central gully left branch with the Ice pitch being in good condition . Then climbed south east gully again great snow but stepped out , the chockstone provided a nice mixed section with the ice pitch intact, climbable, but thin. With the current weather pattern I reckon both should be climbable this weekend.
BnB - on 28 Feb 2013
In reply to jon59:
> (In reply to adamleedsuk) Had a great day on Greatend today, the snow was stepped out but in great condition. I climbed central gully left branch with the Ice pitch being in good condition . Then climbed south east gully again great snow but stepped out , the chockstone provided a nice mixed section with the ice pitch intact, climbable, but thin. With the current weather pattern I reckon both should be climbable this weekend.

Heading there myself on Saturday. Here's hoping your hunch is good.
Simon Caldwell - on 28 Feb 2013
In reply to BnB:

Be prepared to queue!
BnB - on 28 Feb 2013
In reply to Toreador:
> (In reply to BnB)
>
> Be prepared to queue!

Yeah, the whole world will be on Great End and Helvellyn!!

paulh.0776 - on 28 Feb 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

A beautiful Apline day on Nethermost and Helvellyn today, it'll definitely last into the weekend, there's plenty to go at with snow right over the centre of the Lakes.

Somes images from today at:

http://paulhorsmanphotographer.blogspot.co.uk
Exile - on 01 Mar 2013
In reply to paulh.0776:

Did you get a look into Chock Gully on Falcon Crag - I'm guessing not from the angle of your shots but thought I'd ask.
Jim Haydock - on 01 Mar 2013
In reply to Crofty:
Thanks for that Crofty/Simodgee
Will have a look at it on the way in next time - just to add a bit of interest on the walk-in :)
JH.
paulh.0776 - on 01 Mar 2013
In reply to Exile:

Hmm .....you may be ok in the gully, I nipped down into Cock Cove for a look but the slopes were softening fast in the sun so didn't stay for a good look.
Exile - on 01 Mar 2013
In reply to paulh.0776:

That's what I thought thanks, quite a long shot now. I've only got Sunday to play with and given the freezing level is going above the tops on Saturday and not coming back down until Sunday afternoon I may go and look elsewhere.
paulh.0776 - on 01 Mar 2013
In reply to Exile:
Just found this, Paddy Cave climbed the very thing yesterday andhas put pics and condition report on his blog.....looks like it'll ok yippee
http://mountaincircles.blogspot.co.uk/
Simon Caldwell - on 01 Mar 2013
In reply to paulh.0776:
> has put pics and condition report on his blog

thus guaranteeing long queues...
Exile - on 01 Mar 2013
In reply to paulh.0776:

Thanks for that.
ablackett - on 01 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: What do people know about Pinnacle Ridge on Gable?

My mate wants to climb it, but I don't know anything about the route. I know there is snow in gullies and on the summits, but is Pinnacle Ridge likely to be bare, with patches of frozen turf? How much of it is turf, and how much is rock/snow?

Thanks for any info.

Andy
ads.ukclimbing.com
Mountain Llama - on 01 Mar 2013
In reply to ablackett: Have climbed the route, its fine. I would guess its fairly black at present, have not seen it but climbed at dollywagon and great end in last week. So my answer based on observations. Best bet is to go for a gully line.
ablackett - on 01 Mar 2013
In reply to Mountain Llama: Thanks, that's what I though.
DSM - on 02 Mar 2013
Saturday 2nd March.
Brief report from an early morning run up Coniston Old Man to catch the sunrise (which was beautiful!).
The shady slopes still hold a lot of iron-hard neve which will render the tourist paths rather slippery later today I think (crampons advisable for descent). For climbers there are a multitude of easy snow routes climbable from Low Water up to the summit all at around I/II, but the snow will soften during the day. Perfect conditions for walking/running really. Low Water beck is a waterfall. Enjoy.

DSM
sbc_10 - on 02 Mar 2013
In reply to DSM:

Good work DSM. We need more like you. Thanks for the heads-up.
Exile - on 02 Mar 2013
In reply to sbc_10:

Chock Gully on Falcon Crag this morning, think NMM and LakesWinter from this shire folowed us up it. In 'lean' mode at the moment - good ice and snow most of the way, but the chock stone moves were snow free. About IV 5 at present. I don't think it's going to be there much longer given how warm it is in Kendal now.
Lurker on 02 Mar 2013
Anyone know if there's much snow left in Skew Gill on Great End, or is it just a bit too low down to have retained any? Cheers
TAbbey - on 02 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: climbed SE gully and central gully left branch at Great end yesterday. The crux pitch in SE was thin but still very climbable, icefall in left branch was good. not sure how it would have stood up to the masses today though, Hope that helps.
LakesWinter on 02 Mar 2013
In reply to Exile: Yeah, I'd agree it wont last long, but it was a great route with lots of interest. I've got a couple of pics of you on the chock and I'll email them to you later on.

We looked into the top of Dollywagon Gully but the last 20m or so would have involved some turfy ledge hacking so we decided against it.
LakesWinter on 02 Mar 2013
In reply to Toreador:
> (In reply to paulh.0776)
> [...]
>
> thus guaranteeing long queues...

Actually there were only ourselves and Exile plus mate on the route today and very good it was too!
a lakeland climber on 02 Mar 2013
In reply to Exile:

The chockstone in Chock Gully is rarely snowed up, at most you might get a bit of verglass on the holds.

ALC
Simon Caldwell - on 02 Mar 2013
In reply to LakesWinter:
We've got a plan for tomorrow, so I know exactly where the queues will turn out to be :-)
LakesWinter on 02 Mar 2013
In reply to Toreador: have fun with whatever it is, chock would be a gamble tomorrow though
paulh.0776 - on 02 Mar 2013
In reply to LakesWinter:

we were in Red tarn cove today.....it was very quiet, just us and 2 other ropes of 3, its in lovely condition, so was very surprised to find it so quiet.
The A66 didn't have much traffic on it either.
Exile - on 02 Mar 2013
In reply to LakesWinter:

Pics would be great thanks.
DSM - on 02 Mar 2013
Here's a photo from Coniston at sunrise this morning (Sat/2/Mar):
http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=214657

DSM
simondgee - on 02 Mar 2013
In reply to paulh.0776:
Hi Paul Hope you a had a great day...good to blether and day worked out well
S
DSM - on 03 Mar 2013
Report from 13:00/Sunday/3 March.
Lots of snow remains on North facing aspects but its melting fast!
Just got back from an early morning trip to Dollywagon North.
Did Thrash Corner & Rescue Groove just in the nick of time due to the rapidly advancing thaw & found them quite sporting but good fun nevertheless.

DSM
paulh.0776 - on 03 Mar 2013
In reply to simondgee:

Had a great day on Sat thanks... conditions in Red Tarn Cove were excellent and no crowds!!
Congratulations to my climbing partner Peter (red fleece and trousers) who started his winter climbing career this year aged 67!! :-)
images at from sat:

http://paulhorsmanphotographer.blogspot.co.uk
woodsy - on 03 Mar 2013
In reply to paulh.0776: any advice on likely conditions great end or hellvellyn for tomorrow?
Cheers
Woodsy
paulh.0776 - on 03 Mar 2013
In reply to woodsy:
I'd put money on Helvellyn being in good nick, and probably Great End as well...there was plenty of snow pack in the gullys so it just depends how well its stood up to todays temps. The temp will drop tonight and the freezing level isn't too high tomorrow so I think there's a fair chance it'll be ok..
I'm off to Great End tomorrow, for my first climb up Central Gully so I'm hoping its still good....anyone up there today??
BnB - on 03 Mar 2013
In reply to woodsy: Did North Gully of Bowfell Buttress today which was thin and sugary, despite topping out just short of 900m. Yesterday on Brown Cove Crags was bomber neve down to to 700m. Think you'd be best off in the Helvellyn area.
Simon Caldwell - on 04 Mar 2013
In reply to paulh.0776:

Went to Foule Crag yesterday, the snow was all soft and wet, but we found some ice which gave 3 short pitches on nice plastic ice. Temperatures at 900m were about +2, which was 3 or 4 degrees warmer than forecast.

Early starts tomorrow or Wednesday (assuming overnight frosts) should pay dividends, otherwise head for ice rather than snow.

The proper thaw is due from Wednesday afternoon onwards, though there are vague hints for a return to cold weather next week.
oldbugger12 on 04 Mar 2013
In reply to paulh.0776:
central G LH branch was in fine nick midday Sunday, I reckon will be good for a few days yet.
Plus some good sport ice around angle tarn
redsonja - on 04 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: does anyone know what condition any of the easy gullies on dow are in? for a play tomorrow
paulh.0776 - on 04 Mar 2013
In reply to Toreador:

Glad you found something to play on:-)....
We did central gully Great End today, first time up for me. It was a lot easier than I expected and we didn't feel the need to rope up at all, good snow and ice all the way. It's holding up well at present. Left branch had lots of ice on it (2 guys climbed it as we passed through)and the snow field at the top was firm with steps!.. the ice around window gully looked good from below as did south east gully.
I'll put some pics up on the blog tomorrow.
woodsy - on 04 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
Had a great day along with several other parties on great end today
May last for a few more days if temperatures dont rise too much
paulh.0776 - on 05 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Climbed Central gully Great End yesterday, its in easy condition, the ice and snow were nice and sticky...
images at
http://paulhorsmanphotographer.blogspot.co.uk
In reply to adamleedsuk:
Did Window gully on great end today. 4 good little pitches ( including start pitch). A bit stepped out but that didnt detract.
Good neve, sunny weather, no wind, only one other person on the mountain-magic!
In reply to paulh.0776:
Your photo shows the wall and groove finish to Window Gully which was looking a bit fragile today
paulh.0776 - on 05 Mar 2013
In reply to Last Thursday:

thanks for that, I've updated the blog :-)
petegunn on 06 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
Probably my last venture out this winter so fed the rat by climbing several of the gullies on Great End this morning. -2.3 at the car 6.45 am but quite warm once up above the fog.
Central Right Branch, good, one rock step.
Window, good though second step melting fast becoming rocky.
Custs, good.
One Pitch Gully, good, one rock step.
jas wood - on 08 Mar 2013
In reply to petegunn: Any upto date info on crags holding snopw and ice. Falcon / tarn crag ?

Any info appreciated :O)
Wesley Orvis - on 08 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

They were half stripped last weekend (so i heard), i think you will need to go higher!!!!!
LakesWinter on 08 Mar 2013
In reply to jas wood: Chock was fine last sat early but the neve on the pitch above the crux was good but thin. A light thaw this week would have stripped it. The pitch above the main chock is interesting grade IV atm.
Lostgear - on 08 Mar 2013
Did no.1 on Helvellyn today, it was still in and enjoyable. All the buttresses were stripped though. Still some ice around high up if you know where to look.
joe.91 - on 08 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: next weekend is the one to wait for, -7 forecast sunday and then remaining cold till next weekend. Could be great conditions.
Exile - on 08 Mar 2013
In reply to jas wood:

Hi Jas. I also climbed Chock Gully last Saturday. If you're after that, (as I suspect you are!) it could still be there, but have a plan B / be prepared to go for a walk. I'd leave it until this Sunday at the earliest given the freezing levels over the last few days and predicted ones to come. I'd also start early as the route is actually pretty low - we'd finished the route by 9.00am and it had been properly cold on the walk in, but we still saw a little drippy water ice on the route.
Exile - on 08 Mar 2013
In reply to joe.91:
> (In reply to adamleedsuk) next weekend is the one to wait for, -7 forecast sunday and then remaining cold till next weekend. Could be great conditions.

We could really do with more snow though, as it stands there isn't going to be a great deal above grade II in until water ice routes start to form up.

machine - on 09 Mar 2013
In reply to Lostgear:

did v corner look like it was in?
Lostgear - on 09 Mar 2013
In reply to machine: couldn't see past my nose I'm afraid. However there was good ice about 25m above the tarn.
Wesley Orvis - on 09 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Went up to Red Tarn Cove today, did the buttress left of gully no.3 linked about 4 pitches of ice at about II/III, ice is forming everywhere but a bit hollow today, and 3 inches of fresh snow from today and that's on top of the old hard snow of which is about 4 inches and that's on top of about 4 inches of sugary stuff, so not a good base for it all, ended up lowering off after the 4 pitches due to the snow feeling quite unstable on the top two pitches and it feeling harder than my limit of leading III, dug a pit at the bottom and was quite shoecked at how unstable the layer of neve is on topo of the sugary stuff it didn't take much to move it, also tested and axe anchor at the bottom with my mate doing a big slide on purpose and it popped the 4 inch crust quite easily, only one other person on helvellyn that we saw and he was soloing gully no.1, even the edges were empty of poeple, snowed all day and whiteout of about 10 metres all day too. It was still falling as snow above 100m all the way home, once this lot settles down and the freeze continues i think some pretty ogdd conditions are due. Great day.
simondgee - on 09 Mar 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis:
great news Wes...was bound to be unstable but am surprised so much fell. if we get a little bit of cycling this week we are back in there :-) was it rimeing at all or mainly just falling ?
Wesley Orvis - on 10 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Went up the easy mixed ground from Kirkstone Pass straight up to summit of Red Screes today, loads of ice forming on the buttress and gullies facing the pub and loads more in North Cove, loads of fresh snow been blown from the north into east Cove but Raven Crag Gully and the ice falls in East cove seem to be well behind the ones in North Cove for ice build up, the Kirkstone ice falls didn't seem to be forming at all either. Still snowing up there and more due, shit loads been blown about in the strong winds, all in all it seems to be shaping up into the best winter i have seen in my short time winter climbing (i was out due to injury 09/10).
Wesley Orvis - on 10 Mar 2013
In reply to simondgee:
> (In reply to Wesley Orvis)
> was it rimeing at all or mainly just falling ?

rimeing high up and a layer of verglass over every bit of rock from the pub up, so cold my gloves were sticking to the axe something i don't usually have a problem with and gloves and laces completely frozen stiff

charlie out - on 10 Mar 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis: Soloed Gully 1 this morning, conditions great. Just wish I could have stayed out longer.

Did you do Robs ice fall in North Cove yesterday? If not, why not??!!
mockerkin on 10 Mar 2013
Simon Caldwell - on 10 Mar 2013
In reply to charlie out:
> Soloed Gully 1 this morning, conditions great

Has all the new snow blown off? It can't have stabilised yet.
Wesley Orvis - on 10 Mar 2013
In reply to charlie out:

Popped into north cove on descent and just had walking axes with us, looked nice and fat though, how about one night after work this week? Could meet you on the pass.
Wesley Orvis - on 10 Mar 2013
In reply to Toreador:

We have had strong easterly to northerly winds all day but i doubt all 3 inches that was there yesterday and more falling as i was leaving has been blown away.

Probably just a difference in opinion of avalanche conditions, i have been avalanched on the scarp slope there before, so i could have been over paranoid yesterday and the day felt very much the same as that day so i could have been playing it safe. It just didn't feel right to me.

DSM - on 10 Mar 2013
Ran up Coniston Old Man this afternoon. High & very cold winds made it all feel rather arctic. There's a modest amount of very fine powdery snow about but the wind is shifting it all over the place. Lots of neve on paths etc still.

DSM
charlie out - on 10 Mar 2013
In reply to Toreador:

Gully number 1 was safe as houses, I did it in running shoes with Kahtoola KTS and one axe... it was bomber!!

There is a cornice built up in other areas and I'm not sure at all how stable it is there, sure there will be windslab built up in places, but not where I was. I descended off swirral and took a direct line to collect my dogs, once they saw me, we headed back to the path on Swirral to descend to Red Tarn and the Glenridding YHA.

The conditions were perfect. Great bomber neve, good ice, all you could want. Felt easier that it ever has before. Follow link below to see images on my facebook page

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.611397815552315.1073741826.121033984588703&type=1
charlie out - on 10 Mar 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis:

See how the week pans out mate. I have a first aid course on Weds/Thurs, so not sure if I can get the time, but maybe Thursday eve?? Maybe friday? Lets keep in touch
Exile - on 11 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

1 - 2 inches of snow in Kendal this morning.
BnB - on 11 Mar 2013
Anyone been up on Great End or the Scafells this weekend? How are the conditions? Thanks
joe.91 - on 11 Mar 2013
In reply to Exile: well that answers the request for more snow! Should hopefully be good by the weekend.

Anyone done Birkness Gully up on Eagle Crag? Been looking through the guide book and noticed it but haven't found any pictures to have a better look. Is it more icefall than mixed? Is it turfy/snow based etc. Any info would be appreciated!
mockerkin on 11 Mar 2013
A Mountain Journey - on 11 Mar 2013
In reply to BnB: Been some pretty heavy snow in Ambleside overnight & this morning. Heading out in a bit so will post a few photos later today.
BnB - on 11 Mar 2013
In reply to A Mountain Journey: Much appreciated thanks
Wesley Orvis - on 11 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

A shot from yetserday aftetnoon there will be even more now

http://www.facebook.com/#!/wesley.orvis/posts/496088310428779?notif_t=like
Wesley Orvis - on 11 Mar 2013
ads.ukclimbing.com
Kid Spatula - on 11 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Will this hold til the weekend do people reckon? Fancy a trip up Sharp Edge. Never done it in the snow so would be a nice opportunity!
mick taylor - on 11 Mar 2013
In reply to Kid Spatula: Reckon it'll be better by the weekend - forecast looks billiant!
Simon Caldwell - on 11 Mar 2013
In reply to mick taylor:
"On Friday, snow showers will follow constant snow (although in England and Wales rain, except perhaps highest summits)"

A Mountain Journey - on 11 Mar 2013
In reply to Toreador: Red Screes around lunchtime today: http://mark-mountainjourneys.blogspot.co.uk/2013/03/winter-makes-comeback-monday-11th-march.html

Will likely update this tomorrow eve & weds eve as am out both days.

Mark
HenryJM - on 11 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Just been for wee looksee on Brown Cove crag, the old snow is hard, buttresses are black. Really quite windy in the top of Helvellyn, lots of snow being blown about.
LakesWinter on 11 Mar 2013
In reply to joe.91: I haven't completed it but I had a look in 2010 in Feb. It needs plenty of snow and thaw and freeze to form the ice streak down the gully wall. It would be icy mixed, like Chock Gully but more sustained. I was ill on the day, hence walking in and then walking out again. I think it is a tricky one to get in nick. I don't know how much snow High Stile was holding but would certainly be worth 3 stars.
Kid Spatula - on 11 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Which of the ridges is most reliable for this weekend? I'm presuming Striding and Sharp are fairly reliable? How's about the Langdale Pikes?

Also any fairly reliable Lakes Venues really! Never been the Lakes y'see winter climbing wise.
LakesWinter on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Kid Spatula: Great End should be in nick, but I've no idea how much fresh snow there is and whether the gullies will be avalanchy. Window Gully is a nice climb.
hdog76 - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to LakesWinter:
We were at Great End yesterday, Great conditions hard packed snow.
Kid Spatula - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Hows about Blencathra? In nick?
redsonja - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Kid Spatula: probably not much on blencathra. we did easy gully on dow today, which was good, solid stuff
Francis Charlesworth - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
Winter conditions report from Rampsgill Head today with pictures
http://www.facebook.com/AdventureToday1
Etak - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Francis Charlesworth: anyone been out on brown cove crags? - just trying to get phyched for a very early morning - or lazy.......
Exile - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Etak:

Go Kate go!!! Think it will be good.
Etak - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Exile: will do :)
Matt Reed on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Etak: I did Central Gully today. A little thin in places but complete. Great neve, newly formed ice was brittle. The buttresses were pretty bare. I also went over to Red Tarn face and went down Gully 2. Quite a few parties out. Bomber neve, but again some of the ice is brittle.
Dave Cumberland - on 13 Mar 2013
In reply to MR1969: Sign of the times again - perfect and extensive Lake District ice climbing conditions for real climbers, either further up the hill or within 15 minutes of the road, and guess what, boulderbators are out at Carrock fell. Real climbers take note.
peachos - on 13 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: we walked in & out through Grasmere Common yesterday & spotted what looked like a good amount of icefall in Rowten Beck, a short way up from the mines. it looked really good in fact. had a bit of a search but couldn't find anything though, has anyone got any info?

here:

http://www.streetmap.co.uk/map.srf?X=335512&Y=517355&A=Y&Z=115&ax=335575&ay=5172...
drsdave - on 13 Mar 2013
In reply to CurlyStevo:
nice site thanks
LakesWinter on 13 Mar 2013
In reply to peachos: I soloed it years ago, it's about grade II. I thought it wasn't worth putting in the book so I left it at that. I'm sure many others have done the same. It's pleasant enough tho
Etak - on 13 Mar 2013
In reply to all: early morning trip out on brown cove crags - only one there :) - central gully looked a bit bare / incompleate ice step at bottom- did some easy gully off to the left bomber snow cold wind mmmmmm good day
Ghastly Rubberfeet on 13 Mar 2013
Grabbed an early morning ascent of Low Water Beck today.

Been wanting to do it for years.

First pitch in poor condition. Wet and falling down as I seconded it.
The mid-March sun is hammering it, despite the cold nights.

Great lead by my mate Mark!

The top pitch (slab) was in great condition despite being showered with water from the unclimable Direct Finish.

I doubt it will be in condition again this season.

Pictures to follow....

No snow anywhere, just frozen water lines.
waiting for snow - on 13 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

I was up Great End this morning; there's not that much snow on the hills. But what's there is in all the right places and is in really good nick. The snow is pretty much only in the gully lines making for an easy walk in, the snow was firm snow ice and the ice felt nice and plastic. The side walls of the gullies appeared dry, so should allow for good/easy protection.

I soloed Central Gully Right Branch, which has a couple of lean steps (any thaw might leave some gaps) and then an ice step which felt quite exposed when soloing, but of good quality. The ice pitch on the Left Branch looked nice and fat. On my way back to the car I saw someone belaying on top of the pitch, proving it must be complete.

I descended Custs Gully which was banked out with very firm snow ice, without any steps.
Simon Theobald - on 13 Mar 2013
We had a great day on Bowfell today. Climbers Traverse was interesting due to good firm neve and some windslab which we managed to avoid. We saw a team on Bowfell Buttress in what looked like full summer conditions in bright sunshine. However our route was Cambridge Climb on the north facing crag opposite and this proved to be in great nick.
peachos - on 13 Mar 2013
In reply to LakesWinter: thanks! it definitely looked appealing from the path at the bottom.
joe.91 - on 13 Mar 2013
In reply to Simon Theobald: how did shelter crags look like? Huge snow dump forecast thursday night which should bring routes into condition
Ghastly Rubberfeet on 13 Mar 2013
Photos of Low Water Beck from this morning

http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=215389
Ghastly Rubberfeet on 13 Mar 2013
In reply to waiting for snow:

I think I might have met you on your way down. Did you stop to chat to an party of three, one of which was an Irish girl? If so thank you for your kind advice. We did Central right branch and had a brill day :-)
Puma - on 14 Mar 2013
As others have already mentioned, Great End conditions were great yesterday. Window Gully had ice all the way up. Exit either left or the right hand ice fall are both possible.
GPN - on 14 Mar 2013
In reply to Dave Cumberland:
> (In reply to MR1969) Sign of the times again - perfect and extensive Lake District ice climbing conditions for real climbers, either further up the hill or within 15 minutes of the road, and guess what, boulderbators are out at Carrock fell. Real climbers take note.

Loving your work there - keep it up Dave!

Will Mc - on 14 Mar 2013
I was at red tarn yesterday and the gullys were filled with perfect neve. It has seen a bit of use though so is starting to look tired but still some great climbing to be had. Be warry though if high amounts of snow fall between now and any planned trip as it will create a very unstable pack ontop of it.

THE ONE GLOVE CLIMBER - PHOTOS

Also there was a chap, sorry forgot your name mate, at the top of gully 1 yesterday who was taking photos as I had an 'interesting' time on the left finish of viking butress.

McDuck on 14 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Me and a mate were in Catstyecam gully yesterday, most entertaining for our 2nd winter foray, lovely neve most of the way up, if a bit "laddered", patches of water ice underneath in places and an interesting exit to the right of the fan. Only downside - my camera and pouch disappearing down the slope (see "lost and found" :-(
DSM - on 14 Mar 2013
In reply to Ghastly Rubberfeet:
Good effort guys!

DSM
Simon Caldwell - on 15 Mar 2013
Anyone local know whether today's rain is falling as snow on the hills?
redsonja - on 15 Mar 2013
In reply to Toreador: i doubt it, but the mist is starting to lift and once i can see the fells i will let you know for sure
Tom the tall on 15 Mar 2013
In reply to Toreador: there is new snow on the high peaks but it's 7 degrees and raining in keswick atm. Will need some more cold, I think.
Simon Caldwell - on 15 Mar 2013
In reply to Tom the tall:
Thanks.
There's some more cold due from tonight, whether it's too late remains to be seen...
A Mountain Journey - on 15 Mar 2013
In reply to Toreador: Plenty of snow falling on Wetherlam this morning, pouring with rain at Hodge close.
redsonja - on 15 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: there is a sprinkling of fresh snow on the coniston fells, only on the highest peaks
Marq - on 15 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
Currently trying to decide what to do from Langdale tomorrow - walk, winter climb or summer climb! Or just go to the pub to watch the rugby.
roperat - on 15 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
Slinging it down in langdale this morning.

Snow on the bits of the fells I could see through the murk but looking at the amount of water in the streams probably melting fast.
johnboy87 - on 15 Mar 2013
if the conditions are at all good, could some one give me a little advice as to which would be better,if any.....red tarn or great end ?
simondgee - on 15 Mar 2013
In reply to johnboy87:
The conditions wont be particularly good for climbing anywhere. The ice has broken up quite a bit and the snow pack has a mix of old hard neve hacked to pieces, windblown and slab areas atop and in the next 48 hours wet to dry snow accumulating on top with a lowering of temperature. This all being at higher levels. Be interesting to hear the reports back from tomorrow for Sunday.
paddy cave - on 15 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Climbed SE Gully on Great End today, Central Left climbed also. These routes had debris at their bottoms and had shed some of the snow accumulation from overnight leaving a scoured track which was helpful. Some very dodgy snow about, not much blowing about as its a bit damp even high up but plenty has fallen. Central Gully Right for example looked dodgy above the split... I think there will be some very unstable snow about over the coming days and route choice will be worth considering carefully.
Wesley Orvis - on 15 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Snow falling above 400m last night at the pass, fresh snow covering above 500m on Helvellyn at Browncove today, then the freezing level went above the summits this afternoon with a refreeze tonight, which it is as it's only 2 degrees in Kendal and a cold day expected tomorrow, you never know, i will certainly be having a smooch about!!!!!
johnboy87 - on 16 Mar 2013
cheers simon, think we will venture up any way, will keep people posted. as you said will be careful on the choice of line. thanks for the heads up.
joe.91 - on 16 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: was up Langdales way, lots of snow falling down the crags, turf not frozen, ice rotten, lots of powder snow. Not good conditions atm, don't reckon they'll be in tomorrow. Needs a seriously good freeze and then everything will be perfect!
Somerset swede basher - on 16 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
Good day out today, Pinnacle Ridge (St. Sundays) good fun, Dollywagon gully good nick but could do with a refreeze as snow getting soft but plenty of cover so you don't get near any turf, tarn gullys 2 & 3 also soft snow but thick enough not to touch turf, Tarn gully 1 not good nick and not recommended without a really good freeze and some more snow.
Wesley Orvis - on 16 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Did Pinnacle Ridge too, great winter route, lots of soft snow above 550 and avalanche debris at the bottom of the gullies around the ridge, no frozen turf or neve, but all rock hooks anyways, good day out.
gavin kellett - on 16 Mar 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis:
Out of interest what was the exit slope like on Pinnacle Ridge?

Cheers

Gavin
thegoatstroker - on 16 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: anyone been out scafell way today?
DSM - on 16 Mar 2013
Been for a run around the Consiton fells late Sat/afternoon (Dow, Old Man, Swirl How, Greyfriar). Large quantities of wet snow on all the tops with some unusually large cornices (for this area) & deep wet snow accumulations in many gullies. Not pleasant or particularly safe snow climbing conditions without a significant freeze in my opinion. Scafell area looked similar from a distance, Langdale appeared to have less snowfall. The new deep/wet snow has in some cases fallen on old neve for double trouble. Take care out there.

DSM
Wesley Orvis - on 16 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Wasn't too bad although it was starting to get loaded in certain areas, we just avoided large accumumlations and aimed for the craggy/turfy bits
Fell hog - on 16 Mar 2013
In reply to thegoatstroker:
Had a run over Pillar this afternoon, plenty of new snow which is knee deep in places, with some very large cornices forming.Would think Scafells will be very unstable under foot making it hard going at present.
MFB - on 17 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: langdale valley - inch of snow on ground, still falling, temp. just above zero
redsonja - on 17 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: its turning to rain in windermere but was dumping it down when i went to work at 6am. very mild though
threepeaks - on 17 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: We headed up to Great End yesterday. Read our blog post here: http://wp.me/p14X6I-CV
redsonja - on 17 Mar 2013
In reply to wildspaces: any idea what custs gully was like yesterday?
threepeaks - on 17 Mar 2013
In reply to heidi123: Sorry no, we never went over that way and couldn't see it. I would imagine it's complete and as to climbing it, it depends how you feel about about moving on soft snow.
ads.ukclimbing.com
Simon Caldwell - on 17 Mar 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis:
We picked a crag (Chapel Crag) that had lost most of its old snow before Thursday, so the new snow didn't create any avalanche hazard (until the top 10m or so). Much to our surprise, there was excellent ice as well. Turf varied from frozen solid to completely unfrozen. No cornices, but areas of windslab on southern slopes.
An inch of new snow down to valley level overnight, melting fast in the valley when we left. But freezing level still about 500m and due to cool down - hope it's enough for the new wet snow to freeze nice and hard :-).
Wesley Orvis - on 17 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Did the Old Man and Brim Fell today, now i know the word epic and Brim Fell don't really sound right, but for two hours i could not see a single thing, didn't know left right up down, had to plung my axe really deep for every step just to make sure i was on solid ground, been in lots of whiteouts but nothing like this, trying to cross the ridge from the Old Man to Brim Fell was EPIC (huge cornice) and down to Goates Hause wasn't easy either, lots of people turning back with the waist deep snow and zero visibility there was no wonder, it felt a lot more epic than Pinnacle Ridge yesterday and this was just walking, the ammount of snow above 700m is unreal, if this lot turns to neve it won't shift for a long while. The park was plastered this morning all thawed below 200m by the time we got down. Another fantastic day this winter just keeps coming......
adamleedsuk - on 17 Mar 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis:

Sounds great Wesley. We had very similar conditions on Aonach Eagach yesterday, i would certainly call that EPIC as well, 12 hours in fact!

Let's hope the temperatures stay low and keep hold of it for a bit.
lanky - on 17 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Did Pinnacle ridge up st sunday today, had a few inches of snow. still good exit out the top not loading up excessivly.
paulh.0776 - on 17 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
"Life in the White room"
We went over Striding Edge today, lots of deep powder on the climb up to the ridge from Red Tarn and on teh ridge itself, visibility was only a few meters most of the time and made distinguishing distance, orientation and direction very challenging. Very difficult to make out the difference between white snow and fresh air while on the ridge...
Lots of fresh snow everywhere, we could be climbing well into April if we get a good freeze, the gullies may take a day or two to consolidate at present though.
Prof. Outdoors on 17 Mar 2013
In reply to paulh.0776:
Went in to have a look at the face climbs but there was deep snow to get to them with windslab on top. Unstable layers and did not fancy the top out slope or exit through slumping cornices so ended up on Swirral/Striding. Visibility dire on the top and on the edges.

Should be fitter though as we took the gear for a walk on Saturday. Scrubby crag was awful with deep soft snow and some big fresh avalanches at the far end of Scrubby. (E - NE aspect)

There is great deal of fresh snow but think next weekend is set for wind and rain. Ah well
paulh.0776 - on 17 Mar 2013
In reply to Prof. Outdoors:
yup we probably passed at some point. LOL.

I've put some images from today on the blog
http://paulhorsmanphotographer.blogspot.co.uk
johnboy87 - on 17 Mar 2013
went over to brown cove on saturday.decent amount of snow although still quite soft, can only imagine what it is like now, all in all excellent day out. although just a note for any going to climb there,that there is a large cornice forming at the top of central gully.it looked very unpleasant on the saturday and can only imagane that is even more heavly loaded than it was then,if it's still there.
matt pigden - on 18 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: We went into Scrubby's cove yesterday and climbed Pinnacle gully II/III. Deep soft snow 30-50cm deep in places. Ice was sound in places but rotten on upper steep section. Generally for conditions it was already starting to bond by the end of the day so with a freeze over next few days conditions should be good.
simondgee - on 18 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
Sunday we were out Red Tarn/Helvellyn (running training for our MRT including snow pack assessment and avalanche search and recovery...hence the detail). New snowfall is at 20-90cm depth and at the base of gully 1 with full depth (surprisingly) good stability. Pretty representative of the recent falls. Evidence on the old neve (isolated areas in gullies and high up) of a shallow instability layer of sugar snow, accounting for some of the isolated patches of debris. Extensive and substantial cornices ...some of these now being in filled ...but quite a few have infilled the underlying fractured ones from earlier in the week. Ridges, summit and plateau very alpine and quiet, few parties choosing to turn back before the top...we passed somebody walking down from red tarn in baseball boots.
All in all full winteriness is back and continuing this week for a brilliant continuation of the season :-)
DSM - on 18 Mar 2013
Saturday was for the most part a virtual white-out in the Coniston area. But at around 4PM the clouds suddenly lifted revealing this:
http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=215647

DSM
Wesley Orvis - on 18 Mar 2013
In reply to DSM:

What a difference and hour makes.

In reply to DSM:
Did you get to see how much snow there was on Dow Crag?

Thanks

NMM
Wesley Orvis - on 18 Mar 2013
In reply to Northern Mountain Monkey:
> (In reply to DSM)
> Did you get to see how much snow there was on Dow Crag?
>
Couldn't see high up but as we dropped down to Goat's Water, we could see over a semi frozen water to the approach slopes and they were loaded, as is the whole area.
Jim C - on 18 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
> (In reply to Wesley Orvis)
>
> I was starting to get that feeling myself! I
.......as it's rare to see people publishing route conditions.
>
You might as well ask for a GPS co-ordinate for where their coal stash is at bothys

DSM - on 18 Mar 2013
In reply to Northern Mountain Monkey:
There was deep snow on top of Dow & the gullies (eg Great Gully, Easy Gully) were laden with deep wet snow & also corniced. But having said that there was plenty of black rock visible too due to above-zero daytime temperatures. This was all on Saturday - looking over at Dow / Old Man this evening (Monday 18:20) the whole place appears plastered in further snowfall from Sunday & this morning. Rarely ever seen it so white.

DSM
In reply to DSM:
Awesome. Thanks, I've been trying not to think about certain classics on there this weekend but a covering of wet snow followed by some sun and more snow on a strong SE make me think it could be worth some serious consideration!

NMM
In reply to Wesley Orvis:
Are you saying the scree and boulders are buried too?

NMM
Simon Caldwell - on 19 Mar 2013
In reply to Northern Mountain Monkey:

I'm currently trying to disbelieve forecasts of a thaw lasting from Friday lunchtime until Sunday...
In reply to Toreador:
Latest Met forecast is 900m FL sat (and dry) and 400m FL sun with a good strong SE wind...

NMM
Wesley Orvis - on 19 Mar 2013
In reply to Northern Mountain Monkey:
> (In reply to Wesley Orvis)
> Are you saying the scree and boulders are buried too?

It was low visibility but the whole cove was covered.

paddy cave - on 19 Mar 2013
A Mountain Journey - on 20 Mar 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis: Been up to Brown cove crags & Helvellyn today. Plenty of snow blowing around lower down, but almost no wind on the summits. A few photos etc here: http://mark-mountainjourneys.blogspot.co.uk/2013/03/winter-bites-back-wednesday-20th-march.html
Mountain Llama - on 20 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Anyone been out to play today?
somethingelse - on 20 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Dollywagon gully today was fun today. LOTS of snow, some good ice in the right places, if a bit thin here and there. Dodgy looking cornices on top of adjacent gullies, but not on Dollywagon gully itself.
Gav Parker - on 20 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Great End, anyone been up for a look.....
A Mountain Journey - on 20 Mar 2013
In reply to Gav Parker: Hi Gav, looking over that way from Helvellyn the whole of the central Lakes was plastered today.
Kid Spatula - on 20 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Odds of this lasting til next weekend? Please Sky Gods!
jowzed - on 20 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Walked from Seathwaite up to the bottom of Great End then over Esk Hause to Langstrath. Everything under a monster layer of snow, all the streams above 500m are totally covered. Couldn't see the gullys as they were in cloud but safe to assume they're full. The snow is still very soft in most places. I noticed there are some large areas of ice above Angle tarn but again smothered in snow.
ICB - on 20 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: on Monday waded up Skew Gill in ever deepening snow. At head wall avalanche swept all 3 of us down. Had to dig wife out! All ok except shocked. Assume all of great end will need significant freeze/ thaw to make safe.
ads.ukclimbing.com
Wesley Orvis - on 21 Mar 2013
In reply to ICB:


You were very brave to wade up Skew Gill with the mrs after the ammount of snow put down on Sunday, glad you all came out unhurt and hopefully a lesson learned.
simondgee - on 21 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
Here it comes again...(not that we lost any momentum this week :-))... friday a yellow warning NW with amber (poss 10-15cm) cheshire/south mersey and Saturday yellow also...

johnboy87 - on 21 Mar 2013
any one got advice for this weeekend if the forecasts are right with regard to avalanche.or know of a website with avalanche information for the lakes?
nickcj - on 21 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Weatherline is still posting updates from top of helvellyn gathered by the assessors who gi up everyday. It's not the same as sais reports but does give an idea of snow conditions, wind speed, strength and temperatures.
paulh.0776 - on 21 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
we made our way up towards Brown Cove Crags today... very very windy with lots of spin coming over the top of Helvellyn, realizing that the gullies would be banged out with powder and slab and the wind was forecast to increase we retreated.
Its very possible that the snow has been moved by the wind onto the west facing slopes, but with more forecast over the next day or two and very windy for a good few days after that , it could be a while before we have a little freeze thaw cycle to settle things down again.
In reply to johnboy87:
I'm not bothering with the Lakes this weekend due to the avalanche risk. Only slopes that have been exposed to the wind, i.e. S through to E may be scoured. All other slopes (especially above 500m) I would say were 'avalanche city'. Could be some good conditions in May ;-)

NMM
johnboy87 - on 21 Mar 2013
cheers guys.to be honest that is what i thought but was hoping that someone would tell med that i was wrong :(
Tom the tall on 22 Mar 2013
In reply to johnboy87: Not been climbing, but from speaking to folks round here (Keswick) there is a lot of unconsolidated snow in the central fells and Helvellyn area, where temperatures have never risen high enough to compact the new snowfall. This powder is being blown a lot on v strong easterlies atm. HTH.
charlie out - on 22 Mar 2013
In reply to johnboy87: Skied the high Street ridge yesterday, all easterly slopes i was on seemed fine, wind blown and stable, but westerly aspects were not good.

Went upto Red Scree's north cove today and climbed on the Crag looking down into Patterdale, slopes had a slight build up of wind slab under the crag, but it was mostly stable. Descended down the gully on the opposite side of the mountain looking into Ambleside/Lake Windermere, all snow stable, wind blown and hard. Good glissade down what would have been the Red Screes.

Wind blowing from the South East tonight.

By the look of the forecast, it will be windslab & danger... but some places will be ok.
MFB - on 22 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: langdale valley - currently, a blizzard with about 3 inches on ground
Superchop75 - on 22 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Anybody know what road conditions are like around Troutbeck now please??
Due to drive up from Blackburn in the next couple of hours.

Cheers
redsonja - on 22 Mar 2013
In reply to Superchop75: think its ok at the moment
simondgee - on 22 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
fyi yesterday a 100m wide and 30m long slab avalanche was triggered in the Howgills within 100m of the road...
In reply to Northern Mountain Monkey:
Up by Red Tarn yesterday, gullies snowed out but Striding Edge fantastic! Difficult windy conditions on Helvellyn summit.
Skyfall - on 22 Mar 2013
Also on way up this morning supposedly. Great timing, not. Are roads around Ambleside ok?
redsonja - on 22 Mar 2013
In reply to Skyfall: ok at the moment. its more or less stopped snowing in windermere, just very windy
paulh.0776 - on 22 Mar 2013
Skyfall - on 22 Mar 2013
In reply to heidi123:

Thanks
goose299 - on 22 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
snowing pretty hard in ambleside at the moment. roads are o.k though
Simon Caldwell - on 22 Mar 2013
In reply to johnboy87:
Given the amount of snow and strength of winds I'd say it's a good weekend for low-level navigation practice - but stay aware of avalanche risks.
We were planning another trip over, but the A66 is currently shut, and it looks like getting worse before it gets better :-(
Exile - on 22 Mar 2013
In reply to Northern Mountain Monkey:

I've got some ideas,(one of them is a chimney not far to the right of where we last met up,) - def' not a sure bet, but if you change your mind feel free to e-mail.
martinph78 on 22 Mar 2013
In reply to Toreador: Thanks for the heads-up about the A66. Nav practice was exactly what I was planning on doing tomorrow, looks like I'll head for the North Pennines/stay east instead!
Henry Iddon - on 22 Mar 2013
In reply to Martin1978:

If your on twitter the Highways Agency NW is worth a follow for all the latest - @HAtraffic_nwest

or check the webiste - http://www.highways.gov.uk/traffic-information/
martinph78 on 22 Mar 2013
In reply to Henry Iddon: I'm not on Twitter but have added the HA link to my favourites. Saves waiting for Sally traffic on Radio 2.

Thanks :)
In reply to Exile:

Yes, I'd thought about that. Although I'd prefer it to have some neve on I think, which it might have firmed up a bit after the warmth on Tue and E wind. I'm not travelling up this weekend now though. All transpennine routes are either dodgy or closed. Having a rest before the Easter hols next week!

Hopefully conditions should settle abit and this easterly should do some good things that make driving round to Wasdale worthwhile!

Hope you get something good done this weekend. I'm going to play in the peak.

NMM
crowberry gully - on 22 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Sharp Edge, was a Sharp snow arete on Thurday. Rocks hardly visible, strong winds. Lots of varying snow: neve, slab, powder.
boots - on 22 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: 8 to 10 inch in Coniston and still snowing...
p.s this is the true depth not an exaggeration... Lovely :)
Exile - on 22 Mar 2013
In reply to Northern Mountain Monkey:

Comments in the logbook on here, and what I've been told, lead me to believe it's mostly turf, but more like V 6. We'll see - it looks like sunday's plan now.

If you're in Wasdale, and it's in, over Easter and don't mind an extra tagging along I'd be keen.
MFB - on 23 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: about foot of snow in langdale valley, waist high drifts on road to blea tarn, road ploughed about 11pm last night as far as old dungeon ghyll (not sure what fell overnight)
Wesley Orvis - on 23 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

No snow in Kendal but last night tried to get over the pass and a camper was blocking the road just after Limefit Caravan Park with snow drifts all around it, fast turn around was in order, then tried to get over Dunmail Raise couldn't even reach the bottom of it the snow was that thick, i think i will have a day off today sped it with the mrs and head out tomorrow for some nice winter walking,
Simon Caldwell - on 23 Mar 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis:

Anyone know how much snow's fallen in the Northern Lakes? If the A66 opens in time we might head over for a walk.
Carolyn - on 23 Mar 2013

Potentially really quite a lot....

Main roads are mainly open (but problems on A66 between Keswick and Cockermouth because of fallen tree), minor and high level routes often closed (eg Loweswater only accessible by 4x4). So don't necessarily expect to be able to get close to a lot of stuff easily.

There have been strong winds and lots of drifting low down, so presumably much more so high up.
Simon Caldwell - on 23 Mar 2013
In reply to Carolyn:
Thanks. We might give it a miss - not sure I can be bothered with yet another walk up Blencathra!
Wesley Orvis - on 23 Mar 2013
In reply to Toreador:

I think the whole Lakes is plastered mate, Blencathra yesterday looked the whitest i have ever seen it. All main roads should be open now, any high roads will be completely impassible. Kirkstone Pass was shut officially at the Queens Head last night, but shut well before that due to a large camper in drifts blocking the road, was a hell of a night for a drive about but saw some of the most arctic conditions i have ever seen, the whole Lakes was like been on top of the Cairngorm plateau in a blizzard, great for March 22nd.
Carolyn - on 23 Mar 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis:

Even some of the main roads (eg A591 over Dunmail Raise) are currently struggling to be kept open because of the amount of drifting in the strong winds.

Or, looking at things positively, many lakes holiday cottages are currently able to offer ski in, ski out accommodation ;-)
Simon Caldwell - on 23 Mar 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis:
Looks good for the next couple of weeks, unfortunately (?) we'll be in Scotland and then Spain. Can't see it lasting until May!
no_more_scotch_eggs - on 23 Mar 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis:

What are the roads around coniston and langdale like at the minute...?

Cheers

Gregor
Simon Caldwell - on 23 Mar 2013
IainFP on 23 Mar 2013
In reply to no_more_scotch_eggs:
> (In reply to Wesley Orvis)
>
> What are the roads around coniston and langdale like at the minute...?
>
> Cheers
>
> Gregor

Avoid, south lakes is pretty bad;
http://www.cumbriacrack.com/2013/03/23/latest-update-on-the-impact-of-snow/
no_more_scotch_eggs - on 23 Mar 2013
In reply to Toreador:

hells bells! thought we had it bad in yorkshire...!
no_more_scotch_eggs - on 23 Mar 2013
In reply to IainFP:

ok, thanks folks, will give it a miss and hope that by the first weekend in april this has all turned to perfect neve...!

<fingers crossed for the next 2 weeks>

cheers
gregor
Etak - on 23 Mar 2013
In reply to no_more_scotch_eggs: There is no snow in kendal! very weird looking at those pictures from just a few miles away - we must be on some sort of green island!
redsonja - on 23 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: thawing rapidly in windermere
simondgee - on 23 Mar 2013
In reply to heidi123:
just done 8 callouts back to back 24 hours continuosly...thawing where there is no wind freezing off higher up in the wind, 8ft drifts here...last night at 3 in the morning i think we must have been at about minus 20C.
joe.91 - on 23 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: what are peoples thought on ice? Reckon this cold has brought things like raven gully, blea water and low beck in nick? Thinking mid week when the winds have died down.
redsonja - on 23 Mar 2013
In reply to simondgee: yes still bitterly cold. are you from RAC or similar when you say you have done 8 callouts?
simondgee - on 23 Mar 2013
In reply to heidi123:
In reply to heidi123:
mountain rescue...having a snooze on couch before the expected SARCALL this evening...
Tom the tall on 23 Mar 2013
In reply to simondgee: keswick mrt got away with it then, think was the only team not out doing road rescues.
Wesley Orvis - on 23 Mar 2013
In reply to no_more_scotch_eggs:

All the A roads are passible, just done a big round of the Lakes over Dunmail, round to Penrith on the A66 and back down the motorway and over Shap, some amazing sights to be seen, most of the snow is held up in massive cornices at low levels, what you can seee high up is plastered, there is a fairly big cornice over the side of the road on the north side of Dumail Raise aswell as along the motorway heading north between penrith and Shap, one side of the walls are bare and at the other side there is 10 foot of snow, crazy never seen anything like it here in the Lakes, surely this winter has to give 9/10 a run for it's money????
Rog Wilko on 23 Mar 2013
In reply to Etak:
> (In reply to no_more_scotch_eggs) There is no snow in kendal! very weird looking at those pictures from just a few miles away - we must be on some sort of green island!

Just what I was thinking! Sitting here looking out on no snow whatever and people talking about waist deep drifts only half an hour's drive away. And the same to the south of us (nr Milnthorpe). Don't know if it was a mistake but the BBC NW news on TV last night was talking about problems on the M6 near Carnforth! Can't believe it.
chris m fisher - on 23 Mar 2013
Anyone know how accessible the Langdale valley is at the moment?

Cheers.
boots - on 23 Mar 2013
In reply to chris m fisher: its clear...
simondgee - on 23 Mar 2013
In reply to Rog Wilko:
main problem has been the wind ...70-90 on high ground scouring everything and then dumping it...behind those pesky, walls and scarps. Seen cornices that would put those on the ben to shame in places where you wouldnt think they could form...
3leggeddog on 23 Mar 2013
In reply to chris m fisher:

Hi Chris

We attempted to get down Wasdale this morning but gave up, could barely open van doors in the valley. We had considered langdale, rare things will be plastered, but decided against it. Wind far too strong to be stopped belying in for any time. Stay safe if you do go out.
simondgee - on 23 Mar 2013
In reply to heidi123: the funny bit of your comment is the folks asking when we could back to their vehicle and fix the battery or something...maybe we could get the RAC into dragging stretchers up lumps ...
redsonja - on 23 Mar 2013
In reply to simondgee: sorry! stupidly I never thought of mountain rescue on the UKC site!! when you said you had been to all these callouts I immediately thought RAC! dunno why
simondgee - on 23 Mar 2013
In reply to heidi123: this was on the way up to get out a casualty ...same 5Km walk 2 hours later with stretcher for someone in same place...
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=494530857250353&set=a.116436441726465.7797.1000008032917...
then at midnight in the same wind but feet of drifted snow...nuts day
redsonja - on 24 Mar 2013
In reply to simondgee: you are great guys indeed
wercat on 24 Mar 2013
In reply to simondgee:

If the RAC were involved you'd have more people to rescue!!!

Just before Christmas we broke down on the other side of the pennines from Penrith area where we live. I walked through rain to beg use of a phone in the shop queue at Raby Castle, and made the famous "A phonecall away from help" of which they boast. It was a wet day and when I mentioned the road had been wet they refused to come out. It was already close to dusk so our breakdown became a total crisis.

We had to beg help from strangers to get the car running enough to get to my brother's for the night and lots of help the next day to get various jumpstarts as we came back over the A66. OVER 24 HOURS to get home, the first and only time I've called for help since we joined in 2009!!!!!!

Who needs enemies with an organisation that will let you down like that after charging you through the nose?
redsonja - on 24 Mar 2013
In reply to wercat: was this the RAC? I cant believe it. whats the point of joining if they wont come out? why would they not come when the road was wet?
ads.ukclimbing.com
simondgee - on 24 Mar 2013
In reply to heidi123: your sounding like a saleswoman/man for the AA now :-)...anyway this week looking good anybody been up high today or playing out this week?... at 600M on easterly slope we assessed 1-1.M full depth windslab with pockets of sugar snow, and continued 40-50MPH winds.
Exile - on 24 Mar 2013
In reply to simondgee:

Tried to get to a route early this morning but got stopped by the wind.
Etak - on 24 Mar 2013
In reply to Exile: must have been bad to stop you! where did you head
Simon Caldwell - on 24 Mar 2013
In reply to simondgee:
A66 was still shut all day. Open again now, just in time for the working week :-(
LakesWinter on 24 Mar 2013
In reply to Toreador: A69 was fine all weekend if you dont mid driving a little further
johnhenderson - on 24 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Just got back from a day on blencathra drove up from Warrington no road problems . North lakes roads look ok.Heavy snow on the fells keep out of high valleys deep drifts over a meter in depth,heavy spindrift above 2000 feet. navigation will be a nightmare if the clouds are down.Harsh but magic day.
Exile - on 24 Mar 2013
In reply to Etak:

Even had Malc along to break trail and still got stopped! Just walking up from Dunmail.
MFB - on 24 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: pike of blisco - cold wind approx 65mph on summit, massive drifts, sufficient scoured ground to allow reasonable progress, no evidence of any avalanche debris
rockandroad - on 24 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
Went up around low water beck today, long way off being in, still running and incomplete. Continued up to low water crag and up around percy's passage - some ice but not enough to climb. dug a few pits and some worrying instability in places below 700m. The top section had descent patches and no real cornice to speak of. Wind gusting 50 mph + and walking was very difficult on the summit. Lots of snow being blown around and massive drifting making walking difficult (waist deep snow in places!)Walna scar rd has a good 2/3ft of drifted snow filling it. On the plus the sun was out, it wasn't that cold and got to play out!
wercat on 25 Mar 2013
In reply to heidi123:

It was indeed the RAC and I was so worked up about it afterwards it made me ill. We had 2 kids in the car one of whom needs medication daily.

I couldn't stay on the borrowed phone to argue as my attempt to continue the conversation appeared to be going nowhere and I now had an emergency with dusk approaching to deal with rather than a breakdown, thanks to the rather expensive RAC - we feel as if we've been mugged and are looking for an alternative
wercat on 25 Mar 2013
In reply to simondgee:

well to get back on topic the wonderful conditions on Great End earlier in the month helped cheer us up!
Carolyn - on 25 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Up in Pillar Cove yesterday. There was debris from a small avalanche high up (hard to tell how recent given how fast the snow's moving round in the wind), and a pit we dug on (N-ish facing? need to double check on map) had a slab on the top, 4-6 inch deep, that would slide fairly easily.

Snow depth is very variable - completely blown off some exposed slopes/ridges, drifted in stream beds, etc, giving soft snow you sink into to well above knees every step. And in other places high up, it's hard enough that crampons are essential unless you want to spend your whole day cutting steps....

Driving along the A66 again this morning - drifts a few feet high by the side of the road in places, but lower south facing slopes of Skiddaw and Blencathra stipped bare by wind/sun. So really very, very variable - but plenty of winter out there! Oh, and many minor roads still needing a lot of care and/or not yet passable in normal car, though hopefully that'll improve quickly over the next few days.
paulh.0776 - on 25 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
Had a walk in the Newlands valley and up onto Outerside for a look. The paths were ok but lots of wind blown powder about in the dips and hollows. the exposed areas are stripped but anything sheltered was holding snow.
bitterly cold with the biting wind chill.

images from the day at:
http://paulhorsmanphotographer.blogspot.co.uk
Simon Caldwell - on 25 Mar 2013
In reply to LakesWinter:
> A69 was fine all weekend if you dont mid driving a little further

We did think about that, briefly, but it adds an extra hour each way, and we were only planning a day trip anyway. A 7 hour round trip with a low probability of finding good conditions was more than I could justify!

Of course in the event our race in the Peak on Sunday was cancelled, so we could have gone for the whole weekend.
redsonja - on 25 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: has anyone been on wetherlam and prison band to swirl how the last day or two?
simondgee - on 25 Mar 2013
In reply to heidi123:
very big windslab avalanche on skiddaw today...estimated at 150M-200M wide, 1-1.5M crown
Carolyn - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to simondgee:

I was just about to say I'd seen a photo on Facebook of an avalanche on Skiddaw......
CurlyStevo - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to simondgee:
Do you know on which aspect?
Carolyn - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to CurlyStevo:

Pic I've seen said "West fork of How Gill", and suggested it was likely due to warming up in the sun. Will need to check map, but guessing southerly-ish...
mike123 - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to Carolyn: Anybody got links to the pictures ?
Carolyn - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to mike123:

Can't from phone, will try later from PC.
CurlyStevo - on 26 Mar 2013
So what's it looking like for this weekend, very cold this week, what about E and NE facing venues and lower to mid level ice falls? Obviously a lot of snow has come down but can careful route and venue choice avoid the worst of it and find some good conditions ?
simondgee - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to mike123: The picture was taken by Rob Grange who lives at Swinside (and is also on Keswick MRT).

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10151311174375146&set=pcb.10151311187065146&type=1&a...

Windslab avalanche, South facing bowl (Howe Gill West), side loaded over the ridge on the right (east) over the weekend partially onto an area of old snow.
Estimated crown wall 1-1.5M high > 200M wide >30M long which would make it about 1500-3000 tonnes!
It looks like you can make out the older snow which has created the (instability) shear layer on which it propogated just below the crown (once it got going it has scoured down to the bare fell below the old snow patch).

CurlyStevo - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to simondgee:
looks to me the slope that avalanched was on SW aspect which would be expected given resent wind directions.
Carolyn - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to CurlyStevo:

Yes, definitely where the snow build up has been from the wind, and also would have been in the sun yesterday.

The head wall is clearly visible from the A66.
Exile - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to CurlyStevo:
> So what's it looking like for this weekend, very cold this week, what about E and NE facing venues and lower to mid level ice falls? Obviously a lot of snow has come down but can careful route and venue choice avoid the worst of it and find some good conditions ?

Yes
guisboro andy - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Anybody actually been out on fells
Petarghh - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to guisboro andy: Did Shoulthwaite Gill this morning, thin for gear but good condition overall, probably will be better by the weekend after a few days more build up if the temp stays cold.

As for gully climbing conditions I would hold off for a while longer.

Route tip for the weekend would be Blea Water gill assuming it stays cold.

Pete.
guisboro andy - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to Petarghh: Thanks for info
mike123 - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to simondgee: thanks for link
ads.ukclimbing.com
redshapedfriday - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
Anyone any idea what conditions look like on red tarn and great end in the last day or two? Or opinions on grade three's worth looking at for this thursday/friday?
Exile - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to redshapedfriday:

I haven't been out since Sunday, but I'd still be looking at ridges for the end of the week rather than gully lines. Pinnacle Rodge on Great Gable or some of the Green Gable buttresses maybe?
nrhardy - on 26 Mar 2013
Anybody in or been in Wasdale recently? Heading up this weekend and wondering whether worth sticking in the valley or heading round to Great End.
Carolyn - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to Exile:

> I haven't been out since Sunday, but I'd still be looking at ridges for the end of the week rather than gully lines. Pinnacle Rodge on Great Gable or some of the Green Gable buttresses maybe?

Green Gable Buttresses (as seen from a fair distance in Ennerdale) were certainly looking nicely white on Sunday.
Clevelandclimber - on 26 Mar 2013
Went up to the Tarn and Falcon crag area today. Lots of snow made the walk up from Dunmail Raise easy on solid neve with little sign of the stream. Buttresses were black and turf soft although often sheathed in ice on the approach. Dollywaggon gully and Tarn gullies were pretty good, neve in Dollywaggon and some ice on steeper steps and top pitch. Scarp slope of Tarn Gully 3 was just wind blown powder and supported no weight whatsoever! Dollywaggon chimney had little in it. Didn't look further round at steeper lines but I'd be surprised if they were in.
nickcj - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Right buttress crack on brown cove crags was good today. Usual icy bulges around bottom of crags fun to play on as well.
joe.91 - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: great conditions on Raven Crag Gully today

http://www.flickr.com/photos/joedobson91/8592453979/in/photostream
ralphio - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to nickcj: thinking of heading to brown cove either Fri or Sat. Thought with it being NE facing it may be relatively safe at the moment? What were the stresses looking like? Completely plastered? On the hunt for some grade 2's.
Tom W - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to guisboro andy:

Low Water Beck is ice top to bottom, but not currently climbable. Very brittle, wet and thin. A few days freeze could see it right though. I scrambled up mixed ground to the left at about grade 2. The tarn is frozen, and Low Water Crag was white, but I didn't go for closer inspection so can't comment on the snow or cornice. (Yesterday)
johniebriggs - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to joe.91: is that pic from today? where exactly is raven crag gully??

anyone checked out blea water recently?
Simon Caldwell - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to johniebriggs:

just follow the massive queue :-(
johniebriggs - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to Toreador:
where will this queue start from sir?
In reply to johniebriggs:
One of the many Raven crags...
simondgee - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to Northern Mountain Monkey:
its in needlesport in copies of a large format book
jon59 - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: for those that live and breathe the lakes, what's the temp low down and the snow height in the keswick area. I've watched the wind and weather I'm just after some local int that's all?. Any info gratefully received
Carolyn - on 27 Mar 2013
As a first attempt at local knowledge...

I've driven across the A66 (Cockermouth - Penrith) mon & tue at 9 am & 3pm. It's never been above 4 degrees, and sometimes down to freezing point, according to car (and there was certainly ice on back roads yesterday morning).

Snow level is very variable because of the drifting and sun. Certainly lots of cover over maybe 400m on most aspects, but equally still big drifts at ground level against walls, etc.
joe.91 - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to johniebriggs: Raven Crag Gully is on Raven Crag in borrowdale
peas65 - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

It has been snowing down to ground level today and yesterday but still turf at under 250m is not frozen at all. Not sure about higher, have been chained to a desk :(
joe.91 - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: turf was solid from around 450m + yesterday. I imagine it to tay the same till at least the weekend.
Dave Cumberland - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to Toreador:
> (In reply to johniebriggs)
> just follow the massive queue

I wouldn't worry about that. There's plenty going on that this site never gets to hear about.
Carolyn - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to Dave Cumberland:

> I wouldn't worry about that. There's plenty going on that this site never gets to hear about.

Sssshhhh. Don't tell them!
Southampton Tom on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
So... Up on my loansome for the weekend and thinking it would be nice to solo a grade 1/II gully somewhere, any advice?
Simon Caldwell - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to Dave Cumberland:
> There's plenty going on that this site never gets to hear about.

I know.
But whenever a specific route does get mentioned on here (usually the day before I've planned on climbing it), it's immediately swarming with people hacking it to bits.

This time in doesn't affect me - we're off to Braemar to fail to get to any of the crags due to snow drifts :-)
Exile - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to Southampton Tom:

The obvious ones are all in the guide book, but there is not a great deal of info on snow condition at the mo'. If I was you I'd have a few ideas, maybe on different aspects, and then look back here Friday night, (given people will be out climbing on Good Friday,) and see what's been done / what's been done near where you want to go.
joe.91 - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to Exile: what are peoples thoughts on the climbs such as Right-Hand Branch, Inaccessible Gully, Black Crag Icefall?
Southampton Tom on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to Exile: I have the guidebook (selected anyway) just after local knowledge of what is likely to be in condition/safe. ideally sticking to eastern slopes looks like sense to me.

Cheers T
In reply to joe.91:
As Exile said. Pick somewhere with different options so you know you'll get something done. Also look at the aspect (in the guidebook) as the late March sunshine...
In reply to simondgee:
I was going to give a similar reply...
A Mountain Journey - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to joe.91: Just back from Langdale, a few photos here: http://mark-mountainjourneys.blogspot.co.uk/2013/03/snowy-adventures-in-langdale-wednesday.html

Lots of deep snow out there, but also plenty scoured slopes almost snow free. Lots of ice forming too.
Exile - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to joe.91:

Don't know, but Black Crag icefall comes in more quickly than Inaccessible Gully. Shalthwaite Ghyll has been done so they could be worth a look.
In reply to Exile:
> (In reply to joe.91)
>
> Don't know, but Black Crag icefall comes in more quickly than Inaccessible Gully. Shalthwaite Ghyll has been done so they could be worth a look.

Black crag icefall SE facing. Innaccessible needs a lot of freeze thaw with a FL fluctuating around 600m. Doubt they'll be in but I could be wrong!

NMM
joe.91 - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to Exile: Given how much ice there was at Raven yesterday at 400m I'd like to think Black Crag will be in as I was under the impression Raven crag takes much longer to come in! Freezing level is still between 300-400m so should be some ice at least.
In reply to joe.91:
I did Inaccessible gully with an experienced Scottish climber who thought it was harder than any V he'd done. It's certainly not the same grade as Chock gully, harder climbing with less reliable gear when I did it in 2009.

NMM
joe.91 - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to Northern Mountain Monkey: it does look a lot harder from the pictures I've seen! I was lucky enough to do Chock Gully last month and hoping to get another cod climbs classic of the list but doubt either dove crag icefall will be in this weekend. Hence thinking Black Crag Icefall of something similar!
johniebriggs - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
cheers joe, raven crag gully was in great nick today, well the top pitch anyway, bottom 2 were a wee bit thin.
joe.91 - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to johniebriggs: yeah they were a bit, I found the ramp on the right hand side of the second pitch quite scary to climb along with little gear.
martinph78 on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Anyone done striding edge today? Looks like I'm gonna get over tomorrow!
jas wood - on 27 Mar 2013
jas wood - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to jas wood: Goods website for helvelyn conditions.
martinph78 on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to jas wood: Great, thanks. Believe it or not I had looked on there at 5pm and the photo was from yesterday, and not of striding edge.

Looks good...roll on blue sky and no wind for tomorrow :p

Cheers, Martin
LakesWinter on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to joe.91: Nah, Raven Crag Gully takes one properly cold week, that's all. I've walked into Black Crag Icefall 3 times and not found it in yet - but I have done lots of routes on Scrubby, Hart Crag etc as a result.
Dark Peak Paul - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to Martin1978: Did Striding, Swirral and Catsycam Gully today. Full winter up there. Very windy at the top of Striding and the snow is pretty deep and not very firm. Knife edge snow crest in places. Swirral very good cover with no issues. Catsycam soft lower down and some unstable windslab on the south side (avoidable). Good snow in the top third.

Enjoy :-)
martinph78 on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to Dark Peak Paul: Thanks Paul. From your suggestion I might take a look at Catstye Cam gulley (handn't considered that), then the gulley from Red Tarn onto Swirral, and descend via Striding. Could be a good day out :)

Will keep it flexible and judge the conditions when we get there though. I've known the weather forecast to be wrong before...

Cheers :)


johnboy87 - on 27 Mar 2013
wouldn't bother going now you told the whole world...... every man and his dog will be there.looks like i'll be going somewhere else, cheers
joe.91 - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to LakesWinter: Well I'm up walking in the area anyway before heading out Friday so we'll see!
martinph78 on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to johnboy87: Gotta ask, what where you looking for in this thread if it wasn't condition reports..?

johnboy87 - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to Martin1978: ok you got me on that.just cant deal with masses of people on one route.
charlie out - on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to joe.91: That look beaut..
charlie out - on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to Martin1978: Did the edges on Sunday, late afternoon - cornices along Striding Edge and the Nick was almost gone, the scramble at the far end was banked out in snow and I crossed 2 knife blade snow arretes, deffinitely spicy conditions.. It will have all settled down now and most likley have tracks across the snow arretes

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.618263488199081.1073741829.121033984588703&type=1
macinboots - on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to Martin1978:
You can do condition reports without having to name routes or crags.
tripehound - on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to Northern Mountain Monkey:
Did inaccessible gully in 2010. It was in its usual thin condition and certainly a hard 5. I saw it in the early 80s in properly full iced condition and it looked more like a grade 4. But that's a rare occurrence.
Simon Caldwell - on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to macinboots:
> You can do condition reports without having to name routes or crags.

+1
DefenderKen - on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to macinboots:
> (In reply to Martin1978)
> You can do condition reports without having to name routes or crags.

Err.....how or why? Does that not defeat the object of this thread?

"fantastic winter conditions in the Lakes, but I'm not going to tell you where"


Exile - on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to general:

Lets please keep this about winter climbing in the Lakes rather than if we should or should not be posting conditions on a conditions thread, and how exact / vague these reports should be. If you want to discuss that then please could you start a new thread? Thanks.
Simon Caldwell - on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to Exile:
Fairy nuff :)
Petarghh - on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to Toreador: Let's face it its going to be incredibly busy this weekend either way, the conditions in general are shaping up to be probably the best of this season.

Tips for the weekend:

Climb at lesser known venues

Climb harder than grade III or IV and you probably wont encounter queues

Avoid bowfell buttress, viking buttress, great end - central gully.

Pete
Wesley Orvis - on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Coms on guys it's a conditons thread if you don't like it don't get involved and keep the thread for the sharing conditions sort of people, start your own with codes so noone knows what your on about or even better don't even report it on the net at all.
ralphio - on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: My partner and I are both fairly novice winter climbers, normally just sticking to Brown Cove Crags and Hellvelyn (lack of imagination). Like the above poster said it's highly likely that this areas will be v.busy this weekend so we'd like to try something a bit different to beat the crowds. Only climbing at grade 2 and having a look through the guidebook Chapel Crag in Buttermere and Harter Fell Crag both seem to have a few routes to go at and are a bit more off the beaten track. Does anyone have advice on how reliably these are, bearing in mind the conditions we have at the moment? Or if you live in the area and have actually been up in the last few days? Obviously they're both quite a drive.

Many thanks.
redsonja - on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to ralphio: im not sure of the conditions on dow crag, but it will be a bit quieter than helvellyn and a couple of easier routes
DANNYdjb on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to Exile:

Well put.
ads.ukclimbing.com
simondgee - on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to heidi123:
Helvellyn will be quiet as mouse if everybody assumes it wont be ...
In reply to Petarghh:
Climbed Blea water Gill today. The ice is good but there is a lot of soft snow on the slopes between the pitches. No doubt this will be soon stepped out.
OK then, let the Easter hordes in and kick the f**k out of it! Happy Easter!
Henry Iddon - on 28 Mar 2013
redsonja - on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to Henry Iddon: wow! fabulous. hope its like that on tues when im next off
stuart58 - on 28 Mar 2013
In reply t Henry Iddon: hi everyone has anyone actually climbed anything today just that helvellyn looks pretty white plenty of wind slab I think. Anyone climbed. Any gulls
martinph78 on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Well as a thanks for the above advice regarding Helvellyn, we had a great day out. It's going to be busy this weekend regardless of this thread, it's easter weekend - hence why we went today!

Snow on Striding Edge is mixed, soft in places, hard in others, didn't inspire the confidence that swirral edge did. The exit ramp is frozen solid. Swirral edge was good snow, compact. Plenty of snow and some big drifts on the paths up. Finally the wind stayed low enough for me to get this ticked off!
martinph78 on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to Martin1978:

http://www.lakedistrictweatherline.co.uk/__data/assets/image/0006/322575/P3280098.JPG

Just spotted this photo, was taken a few minutes after we summited (that's not us, but they were behind us)

crowberry gully - on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Raven Crag Gully is in fine condition, even with 12+ people climbing it today. Lots of routes we saw look in condition and the weather is glorious. Enjoy.
joe.91 - on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: had a look at black crag icefall today, not in good nick. Needs a lot more time to form.
Jim Haydock - on 29 Mar 2013
Anyone done Shoulthwaite gill or Launchy recently or are they too low for the temps ?
JH.
DSM - on 29 Mar 2013
Good Friday 11:45. Just returned from a run around the Coniston fells. Conditions high up are almost arctic - very cold wind, some very deep snow drifts and large cornices in places. I would not have been surprised if I'd met a huddle of penguins. And yet at valley level its positively mild, the daffodils are out, a Spring morning. In terms of routes all sorts of stuff should be possible I think - Low Water Beck with a pre-dawn start, any of the Hen Crag routes & most of the snow routes high on the Old Man should all give good sport. Same goes for Dow Crag. And yet all I saw today was a couple of walkers & a guy with skis. Where is everyone?

DSM
Rog Wilko on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to Jim Haydock: Shoulhwaite gill mentioned on this thread a couple of days back, I think.
Peter Holder - on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to Jim Haydock: I climbed Shoulthwaite Gill on Tuesday. It was slightly on the thin side at the start and was suprisingly fat at the top. It felt like top end V. I imagine that it will still be in a climbable state this weekend.
Wesley Orvis - on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Helvellyn Red Tarn area very quiet today only saw one other team and a soloist, even the edges were quiet, did gully no.2 and descended Striding Edge, approach slopes were still quite soft and areas of windslab to avoid but once in the gully it is ice with 3 inch of soft snow on top all the way to about 10m below the cornice, were it changes to sugary shite, not very nice for topping out.
Absolutley amazing today, blue skies and deep snow, ice everywhere, done the edges over 20 times and yet today they were the most fascinating i have ever seen, Striding Edge actually as it's own cornice running the lentgh of it, and no rock hardly visible at all which makes it easier than with no snow on it. So glad to live in the Lakes, Great End tomorrow!!!!!
Enock on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to DSM: We went to have a look at Low Water Beck today, but came away because the bottom half was falling down. We were there at about 11am and noone else had been up to it earlier that day judging by the old footprints. There was a dramatic difference in conditions higher up and the ramp on the top pitch was blue and fat, but getting to it would have been a right palava. There was an additional scrappy pitch high up, just below the rim of Low Water which also looked to have good ice. Two guys went up to have a look at this as we turned round. Hardly worth it for a few metres of easy climbing we thought. We considered going up to Percy's but it looked seriously banked out and more or less buried in snow. We saw a party of three slogging there way up as we ditched our gear and went for a walk.
Martin Davies on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis: Ditto, came down Striding Edge this afternoon around 2-2:30pm, incredible weather, blue skies, not a breath of wind on the main ridge. If you were one of the group of 3 I took a photo for, I've got a few more of you guys on my phone I can email your way? Glad you're making the most of the great conditions!
joe.91 - on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: just come back from Blea water, lots of teams out today. The gill and icefall were in good conditions, bit stepped out by the end of the day. Birket's was thin low down but fat high up.
DSM - on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis:
I do agree Wesley about the snow conditions today - there are some amazing wind-made sculptings around, rather rare for this part of the world.

DSM
Petarghh - on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis:
> (In reply to adamleedsuk)
>
> Helvellyn Red Tarn area very quiet today only saw one other team and a soloist, even the edges were quiet,

You probably saw me, did a few lines on Brown Cove crags too, Red Tarn in much nicer nick if you're going tomorrow. lots of ice here and there that i've never seen before and some really really nice conditions.

Going to look at Inaccessible Gully tomorrow - hope its in !

Pete.

sammy5000 - on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis: first in the carpark at thirlmere 6am to escape the crowds they werent there soloed steeped ridge in brown cove which was in excellent condition much better than the snow in the gullys was amazing to have the place to myself then went on too helvellyn quick descent then gully 1.saw 7 people walking up on way back to car. back at home for 11.30!
joe.91 - on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to Petarghh: from what I saw of black crag icefall yesterday I doubt its in.
Petarghh - on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to joe.91: I was hoping it would be due to the fact we did shoulthwaite the other day.

What altitude/aspect is black crag icefall ?

Cheers.

Pete.
DSM - on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to Petarghh:
For any chance of Inaccessible Gully you might want to be there at daybreak. It gets sunshine very early which can render it unclimbable. I did it in immaculate early-morning conditions in 2010 (http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=137188) but a party that turned up 90 minutes later had to turn away due to meltdown.
Black Crag Icefall is much lower down & also faces the sun...

DSM
Petarghh - on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to DSM: Thanks for that.

Pete.
John Kettle - on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to Petarghh: If anyone wants a short walk in with minimal snow, the Carrock Fell Icefalls and Trough Gully are all in.
jon59 - on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Went to deepdale today to keep away from the crowds, had a look at link Cove gill left + right which were both very close to being in condition but not quite there. Switched over to step gully on Greenhow end which was in good condition with some nice ice sections, although high end III at the moment. Moved to Scrubby crag next with an ascent of pendulum gully which was in good condition, first ice pitch is nice although the second ice pitch is bare with a nice mixed step moving into a bold upper section, again high end III in its current condition.
Scrubby routes that looked in:
Pendulum ridge
Tongue and groove.
Andrew Wilson - on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to jon59:
Did you notice if the ice was in on the upper pitch of heorot/Grendel?
Thanks for the info

Andy
Francis Charlesworth - on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: was on Raven Crag Gully today, very busy but with lots of friendly people! Conditions were as previously suggested- see full report and photo's at: http://m.facebook.com/home.php?refsrc=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.facebook.com%2F&refid=8&_rdr#!/media/...
jon59 - on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to Andrew Wilson: looked a bit bare for the main hard lines on scrubby
Andrew Wilson - on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to jon59:
Ok, cheers Jon.
ads.ukclimbing.com
osheye - on 30 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: dove crag gully friday ,1st pitch fail , very thin top half where have to move left , 2nd pitch very steep but also complex shape due to wind so top roped it from 3 bomber nuts , wow.
tripehound - on 30 Mar 2013
In reply to james.peter: Jim & I did Shoulthwaite Gill late on Friday. The first 30ft were rock but after that remarkably good fattish ice. Certainly worth doing. Needs a bit of cold to keep it climable though. Thanks for suggesting we go back to do it Jim.
scottidog - on 30 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

We were up on Shelter crag yesterday.Snow was horrible sugary stuff all the way up, no neve and very little ice. Will be looking elsewhere on Monday!
Phil J Booth - on 30 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Considering heading up Blencathra on Monday, from either Threlkeld or Scales, possibly with the inclusion of Sharp edge.
Anybody been up there in the last day or two? What are the snow conditions like on the various aspects?
Are we likely just to be floundering around in powder all day?

Thanks

Phil
Exile - on 30 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Did Great Gully with the Right Hand finish yesterday and had it to ourselves. Northern Mountain Monkey from this shire did it today. If you go for it get an early start as the bottom pitch and a half were a bit delecate when we did them, we started climbing at 6.15am.

It is one of the best routes I've done in the Lakes, great climbing for the most part, and including the easy snow at the top we did nine pitches.
Gerry_Doncaster - on 30 Mar 2013
I did Cockly Pike Ridge today, setting out from Seathwaite. I encountered various types of snow on the walk in and on the ridge itself and none of it was in condition. Brilliant outing all the same.
Wesley Orvis - on 30 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Did Skew Gill and Cust's Gully today, seriously banked out, very easy and very pleasant, beginner friendly even compared to usual. Once again a fantastic day out in the Lakes with blue skies and views to die for, lots of people topping out on Great End having completed, Central Gully, South East Gully and Window Gully, all reported good conditions with fat ice and a mixture of neve and sugary stuff and the odd patch of windslab. The snow pack seems to be firming up now and if these conditons continue it's going to take a long time to thaw out. Skew Gill must be 30ft deep judging off how far off the top of the ravine compared to usual you are??? Cust's as well never been up it so close to the top chockstone
Dave Hewitt - on 30 Mar 2013
In reply to Phil J Booth:

> Considering heading up Blencathra on Monday, from either Threlkeld or Scales, possibly with the inclusion of Sharp edge.
> Anybody been up there in the last day or two?

Yesterday afternoon (Friday) a pal and I walked round the Bowscale-Bannerdale-Souther loop from Mungrisdale. We were in snow from quite low down and from 400m or so it was more or less complete cover, although pretty thin in places. Up top around the 700m contour there were some large patches of good firm stuff, especially along the top of Bannerdale Crags. Hardly any sloggy snow at all – the softer stuff when encountered was never very deep. We didn’t take axes or crampons and never wished for them, but we both felt that anywhere even slightly higher – say from 750m – or generally steeper would be a crampon job for sure. So Blencathra – which was looking fantastic – would fit the bill, assuming conditions are much the same come Monday.

wercat on 31 Mar 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis:

The latest I climbed Central gully was 8th May 1993 and I had to cross about 15 feet of snow at the top to reach dry land. Mind you it was looking a bit dirty by then! I experienced ankle deep snow around 20th Oct 1992 on top of Great End - will be interesting to see what happens this year
DefenderKen - on 31 Mar 2013
In reply to wercat:

Great conditions on Brown Cove Crags yesterday.

2 pairs on Left Branch, one team on Left parallel Gully and we did Central Gully - not exactly Picadilly Circus given Saturday of Easter Weekend!

Gully went from soft powder to perfect neve back to sugary stuff about every 5 steps, but great fun all the way to the top.
Christine - on 31 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
Thinking of Custs Gully on Tuesday. Any comments about conditions on Sunday or Monday would be gratefully read. Ta!
dan bulman - on 31 Mar 2013
custs was fine today. i did what wesley had suggested and went up skew gill then cut accross to custs. both were fine and very easy. the steepest bit was the approach slopes to the bottom of custs.
get there as early as you can so its frozen and hopefully quiet. there was no-one there this morning.
thanks wesley.
adamleedsuk - on 31 Mar 2013
In reply to dan bulman:

Wow, my original post was at over a month ago and look at the conditions today!!!! Let's hope the temperatures stay low....
Full moon addict - on 31 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

had a good day out on sat - lots of neve forming on green gable where exposed to the wind. Gable Crag looked good. then down to sty head and up skew gill and custs. like other posters have said nice conditions and firm snow. then off to scafell pike and west wall traverse/deep gill to scafell. some rather disconcerting snow on the west wall traverse which broke away when traversing. lots of rime on walls bounding deep gill. then down to wasdale and up red pike. some little icefalls on cover up to black crag and plenty of cover around red pike/scoat fell. very little snow to west from there. finished over pillar and back to honister. felt a bit shattered after dragging my camera gear round that, but this weekend really has been special for easter.
stouffer on 31 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Went up to do Angle Tarn Gully today but looked loaded with powder so we gave it a miss. Walked past the top later and there was a set of steps kicked up it so someone had braved it.

The far right icefall at Hanging Knotts looked amazing, but we noticed a unique challenge for aspiring ascentionists; a sort of ice 'chute' protruding over a metre from the top of the fall. Not seen anything like it before.
Fell hog - on 31 Mar 2013
In reply to Full moon addict:
Good effort, how long did it take you?
Francis Charlesworth - on 31 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Blea Water Conditions report and pictures from yesterday: http://www.facebook.com/AdventureToday1?bookmark_t=page
stouffer on 31 Mar 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Crap pics of weird ice at Hanging Knotts http://www.flickr.com/photos/41777717@N06/sets/72157633131629125/
paulh.0776 - on 01 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
Had a very quiet day yesterday out on Helvellyn, Striding Edge now has a track across the snow but is still superb. The open snow slopes still have a covering of slab and the gullies are a mix of neve, slab, powder and sugar snow. The buttresses looked to be in good nick but didn't get up close.
Red Tarn Cove was empty of climbers, a few were on Brown Cove Crags.
The climbing isn't perfect ....yet ...still a sublime day to be out in the mountains....long may it continue
images at

http://paulhorsmanphotographer.bogspot.co.uk
xplorer on 01 Apr 2013
In reply to stouffer:

Weird ice????????
redsonja - on 01 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: was anyone on red screes over the bank holiday? just wondering about kilnshaw chimney tomorrow. thanks
LakesWinter on 01 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Did Great Gully Right Hand on Saturday, we were the only people on it and it was excellent. The first 2 pitches were a bit necky but climbable and the ice above was excellent. Lost count of how many pitches, one of the best winter routes in the UK for sure.

Did Newlands Hause yesterday, it's a bit hollow. The left side is better than the right.

Went to look at Force Crag very early this morning but it has lost chunks and is no longer in nick sadly. We climbed the waterfall a bit to the left of it, which was a pleasant consolation.
paulh.0776 - on 01 Apr 2013
In reply to paulh.0776:
> (In reply to adamleedsuk)
> Had a very quiet day yesterday out on Helvellyn, Striding Edge now has a track across the snow but is still superb. The open snow slopes still have a covering of slab and the gullies are a mix of neve, slab, powder and sugar snow. The buttresses looked to be in good nick but didn't get up close.
> Red Tarn Cove was empty of climbers, a few were on Brown Cove Crags.
> The climbing isn't perfect ....yet ...still a sublime day to be out in the mountains....long may it continue
> images at
>
>

that should be
http://paulhorsmanphotographer.blogspot.co.uk


Wesley Orvis - on 01 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Did a variation of Buttress Route (II) on Red Screes Crag today, was going to do Rob's Icefall but couldn't get to it due to lots of windslab in the cove, the approach slopes in the north cove are extremely volatile, one minute you are on neve and one step later you are in chest deep windslab, we abondaned our attempt and took the only route we could get to safely, which was a very pleasant variation so overall pleased with the day and then a perfect glissade down the full length of the far right gully in the east cove.

In my opinion the Kilnshaw Chimney will be fine due to it's apsect and looked in to me, also the exit wasn't too loaded either but make your own evaluation when you get there but it is definitely worth a shot.
redsonja - on 01 Apr 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis: thanks wesley
Wesley Orvis - on 01 Apr 2013
In reply to heidi123:

No problem, Report back if you can as i was going to give it a shot on Wednesady night!
redsonja - on 01 Apr 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis: yes sure
Exile - on 01 Apr 2013
In reply to heidi123:

Climbed Raven Gully diret finish on Red Screes today - Kilnshaw Looked fine.

It's official - this season I've climbed in the Lakes in Dec', Jan' Feb' Mar and April - and still it goes on!
redsonja - on 01 Apr 2013
In reply to Exile: thanks for your help. 5 months winter climbing in the lakes is pretty impressive!
Wesley Orvis - on 01 Apr 2013
In reply to Exile:

I did November too (i you can count Striding Edge in deep powder) so i have climbed for a six month season in the Lakes this year
ads.ukclimbing.com
DefenderKen - on 01 Apr 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis:

Wesley, if you are ever in a pub in the Lakes and i'm in there make yourself known as your drinks are on me all night.

The info you've provided on this thread has been superb!

Cheers,

Ken
Jim Haydock - on 02 Apr 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis:
Hi Wes,
If you are short of a partner anytime get in touch.
I live South lakes so am handy when not working ??
JH
PS - sent you a mail.
tripehound - on 02 Apr 2013
In reply to Jim Haydock:
Jim you are a keen beggar.
(JeffB)
Petarghh - on 02 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Anyone been to look at Inaccessible Gully on Dove Crag ?

any info would be great.

Pete.
mountainbeast - on 02 Apr 2013
runner who did great end without any climbing gear on sunday just my speed cross as left it in car had to chip away with toes to make holes staffy was,nt to chuffed either but asked a climber for a lend of his axe which he replied no while his 3 mates were standing there laughing with camcorder hoping i was going to fall a--eholes but i made it to the dismay of the audience all ive got to say is not all runners cant climb as i proved with or without gear on
Rog Wilko on 02 Apr 2013
In reply to mountainbeast: I tried putting this post in Google translate but it still made no sense to me.
lpretro1 on 02 Apr 2013
In reply to mountainbeast: Yo go without gear and then expect others to lend you their stuff???? and you call them a******es? You have an ego problem mate
redsonja - on 02 Apr 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis: we decided to do striding edge and swirral edge today, which were fabulous. looking up to kilnshaw chimney, from what we could see from the road it looked fine and there were a team up there. we are thinking we might manage it tomorrow in between shifts at work. not sure what it might be like this time next week!
DefenderKen - on 02 Apr 2013
In reply to Rog Wilko:
> (In reply to mountainbeast) I tried putting this post in Google translate but it still made no sense to me.

Like!
Southampton Tom on 02 Apr 2013
In reply to Ken Shewry:
Was one of the first (actually I think the first or 2nd) on Great end on yesterday.
Don't know much about conditions except to say both Central and Cust's gully were in good nick, solid ice on Central in a couple of steps which proved too much for the party with a dog and turf where exposed was well frozen too.
If you were the two guys I soloed past cheers for letting me nip by.

martinph78 on 02 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Did Sharp Edge and Halls Fell Ridge toady. Not much snow left at all below maybe 750m. Crampons still a good idea for Sharp Edge though, and possibly the top of Halls Fell Ridge. Great weather, glad I got it in before the end of winter :)
Wesley Orvis - on 02 Apr 2013
In reply to Ken Shewry:

Hi Ken, thanks for you kind comments!
Wesley Orvis - on 02 Apr 2013
In reply to Jim Haydock:

Hi Jim, cheers for the offer, sent you an email back :-)
Wesley Orvis - on 02 Apr 2013
In reply to Martin1978:
> (In reply to adamleedsuk) glad I got it in before the end of winter :)

It's not over yet........

machine - on 02 Apr 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis:
Did V corner (Red tarn cove) on Monday, Conditions were good, plenty of ice under a small dusting of snow, however there were very short sections where the snow had drifted and it was quite deep and felt a bit unstable. An early start would be preferable to get the safest conditions. On the summit we were greeted by 2 guys wearing jeans and trainers who asked us if we had abseiled up the mountain?? On a high note we also met the fell top assessor it was his last day of the season. In all a great day, just hope it stays cold.
martinph78 on 02 Apr 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis: Hope not! Done Striding/Swirral and Sharp/Halls in the past week, nice surprise to get those ticked off so late in the year.

Going to have a think about what's next. Quite fancy some easy Grade 1 gullies (I'm soloing and only have walking axe/crampons).
Wesley Orvis - on 02 Apr 2013
In reply to machine:

On the summit we were greeted by 2 guys wearing jeans and trainers who asked us if we had abseiled up the mountain??

love it....
Purple - on 02 Apr 2013
In reply to machine: Well, had you? The public has a right to know. And by what route - not all abseiling-up routes are in proper winter nick at the moment. Hope you didn't do it in questionable conditions.
In reply to Martin1978:
Out today Helvellyn area. Plenty of snow left but soft and sugary up to about 2300-2500ft.
Exile - on 02 Apr 2013
In reply to Petarghh:

I was on the summit of Red Screes yesterday and 80 - 90% sure I was looking in the right place for Inaccessible as I've also not done it yet. If I was looking in the right place it's not in - love to be proven wrong though!
Ann S on 02 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Blea water gill today -ice was in very good condition, especially the upper icefall. Soft snow outside the beaten track link ups.
Jim Haydock - on 02 Apr 2013
In reply to tripehound:
Hi Jeff,
Well, I hope to get LOADS done this summer (and what's left of winter ??)
Just need a few partners to climb with pal :)
Jimbo.
Jim Haydock - on 02 Apr 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis:
Cheers Wesley but just realised I've changed my e-mail recently - try again with the new one ??
Jim H.
martinph78 on 02 Apr 2013
In reply to Bob Bennett aka Last Thursday: Thanks Bob, migh pay another visit to the area. I was also thinking about something onto Skafell/Skafell Pike, just looking through the books now :)
Petarghh - on 02 Apr 2013
In reply to mountainbeast: We were watching you to provide medical support if indeed you did fall (it appeared quite likely!).

You didn't take notice of any of our advice when we said that the slope you were about to tackle was quite steep, your dog fell down the approach and wasn't looking too happy at all. And you still continued with no axe or crampons.

The swearing and general ignorance didn't help when you asked for a F***ing Ice axe either.

Regards.

Pete.
martinph78 on 02 Apr 2013
In reply to mountainbeast: I think that the general advice would be: if you realised that you needed an ice axe (or crampons) and didn't have one you should turn back.

Choosing when to turn back is one of the most important decisions that you can make on the mountain.
Smith42 on 02 Apr 2013
In reply to Petarghh: it was me who said no to the request for an ice axe. The proposal was that i lend him my axes so he could solo Branch Gully and throw them back down. My reply was if he needed axes then he should have brought them. I was descending Custs with a novice on a rope and had no intention of getting involved unless we had too. I have a lot of respect for fell runners but the gentleman in question is one slip away from a helicopter ride.
DANNYdjb on 02 Apr 2013
In reply to mountainbeast
Isnt this a conditions, not a circumstance Post ???
Ghastly Rubberfeet on 02 Apr 2013
In reply to mountainbeast:
> runner who did great end without any climbing gear on sunday just my speed cross as left it in car had to chip away with toes to make holes staffy was,nt to chuffed either but asked a climber for a lend of his axe which he replied no while his 3 mates were standing there laughing with camcorder hoping i was going to fall a--eholes but i made it to the dismay of the audience all ive got to say is not all runners cant climb as i proved with or without gear on

asphinctersayswhat!
goose299 - on 02 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
Great conditions at Great End today. Did custs gully, brilliant snow
ads.ukclimbing.com
MFB - on 02 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
today
grassmoor
dove crag gully
first pitch thin and we avoided via pitch one and two of chicken variation
back into gully and climbed the crux pitch which was fat
Petarghh - on 02 Apr 2013
In reply to Smith42: Ditto, I do a bit of running myself, but my objectives are somewhat less steep and snowy. My partner and I were slightly taken aback by the whole situation !

Hope you and your son had a good day otherwise.

Pete.
Ben lad - on 03 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Been up red tarn Helvellyn today and all the gullies are in. Maybe keep clear of the bowls for decent as there is a dodge layer in the snow pack at about 5 cm.

On Monday I shot up a load of the lines around red screes from the pub at the top of the struggle. Kilnshaw is ok. Robs ice fall has some good ice but best to approach down from the saddle to middle Dodd as there is an accumulation of soft snow on NE aspects.

Raven gully is spot on.

Have fun
mountainbeast - on 03 Apr 2013
In reply to Petarghh:alright this has stirred the reaction i was actually looking for as i would not have known who you were the only time i swore was after you had said no when i asked was when i knew there was no return as the holes were in ice and hard to find to get back down but i would like to get a copy of my climb as it happens i realised i had made mistake continuing but i had no choice so it was not ignorance
goose299 - on 03 Apr 2013
In reply to mountainbeast:
jesus man, use some punctuation!
Purple - on 03 Apr 2013
In reply to goose299: And you use capitals appropriately please. It's J for jesus, not j.

jesus wept........wots the world coming to.
Wesley Orvis - on 03 Apr 2013
In reply to Ben lad:

I think i may have spoke you in the car park at Kirkstone, did you set off quite late on your own?
Peter Holder - on 03 Apr 2013
In reply to mountainbeast: Actually that does sound like ignorance to me!

I'm the guy who advised you that the gully was steep and icy and suggested that it was not suitable to climb with running shoes, not to mention your little dog who was clearly terrified after falling down the approach.

We weren't laughing at or filming you; not sure where you got that from, just concerned for your safety!

'only time i swore was after you had said no' Not sure about that, but you did shout rather aggressively to stop 'throwing snow' down at you while we were descending Custs. We weren't throwing snow! just the usual spindrift you would expect if there are people climbing above you.

'Not all runners can't climb as I proved with or without gear' You seriously need to take a long time to ponder you ego problems otherwise you may end up dead, You got lucky this time!
jas wood - on 03 Apr 2013
In reply to mountainbeast: Correct me if i'm wrong but it sounds like you set off i'll prepared for climbing, refused advice/input on attempting the route then have a problem with people for not lending you there equipment ?

If so get a grip and take responsibility for your own actions.
mountainbeast - on 03 Apr 2013
I take the rough with the smooth .If I didnt I would,nt do the sports I do on weekends as majority have risks involved
johnboy87 - on 03 Apr 2013
where's Jeremy Kyle when you need him? :)
Andrew Wilson - on 03 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
Anyone know if Force Crag is still in? Looking to get out very early tomorrow morning.
Cheers
Andy
LakesWinter on 03 Apr 2013
In reply to Andrew Wilson: It wasn't really in on Monday so probably not. There was a hole in the top pitch above the ice pillar. It might go but looked dodgy and was getting the sun by 8am or so.
LakesWinter on 03 Apr 2013
In reply to Andrew Wilson: PM'd you too
Purple - on 03 Apr 2013
In reply to Andrew Wilson: And any reports from Raven Crag Gully today?
Petarghh - on 03 Apr 2013
In reply to Purple: Not sure but the weather station in our shop (Ambleside) hit 11 Degrees today so I doubt it will last too long.
Andrew Wilson - on 03 Apr 2013
In reply to LakesWinter:
Ok. Thanks for the tip.
Anyone seen how white Scafell crag is at the moment?
Andy
Exile - on 03 Apr 2013
In reply to MFB:

Was there much water running down it?
Bingers - on 03 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Can anyone tell me if gully lines on Brown Cove Crags have gone soft or are still playable?

Have sorted a trip out tomorrow and need to know which side of the hill to head for. Can do either, but would like to go up the west side, but would like to maximise my efforts for not such young limbs.
BenTiffin - on 03 Apr 2013
In reply to Purple: Was hacked but fine yesterday - lots of ice although the first pitch was probably the crux due to ice missing off some of the rock ledges.. The temperatures stayed pretty low all day although I'm afraid I comment on today.

Ben
woodseel - on 03 Apr 2013
In reply to Bingers: They were fine yesterday. Central has a very short ice pitch at bottom. All the gullies are complete, but as you would imagine, are very "stepped out"-bit like a staircase. Still good fun though!
Bingers - on 03 Apr 2013
In reply to woodseel:

Thanks
simondgee - on 03 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Great End
Tues-Window and Left Branch both in fine fettle...affected by traffic but still good
Overnight- snow hole (just to the left up the snowed in beck after you crest out coming up Grains Gill)...bookings for the summer being taken for it at laterooms.com
Wed-South East-Great with one steep pitch of ice in the usual place...a bit harder than usual...Belting alpine conditions, clear blue, piercing sunlight.
Down to climb on Shepherds (bumped in Lakes climbing legend Rick Graham so we shared a rope on climbs had been looking down on from a snowy belay just a few hours earlier). Can confirm the Shepherds Cafe is in nick.
Skiving off to Ravens Tomorrow so will report back.
stuart58 - on 03 Apr 2013
In reply to simondgee: do u think it will be in on sun thats left hand branch
simondgee - on 03 Apr 2013
In reply to stuart58:
very probably...its still very cold and left doesn't catch the sun...
machine - on 03 Apr 2013
In reply to Purple:

Sorry to disappoint but gravity kind of made the going a bit tricky, it just wasn't in. We could have done with a vortex but that wasn't to be and the force was not strong with us that day so we had to revert to the more traditional method of pogo stick.
Ann S on 03 Apr 2013
In reply to Purple:

A mate did Ravens today. I quote his report as " all pitches 4 - all thin and bold except top."
MFB - on 04 Apr 2013
In reply to Exile:
> (In reply to MFB)
>
> Was there much water running down it?

(Dove crag gully)

it was fine on tuesday afternoon

pitch one dry and thin

crux pitch - some seepage (wet gloves)but ice was fat and in good nick

we weren't sure if anything would be climbable when we left the valley at about 7 degrees however there was no free water at bottom of the crag and it quickly turned gloves to ice on the summit - big wind chill on top
MFB - on 04 Apr 2013
In reply to Andrew Wilson:
very white - picture from Tuesday
https://www.facebook.com/NTLakescampsites?ref=hl




Ridge - on 04 Apr 2013
In reply to MFB:
A bracing -4 on the cumbrian coast, clouds on the fells atm.
ads.ukclimbing.com
Rog Wilko on 04 Apr 2013
In reply to mountainbeast:
> (In reply to Petarghh)alright this has stirred the reaction i was actually looking for as i would not have known who you were the only time i swore was after you had said no when i asked was when i knew there was no return as the holes were in ice and hard to find to get back down but i would like to get a copy of my climb as it happens i realised i had made mistake continuing but i had no choice so it was not ignorance

This is a perfect example of why punctuation matters.

martinph78 on 04 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Anyone been up Lords Rake/Scafell Crag in the last day or two? Guessing conditions will be good for Saturday.

A photo would be brilliant if you have one (trying to convince my mate it's worth the extra drive so we don't end up back at Helvellyn, again!).
Purple - on 04 Apr 2013
In reply to Ann S: Thanks Ann!
David Cowley - on 04 Apr 2013
In reply to simondgee: ah was that you we seen you on wed morning quickly ask you about conditions. That snow hole looked pretty cool :-) can't believe we had the place to ourselves on such a great day in great conditions. Didn't get down till 8pm had to stay up all day in those conditions
In reply to simondgee:
Nice one SG!
machine - on 04 Apr 2013
In reply to Bob Bennett aka Last Thursday:

Does any know what the conditions are like on hart crag and green how end?
Dave Cumberland - on 04 Apr 2013
In reply to machine:
> (In reply to Bob Bennett aka Last Thursday)
>
> Does any know what the conditions are like on hart crag and green how end?

Was up there this week - loads of ice out of the sun.
Smith42 on 04 Apr 2013
In reply to Petarghh: Hi,yes son had a good day out and is keen for more!

Was out again yesterday and climbed Great Gully Right Hand. First pitch of main gully was wet but rest was superb.

Has to be a contender for the best value ice climb in the lakes.
Radioactiveman - on 04 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Was at bleawater today.

Blea water Gill was still fat with ice but sounding hollow in places and water could be heard running behind it,missed the first pitch out.

birketts gully had a small stream running out of the bottom of the first pitch and the snow on the next pitch up was very soft. Traversed in to the upper pitches and the ice was fine. Imagine it will get worse with the current temps.
Bingers - on 04 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Had Helvellyn to myself today. Bit windy mind, particularly going over the top.

A few were out on Brown Cove Crags, but that was really in the wind.
Ann S on 04 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Great day today on Great End. Window gully still in fine nick with fat ice though snow soft between the ice pitches. Middle fall hard water ice and quite steep. Right hand exit looked more like an easy ramp but still good ice.
Andrew Wilson - on 04 Apr 2013
In reply to Martin1978:
Did moss ghyll today. Quite thin conditions. Although snow was bomber on approach there were patches of powder on the route which made some moves very insecure. Found the traverse back into the gully after tennis court wall quite tough. Just enough ice on collie step for it to go.
Lords rake looks great, it was a fantastic blue sky day today and I saw a team of 4 set off up it.
We were going to do great western but buttress was pretty bare so stayed in gully.
Had hoped to do great gully on the screes but decided it would not be fit. On the drive out this aft it looked as though it was hanging in.
Cheers
Andy
martinph78 on 04 Apr 2013
In reply to Andrew Wilson: Many thanks Andy, great info, much appreciated.
simondgee - on 04 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
Raven Crag Gully Today (probably the 363rd ascent since last friday...parties 364 and 365 just behind)...still very good...thin bottom pitch, chockstone pitch lead in ice good, then rocky exit, main pitch beltin fat ice all the way. Should be good for weekend still.
cup of tea then over to Trough Gill which is now unhealthy.
Baron Weasel - on 05 Apr 2013
In reply to simondgee: Just back from a late one to Red Screes. I think it was The Candle we climbed from looking at the data base? Spied it the other day and made it there this evening. Really good climbing and should be in for the next couple of days.

BW
pjor - on 05 Apr 2013
In reply to simondgee: just been up raven crag gully this morning - still in good nick. Got home and emptied sack but no helmet. Realize I left it in hollow where I stopped to take crampons off which I am sure is top of right hand exit from tree belay - I exited left. Its a red petzl and is perched on ledge on left as u come up near top. If anyone's up there and finds it I would really appreciate a call or email. Mobile is 07949493099. Thanks Paul
Purple - on 05 Apr 2013
In reply to Baron Weasel: Indeed. Did it myself this morning before work. I can report that while it's seen plenty of traffic, it's still in good condition with a choice of finishes. Other fun smears about the cove as well. On my own there this morning - great start to my day.
stouffer on 05 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Has anyone been in North Gully on Bowfell recently? Gets a star in the guide so I might go for a potter up there tomorrow before it all disappears.

I figure the snow should have consolidated a bit since last weekend?
Baron Weasel - on 05 Apr 2013
In reply to stouffer:

> I figure the snow should have consolidated a bit since last weekend?

Mostly good on Red Scree's, but highly variable. Got better the higher up you get and on steeper ground. It has not been through a proper freeze/thaw in the last week though. Ice was excellent for the most part.

BW

stouffer on 05 Apr 2013
In reply to Baron Weasel: Ta. Looks like the bottom of the gully is about 750m so should be good. Angle Tarn looked better higher up last week but was full of wind slabby type stuff lower down.
DR - on 05 Apr 2013
In reply to simondgee:
Two questions Simon:
What grade would you put Raven Crag Gully at? Lot of people putting it at III in the logbook.

Any more detail on Trough Gully? Was thinking of heading over there tomorrow. Had man flu and am going stir crazy reading all the routes being done...

Cheers
Davie
Cuillin Calling on 05 Apr 2013
In reply to DR:

Did Raven Crag on Wed. I'd put the mixed ramps on the 2nd pich as a fiddly III+ because the ice was thin and you were using small hooks/bits of turf/anything to get some purchase and avoid a barn door effect. The chockstone pitch was easy III with ice for the first half and then I ended up letting the axes dangle and rock climbed the top. Final pitch was superb, 35-40m of ice and 6 screws (much longer than the 25m in guidebook) and to me felt III+/IV-, because of its length and airy finish (mind you I did take the v airy option of traversing right and stepping on to the chandelier!). Its well stepped out but I'd say it's harder than the II/III that's been mooted. Just my opinion but I lead up to IV.
DR - on 05 Apr 2013
In reply to Cuillin Calling:
Cheers for that. I was thinking of going for a solo but I'm only confident of doing that on solid III's in good nick. Sounds like it might be a wee bit harder than that.

Davie
helix - on 06 Apr 2013
Hi Simon
I think we (me and missus) talked to you on Weds as you were heading off - you pointed us in right direction for Cust's - much appreciated! It was all fine, and top views from the summit.
Hope you get your May route in!!
Thks
Charlie Helix
simondgee - on 06 Apr 2013
In reply to helix:
cheers yes it was us, andy had to dash off but in 2 and half days have enjoyed both winter and rock routes with 19 stars and 3500+ climbing which is very :-)...hope you enjoyed the classic alpine day.
simondgee - on 06 Apr 2013
In reply to DR:
raven crag gully now at IV (easy way to index a route like this is to ask what would you give SEG ...which is not II...) bottom pitch is tech IV, and though stepped out top pitch is sufficiently long with the 'hardest' move at the top and reliant on screws to warrant IV
Tough Gully water running underneath and falling down quickly ...and has a gap in the middle.
Blea water sounds like its still a goer from a mate.
Wesley Orvis - on 06 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Wow can we get any more alpine like days into this winter? Another amazing day today in the Lakes with perfect visibility and some pretty good routes too, did Central Gully, down Cust's and back up Branch Gully, a fantastic day on Great End and met lots of friendly ukcer's too. Snow was getting a bit soft in the sun on the top out and a bit sugary up most of the gully too, but the ice is perfect at the moment taking all lengths of screws.

Have fun out there because their ain't long left of this season!!!!!!
In reply to DR:
An accurate grade for Raven Crag Gully is III/IV. People should use split grades more IMHO.

NMM
Wesley Orvis - on 06 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

i must add a rather large avalanche came down central Gully from the right arete just above the crux of right branch about 2 mins after we passed, it would of took us right out and was caused by the sun on the right hand side slopes, be careful on sun lit slopes, it only left a small scar but was fairly epic to be so close too.
Simon Caldwell - on 06 Apr 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis:
> Have fun out there because their ain't long left of this season!!!!!!

There's probably more left than you think - at least another week of subzero temperatures currently forecast
ads.ukclimbing.com
simondgee - on 06 Apr 2013
In reply to Northern Mountain Monkey:
? ??
1. There isn't an 'accurate' grade for winter routes ...you know they vary and are graded for best conditions and are there as a guide.
2. and III/IV is just an inability to grade using the scope of the current grading system...
3. But hell what what do we know...we just go climbing...
stouffer on 06 Apr 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis: I set out across the climbers' traverse on Bowfell but bailed fairly sharpish as it was melting beneath me. Looking over at the big dump of snow around the base of Bowfell Buttress in the baking sun meant there wasn't much incentive to continue anyway...

Instead I had a nice walk and got totally sunburnt!
Si Withington - on 06 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

A quick update from today on Great End. Amazing weather, views and conditions and still plenty to go at: http://www.lakelandascents.co.uk/2013/04/great-end-in-amazing-conditions-ice-and-winter-climbing/
Baron Weasel - on 06 Apr 2013
In reply to simondgee:
> 2. and III/IV is just an inability to grade using the scope of the current grading system...

We did it without consulting the guide and discussed what grade we thought it was after. We came to the conclusion it would have been a bit of a sandbag at III, whilst at IV you would need to tell your mates down the pub it was 'soft touch'. Difficulty can vary with conditions too, so I have to side with Northern Mountain Monkey on this one.

BW
martinph78 on 06 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: Mates bailed so didn't get onto Lords Rake today :(

I was in the gully to the right of Falcon Crag, onto Dollywagon though. Echoing the "take care" as there was signiicant rock fall from the right side of the gully that was baked in sun.

A very warm day with t-shirts on most of the day. The snow on main paths and slopes in the sun pretty much gone now (up to Grisedale Tarn). St.Sunday Crag looked good though, not sure of actual ground conditions but still covered in plenty of snow.

simondgee - on 07 Apr 2013
In reply to Baron Weasel:
Fair enough I tend to use the grades used in guidebooks and don't have any with III/IV used so its either hard III or easy IV (which is what we plumped for mainly based on the first pitch and screw only protection for the long top pitch)...and given SEG, Twisting, SC are bench mark III. Both Al and I have soloed it in the past when Raven is fat III and 'at grade'. Notably different from then is that axe technology and vertical cramp points make it easier. It matters little its a pleasant amble.
LakesWinter on 07 Apr 2013
In reply to simondgee: SEG is grade II in my opinion and III/IV describes the difficulty of RCG perfectly - it's a bit hard and serious for a III but not really a full IV either, especially if you compare it to other routes graded IV in the Lakes, e.g. Dove Crag Gully, Chock Gully etc (the real grade of these routes is another matter entirely...). Having routes at III/IV and IV/V is a useful indicator of routes that fall right between 2 grade boundaries on the difficulty continuum in my opinion.
simondgee - on 07 Apr 2013
In reply to LakesWinter:
Fair enough I tend to use the grades used in guidebooks ...which day did you climb it btw? http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=108286 is classic III conditions by the looks...?
LakesWinter on 07 Apr 2013
In reply to simondgee: That was when I did it yeah, it was thin on the next 2 pitches, so was harder than any III I'd done up to then, but not hard enough for IV. Anyway, conditions vary so much day to day that I've climbed IIs that feel IV and Vs that feel III
jon59 - on 07 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: climbed dolleywagon gully on Tarn crag today, the chockstone was ok with the rest of the route in good condition though stepped out. The final slab section was very thin then the snow and ice petered out leaving a steep turf exist....not nice. Unless it snows again or gets very cold I would give this climb a miss until next year.
Exile - on 07 Apr 2013
In reply to LakesWinter:

My grades in order of difficulty for some of the classics:

Central Gully Left Hand: III
South East Gully, (taking the corner direct,): III, but harder, and better, than Central Left Hand
Raven Crag Gully: III/IV
Chock Gully: IV 5
Dove Crag Gully: IV/V 5
Great Gully, right hand finish: V 5
Moss Ghyll: IV 5/6
Steep Ghyll: V 5 (we didn't have prime condition for this.)
Bowfell Buttress: V 6

Discuss!
Wesley Orvis - on 07 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Went up Red Screes today, Left Hand Raven Crag Gully not in, did Kilnshaw Chimney also not in, went round to the North Cove lots of snow left but needs a good re-freeze all snow slushy and all ice dripping and unattached. Need to go very high at the moment to find anything left in. I personally feel it's all over :-(

Temps much higher than predicted by met office, got 12 degrees on my van thermometer today.
GPN - on 07 Apr 2013
In reply to Exile:
> (In reply to LakesWinter)
>
> My grades in order of difficulty for some of the classics:
>
> Central Gully Left Hand: III
Agree, although II if you skirt the icefall on the right!
> South East Gully, (taking the corner direct,): III, but harder, and better, than Central Left Hand
Agree entirely
> Raven Crag Gully: III/IV
Standard III when we did it last weekend
> Chock Gully: IV 5
V 5 although was thin (normal?!) when we did it.
> Dove Crag Gully: IV/V 5
Not done
> Great Gully, right hand finish: V 5
Not done
> Moss Ghyll: IV 5/6
V 6, although again it was thin (ish)
> Steep Ghyll: V 5 (we didn't have prime condition for this.)
> Bowfell Buttress: V 6
Not done.
> Discuss!
A couple of others:
Shoulthwaite Ghyll: IV 4
Viking Buttress LH: V 6

LakesWinter on 07 Apr 2013
In reply to Exile:
> (In reply to LakesWinter)
>
> My grades in order of difficulty for some of the classics:
>
> Central Gully Left Hand: III
Not done it!!! shocking eh. Bu from doing Middle way and right hand and seeing it yeah looks standard III.

> South East Gully, (taking the corner direct,): III, but harder, and better, than Central Left Hand
Maybe - I might have got it in easy nick when I did it, I thought II on the day and II/III a fair grade.

> Raven Crag Gully: III/IV
Completely agree, same grade as Crowberry Gully and just as good.

> Chock Gully: IV 5
Maybe IV 6 or maybe I climbed the crux like a plank. No way grade V coz the gear is too good and the hard bit is short.

> Dove Crag Gully: IV/V 5
Not done it
> Great Gully, right hand finish: V 5
Yeah agreed, that icefall is too sustained and steep for tech 4.

> Moss Ghyll: IV 5/6
> Steep Ghyll: V 5 (we didn't have prime condition for this.)
> Bowfell Buttress: V 6

Not done these 3 yet.
> Discuss!
Exile - on 07 Apr 2013
In reply to GPN:

We ran Raven Crag Gully as three pitches, so I think the way we did it our first pitch was the guide book pitches 1, 2 & 3(?) Felt a little too hard and sustained for III on the day.

Chock Gully was thin when we did it, but the only moves of 5 were the ones from under the chock stone with bomber gear right there. We didn't do the introductory pitches though.

I wouldn't argue with your grade for Moss Ghyll, it's actually what I thought on the day. However Steep Ghyll is harder, but I don't think its VI, which is why, (along with the reltively short lived nature of the difficulties on MG,) I gave it IV above. A bit of a round about way to grade a route I know!

Shoulthwaite Ghyll I've done twice - IV 4 in good nick, wouldn't argue with V 4 for one of my ascents though.

Only done the original line on Viking Buttress which I thought was IV 5.

For those who have done Inaccessible Gully would IV 6 be a good guess?
Exile - on 07 Apr 2013
In reply to LakesWinter:
> (In reply to Exile)


> Maybe IV 6 or maybe I climbed the crux like a plank. No way grade V coz the gear is too good and the hard bit is short.

Plank :)

> Yeah agreed, that icefall is too sustained and steep for tech 4.

I thought the initial pitch of the right hand finish (we did a 30m pitch here) sneaked into 5

GPN - on 07 Apr 2013
In reply to Exile:
> (In reply to GPN)

> Chock Gully was thin when we did it, but the only moves of 5 were the ones from under the chock stone with bomber gear right there. We didn't do the introductory pitches though.

The 2nd pitch is very tricky (definitely 5) in 'mixed' conditions hence V overall IMO!

machine - on 07 Apr 2013
In reply to Wesley Orvis:

Hi Wesley, after I spoke to you at the bottom of Custs on Saturday, my mate and I waited for the threat of human avalanche to pass (the 6 numpties ascending branch gully with out axe or crampons) we went up branch and started to descended Custs I heard a crunch in the snow, I looked up and it was no other than Alan Hinkes. Sorry for the expletives Alan but you did give me a shock. Great day all around.
a lakeland climber on 07 Apr 2013
In reply to Exile:

Inaccessible Gully: IV back in the day, suppose still that, just a move or two at the top of the ice to give food for thought. Then there's the chockstone, which is slightly harder thn the one on Chock Gully. I did them both the same day and there didn't seem much between them.

ALC
joe.91 - on 07 Apr 2013
In reply to GPN:

Raven Crag Gully; III/IV seems fine to me, I was one of the first teams up it this year and though it was hard III soft IV.

Chock Gully; felt solid V 5 to me

Not done Dove, Great, Moss, Steep, Bowfell (yet...)

Viking LH; no way V, far to short. Felt as hard as Two Grooves on Brown Cove, so IV 5/6 I think.
a lakeland climber on 08 Apr 2013
In reply to Exile:
> (In reply to LakesWinter)
>
> My grades in order of difficulty for some of the classics:
>
> Central Gully Left Hand: III
> South East Gully, (taking the corner direct,): III, but harder, and better, than Central Left Hand

Done them but can't remember anything about the grade - a long time ago!

> Raven Crag Gully: III/IV

Probably about right - III in normal fat conditions, IV when thin.

> Chock Gully: IV 5
> Dove Crag Gully: IV/V 5

Agree with these - short crux sections

> Great Gully, right hand finish: V 5

Not done this.

> Moss Ghyll: IV 5/6

Probably the hardest in this list! However it's the only one where I wasn't using dropped picks.

> Steep Ghyll: V 5 (we didn't have prime condition for this.)

I'd say V 4 for Steep Gill, it's serious rather than technical. Done it a couple of times and I've never found that much gear.

> Bowfell Buttress: V 6

Possibly - meant to be harder than Fallout Corner in Coire an Lochain.

Hardest gully that I've done in the Lakes is Robinson's Gully, to the right of Dove Crag Gully, tenuous climbing with very little gear: VI 6
>

ALC

Exile - on 08 Apr 2013
In reply to a lakeland climber:

Yeah, I'm intrigued by Robinson's Gully - both times I've climbed on the crag, once doing Dove Crag Gully and once Chicken Out, it appeared to be nowhere near in condition. I'd be interested in what weather / freezing paterns you think brings it in?

There is a move in the top chimney on Bowfell Buttress that is as hard ar anything on Fallout Corner, (I've heard the comparison you make from an Ambleside shop owner of the 80s and 90s, possibly the same person?) but you can easily step around it to the right as the Summer line does.
a lakeland climber on 08 Apr 2013
In reply to Exile:

When I did Dove Crag Gully it was fully formed so possibly something similar. I've only been to the crag once so can't really come to any conclusions about the conditions there. I think we just decided to have a look "because we are here now". From memory (we are going back nearly 30 years now) it was mainly bridging and back and footing with sod all gear worthy of the name - I ran the two pitches described in the logbooks here together.

Bowfell Buttress/Fallout Corner - yes same person.

ALC
Gael Force - on 08 Apr 2013
In reply to a lakeland climber: Robinsons, definitely a grade harder than Dove crag gully, very serious.Spiral gully next to it is not much easier. I thought they both looked as if they might be in condition this winter as I walked by. Osheye who posts on here soloed it some years ago.
paulh.0776 - on 08 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Had a fantastic day on Saturday climbed Catsty Cam Gully to warm up, slighty soft near the top, then onto Helvellyn to climb no 2 and no 1 gullies.
Both in good condition and worth a visit.
Back down Striding Edge, still covered in snow,
Nethermost Gully looked to be in good condition from 100m away.
Hope these Alpine conditions continue for a week or two yet.....
A few images on the blog at.

http://paulhorsmanphotographer.blogspot.co.uk
MrJohnSan - on 08 Apr 2013
I agree with 'GPN' and 'A Lakeland climber' - In my opinion Chock gully pitch 2 is the crux and is about tech grade 5. There is plenty of good scratchy rock/mixed climbing in the first two pitches; I wonder how many people avoid these by traversing in to the main chockstone pitch, which although technically hard does have bomb proof protection.
A Mountain Journey - on 08 Apr 2013
In reply to MrJohnSan: Brown cove crags today: http://mark-mountainjourneys.blogspot.co.uk/2013/04/winter-skills-refresher-day-monday-8th.html

Some really good ice formations at the base of the crag. Good snow in the gullies too
DSM - on 09 Apr 2013
Report from Tuesday lunchtime - did Percy's Passage on Coniston Old Man last might (Mon/8th) after work. Topped out at 20:40 without having to use a torch - unbelievable! Three very pleasant pitches with the icefalls well formed, basically loads of fun. Should stay this way for a few days in my opinion given current weather forecast.

DSM
redsonja - on 09 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: we did kilnshaw chimney on red screes today. not in condition, but still do-able and good fun. coming down the tourist path, we were asked by 2 guys going up, which mountain they were on!
Exile - on 09 Apr 2013
Did Dove Crag Gully today. I would agree with the post in the logbook from the team that did it on Sunday - the first pitch is probably tech 6 at the moment. The second pitch is also harder than when I last did it - solid rather than soft tech 5. (When I did the route three years ago however it was very hooked out.)

Having said this it is in suprising well though, we had a superb day and it will stay in until this warmer weather comes in for the weekend.
stuart58 - on 10 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk: did number 2 gully today hellvelyn perfect neve with middle pitch of ice. Sun out all day was warm. Striding edge holding upon think if weather doesn't change too much might ok for a days
The only thing is we were the only climbers on the face all day


Dave Cumberland - on 10 Apr 2013
In reply to stuart58:
> if weather doesn't change too much might ok for a days

10 degrees North Lakes at 900 feet today, little wind, sunny, hills looking hazy and ghostly white, ice may hang on a while at high level.
Radioactiveman - on 10 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Anyone been anywhere near the kentmere horseshoe? thinking of going for a run friday but dont fancy it if its too icy/snowy

Aprreciate its not exactly climbing but it does relate to winter conditions :)
tripehound - on 10 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
Soloed Central Gully Gt End today. Excellent conditions and beautiful day. Good neve in central runnel which is the line of an old avalanche. Plenty of ice, left hand looks fat SE and Window good too. Did some ice falls in Grains Ghyll on the way down.
Cracking day out.
macinboots - on 10 Apr 2013
In reply to Radioactiveman: was over that way on sunday, most of route still has a lot of snow which was soft in the sun but the well trodden bits were firm. Was further west on Tuesday and there had been a good frost so there was a couple of cm of crust.
callwild - on 11 Apr 2013
In reply to Exile: Sorry Exile have to disagree about the 2nd pitch of Dove Crag Gully. Not even close to a grade 5 !! Bog standard 4.
Where on this photo is there a grade 5 move?
http://i243.photobucket.com/albums/ff203/callwild/IMGP0216.jpg

There are hands off rests after every move with a couple of large ledges & good screws. Bit of a thrutch at the start in a narrow chimney groove but can't fall out then a good ledge and bridging up to good ledge at top icicle. Thread & screw runner level with you as you step right. Only one steep move on this step right from the top icicle to another big ledge.
In past years it may have had more hooks but been steeper. Always however seems to have good rests and
Gael Force - on 11 Apr 2013
In reply to callwild: Theres a picture of it on my profile and I thought it was a bit harder than it looks on your picture. Dont recall any rests, and when we did it , we thought the first pitch was the harder, having ice only about 2 cm thick, in places, the normal thread was buried. I suppose theres not much difference between 4 and 5 though.
Exile - on 11 Apr 2013
In reply to callwild:

I thought the bottom thrutch was 5. It's certainly no easier, (although shorter,) than the cruxes of many of the Scottish V 5s I've done. (Eg Point five, Orion, Hadrians, Vanishing, Minus Two, Indicator Wall Right Hand, Last Post, Peter Pan Direct) and on a par with the harder V 5s I've done, (Centre Post Direct, Smith Route by the original finish, Poacher's Fall.)

For me 'bog standard' 4 is the crux of Comb Gully, Italian Right Hand, Observatory Buttress, Zero, Indicator Wall Left Hand, Quarts Vein Scoop, Grey Mare's Tail etc. The second pitch of DCG is presently harder than all these.

Having said all this I may just have been feeling jaded after leading the first pitch with a cold! :)

At the end of the day the route is great, in condition at the moment and, in my opinion, presently quite a lot harder than the advertised IV 4 in the new guide. If people go to do it as a result of my post I'd rather they felt it was easier than I say rather than getting strung out.
Radioactiveman - on 11 Apr 2013
In reply to macinboots:

Cheers mate :)
Tom W - on 11 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

Early start on Dollywagon Gully yesterday. Snow all the way, mostly good but the snow below the chock was pretty sugary. Mid step ice fine but top pitch all but gone, there was a very thin patchy slither up the groove that led to within feet of the top. Will not survive predicted temperatures (if it survived yesterday afternoons sun...). Had thought of it as a safe sheltered bet but forgot the top catches lots of sun. Went cragging today instead.
MFB - on 11 Apr 2013
In reply to Exile:

for what its worth, when we climbed this 10 days ago

bottom pitch - too thin for decent screws, hard for the grade, might well be 6
crux pitch - fat, good screws, some rests, grade probably as per guide book
In reply to adamleedsuk:
Had a good day out soloing yesterday. Did Skew Gill direct finish (a nice 20m pitch of III). Window gully is currently II and must have about 8-10 foot of snow banking out the top icefall. Broad Crag gully is in good nick although it is solid III and made for a pokey solo. Well worth it's 2 stars though!

NMM
In reply to Exile:
> (In reply to LakesWinter)
>
> My grades in order of difficulty for some of the classics:
>
> Central Gully Left Hand: III AGREE
> South East Gully, (taking the corner direct,): III, II/III
> Raven Crag Gully: III/IV AGREE
> Chock Gully: IV 5 AGREE
> Dove Crag Gully: IV/V 5 (see below)
> Great Gully, right hand finish: V 5 1 move gets 5
> Moss Ghyll: IV 5/6 Not done
> Steep Ghyll: V 5 AGREE - hats off to the FA. I thought this was a necky route.

Here's my thoughts on the Lakeland 'Wild card' routes. These routes can vary immensely, as let's face it, ice build up varies depending on snow amount, freeze-thaw cycles, wind direction and the nature of the bulges (no jokes please!)

West Waterfall gully? Lakeland IV (i.e. anywhere between IV and VI) It had a 5m section of vertical sheet of ice that was detached behind and only attached at either side with effectively no reasonable protection...

Inaccessible gully - seems to vary massively depending on ice build up, the nature of the bulges and how much you trust the gear! When I did it in 2009 (will try to post a photo) the ice column was bulging out at the top and very featured chandelier ice about 2ft wide. My Scottish mate who seconded said he couldn't of led it and he's solid on Scottish V. I haven't done a Scottish V that compares in difficulty/thinness. I would suggest V 6 in Feb 2009. So IV/V in the guidebook.

Dove Crag Gully - I could imagine that the first pitch could bank out a lot if the right amount of snow came on the right wind pattern and acutally be IV... However, I think the guidebook should be graded for most likely conditions rather than 'back in 63 this was...'. The 1st pitch had about 6m of plum vertical (if not steeper) with a couple of cm of ice and not thick enough for screws until you could rest you back against the side, therefore V,6. The second pitch bulged outward (not inward as in the picture linked above) with steep chandelier ice, so bridging was not really possible and supports my overall grading of IV/V. I did Clogwyn L branch (IV/V,5) the same season and DCG felt harder.


Let's face it, ice conditions can vary immensely and further supports the argument for split grades. DCG can occasionally be IV but more often is V, so IV/V in the guidebook seems fair. If guidebooks don't aim to provide the most accurate grade possible, then what's the point in them, you may aswell just get an OS map look at photos on the internet and get on with it. This would probably lead to much more MR call outs and then there'll be more media calls for limiting access to the hills.

So let's have some realistic grades that give people the best idea of what they may be about to climb! So concludes my essay

NMM


Exile - on 11 Apr 2013
In reply to MFB:

Fare enough - you guys must have been one of the first teams to do it this time round. - good effort for going to have a look.
DR - on 11 Apr 2013
In reply to Exile:
> (In reply to callwild)
>
> I thought the bottom thrutch was 5. It's certainly no easier, (although shorter,) than the cruxes of many of the Scottish V 5s I've done. (Eg Point five, Orion, Hadrians, Vanishing, Minus Two, Indicator Wall Right Hand, Last Post, Peter Pan Direct) and on a par with the harder V 5s I've done, (Centre Post Direct, Smith Route by the original finish, Poacher's Fall.)
>
> I've not done as many of those V's as you have Exile but I'd agree that Dove Crag Gully felt harder than some. Although short compared to the Ben and Meagaidh classics it's the hardest pitch on a grade V route I've ever done.

But as others have said, conditions can vary so much. I opened that photo link and couldn't believe the amount of ice on it compared to our ascent - almost looks twice as much.

Aye,
Davie
simondgee - on 12 Apr 2013
In reply to Northern Mountain Monkey:
>This would probably lead to much more MR call outs and then there'll be more media calls for limiting access to the hills.<

classic!
callwild - on 12 Apr 2013
In reply to DR:
Quite agree ice can vary a lot and I was commenting as the routes are found at the moment. It seems there was only two days between Exiles ascent and mine on Dove crag, and not sure they change that much in 48 hours. The photo was taken on Saturday afternoon 6th April. I live right below the route so have seen it in many different conditions over 30 years. Think this year the 2nd pitch was the easiest I've seen it, I don't know any grade 5s where you can take you hands off after every move! While I agree the 1st pitch was looking thin and probably 6.
Exile - on 12 Apr 2013
In reply to callwild:

I couldn't / didn't want to take my hands off after every move on the thrutch, although, as I think you're intimating, there was probably only one or two moves where you needed to properly pull / hang on the arms.

We climbed the route on Tuesday - I'm not sure how much the route changed but there was certainly one ice screw hole I could see behind the bottom 'umbrella', (at the trutch,) that I couldn't possibly reach - the umbrella having lengthened in front of it. This may obviously not have been yours though.

I think somebody who was steady on IV 4, having done some of the routes I've suggested above, would find that pitch a grade harder.

Anyway - it will all be gone pretty soon - such are the vagaries and so rewards of Lakes winter climbing!
Exile - on 12 Apr 2013
In reply to Northern Mountain Monkey:

I thin you are right about Great Gully Right Hand Finish - just sneaked the 5.

I may be completely off the mark here but one possible explanation for DCG getting IV 4 in the present guide book is that there may be a reluctance to give 20m of ice on Dove Crag a VII or 7 in the grade. I've climbed Scottish VI 6 a few times and the Edge On Variation looked, (I saw it near the time of the first ascent,) and sounds in the guide book, far harder than the grade. But if you give that VI 6, then Chicken out is easier so it gets V 5, and DCG is easier again, so can only get IV 4.

I can think of a few examples where routes in Scotland may have also been inadvertently 'down graded' because of neighbouring routes, and would get a higher grade on a different crag.
a lakeland climber on 12 Apr 2013
In reply to Northern Mountain Monkey:

There were similar arguments about things like Eagle Ridge in the early 1990s when the current two part grading system was proposed. I don't think you can accurately grade many routes as conditions vary so much especially in the Lakes and N. Wales, the best you can do is give a rough indication as to what to expect.

When I did DCG (1986 I think, may have been a year earlier) the first 5 metres were a couple of grades harder than the rest of the route so a grade of IV 6 might have been right for those conditions - basically a boulder problem start to a standard grade IV. In a way similar to your description of 6m of plumb vertical ... I'm not sure if the base of the route would bank out with snow, a collapse and a refreeze might be more likely. For a short while it's similar to Gemini on Carn Dearg though without the exposure - without the converging walls the first pitch would be a lot harder and sustained and probably the equal of Gemini.

ALC
MFB - on 12 Apr 2013
in reply to a lakeland climber:

is there a concensus that pitch 1 is crux of Dove Crag Gully?

it seems it was the hardest pitch in 86 and 2013
In reply to a lakeland climber:
Thanks for your comments, particularly about Gemini as I had wondered what that route is like and how it compares to the start of DCG. I agree with what you are saying for the start of DCG to an extent, but I would not want to deck it with winter kit on from 6 metres. IV,6 would surely suggest some good protection on the harder climbing?

If split grades aren't allowed, how about a grade of 'Lakeland IV'. In the same vein as 'Scottish VS', i.e. that the actual grade can vary a lot... This would give newcomers to the discipline of winter climbing a better guide of what to expect (rather than simply IV).

NMM
machine - on 13 Apr 2013
In reply to Northern Mountain Monkey:

Went to red tarn cove and then hart crag in Deep Dale today. Neither crag was in condition. The snow was the horrible sugar type. There is avalanche debris at the bottom of both crags. All of the gully lines on red tarn cove are still full.
Timo Austino - on 14 Apr 2013
In reply to machine: i went to have a sniff around percys passage today - blea farm, although it appears frozen, isn't.
Exile - on 14 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:

lakes winter - going, going, soon to be gone. Great season though!
paulh.0776 - on 14 Apr 2013
In reply to adamleedsuk:
we had a final plod up Central gully on Great End yesterday, The snow was very soft at the bottom but firmed up just enough by the time we got to the first pitch to give us the confidence to progress.
Th exit slopes were a lot softer than we would have liked and without a refreeze I guess its all over,
It was raining steadily by the time we came down and with the temperature as high as it is, it won't last long...
Images at:

http://paulhorsmanphotographer.blogspot.co.uk

p.s Now that this lovely warm, wet windy weather has finally arrived... all the people that were complaining about the cold have shut up....
"old chinese proverb" says ..be careful what you wish for!!! lol

paraffin on 15 Apr 2013
In reply to paulh.0776:
It pains me to say after over 23 weeks of winter fun in the Lakes - "That might just be it, for just now." sigh
Swiss Tony - on 16 Apr 2013
In reply to paulh.0776: Hi Paul, if it was you two on the route around 3pm, think I saw you guys, I walked in considering a solo but don't know the route so backed off considering conditions & knowledge of this crag, is this easy route enough to solo if your used to leading on iii ?

BTW I think we met on mount blanc a few years ago - Simon from Assured
stuart58 - on 19 Apr 2013
In reply to Swiss Tony: does anyone think there is any snow in custs or on the front face of helvellyn just thats its going cold tonite for tomorrow?
Full moon addict - on 19 Apr 2013
In reply to stuart58: definitely. there was a bit of fresh snow on helvellyn this morning and there's still plenty in easy gullies
paraffin on 19 Apr 2013
In reply to Full moon addict:
Although fresh this morning this gives you a picture:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/raise_up_dated_pics/8662381461/

Davie
waiting for snow - on 19 Apr 2013
In reply to stuart58:

I was being optimistic and had a play around Red Tarn this morning. There is very little snow about now, especially where the graded climbs are. Even if it froze hard over night, you'd do very well to link them into any sort of route. There are some patches heading towards the end of Striding Edge, and a large patch between No 1 gully and Swirral Edge. I had a check of the cornice from the plateau. Whilst appearing solid, it does not look to be very bonded to the rock/mud (which was soggy and well above freezing). I personally wouldn't/ didn't trust it!

I couldn't say for Great End though? You'll only know by having a look?
paddy cave - on 21 Apr 2013

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