/ Power endurance on a woody

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griffithsa - on 11 Feb 2013
So, I'm thinking about doing a session a week on a woody just training power endurance. I've never really trained this before so if anyone has any advice that would be great. I was thinking about starting off with about a 30 move circuit that I was pretty much falling off at the end, and repeating that a couple of times with about a 20 minute rest in between. Sound any good?

Cheers.
shark - on 11 Feb 2013
In reply to griffithsa:

Bit long for PE and rests too long for interval training.

I tend to do about 15-20 moves x 4 with 2/3 mins rest. 10 mins rest then another set.
griffithsa - on 11 Feb 2013
In reply to shark:
Do you go to failure on each attempt? I'm not sure I could recover fully in 2/3 mins if I give it full beans!
Daniel Heath - on 11 Feb 2013
In reply to griffithsa:

I would do something like Shark suggests, and pace it so you don't go to failure until towards the end of the session.
Richard Hession on 11 Feb 2013
In reply to griffithsa:

Do what shark says lad. Make sure you start it off on decent holds if you are on the core board or AWCC woody as they are steep! davo, Matt and a few others do similar training at around 20 moves and 3-4 min rests from what I gather. I used to rest for about 5 mins when Trying a similar session but I am a lazy b@stard and only ever developed problem specific fitness outside from siege tactics!
griffithsa - on 11 Feb 2013
In reply to Richard Hession:

Cheers fellas! Reckon I'm gonna try this tomorrow, hopefully I've still got a little bit of stamina left over from all the trad climbing I did a year or two ago!
Quiddity - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to griffithsa:

What shark says, probably aiming to go to failure at the end of the 3rd lap and somewhat earlier on the 4th lap. This is interval training really - the idea is that you accumulate pump throughout the set (ie. incomplete recovery) to force adaptation.

Perhaps try reducing the rest time to ramp up the difficulty if this starts to feel too easy.
Boulderdaz - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to griffithsa: isn't this essentially 4x4 training? That's my understanding of what 4x4's are used for.
seankenny - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to shark:

> I tend to do about 15-20 moves x 4 with 2/3 mins rest.

Roughly how long do those 15 to 20 moves take? ie. are is your work:rest ratio 1:1, 1:2 or longer?
shark - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to seankenny:

Much longer. Not even Geraldine is that slow. I've not timed it but for what I'm currently doing I reckon around 30 secs to do 15 moves. Mine is on bad footholds on a steep systems board so I cant speed it up - which is good. You are right to focus on work time rather than moves though. Tip. If you have a circuit wired and are going artificially fast good idea to slow it down by counting to 3 on each hold particularly if you are training for onsighting.

AJM - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to shark:

Have you timed that? I used to find fiddly feet meant 15 moves could take 50 secs for me...
shark - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to AJM:

Just been checking some footage of my best go on the Oak which is just 12 moves but involves 24 foot moves and takes 70 secs including a clip. Eek.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fwZ653MbUT4

Perhaps I should follow my own advice and slow my climbing down again on the systems board laddering.

This is what I am doing but following criticism from Serpico I have since reset the footholds (poor screw ons) symmetrically
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TOu3vUYsYj8
seankenny - on 13 Feb 2013
In reply to shark:
> (In reply to seankenny)
I've not timed it but for what I'm currently doing I reckon around 30 secs to do 15 moves.

So we're talking 30 secs of dead hard moves here, with the aim to be powered out rather than actually pumped (towards the last or last-but-one set).

Whereas on 20/10s the moves would be somewhat easier, right?



Tip. If you have a circuit wired and are going artificially fast good idea to slow it down by counting to 3 on each hold particularly if you are training for onsighting.

I already do this, and it hurts! :)
Scraggadoo - on 13 Feb 2013
So what should be the work : rest ratio be ideally?

If I understand correctly, the principle is to mimic the circuit (or 4x boulder problems) so that it is similar to project / aim. Rest in between reps should be 3 - 4 times the time taken for circuit. Longer rests of ~10 minutes between sets?

Progression: Either reduce rests in between reps, or make circuit harder?

I tried a similar routine last night and as I completed the third set I was all powered out. But this was on a 1:1 work / rest ratio approx for the sections I completed (circuit broken down into 3, approx 15 moves per section). It seemed to do the trick, but perhaps could have done more had I rested longer in between sections. Too early to say if I'm getting any gains obviously but it definitely was a good workout.
colina - on 13 Feb 2013
In reply to griffithsa:
don't seem to get much training done when I get my "woody". plays havoc with my harness tbh
shark - on 13 Feb 2013
In reply to seankenny:

They are basic and so dont feel dead hard and really target the fingers more than the arms. The feeling when coming off is somewhere between pumped and powered out. 20/10s need to be much easier as the rests are so short.

If you want to investigate further Steve Bechtel of ClimbStrong is really into this stuff and has a variety interval sessions mapped out on his website blogs and a short book he published.http://www.amazon.co.uk/Climb-Strong-Endurance-Steve-Bechtel/dp/1470046156
sam - on 13 Feb 2013
If you're training for routes then you want a 20-40 move circuit that you are able to do all the moves on but cant complete in one push. The smaller the holds, the better. Treat it as a redpoint project. The most important thing is the effort you put in when attempting to complete the circuit. It must be maximum effort every time. If you are giving your all then you will probably need 15 minutes rest between attempts, you need to recover enough so that you can put in a quality effort every time. Four attempts per session should be a pretty good workout.
You could then finish your session with some foot-on campusing to totally empty your forearms.
slinky wizard - on 13 Feb 2013
In reply to sam: using an old climbing rope and adding clip points makes circuits you've wired harder!
ads.ukclimbing.com
seankenny - on 13 Feb 2013
In reply to shark:

Thanks Simon.

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