/ Why would anyone wear a headcam?

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Blizzard - on 11 Mar 2013
When mountaineering? Personally I just dont get it.

You are not going to be able to sell your movie and become a millionaire unless you are a Aron Ralston (127 hours) Or are you?

Can it encourage people to take bigger risks doing stupid things?
xplorer on 11 Mar 2013
In reply to Blizzard:

Maybe for their own enjoyment, obviously with sharing videos online becoming easier all the time, you see more of it.

Don't understand how this causes you any bother. A person with a camera on his head won't risk their life anymore than without. I'm sure after a few minutes you would forget its there
Cameron94 on 11 Mar 2013
In reply to Blizzard: Pretty sure it's for the same reason I keep a camera in my pocket...
Why does it being on their head make any difference to the reason?
Dave Kerr - on 11 Mar 2013
In reply to Cameron94:
> (In reply to Blizzard) > Why does it being on their head make any difference to the reason?

Because 99% of the footage generated is gash. When you stop to take your camera out it's because there is something worth recording.

Blizzard - on 11 Mar 2013
In reply to xplorer:

It doesnt cause me any bother, I was hoping someone could explain to me what I dont understand. If there was money to be made doing it, perhaps I would understand, but thats not the case is it?
Oceanrower - on 11 Mar 2013
In reply to Blizzard: So you only ever do anything if money is involved? That's a bit sad.
Blizzard - on 11 Mar 2013
In reply to Oceanrower:

No, I wouldnt. But I thought that was the general mentality in this capitalist country in which we live.
Ciro - on 11 Mar 2013
In reply to Dave Kerr:
> (In reply to Cameron94)
> [...]
>
> Because 99% of the footage generated is gash. When you stop to take your camera out it's because there is something worth recording.

Quite often on a long day out I'll see something worth taking a picture of but be too cold and tired to be bothered. I imagine filming the day and grabbing stills from it later would be quite a good way to catch those moments.
Milesy - on 11 Mar 2013
In reply to Dave Kerr:

And a lot of the time the best situations when climbing is exactly when you can't take your camera out. Some people like photos and some people like to record footage. So what?
Dave Kerr - on 11 Mar 2013
In reply to Ciro:
> (In reply to Dave Kerr)
> [...]
>
> Quite often on a long day out I'll see something worth taking a picture of but be too cold and tired to be bothered. I imagine filming the day and grabbing stills from it later would be quite a good way to catch those moments.

I'd be really surprised if this worked and if it did then there would be a lot of trawling through to find the good bits. Still, if it works for you.

Camm on 11 Mar 2013
In reply to Blizzard:
I mainly have one so I can see where I'm going wrong, and if I come across something interesting I put it on you tube to show my friends. I don't encourage me to do anything stupid, though I have been known to find more left in the tank when I know someone is recording me climb.
MtnGeekUK - on 11 Mar 2013
In reply to Blizzard:

Bet the guy with the head-cam taking a tumble who was wearing one thought it was a good idea - especially if he was paid for his story / footage?
dutybooty - on 11 Mar 2013
In reply to danrock101: Friends with who I'm replying to! He does it to pose for the girls really!

In fairness, a lot of the videos he comes out with can be rather good, I seem to remember one got a very good reception on here.
Snax - on 11 Mar 2013
In reply to Blizzard: Because GoPro pay me too... cough, cough... I don't use mine much mountaineering, but have it mounted on my boarding helmet, but most of the time its switched off and only used for stills, remote on the wrist or in my pocket makes it easier to use with gloves than a normal camera. Get home with 10/20 photos I most likely wouldn't have taken if I had to dig the compact/DSLR out of the bag...
Stanners - on 11 Mar 2013
In reply to Blizzard:
I totally agree, its completely and utterely ridiculous. Shame on them.
remus - on 11 Mar 2013
In reply to Blizzard: It's like anything creative, if you're smart about it you can get some really cool footage that would otherwise be impossible. Equally you can have an hour of shaky footage of you plodding up a snow gully.
Robert Durran - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Blizzard:
> When mountaineering? Personally I just dont get it.

Adds a new dimension to the term "knobhead" doesn't it? Definitely a worrying trend at Ratho recently.
krikoman - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Blizzard: Down with this sort of thing!!
ice.solo - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Blizzard:
> (In reply to xplorer)
>
If there was money to be made doing it....

there is. by go pro, sony etc.

last few weeks i was working with a film maker who used them in all sorts of ways, but in 2 weeks only twice stuck to a helmet. his thoughts were they capture very specific stuff well - but the vast majority of whats shot is confused crap.
both times the mount came off...

that said; the BASE footage taken in the 80s when the first jump was made off trango - using VHS cams and a chest rig - show what can be acheived.
Jonny2vests - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Blizzard:

Wow, lots of people sticking up for head cams whilst climbing. Which is surprising as surely it doesn't take the brains of a Chinese archbishop to realise its the most un-head-cammable sport EVER.

"Ooooh, there's some rock. And some more rock. This is where I looked at my feet. Looking for gear now."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iZuL6fXgiD4

HELLO?
turtlespit - on 12 Mar 2013
I tried camming my head into an offwidth. Not really an advisable technique :D
xplorer on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Blizzard:

You all wish you could afford a go pro
Jonny2vests - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to xplorer:
> (In reply to Blizzard)
>
> You all wish you could afford a go pro

So you wear one climbing then? Feel free to link some epic footage of rock jerking about the screen.
xplorer on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Jonny2vests:

Do you wear two vest's while climbing?

I don't understand how you all get really wound up and Angry about something that you could quite easily avoid.

Don't watch the footage, surely your not that stupid. The UKC Crew are at it again. I'd join but I'm not a middle aged man going through a real big crisis. Your like women
xplorer on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Jonny2vests:

Why have you taken pictures with a camera, to share or remember a memory.

I just think your jealous that people have started making the news with their footage.

This mentality is why people just simply don't get along in this world, you love a bit of drama, go watch coronation street
Jamie B - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to xplorer:

> The UKC Crew are at it again. I'd join but I'm not a middle aged man going through a real big crisis.

I am. I don't like people with headcams because they've all got bigger knobs and pull more chicks than me. By scorning them online I feel that I can redress this imbalance.
Jonny2vests - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to xplorer:
> (In reply to Jonny2vests)
>
> Do you wear two vest's while climbing?
>
> I don't understand how you all get really wound up and Angry about something that you could quite easily avoid.
>
> Don't watch the footage, surely your not that stupid. The UKC Crew are at it again. I'd join but I'm not a middle aged man going through a real big crisis. Your like women

Its quite hard to infer mood from plain text. I think anyone reading that would think that you were angrier than me.

xplorer on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Jonny2vests:

Ok mate, yea your right, absolute morons do get me angry yea. There's plenty in this world I don't agree with, but don't start a thread about every single gripe.

You just need bringing to light because your that bad
Jonny2vests - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to xplorer:
> (In reply to Jonny2vests)
>
> Why have you taken pictures with a camera, to share or remember a memory.
>
> I just think your jealous that people have started making the news with their footage.
>
> This mentality is why people just simply don't get along in this world, you love a bit of drama, go watch coronation street

I haven't actually got a problem with GoPros etc, in fact I've been asked to wear one on a skiing trip.

But anyone who films the rock in front of their face and then proudly posts it, unedited in any way, is fair game. It takes a special kind of person to call that entertaining, maybe your special.
Jonny2vests - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to xplorer:
> (In reply to Jonny2vests)
>
> Ok mate, yea your right, absolute morons do get me angry yea. There's plenty in this world I don't agree with, but don't start a thread about every single gripe.
>
> You just need bringing to light because your that bad

I think you like being angry on the internet, is this your hobby this month? Another one looking for an argument (whilst feigning the opposite), you seem determined to be disliked.
Pinged - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Jonny2vests and xplorer:

It's 'you're' as in you are, not 'your' as in belonging to you.

If you're going to have a debate at least get your words right. :)
Jamie B - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to xplorer:

> I just think your jealous that people have started making the news with their footage.

Personally I'm not at all jealous of the guy who slid down Parsley Fern Gully...
Jonny2vests - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Pinged:
> (In reply to Jonny2vests and xplorer)
>
> It's 'you're' as in you are, not 'your' as in belonging to you.
>
> If you're going to have a debate at least get your words right. :)

Thanks. I hate myself now.

PS. You misspelled 'Frogatt' and your diffy at least one apostrophe in your profile. Just letting you know so you can be whiter than white next time you help me out ;-)
Pinged - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Jonny2vests:

Hahaha....I'm hanging my head...oh the shame! :)

Robert Durran - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Jonny2vests:
> But anyone who films the rock in front of their face and then proudly posts it, unedited in any way, is fair game. It takes a special kind of person to call that entertaining, maybe your special.

To be fair, if a headcam is used to film someone actually climbing while leaving the hands free to belay, it can produce excellent stuff (see that recent film on here of Bullock on the Czech Direct on Denali for a fantastic example), but yes, most headcam footage is totally shit.

mikekeswick - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Robert Durran:
> (In reply to Blizzard)
> [...]
>
> Adds a new dimension to the term "knobhead" doesn't it? Definitely a worrying trend at Ratho recently.

Very good!
I think what it demonstrates is the relatively new mentality of 'check me out, i've got such a big ego that everybody is going to want to watch my latest effort at being cool'.
People who say 'it's about the memories etc is just plain nonsense. A camera,video etc doesn't catch so much detail that goes to make up the whole experience, all it gets is what you point it at. I personally prefer the memories that are in my head. If people started using their brains to something like their cabaility maybe they would realise that the best storage device is sat on your shoulders and you don't have to pay some multi-national for the privilege.
scott quinn - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Blizzard:
Like its already been said for the individuals enjoyment and keepsake.
I personaly like the idea of being able to film my climbs but cant justify spending 300 odd on a gopro :P haha

Also does no one think it would be good to review your gear on a trad climb perhaps with a more experienced climber, some of the ones i've watched on you tube scare the sh*t out of me with people putting in the worst protection ever. Atleast this way they have a viral medium or friends at home to tell them they arent the safest...Your second cant remember everthing.
ashaw - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Blizzard: I encourage my students to do it as it means we can then sit observe the footage and use it against criteria
Mark Westerman - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to scott quinn:

I saw a couple of guys from London on the Guide's route on the back of Cinque Torre last year wearing them. They were stuck behind a party of people being guided on the first belay for about an hour.

I'm guessing some Xtreme editing would be required.

cheers
mark
Andy Clarke - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Robert Durran:

if a headcam is used to film someone actually climbing while leaving the hands free to belay...

This is how my partner and I use a go pro and we've got some good footage. In fact, I'd be surprised if this wasn't how most people used them while climbing. Seems rather strange for the leader to wear it other than in exceptional circumstances. It does however have the disadvantage that if you nod off while belaying it's recorded for posterity.

Kieran_John - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Blizzard:

I've used one a few times, I enjoy messing around with video editing software and it offers up some interesting footage. Unedited I agree, it looks dreadful but used to:

a) Capture someone else climbing on the route next to you.
b) Face backwards and capture the view

headcams can produce some quite interesting stuff. Even faced slightly down in 940p (4:3 aspect ratio) you can capture hand and foot movements which, if edited in to other footage, can look pretty good.

That said I didn't get my GoPro for use as a headcam, I wanted a camera I wasn't scared to use out and about, something a little tougher. My Panasonic SD90 was getting chalky and banged up. I'm looking forward to getting some proper use out of it when it warms up a bit and I can get outside more (yes, I'm a wimp).

And nope, I'm not likely to make ANY money out of my footage, but that doesn't mean I don't enjoy editing clips together, similar to how 99% of people taking photographs have no interest in selling them.
tlm - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Blizzard:
> (In reply to Oceanrower)
>
> No, I wouldnt. But I thought that was the general mentality in this capitalist country in which we live.

So you honestly think that people only go climbing because there is money to be made out of it???!!!

deepstar - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to krikoman:
> (In reply to Blizzard) Down with this sort of thing!!

Careful Now!
xplorer on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Jonny2vests:

I've met your type before mate, you always win your arguments, not on the basis that your right, you just take it to far. You have way to much time on your hands. Get a job or a hobbie your not going to slate.
Mark Westerman - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to xplorer:

Your right

stunted = angry

cheers
mark
xplorer on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Mark Westerman:

Ahhhh little man syndrome
PeterM - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Blizzard:

You're a tool?
mutt - on 12 Mar 2013
Robert Durran - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Andy Clarke:
> (In reply to Robert Durran)
>
> if a headcam is used to film someone actually climbing while leaving the hands free to belay...
>
> This is how my partner and I use a go pro and we've got some good footage. In fact, I'd be surprised if this wasn't how most people used them while climbing.

I expect that probably is how most people use them, but because it can be good it doesn't provoke comment, unlike the complete rubbish filmed while actually climnbing which is obviously from a head cams and gives them their bad name.
tprebs - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Blizzard:
I can understand why people use them in mountaineering as you are in exposed situations you can get some good footage (mostly crap but some good). I don't really see the point in wearing one while on an 8 metre route on grit where all you see is juttery pictures of grit.
ChrisJD on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to tprebs:

I really like what UKC stanners did on this one:

http://www.vimeo.com/52489663
squicky - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to ChrisJD: Good work, Stanners!

I'm convinced that climbing is the world's worst spectator sport. There may be a lot of adrenaline but the action is painstakingly slow and unless you climb a lot, you can't tell the difference between an easy route and a good climber. I've taken my headcam out quite a bit and got about 5s of useful footage. Much better for skiing and BASE jumping.
Rekotin on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Blizzard:

I typically carry a GoPro and an SLR on trips to shoot video and pictures, which I then edit together at home to put together a video of the trip as a whole so there's a nice memory to go back to + I can easily send it to friends and relatives etc. So instead of going through 200 boring pictures without narration, they get the storyteller-version (which technically editing is all about).

I have some friends who use GoPro exclusively, especially in the alpine environment. The newer GoPros have already good enough quality so the pictures you get etc are nice to look at. They vary between shooting video of the more exposed bits etc and snapping it off the helmet, taking photos and snapping it back in.

Shooting pics and video is a hobby as anything else, which requires commitment to do anything well. I've shot stuff for about 15 years and 2/3 of my time within that hobby goes down with editing the meaningless bits and squeezing 5 hours worth of footage into fun 5 minutes of footage that still retains everything the trip was about.

Never ever thought about money as I do have a day job as well :)
Ciderslider - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Blizzard: I got a gopro a couple of year ago and took it to stanage. Videoed my mate climbing and it made me realise why he hates me soooooo much - from the start to the end of his lead I was taking the piss out of him constantly (I never realised what an irritating b@stard I am).
Jonny2vests - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Mark Westerman:
> (In reply to xplorer)
>
> Your right
>
> stunted = angry
>
> cheers
> mark

FFS Mark it's 'you're'. Foof.
Jonny2vests - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Andy Clarke:
> (In reply to Robert Durran)
>
> if a headcam is used to film someone actually climbing while leaving the hands free to belay...
>
> This is how my partner and I use a go pro and we've got some good footage. In fact, I'd be surprised if this wasn't how most people used them while climbing. Seems rather strange for the leader to wear it other than in exceptional circumstances. It does however have the disadvantage that if you nod off while belaying it's recorded for posterity.

Well, yeah. But that's just 'filming', people do that one handed too with an iPhone. When were talking head cam, the classic use is to film your own actions which is what I assumed the topic was about.

Arse shot video also has it limitations I think too though. As do arse shot stills. How good are the stills from these things?
Jonny2vests - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to xplorer:
> (In reply to Jonny2vests)
>
> I've met your type before mate, you always win your arguments

I accept your resignation.
xplorer on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Jonny2vests:

Your way to persistent you two vests
Robert Durran - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Jonny2vests:
> (In reply to Andy Clarke)
>
> Well, yeah. But that's just 'filming', people do that one handed too with an iPhone.

Yes, but then you can't belay or do anything else two handed. The whole point of a headcam is that it is no-handed (not to take crap stuff while you are climbing or whatever)
Jonny2vests - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Robert Durran:

Ok, but my interpretation was using a gopro to film yourself climbing.
ads.ukclimbing.com
xplorer on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Jonny2vests:

Boring
Jonshef on 12 Mar 2013
I was determined not to reply to this,

but... After a recent climbing trip, my mate and I watched the video, I was all ready to see myself scraping up the route, but instead watched a rather attractive climber to our left instead. Now that has got to be reason enough to wear a headcam
Robert Durran - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Jonny2vests:
> (In reply to Robert Durran)
>
> Ok, but my interpretation was using a gopro to film yourself climbing.

I think that is probably most peoples' interpretation, because so much headcam footage is such rubbish! The good stuff could be mistaken for having a third person filming and could easily go unnoticed.

Stanners - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to ChrisJD:
cheers mate! :)
Jonny2vests - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to xplorer:

I've never actually been stalked on an internet forum before. Are you sure you're 27?
Jonny2vests - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Robert Durran:
> (In reply to Jonny2vests)
> [...]
>
> I think that is probably most peoples' interpretation, because so much headcam footage is such rubbish! The good stuff could be mistaken for having a third person filming and could easily go unnoticed.

Yeah, fair enough.
xplorer on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Jonny2vests:

Have alook on this and the other threads and you will see its you snurging on me
SailorSam on 12 Mar 2013
Each man/woman to there own. Some in favour some not, all a matter of choice! If someone wants to do it, why judge?
Minneconjou Sioux - on 12 Mar 2013
Carolyn - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Jonshef:
>
> but... After a recent climbing trip, my mate and I watched the video, I was all ready to see myself scraping up the route, but instead watched a rather attractive climber to our left instead. Now that has got to be reason enough to wear a headcam

PMSL. Sticking the head cam on my son's head whilst he was skiing demonstrated he really did eye up every bump in the side of the piste for jump possibilities....
subalpine - on 12 Mar 2013
In reply to Blizzard: Dude had a go pro on his head which increased his chances of falling by at least 200% Then there is the britt factor. Britts on ice= annother 200% increase in the odds of an accident.
http://www.supertopo.com/climbing/thread.php?topic_id=2089265

probably not that far from the truth?

hulacams are the future: http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=4da_1347693108
iain miller - on 12 Mar 2013
It's called being in the moment,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iT4SdLiZ3M8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5V09d9Lk-Sg

And if we can make that moment last, then why the cause for complaint?
67hours - on 13 Mar 2013
stephen Rowley - on 13 Mar 2013
In reply to 67hours: its a bit like asking why do people take pictures of them while climbing.
fultonville - on 13 Mar 2013
In reply to Blizzard: After getting hammered by spindrifts last week on Point Five Gully it would've kinda cool to show my North American friends how freakin cool climbing in Scotland is but I see what you're saying.

Encourage bigger risk? Well at least when things do go to shit there'll be some great footage.
BALD EAGLE - on 13 Mar 2013
In reply to Blizzard:
> When mountaineering? Personally I just dont get it.

Personally I think helmet-cam footage by itself does not work that well for climbing or mountaineering so I use a Panasonic V700 camcorder on a decent tripod, complimented with a few GoPro2 shots to hopefully add an interesting mix of angles and views. As an IT philistine I have found the editing to be the greatest challenge and a very steep learning curve but greatly enjoy the creative side of condensing a load of footage into a few minutes of film.
Feel free to have a look at one or two of my latest efforts such as Croesor-Rhosydd, Escalando en Tenerife or Torpantau Ice Climbing for example:
http://www.youtube.com/user/chdslDave/videos?view=0&flow=grid
Cheers Dave

dougyt26 - on 13 Mar 2013
In reply to Blizzard: Im looking at getting a helmet cam so ill be increasing my status from idiot to dick head apparently I also carry a DSLR.
graeme jackson - on 13 Mar 2013
In reply to Dave Kerr:
> (In reply to Cameron94)
> [...]
>
> Because 99% of the footage generated is gash. When you stop to take your camera out it's because there is something worth recording.

When I stop to take my camera out it's usually because I want an excuse to have a rest.

Ann S on 13 Mar 2013
In reply to Blizzard:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I7_4n_4Qhu4

Thanks to this one I'll know what to expect if I ever need rescuing off a Canadian crag face.
adstapleton - on 13 Mar 2013
In reply to Blizzard:

for the view and in case there's a meteorite impact.
mackay780 - on 14 Mar 2013
In reply to Blizzard:

well this escalated quicdkly!

does this forum actually have any worthwhile threads anymore or is now simply a case of,
person A; "i do not like something so i'll have a whinge"
person B; "i disagree completely and will make a semi valid point inamongst angry rantings"
person C; "i'm just going to prod the hornets nest and enjoy the fireworks"


personally i do wear a head cam for climbing/mountain biking/water sports/motor sports and despite feeling a bit of a prat at times, i have captured some amazing stills from footage, made little montages as gifts for people from stag doos and parties, but i get a lot of joy taking all my various "epic" pictures and setting them aside in a folder on my computer, that changes the background image randomly. and i smliel to myself every time a picture comes up that reminds me of some of the cool things i have done.

if it really does bother you that much, go off some where private and die quietly
Jonny2vests - on 14 Mar 2013
In reply to mackay780:

Your own post makes you sound like persons A,B and C.

**disappears in a puff of logic**
iain miller - on 14 Mar 2013
In reply to Blizzard:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5YGQPmgWRR8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qsBck_I2bMA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e-G7trT2p6Q

It would indeed appear to be, a case of that there are those that are having a laugh and there are those who are not?
rocky57 - on 15 Mar 2013
In reply to MtnGeekUK:
> (In reply to Blizzard)
>
- especially if he was paid for his story / footage?

Does anyone know if he did get paid? What is the going rate for this kind of thing. No I'm not thinking of throwing myself down a gully.
obi-wan nick b - on 15 Mar 2013
In reply to rocky57:
> (In reply to MtnGeekUK)
> [...]

> Does anyone know if he did get paid? What is the going rate for this kind of thing.

About 120 mph
rocky57 - on 15 Mar 2013
In reply to obi-wan nick b:
> (In reply to rocky57)
> [...]
>
> [...]
>
> About 120 mph

Is that the max?
TRip - on 15 Mar 2013
In reply to Robert Durran:
> (In reply to Jonny2vests)
> [...]
>
> To be fair, if a headcam is used to film someone actually climbing while leaving the hands free to belay, it can produce excellent stuff (see that recent film on here of Bullock on the Czech Direct on Denali for a fantastic example), but yes, most headcam footage is totally shit.

That was filmed on two compact digital cameras. Not a gopro or similar.
Robert Durran - on 20 Mar 2013
In reply to TRip:
> (In reply to Robert Durran)
> That was filmed on two compact digital cameras. Not a gopro or similar.

Now that film seems even more impressive then!


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