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Just read this http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?n=568853 and it made me think. I was at Froggat yesterday and blithely wandered off from my Rucksack of stuff which even without the rack I was carrying would cost £300 - £ 400 to replace PLUS a mobile worth £100 PLUS my wallet with credit cards and drivers licence and cash. This poor persons misfortune has been a wake up call to me. Total sympathy but if you dump £1k`s worth of stuff on the ground and walk away, why expect it to be there when you comeback, it`s not like you would leave a mountain bike unlocked and expect it to be there on return
In Rocktalk because this is a serious issue all climbers should consider.
In Rocktalk because this is a serious issue all climbers should consider.
In reply to sjc:
I have been climbing over 20 years and the only theft I have ever suffered was the theft of my climbing gear from inside my tent in a campsite near Verdon Gorge (left only two minutes).
I have been climbing over 20 years and the only theft I have ever suffered was the theft of my climbing gear from inside my tent in a campsite near Verdon Gorge (left only two minutes).
In reply to sjc: do exactly the same thing myself, just dump a sack of gear,wallets, phone on floor and wander off. You're are right it is a serious issue. Probably should carry wallet and phone in pocket, but at some point they'd always going to be gear that you will have to leave.
In reply to sjc: Crags that are easily accessible to the general public are the worst. At many of the South Wales quarries there is also a higher risk of theft from the car but generally speaking I think climbers are an honest group of people and once upon a time one climber stealing another climbers gear was unheard of.
In reply to sjc: Thefts tend to go in waves when one or two little scrotes realises what a soft target climbers are. I personally wouldn't leave a pile of cash unattended so in the same way I don't leave my Bike unattended at trail centre cafes or my Snowboard unlocked in a Ski rack. I always take my bag at the crag to under where I am climbing.
>> Why are we so causal at the crag?
Like many things in climbing it is a balance of risks:
- You don't tend to take your posh delicate phone up a single pitch because it is more likely to get smashed than stolen.
- You can't climb with all your gear and there are no handy lockers at the crag so what other option do you have.
- You don't tend to leave your bag in an area frequented by scrotes (Black Rocks excepted but the usual risk here is pissed up teenagers throwing bottles off the top of the crag) and it is normally your sight.
Thankfully outright theft (as opposed to the much contested appropriation of gear found lodged in a climb) is pretty uncommon.
Short of installing lockers at the bottom of Stanage what do you suggest? half the time leaving your valuables in the car is no safer.
Like many things in climbing it is a balance of risks:
- You don't tend to take your posh delicate phone up a single pitch because it is more likely to get smashed than stolen.
- You can't climb with all your gear and there are no handy lockers at the crag so what other option do you have.
- You don't tend to leave your bag in an area frequented by scrotes (Black Rocks excepted but the usual risk here is pissed up teenagers throwing bottles off the top of the crag) and it is normally your sight.
Thankfully outright theft (as opposed to the much contested appropriation of gear found lodged in a climb) is pretty uncommon.
Short of installing lockers at the bottom of Stanage what do you suggest? half the time leaving your valuables in the car is no safer.
In reply to sjc:
Au contrair - if I dump £1k of stuff somewhere, I should be able to expect it to be there when I get back. If left for a significant amount of time, then if it's gone, I should expect to be able to claim it back from the nearest police station, where it's been handed in as lost property.
It's the thieving bastards that are in the wrong for taking it, not me for leaving it.
> Total sympathy but if you dump £1k`s worth of stuff on the ground and walk away, why expect it to be there when you comeback, it`s not like you would leave a mountain bike unlocked and expect it to be there on return
Au contrair - if I dump £1k of stuff somewhere, I should be able to expect it to be there when I get back. If left for a significant amount of time, then if it's gone, I should expect to be able to claim it back from the nearest police station, where it's been handed in as lost property.
It's the thieving bastards that are in the wrong for taking it, not me for leaving it.
In reply to LastBoyScout:
No one is suggesting you are wrong. Perhaps just naive.
> (In reply to sjc)
> It's the thieving bastards that are in the wrong for taking it, not me for leaving it.
> It's the thieving bastards that are in the wrong for taking it, not me for leaving it.
No one is suggesting you are wrong. Perhaps just naive.
In reply to Robert Durran:
I said "I should", not that I actually do - don't call me naive.
> (In reply to LastBoyScout)
> [...]
>
> No one is suggesting you are wrong. Perhaps just naive.
> [...]
>
> No one is suggesting you are wrong. Perhaps just naive.
I said "I should", not that I actually do - don't call me naive.
In reply to LastBoyScout:
fair enough.
> (In reply to Robert Durran)
> [...]
>
> I said "I should", not that I actually do - don't call me naive.
> [...]
>
> I said "I should", not that I actually do - don't call me naive.
fair enough.
In reply to sjc: Unfortunately a sizeable proportion of the population consider anything left unattended as fair game, so my wallet always stays in a zipped trouser pocket along with my keys, and the phone stays on me, too. I don't find it surprising when I hear of gear being stolen, and I always have it in mind if I'm leaving any of my rack in a bag at the base of the route or in the car.
If you were in a high-risk area and wanted peace-of-mind you could get one of those steel-mesh security bags that fits over a rucksack and lock it to a tree (assuming the crag has trees).
If you were in a high-risk area and wanted peace-of-mind you could get one of those steel-mesh security bags that fits over a rucksack and lock it to a tree (assuming the crag has trees).
In reply to wurzelinzummerset:
The problem is judging where "high risk" is though, I think. Thieves will target anywhere they think will be easy pickings, and that's often simply places where people think they are secure. I remember interrupting a bloke who was surreptitiously rummaging in bags at the old Sheffield Poly wall. I'd seen him there before and he didn't seem much of a climber, but he'd clearly clocked it as a good opportunity. It was a small space and I think most people just didn't think there was any risk as they were never more than a few metres from their bag.
Most of my climbing is done on _very_ deserted crags these days, but I think I'd be pretty cautious leaving anything anywhere on a half popular Peak crag. I feel sad that I've become this suspicious though.
The problem is judging where "high risk" is though, I think. Thieves will target anywhere they think will be easy pickings, and that's often simply places where people think they are secure. I remember interrupting a bloke who was surreptitiously rummaging in bags at the old Sheffield Poly wall. I'd seen him there before and he didn't seem much of a climber, but he'd clearly clocked it as a good opportunity. It was a small space and I think most people just didn't think there was any risk as they were never more than a few metres from their bag.
Most of my climbing is done on _very_ deserted crags these days, but I think I'd be pretty cautious leaving anything anywhere on a half popular Peak crag. I feel sad that I've become this suspicious though.
In reply to LastBoyScout:
does this apply to "crag swag"? The gear that was left as unretrievable but someone else managed to get out.
Lockers at crags is a good idea.
does this apply to "crag swag"? The gear that was left as unretrievable but someone else managed to get out.
Lockers at crags is a good idea.
In reply to Jonny2vests:
Exactly. I leave my kit lying around at decent crags all the time. I wouldn't do that at Black Rocks, nor some West Yorkshire quarried shithole.
> (In reply to sjc)
>
> Black Rocks is a special case, often frequented by light fingered chavs.
>
> Black Rocks is a special case, often frequented by light fingered chavs.
Exactly. I leave my kit lying around at decent crags all the time. I wouldn't do that at Black Rocks, nor some West Yorkshire quarried shithole.
In reply to sjc:
Someone stole my approach shoes from Birchen once (had to walk out and drive home in my climbing shoes) almost certainly someone in a dodgy looking family (non-climber) walking by took that. My other theft was when I left my camera on a rock at Baslow lower tier and went back an hour later it had gone. The vast majority of climbers are clearly very honest and trusting (except in the grey area of crag swag).
Someone stole my approach shoes from Birchen once (had to walk out and drive home in my climbing shoes) almost certainly someone in a dodgy looking family (non-climber) walking by took that. My other theft was when I left my camera on a rock at Baslow lower tier and went back an hour later it had gone. The vast majority of climbers are clearly very honest and trusting (except in the grey area of crag swag).
In reply to LastBoyScout:
I couldn't agree more. But back in the real world...
Leaving a tidy bag is one thing, but it is the folks at the likes of Stanage and Froggatt on a busy day who seem to spread their kit out liberally among the rocks that get my amazement.
> It's the thieving bastards that are in the wrong for taking it, not me for leaving it.
I couldn't agree more. But back in the real world...
Leaving a tidy bag is one thing, but it is the folks at the likes of Stanage and Froggatt on a busy day who seem to spread their kit out liberally among the rocks that get my amazement.
In reply to sjc: I have had folks 'half-inch' my gear a number of times. At Red Rocks and an Alpine Hut I threatened to search the rucsack of everybody in the vicinty and both times my gear miraculously re-appeared from someone elses rucksack.
In reply to Juicefree:
Sound like a very odd response to me, are you a man mountain or is this a multiple example of the rare "you got me bang to rights" honest theif. You absolutely sure it wasnt making them think that they might have tidied up stuff by mistake? I've seen theives respond to challenge and they dont voluntary return things unless the alternative is serious.
Sound like a very odd response to me, are you a man mountain or is this a multiple example of the rare "you got me bang to rights" honest theif. You absolutely sure it wasnt making them think that they might have tidied up stuff by mistake? I've seen theives respond to challenge and they dont voluntary return things unless the alternative is serious.
In reply to sjc:
Have had (fortunately old and scrappy) mobile knocked from a well known climbing wall, and a belay device plus carabiner from Kalymnos.
Have a couple of times accidentally left rucksack full of stuff at car parks generally frequented by hikers and got it returned to me both times.
Bit of a small sample size to generalize from, but can't help thinking that hikers are less sticky fingered than climbers. Maybe due to the 'crag swag' that many climbers appear to ascribe to.
Have had (fortunately old and scrappy) mobile knocked from a well known climbing wall, and a belay device plus carabiner from Kalymnos.
Have a couple of times accidentally left rucksack full of stuff at car parks generally frequented by hikers and got it returned to me both times.
Bit of a small sample size to generalize from, but can't help thinking that hikers are less sticky fingered than climbers. Maybe due to the 'crag swag' that many climbers appear to ascribe to.
In reply to sjc: Climbers are no more honest or dishonest than anyone else. After all, who is using/buying this nicked gear? Climbers. Who is it who comes and puts their stuff next to yours when there is plenty of room? That's right. It's other climbers who then 'accidentally' get their gear tangled with yours and 'accidentally' pick up some of yours too. Leaving valuable gear lying around at the bottom of single pitch crags is just plain daft. Keep it with you as you move along the crag. Multi pitch is different and it's a judgement call as to which it the lesser of the evils - leave wallet etc in the car or take it with you, leave in sack and risk it getting nicked or carry it and risk losing it. I feel safer leaving a sack at, say, Gimmer than Shepherd's but it's always a risk and I leave as little as possible.
In reply to sjc:
In South Africa the Mountain Club has installed metal cages near some crags to put your gear in.
This is to stop thieving from your sack by monkeys. Might work against light fingered humans as well!
You are right, we tend to be very trusting in this country and on balance I think that trust is well placed. However I still think it makes sense to be cautious and aware. For example I don't take my wallet or phone with me when I go cragging, I just take enough money for a drink and a pie afterwards, and leave them at home or if away, locked in the boot of the car.
I or my friends have been robbed more than once at Font - a few years ago notorious for rucksack thieving and car break ins - and when there I tend to keep valuables on me with a light daysack or money belt.
I've also had the car broken into in Spain, twice now, so again don't leave things in it, unless locked in the boot - even that is risky but hopefully deters opportunists.
In South Africa the Mountain Club has installed metal cages near some crags to put your gear in.
This is to stop thieving from your sack by monkeys. Might work against light fingered humans as well!
You are right, we tend to be very trusting in this country and on balance I think that trust is well placed. However I still think it makes sense to be cautious and aware. For example I don't take my wallet or phone with me when I go cragging, I just take enough money for a drink and a pie afterwards, and leave them at home or if away, locked in the boot of the car.
I or my friends have been robbed more than once at Font - a few years ago notorious for rucksack thieving and car break ins - and when there I tend to keep valuables on me with a light daysack or money belt.
I've also had the car broken into in Spain, twice now, so again don't leave things in it, unless locked in the boot - even that is risky but hopefully deters opportunists.
In reply to AndrewW:
To be honest, if someone can't see the obvious differences between claiming a nut that the previous owner has abandoned because it was stuck and lifting the valuables from a bag when the owner isn't looking then the problem is probably with them, not with the notion of 'crag swag'.
> (In reply to sjc)
>
>
> Bit of a small sample size to generalize from, but can't help thinking that hikers are less sticky fingered than climbers. Maybe due to the 'crag swag' that many climbers appear to ascribe to.
To be honest, if someone can't see the obvious differences between claiming a nut that the previous owner has abandoned because it was stuck and lifting the valuables from a bag when the owner isn't looking then the problem is probably with them, not with the notion of 'crag swag'.
In reply to Wiley Coyote:
Where are they selling nicked gear? Down the pub? Or should we be suspicious of sellers on UKC?
> (In reply to sjc) Climbers are no more honest or dishonest than anyone else. After all, who is using/buying this nicked gear? Climbers.
Where are they selling nicked gear? Down the pub? Or should we be suspicious of sellers on UKC?
In reply to humptydumpty:
I certainly think we should, unless they are posters with a regular history of posting on here. I am very suspicious of new posters who pop up with things to sell and have no profile or history on here.
Tough on genuine people but I'd rather err on the cautious side and I think we all owe it to each other to try and ensure there is no market for nicked gear.
> (In reply to Wiley Coyote)
> [...]
>
> should we be suspicious of sellers on UKC?
> [...]
>
> should we be suspicious of sellers on UKC?
I certainly think we should, unless they are posters with a regular history of posting on here. I am very suspicious of new posters who pop up with things to sell and have no profile or history on here.
Tough on genuine people but I'd rather err on the cautious side and I think we all owe it to each other to try and ensure there is no market for nicked gear.
In reply to sjc: I used to leave my car keys and wallet in my sack at the top of the cliffs at Swanage when climbing. This was nicked and a housemate had to drive a couple of hours to drop off a spare car key. Rucksack turned up at the local police station - along with all the gear, spare clothes car keys etc, but no wallet.
Wasn't climber, but local druggie who'd figured where to get some easy pickings.
I always climb with car key on me in a secure pocket and don't take valubles unless no other alternative. I take the view that though most people are honest, if you've taken something to the crag your not prepared to lose keep an eye on it.
Wasn't climber, but local druggie who'd figured where to get some easy pickings.
I always climb with car key on me in a secure pocket and don't take valubles unless no other alternative. I take the view that though most people are honest, if you've taken something to the crag your not prepared to lose keep an eye on it.
In reply to Trangia:
Is it worth formally tackling that? E.g. requiring people to confirm their ID somehow before selling stuff, or be a member for a while before it's allowed?
What about people who only post on here to sell stuff, seem to imply it's personal gear, but sell a lot of stuff?
I guess no one really knows if there's stolen stuff being sold on here or not...
Is it worth formally tackling that? E.g. requiring people to confirm their ID somehow before selling stuff, or be a member for a while before it's allowed?
What about people who only post on here to sell stuff, seem to imply it's personal gear, but sell a lot of stuff?
I guess no one really knows if there's stolen stuff being sold on here or not...
In reply to Ramblin dave:
True. Mind you I've also had gear taken after I'd decked out on a route and not been able to retrieve them there and then (for hopefully obvious reasons). It would have been I think clear to the retriever under what circumstances the stuff was left but they didn't appear to make any effort to get the stuff returned to me (I also advertised the circumstances of the loss). I guess the 'crag swag' ethos holds here too. The one occasion I came across something similar I at least took the stuff to the local cop shop.
> (In reply to AndrewW)
> [...]
>
> [...]
>
> To be honest, if someone can't see the obvious differences between claiming a nut that the previous owner has abandoned because it was stuck and lifting the valuables from a bag when the owner isn't looking then the problem is probably with them, not with the notion of 'crag swag'.
> [...]
>
> [...]
>
> To be honest, if someone can't see the obvious differences between claiming a nut that the previous owner has abandoned because it was stuck and lifting the valuables from a bag when the owner isn't looking then the problem is probably with them, not with the notion of 'crag swag'.
True. Mind you I've also had gear taken after I'd decked out on a route and not been able to retrieve them there and then (for hopefully obvious reasons). It would have been I think clear to the retriever under what circumstances the stuff was left but they didn't appear to make any effort to get the stuff returned to me (I also advertised the circumstances of the loss). I guess the 'crag swag' ethos holds here too. The one occasion I came across something similar I at least took the stuff to the local cop shop.
In reply to sjc:
The truth is that you need more at the crag than you carry whilst climbing, and if you're not in a group large enough to accommodate covering for bags, it's a real risk. I generally keep my phone and wallet on me whilst I climb, but the other half of my rack, my clothes and my smaller bits (not to mention the bag itself) represent a loss upwards for £200.
Suggestion;
http://pacsafe.com/pacsafe-55l-bag-protector
Pacsafe it to a rock or a tree? The only worry is that it says "Steal me I'm valuable".
The truth is that you need more at the crag than you carry whilst climbing, and if you're not in a group large enough to accommodate covering for bags, it's a real risk. I generally keep my phone and wallet on me whilst I climb, but the other half of my rack, my clothes and my smaller bits (not to mention the bag itself) represent a loss upwards for £200.
Suggestion;
http://pacsafe.com/pacsafe-55l-bag-protector
Pacsafe it to a rock or a tree? The only worry is that it says "Steal me I'm valuable".
In reply to LastBoyScout:
You're naive. ()
> (In reply to Robert Durran)
> [...]
>
> I said "I should", not that I actually do - don't call me naive.
> [...]
>
> I said "I should", not that I actually do - don't call me naive.
You're naive. ()
In reply to neuromancer:
The harsh reality is it'll probably do enough. What it actually says is "steal somebody else's bag - it'll be easier than this one....."
>
> Suggestion;
>
> http://pacsafe.com/pacsafe-55l-bag-protector
>
> Pacsafe it to a rock or a tree? The only worry is that it says "Steal me I'm valuable".
> Suggestion;
>
> http://pacsafe.com/pacsafe-55l-bag-protector
>
> Pacsafe it to a rock or a tree? The only worry is that it says "Steal me I'm valuable".
The harsh reality is it'll probably do enough. What it actually says is "steal somebody else's bag - it'll be easier than this one....."
In reply to sjc:
Because in general we can be.
jk
> Why are we all so casual about security at the crag?
Because in general we can be.
jk
In reply to Trangia:
Though, if there are dishonest people with posting histories, there's little way of knowing.
> (In reply to humptydumpty)
> I certainly think we should, unless they are posters with a regular history of posting on here. I am very suspicious of new posters who pop up with things to sell and have no profile or history on here.
>
> Tough on genuine people but I'd rather err on the cautious side and I think we all owe it to each other to try and ensure there is no market for nicked gear.
>
> Tough on genuine people but I'd rather err on the cautious side and I think we all owe it to each other to try and ensure there is no market for nicked gear.
Though, if there are dishonest people with posting histories, there's little way of knowing.
In reply to sjc: Leaving stuff at the bottom of a crag is unavoidable but I would neever leave anything that would cause me major hassle if it was lost. Hence I always carry my wallet and car keys. My phone is a £8 Nokia so losing it is no big deal except for the hassle of putting all the numbers into a new one so on single pitch routes I may "hide" it deep in my sack, on multipitch I carry it, if I'm ever very unlucky I might need it to summon rescue.
In reply to sjc: As a development of the theme, I have been guilty of leaving wallet and car keys in a sac at the bottom of a single pitch many times but on reflection may certainly start to carry the car key.
If my bag and any gear I wasn't using got stolen it would be very annoying but not the end of the world.
If somebody took my sac with a car key in it and subsequently stole the car there would be no chance of claiming on the insurance. Now that loss would be a lot harder to bear.
If my bag and any gear I wasn't using got stolen it would be very annoying but not the end of the world.
If somebody took my sac with a car key in it and subsequently stole the car there would be no chance of claiming on the insurance. Now that loss would be a lot harder to bear.
In reply to Gareth:
Disconcerting story.
I tend to regard Swanage as one of the generally safe places to leave gear, not least because of the steep convex slopes leading down to cliffs like the Boulder Ruckle.
> (In reply to sjc) I used to leave my car keys and wallet in my sack at the top of the cliffs at Swanage when climbing. This was nicked and a housemate had to drive a couple of hours to drop off a spare car key.
Disconcerting story.
I tend to regard Swanage as one of the generally safe places to leave gear, not least because of the steep convex slopes leading down to cliffs like the Boulder Ruckle.
In reply to Timmd:
Agreed. Maybe I'm being naive, but I think it's less likely that someone with a recognised persona on this forum would be advertising stolen gear?
Agreed. Maybe I'm being naive, but I think it's less likely that someone with a recognised persona on this forum would be advertising stolen gear?
In reply to sjc:
I've had the same dilemma once or twice. Depending on the crag, I asked the second to tie the bag onto another rope, and brought it up so far up the crag, so it dangled out of reach of casual thieves.
Or, choose your crag wisely.
Sx
I've had the same dilemma once or twice. Depending on the crag, I asked the second to tie the bag onto another rope, and brought it up so far up the crag, so it dangled out of reach of casual thieves.
Or, choose your crag wisely.
Sx
In reply to sjc:
I just leave a grenade with the pin pulled under my sac - that learns the little b*'stards.
I just leave a grenade with the pin pulled under my sac - that learns the little b*'stards.
In reply to sjc: Now then, in my younger, more foolish days 20 odd years ago, I was driving back up to university in Newcastle at the beginning of term. It was a cracking day so decided to go via the Peak. Parked my battered old Fiesta with virtually all my worldly possessions, clothes, uni books, food parcel, cooking stuff, the lot, at the High Neb end. Walked up to the crag and spent a pleasant couple of hours doing some easy solos and a bit of bouldering.
On walking back down I found my car had been stolen and with it everything else. All I had was a pair of shorts, t-shirt and my climbing stuff.
The car did turn up a few days later, a bit damaged but with most of the contents still in it. When they discovered that I didn't own anything of value and they must have been gutted. Shame.
On walking back down I found my car had been stolen and with it everything else. All I had was a pair of shorts, t-shirt and my climbing stuff.
The car did turn up a few days later, a bit damaged but with most of the contents still in it. When they discovered that I didn't own anything of value and they must have been gutted. Shame.
Unfortunately, moral indignation isn't going to look after your valuables. some precautions are preferable.
If you're going to leave stuff in your car, stop 10 mins earlier to change so people don't watch you at the car park and arrive with ruck sacks ready to go on the back seat.
If you're taking everything with you, expose the empty boot by removing the parcel shelf, open glove compartments and deter thieves from breaking in to 'look'. Having paid out to have locks repaired for the sake of losing a couple of CDs before, I'd offer up leaving your car unlocked too.
Climb in threes with your bags always watched over.
Have two distinct bags: one for climbing stuff and one for valuables that you keep with you.
Park near to people and be prepared to walk that extra few minutes.
Climbers are generally honest, so chat at the crag and ask someone to keep an eye on your bag while you top out and walk down.
You've seen the roadside 'THINK BIKE!' so 'THINK THEFT!'. It's maybe not nice but it is realistic.
While you're at it, when you stop at a mountain café while skiing this winter, split up your pairs of skis in the group and leave them at different spots around the racks outside, especially, if near a pedestrian accessed lift nearby.
Being an ex teacher, I know blatant marking of equipment with marker penned names is a deterrent, but maybe unpopular.
Anyone else got any tips?
If you're going to leave stuff in your car, stop 10 mins earlier to change so people don't watch you at the car park and arrive with ruck sacks ready to go on the back seat.
If you're taking everything with you, expose the empty boot by removing the parcel shelf, open glove compartments and deter thieves from breaking in to 'look'. Having paid out to have locks repaired for the sake of losing a couple of CDs before, I'd offer up leaving your car unlocked too.
Climb in threes with your bags always watched over.
Have two distinct bags: one for climbing stuff and one for valuables that you keep with you.
Park near to people and be prepared to walk that extra few minutes.
Climbers are generally honest, so chat at the crag and ask someone to keep an eye on your bag while you top out and walk down.
You've seen the roadside 'THINK BIKE!' so 'THINK THEFT!'. It's maybe not nice but it is realistic.
While you're at it, when you stop at a mountain café while skiing this winter, split up your pairs of skis in the group and leave them at different spots around the racks outside, especially, if near a pedestrian accessed lift nearby.
Being an ex teacher, I know blatant marking of equipment with marker penned names is a deterrent, but maybe unpopular.
Anyone else got any tips?
In reply to Stairclimber: All sensible precautions apart from leaving the car unlocked as this could/will invalidate your insurance. You are expected to take all reasonable steps to secure your car when it is left.
In reply to sjc:
Bump
Bump
In reply to humptydumpty: Selling stolen stuff used to be done in the pub. Then car boot sales started up and provided a ready market place, but you could see who you were buying off and often take their registration number if you were suspicious. Now we have ebay and its like. Anonymous, hard to trace sellers who can register in a number of different names, and move anything.
I got stolen ice axes back off an ebay buy. Reported it to ebay, who refunded my money, but the seller was still selling afterwards.
I got stolen ice axes back off an ebay buy. Reported it to ebay, who refunded my money, but the seller was still selling afterwards.
In reply to sjc:
Just in case anyone is in the Ardales area, although I think it was a one off,
We were climbing ar Turon on 23 Oct & 3 Spanish climbers came up. As the weather had been a bit dubious, we did not expect anyone else so we had a bit of gear lying next to our packs.I said " shall I move the gear, they said not to bother.We had what seemed a pleasant conversation with them. Anyway 2 quickdraws of mine disapperad after they had moved over to another section. I shouted across to them
( In Spanish) have you accidentally taken a couple of Qd,s? They asked " what make" & I replied Black Diamond ( the draws were actually thick long Petzl,s with BD crabs) They replied no & as I was not 100% I had them with me as I usually do, I took it no further.
Anyway they did lift them. One of the guys I would know again( he looked even older than me) 60,s with grey hair in some kind of ringlets. be aware!
Just in case anyone is in the Ardales area, although I think it was a one off,
We were climbing ar Turon on 23 Oct & 3 Spanish climbers came up. As the weather had been a bit dubious, we did not expect anyone else so we had a bit of gear lying next to our packs.I said " shall I move the gear, they said not to bother.We had what seemed a pleasant conversation with them. Anyway 2 quickdraws of mine disapperad after they had moved over to another section. I shouted across to them
( In Spanish) have you accidentally taken a couple of Qd,s? They asked " what make" & I replied Black Diamond ( the draws were actually thick long Petzl,s with BD crabs) They replied no & as I was not 100% I had them with me as I usually do, I took it no further.
Anyway they did lift them. One of the guys I would know again( he looked even older than me) 60,s with grey hair in some kind of ringlets. be aware!
In reply to GridNorth:
They will be taking the contents and not the car. You just get busted locks, windscreens and grief. I leave mine unlocked and drop a tenner in the glovebox. That's been nicked twice in about 25 years........ My mate has had windows/locks smashed, boots forced open, the lot. He believes putting stuff like handbags, wallets, watches, cameras, passports, credit cards, flight tickets (three times whilst abroad) et al in the boot undercover, in the glove box, beneath the seats is safe. He's a f*cking idiot. Nothing is properly protected by insurance in the car anyway.
> (In reply to Stairclimber) All sensible precautions apart from leaving the car unlocked as this could/will invalidate your insurance. You are expected to take all reasonable steps to secure your car when it is left.
They will be taking the contents and not the car. You just get busted locks, windscreens and grief. I leave mine unlocked and drop a tenner in the glovebox. That's been nicked twice in about 25 years........ My mate has had windows/locks smashed, boots forced open, the lot. He believes putting stuff like handbags, wallets, watches, cameras, passports, credit cards, flight tickets (three times whilst abroad) et al in the boot undercover, in the glove box, beneath the seats is safe. He's a f*cking idiot. Nothing is properly protected by insurance in the car anyway.
In reply to sjc: I took a seriously troubled young man with special needs to Shepherds Crag. As we approached Brown Slabs, there was obviously a group present, so I said we would gear up to one side. My young man queried whether our gear would be safe. I explained that we would not interfere with the other people's gear and that they would respect and not interfere with ours. As we were climbing our routes, I could tell that he was pondering something. After some time he caught my attention and stated that he knew why no-one interferd with anyone else's gear. He proudly told me "It is what's called the national trust " ! And who could argue with him.
In reply to unclesamsauntibess: And if someone nicks your car? Which has happened to one or two on here. Your insurance is void. Yes take your valuables, but you shouldn't be making it easier for theives to see what cars to bother with of not. Lock it up, your car is insured for a bust window. Do you have an alarm?
In reply to FreshSlate: I immobilise it myself in a way that they can't be overridden. Not difficult to do. I don't want a bust window for the duration of the time I'm away from the car then the hassle of driving home without one. Then the 2/3/7 day wait until some poxy insurance approved garage can deal with it. The ten/twenty note keeps them happy. Smaller price, less hassle, it works. No wonder insurance is going through the roof if you claim for stuff like that. Anyway they are more likely to target and damage cars that are locked - they know you might have something to hide. I have another dodge about not taking valuables to the crag too. All that goes to the crag with me is climbing gear, nothing else.
Got a severe telling off once from a Snell like dogwalker (while taking 20 mins to summon up the courage to make a move somewhere on Froggat) for leaving a pack at the top of a route. Someone might nick it. I had more pressing security issues at the time.
In reply to unclesamsauntibess: I find all this very defeatest. Let me know when you're next out, could do with a free round at the pub. Locking a car isn't abnormal and doesn't suggest a person has something to hide. Anyway...
How do you immobilise the car?
How do you immobilise the car?
In reply to FreshSlate:
I got fed up with my car getting broken into and fixing the lock outside my gaff, i left it unlocked at night, and Removed the main engine fuse instead.
No more Damaged locks.
I got fed up with my car getting broken into and fixing the lock outside my gaff, i left it unlocked at night, and Removed the main engine fuse instead.
No more Damaged locks.
In reply to sjc:
I usually make sure my van looks messy, with loads of rubbish & chaos (not difficult when used with a family, teenagers and dogs).
At Swanage I was amazed nobody else thought of abbing in with your bag (including valuables) on your back..
I also tend to go climbing early in the morning when most of these scum are tucked up under their duvets.
I usually make sure my van looks messy, with loads of rubbish & chaos (not difficult when used with a family, teenagers and dogs).
At Swanage I was amazed nobody else thought of abbing in with your bag (including valuables) on your back..
I also tend to go climbing early in the morning when most of these scum are tucked up under their duvets.
In reply to sjc:
Keep mobile phone and jacket on you then hang what's left in a backpack a reasonable way off the ground, it will certainly deter a casual opportunistic theft, I have seen plenty of people tie dogs up using nuts.
Hanging your gear out of reach makes a lot of sense on a multi pitch but seems like a lot of hassle for a single
Keep mobile phone and jacket on you then hang what's left in a backpack a reasonable way off the ground, it will certainly deter a casual opportunistic theft, I have seen plenty of people tie dogs up using nuts.
Hanging your gear out of reach makes a lot of sense on a multi pitch but seems like a lot of hassle for a single
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