UKC

I recently soloed Cneifon Arête, and thought that Diff was overgrading it, more Mod I thought. I found it easy.
Now I have my eye on Clogwyn y Person Arete, but articles say it is very under graded at III, more like VDiff.

So how do they actually compare in difficulty?

In reply to Fredt:

cneifon more exposed, sustained with a harder start (unless you do the parson's nose). CyP more episodic, perhaps some harder moves but not as exposed. grade 3 about right for both i'd say,

cheers
gregor

In reply to Fredt:

CyP Arete has nothing as 'hard' as the very start of the Cneifiion Arete, but is more of a standard, and quite scary (very exposed at the point where the route is least obvious). I think it is worth Grade III scramble, but certainly no more. The Parson's Nose, though, is the way to start it. And that's a definite easy rock climb, quite hard to grade. Somewhere between Mod and Diff, on small holds and perfect rock. Probably Mod, but it feels quite something in big boots. Absolutely superb, a perfect solo, leading straight into the CyP arete.

In reply to Fredt:

Further comment: Parson's Nose is totally pure, no escape routes, straight up the middle. Probably as fine a piece of hard solo scrambling as anything south of Skye.

In reply to Fredt:

If you take the Parson's Nose direct, it's a good Diff, possibly bordering on V Diff. The arête itself is no more than a Grade 3 scramble with a bit of scope for avoiding the hardest moves. It is certainly easier and less exposed than the Cneifion Arete.

In reply to Rylstone_Cowboy:

The only warning I would add is that CyP arete is not 100 per cent obvious (or I was being v dim) and I think I got off route, wandered too far to the right (west) and ended up over an abyss with some scary, committing moves that were more worrying than anything on the Nose.

In reply to Gordon Stainforth:

I got lost soloing it and then it started to rain...a bit worrying.

In reply to Pekkie:

I still remember it as about the best solo scramble I ever did in Snowdonia (better than quite a few things on the east face of Tryfan, etc), and a superb variation on the Snowdon Horseshoe. I approached via Crib Goch and then dipped down into Cwm Glas, then did the rest of the Horseshoe.

In reply to Pekkie:

BTW, how many people know that there's an absolutely fabulous variation to the normal scramble up to Crib Goch (via east ridge)? Just to the right of the arete, right of the ordinary 'furrow' - out of sight, and not at all obvious until you move round there. Really good, exposed scrambling on small holds, just right of the arete. I guess Grade II would be the correct scrambling grade, but could probably feel a lot harder if you're not fit and confident.

In reply to Fredt:

Agreed Cneifion is only moderate. The Parsons Nose is quite a tough VD but the ridge above the gap is simple G2 scarambling.

In reply to Gordon Stainforth:


I wonder if part of the joy comes from never quite knowing if you're on 'the route'?

In reply to alan moore:

I disagree, the crux of cyp arete is tough and prob worth a diff (but is only about 5m), the normal chimney through it in my opinion is harder than anything on Cneifion Arete and if wet is pretty desperate. Also did it in winter and went right at the crux (to get out of the wind) and found that way pretty tough too - poor belay above massive drop below. Was very glad when my lead got a bomber nut in! Have done both in the wet and dry and to add what Gordon says - they are both brilliant routes, always find cyp arete more intimidating..

In reply to bowls:

Great to hear someone who has v similar memories of it to myself.

In reply to llechwedd:


Absolutely.

In reply to Gordon Stainforth:


And me. Scrambling/soloing easy mountain routes is fine until you get lost and it starts to rain. Still, it's an adventure sport isn't it!

In reply to Fredt:

There is probably only 25 feet of serious climbing on the CyP arete, up a short corner, with a crack in the wall for holds. I have soloed it in both summer & full winter conditions and a fall from this point would be fatal, so it all depends on you skills/confidence levels. The direct start to the Arete is aleast VD and very small holds that are quite polished. The normal start to CyP is up the gully on the R (west) side which is relatively strightforward. At the short corner is is possible to avoid both L & R, but is not obvious or that easy. There is another tricky pitch above this but nowhere near as serious. Choose a nice day in either winter or summer and it gives a memorable day out. Certainly one of the best mountain days outside Scotland. If you have any doubts carry a confidence rope or similar for the crux.

In reply to Fredt:

Having done both routes twice, I would agree with bowls and Sean Kelly that CYP arête is more serious and intimidating than Cneifion arete, if only for the couple of short, tricky sections which they have described above. Bizarrely, although graded harder in the guidebooks, Cneifion arête seemed easier to me. I only seconded The Parson's Nose, so couldn't really comment on the grade as a leader, but if I remember correctly my buddy was a fair height above me before placing any bomber gear! Both great routes though, despite being completely different.