UKC

I mustn't be the only one with a non-climbing partner.

My question is, how do people arrange their lives so that they can go out climbing, especially if its a weekend and balance family stuff too. Is it just a case of earning brownie points, a set arrangement (every other weekend) or prepare for the wrath upon return?

I'd like to get into a system of going somewhere more adventurous without the family every other week and do family stuff, including outings on the alternate week.

In reply to Bloodfire:

Climbers are self absorbed and selfish. I never did strike a balance.

Good luck with that one.

BTW if you feel the need to implement a system for your family, then..........

In reply to Bloodfire:
I know some folk just go 'Sunday is my climbing day'.

Normally I just ask nicely and the wife's generally ok with it. She has her things to do which she enjoys (and I don't enjoy) so that gives her time to do them. I suspect that if we had kids I'd climb less, but I'll cross that bridge when it happens. I reckon there will be lots of days on the beach on the Gower where there is some bouldering to be had. Even if I was in the house, tbh, I'd be doing my thing and she hers so there isn't much in it. It does mean that we're more likely to go out and do something worthwhile on the other day of the weekend.

My wife hates climbing, so if we can manage it, it can't be that hard.

In reply to Bloodfire:

I have a non climbing girlfriend and I've never missed any climbing on her account and she's never asked me to. She plays in a brass band so she's busy most weekends anyway.

I think it really depends on your partner. It helps if they have a hobby as well. And there's plenty of wet weather weekends where we can see each other. I probably have it a lot easier as we're unmiarried without kids so everythings fairly easy going but I'd just negotiate.

In reply to Bloodfire:

DO. Not. Have. Kids

In reply to Bloodfire:

My wife has no interest in climbing and I have a six month old baby. I gave myself a self imposed timetable of climbing two weekday evenings and one weekend day. That way I can keep an eye on forecasts. I could climb more often without getting a hard time but don't think it'd be fair ( and I love spending time with them).

I could never marry someone where I'd be concerned about 'the wrath upon return'.
No offence.

In reply to Bloodfire:

I have 2 young kids and my wife is generally supportive of me heading out climbing. I can generally disappear climbing a couple of evenings during the week without any notice. However the odd whole weekend needs to be planned in advance so she can get her head around what she is going to do in my absence. She is usually happy as long as it's preplanned, and doesn't occur too regularly. If I want a whole day at the weekend now and again a couple of days notice is usually OK as long as there aren't other commitments on the calendar.

Basically, in my case, it's about advance communication and not heading off all the time. Striking a balance.

I had an ex climbing partner who's wife wouldn't speak to him for a week if he took an annual 3 day trip to scotland in the winter, so I count myself very lucky.

My partner has no interest in climbing but she does enjoy walking. I manage to get out quite a bit for half days, full days or multi day trips without her and likewise she goes off with her friends and does her thing without me. I guess we're fortunate in that I have a zero hours work contract which is quite flexible and she works from home for herself so getting time off when one or both of us wants to isn't hard. The only thing that stops us just going off all the time is our dog who we don't like to leave for more than five hours at a time, we wouldn't leave with anyone else and who needs two hours of walking every day. Because of her we can't both go off for a whole day each doing our own thing, she wouldn't cope being left at the bottom of a climb and as she's a bit old she can't join in on any long walks anymore. I have missed out on one or two conferences and climbing trips because of our arrangement but that's just the way it is. I would agree that not having kids, if you haven't already, would definitely help you climb as much as you want to.

In reply to Bloodfire:

In the usual way - negotiation. This is because we only have one car so it's a bit of "I want the car on Saturday ..." type conversation. Sometimes it's down to who's arranged things with friends first and whether those friends are providing the transport. The only time it tends to get awkward is if one day of the weekend is going to be fine and the other is due bad weather!

So there's no set pattern in our case, we just make it up as we go along.

In reply to Bloodfire:

Ha - welcome to my world. I have two young kids. I don't currently climb. There just isn't enough time. That said, I am currently working away mid week so weekends are very much family time. When I get a job back home again next year I plan to try and find someone up for meeting up at 6am or so on a Sunday morning with a view to finishing at midday. I have done it before and it is great to have the whole crag to yourself.

Only having one car can be difficult for us too. My partner needs it for her work and other things but I'm normally ok getting picked up by friends.

In reply to Iain(2010):





Almost exactly the same for me. My wife even encourages me to go on longer climbing trips to the alps, but then I will also take care of the kids when she wants to do a weekend in Budapest or some other culture trip.

CB

In reply to Bloodfire:

I'm lucky in that I have climbing about ten minutes drive away, so nip out when convenient for all concerned. However, this usually means I climb alone.

In reply to Bloodfire:

In reality, there is no 'Wrath upon return'. There is if I pile through the door with wet gear and don't return things to their respective places in good time, thats just my laziness.

Oh, throw a 7 and 11 year old in the equation too for good measure.

I manage a couple of lunchtime boulder sessions and maybe and evening climbing session. Its weekends that I'm trying to juggle.

In reply to Bloodfire:

My partner isn't into climbing but she does have stuff she like doing, yoga/ukulele in the week sailing at weekends so I can normally get out a couple of time in the week if the weather is good. Weekends usually need arranging as we she sail in the lakes and I usually go as well. We usually just arrange it as we go, if there is a weekend when I would like to climb then she usually OK with that.

But it helps that she knows that climbing is weather depended where her sailing isn't.

In reply to Bloodfire:

For every 'take' there should be a 'give' Our system was a free weekend each (which also gave the kids a Mumless & a Dad-free weekend, which they loved) & two whole family weekends on a four-week rolling rota. Swaps were negotiated to share out Bank Holidays fairly. It does help if your better/other half has a pastime they crave time to enjoy. It definitely is not fair to do your own thing at will & leave the other to do the hard work. Resentment, even hatred, lies in wait on that path!!

In reply to Bloodfire:

Tough all round. There'll be glib responses and others that are pretty heartfelt. Many I have talked to refer to climbing as a 'young man's game' - and in respect of where your 'head' is at I suppose that is true for most, esopecially if you're pushing the grades.

My own experience is that there is a two way tug...when I am with my family I feel a pang for the mountains; when I am on the crag the emotion is reversed. I've wrestled for a equilibrium; even with an understanding partner it is not at all easy

In reply to Bloodfire:

I got into climbing when my wife was pregnant with our first (how I wish I'd started as a student!) and we now have two (a 3 & a 1 yr old). I have tried to get round it by taking everyone out. This has been various degrees of stressful but today, at Windgather in the Peeks, my 3 year old did her fist rock climb and it made me even happier than sending a route myself.

In reply to Bloodfire:

You are not alone in this dilemma , as evidenced by the support from other posters.
I have a 1 year old, a 3 year old and a very understanding wife! being a bit obsessed, I climb indoors twice a week and outdoors one a week and it keeps me sane by combating the effects of a very stressful job. We sat down as a couple and agreed that as a minimum , my days off would be equally shared between my climbing and time spent with the family and that seems to work well for us.

In reply to Bloodfire:

Mrs Goucho isn't into climbing - though in the winter, she is a fanatically keen skier - and I've found the best way to get myself climbing time, is to place large amounts of money into her handbag, so she can go shopping when I'm on the rock.

In reply to Bloodfire:

By being an emotional midget!

In reply to Bloodfire:

If I have to climb which I do; I would consider anything.............
What about this scheme: 1Place advert on UKC partners forum - looking for climber with non climbing partner who like shopping/ talking/ etc etc to meet at such and such a crag / mall respectively?

In reply to Bloodfire:

Have ropes and rack / shopping list and bags etc

In reply to Bloodfire:

I had a non-climbing partner (well, girlfriend rather than "partner", I'd say).
She started to come climbing, for the most wrong reason possible. Not to show interest or anything, but for fear that I was going to run off with a climber. She actually took to the climbing reasonably well for a total beginner. But it was the wrong approach. She ain't around no more

In reply to Bloodfire:



I used to arrange one weekend a month well in advance (like a year ahead) and go to the wall once a week. It was a bit rubbish as I couldn't be flexible with regards to the weather, and he never did organise to do anything himself on the weekends I was away anyway. In the end, I came up with a better solution and we divorced...

In reply to Bloodfire:

This should all be sorted before you decide to spend the rest of your life with someone.

I started a thread last year along the lines of "getting a pass out from the wife". We get loads of lads coming cycling with us who have one of these special "passes" from their partner. What a load of bollocks. If Mrs Ent wants to do something and I want to do something we usually do it. Works both ways - but permission??

I also saw what football did to my mum and dad's marriage so avoided doing the same myself with climbing.

E

In reply to Bloodfire:

The key for me was finding something Helen wanted to do even more than I wanted to climb. Cost me the price of a horse and a stable, but worth it now she has to keep asking me to mind the kids etc. as she heads out the door. My visits to the wall or a couple of weeks in Yosemite seem minor compared to time she spends on the horse.

In reply to Bloodfire:
We have an open marriage so he gets the house to himself with partner of his choice while I'm gone. We had the relationship arrangement before I got into climbing and it's better now. Not sure what it says that if I had to, I'd pick climbing over sex though. Combining the two (in one third-party partner) is nice in some ways but massively problematic. We have no children (not through choice but I doubt we'd have made ideal parents).

It isn't ideal to have to dovetail other people's plans and the weather, or in that we only have one car, but we're happy.

During the week I climb when he has a band rehearsal one night, and the other night he spends alone usually, or out for dinner.

In reply to Bloodfire:

I'm sorry to say , if you want to get a lot done, you have to stay single. Any regular woman wants commitment, relationships and climbing don't really mix. That's my experience. Forget children!

In reply to Bloodfire:

Ah the million dollar question - surprised more people don't ask this and instead ask specifics about training. Finding time to train is by far my biggest limiting factor..

To your question, a few random thoughts: switch to indoors climbing, then you can go weekday evenings after kids are in bed (if you have kids). Then you can keep the weekend climbing free for family stuff.

For outdoors climbing and weekends away etc... Good luck!

In reply to Bloodfire:

Hey Bloodfire,

You should be alright as long as you don't get too 'Beck Weathers' on her!
(Read 'Left For Dead' to better understand my meaning.)
(DO NOT let your girlfriend read 'Left For Dead' to better understand my meaning!)

Good luck.
Personally I find climbing more fulfilling than a relationship, but then maybe I've just had crap relationships.
Having said that, I've had some pretty crap climbs, but I still come back for more!

In reply to Blizzard:


er.... you can change the word woman here for any gender of none climbing partner! I speak from experience! But if you both climb at a similar level it's brilliant and opens up last minute trips, climbing holidays, a partner on tap, kisses on routes and all sorts of other wonderful things!

In reply to Bloodfire:
My misses is a non-climber, she did give it a go when we first met and overcame a fear of heights. But didn't really get into it.

We both work shifts and have a 3 year old. So i now climb probably twice a month now rather than a dozen or more times a month !

She's happy with me going on climbing trips abroad, so all's good there

In reply to Bloodfire:
The rules 1 Never give ETA back after climbing!
2 Always go out on the same day e.g. Saturday even if its raining.
3 Always carry climbing rack in the car plus boulder mat.
4 If you must have Kids Start brainwashing by showing climbing vids from early age.
5 When going out for family day trip try to influence the choice to somewhere with bouldering ( a nice walk up the roaches).I'm sure others will contribute other climbing laws.
6 try to live no more than 5 mins from a crag
7never take mobile phone, If you must keep Turned off

In reply to Bloodfire:

I have a Non Climbing wife and 5 kids (all boys) Most of my kids (- the 18 yr old) are into the Outdoors, Climbing and anything else they are allowed to do, the wife is into Hiking, so as long i i make time for the kids and inc them sometimes she / they are happy.. The only problem now is that when i go outdoors without them. I feel guilty because i know they enjoy it as much as me and i wouldnt like to be left behind.

In reply to Bloodfire:

We are planning on trying for kids reasonably soon. We just sat down and discussed my need to climb with the reality of less time. My wife suggested we build a massive woody in our new extension so that I can train when looking after a baby and without having to be away from the house. I recognize that I won't be able to get out as often but home training facilities hopefully means I'll still be able to crank hard when I do. You never know, a more structureed training plan may even make me better!

In reply to Somerset swede basher:

Hmm I would focus on surviving first lol

In reply to Bloodfire:

Indoors is not so hard:

The lunchtime boulder sessions are awesome. I can get a couple of 1 hour training sessions in a week that don't infringe on any time but my lunch hour at work (flexitime). The walls will do this at discount price usually if you ask.

Both my kids are into climbing but I take them myself. Most kids sessions are well expensive, especially for more than one child.

Getting outside is more difficult because we only have one car. I cycle to work so justifying a second car just to use every other weekend is a little extreme. I've considered just hiring a car which overall might work out cheaper.

In reply to Bloodfire:

Personally I think it unfair if anyone expects to continue to climb just as much once they get into a relationship as they did beforehand... if your new partner is a non-climber.

Last year I was single, climbed indoors 2-3 times a week and outdoors every weekend the weather permitted, rock, ice alpine, whatever. Got loads done, it was a great year for my climbing, I loved it.

This year I've been in a serious relationship, I still climb indoors but only once a week, and I've only climbed outdoors a handful of times all year. As a result, when I do climb outdoors I cannot climb to the level I could last year (last year I was onsighting HVS, this year I've tried two HVS and failed on both!)

While I miss being able to do what I want when I want without compromise, its just not realistic or fair to expect someone else to fit around your life without making compromises yourself. Also, committing more to the relationship, i.e. accepting you won't be climbing as much, and looking for opportunities to do things together rather than separately, makes for a much healthier and fulfilling relationship. After all, the whole point of a relationship is that you both *want* to be together.

It took me a while to figure this out and it until I did it lead to resentment on both sides - from me because I felt she was the reason I couldn't go climbing, and her because she felt she was playing second fiddle to climbing. We both felt each others resentment. Once I realised my mistake and grew up/got over it, our relationship has been 100% better, and life overall is far better now than it was last year when I was living only for myself and climbing all the time (even though I loved that)!

I still get to climb occasionally outdoors but don't even consider it unless my girlfriend has something lined up as well. I just would not go away - even for a day trip - unless she had plans anyway.

My girlfriend and I do live together - this stuff is probably less relevant to those who don't live together/aren't married/don't have kids and are generally just in a fairly casual arrangement!

In reply to Bloodfire:

P.S. I guess I'm lucky that my girlfriend generally loves outdoorsy stuff - hiking/camping etc, just not climbing. That makes it easier for me to get my outdoors fix, even if its not climbing.

Probably if she wasn't into that stuff it would be a deal breaker for me - we'd be too far apart in terms of what we want to be doing in life.

In reply to neilwiltshire:

I agree with what you say about not expecting life to be the same when in a relationship - if you want to spend time together, something else has to go somewhere, be it time climbing, doing something else, or with other people (I ended up climbing more, but because my partner is a climber too and it is something we do together, but I now don't climb as much with other people as I used to)

BUT... My first husband was not a climber and although he never said so, his behaviour showed me that he didn't really like me climbing. He was more important to me than climbing, so I did compromise. I went once a week indoors, and once a month for a preplanned weekend outside, so that he knew when I would be gone and could make his own plans. He didn't want me to climb abroad (I don't know why - he would never discuss it and just thought I was trying to get around him) so I never did. But I did feel that it was important to continue climbing - being in a relationship shouldn't make you a smaller person, less of yourself, or force you into giving up friendships that are valuable to you.

And I am REALLY glad that I kept it up, as those climbing friendships were a real source of support when we finally split up.

I'm not against compromises in a relationship, but too many compromises can be a sign that things aren't right - a relationship should make you into a bigger person who is more fulfilled in life, not the opposite.

In reply to Simos:

Well that may be the case! Better to have a plan than none at all though.

In reply to neilwiltshire:

There is plenty of time for both, particularly if you live close to rock. Cutting out the 5hit TV watching and all other dull stuff and there is plenty of hours in the day for climbing and family.

Anyone who needs to get a "pass" to go out climbing needs to reasses their relationship.

There's plenty of time for climbing and family. We have a 2 year old and I've climbed just as much if not more since he's arrived, this includes trips away.

Everyone needs their own time, I've heard of people who just don't go out anymore due to fear of asking their other half and dilusional people who think your own life should end as soon as a little one comes along...

If your partner is against climbing or letting you do what makes you happy and you can't strike a balance you're with the wrong person.

In reply to Luke Owens:

Nail. On. Head.

In reply to Luke Owens:

Bit judgemental there!

Although I would agree that having just one toddler is a doddle.....

In reply to deacondeacon:

Ha, if only. If I lived in Sheffield I'd be climbing outside every week (weather permitting)! Unfortunately for us south east folk, climbing outdoors is a fairly big commitment requiring a certain amount of advance planning!

In reply to neilwiltshire:

I served my time in Surrey moved up here three years ago and never looked back.
But to be honest even then I'd climb outdoors every weekend and sandstone/ indoors through the week.

I think everyone prioritises their lives differently and there isn't really a correct formula to balance it. What I do know is that I (possibly selfishly) wouldn't be prepared to cut down on climbing anyless than I do now, and thankfully I know that my wife would never ask or expect me to. Happy days all round.

In reply to neilwiltshire:



Only if you let it. Day trips to the Peak or Dorset are a doddle and even day trips to Wales or the Lakes are possible (understandably only for the very commited).

In reply to deacondeacon:


Yep that's the one, TV is a waste of time

In reply to Bloodfire:

You are f*cked. Throw in a mortgage and a couple of kids and you will be totally f*cked. Look back at the fun times, they are over.

In reply to deacondeacon:

Wow, in my book day trips to the lakes and peak are just not on, far too much driving for one day.

Day trips to the Wye valley and Dorset are possible but I tend to like mountain crags more and its a 10-12 round trip for those. I've done that a few times this year already and that much driving is really draining for just a weekend, Its worth doing once every couple of months but I don't think I could stomach it more often than that but as you said its a matter of personal preference and priorities.

In reply to Somerset swede basher:

I was half-joking but any plans I made went out of the window lol It's actually less stressful not to have any plans or expectations and accept any training session you can squeeze as a bonus

I actually do think that having home-training facilities is the way forwards when you have a baby though. Actually having one is not too bad (as you can take turns in looking after the baby etc), it's when you have the second one that things get impossible (the only way I found is to train in the evenings after they're in bed!).

In reply to Bloodfire:
I also have a non climbing wife probably not helped by me scaring her sh*tless in the lakes on a route my years ago. Anyway its about planning and being reasonable. Put some stuff in the emotional bank account before making a hefty withdrawal such as a long weekend in scotland or trip to the alps.

In reply to kiwi boy:

'Emotional bank account' and 'hefty withdrawal' - brilliant lol