UKC

Is it illegal to drive on a "closed" road, or are closures just advisory? Insurance void?

In reply to MG:

Unfortunately it is not advisory, s33 of the Roads Scotland Act 1984 covers this. In its simplest form it is a temporary direction made by the Police and you would commit an offence. Whether you would be caught/prosecuted is a different matter. Your insurance isn't automatically voided by driving on such a road, but if you pranged your car and your insurance company found out that the road had been closed due to snow and you had driven past the closure they probably would not cover you for costs of repair/recovery.

In reply to MG:

Is it the same in England?

It takes a big effort to close a road; rights of way are sacrosanct. Does the local authority have to get a magistrates' order or is it just the blokes in the council vehicle with a couple of rusty signs who make the decision?

In reply to Rigid Raider:



I don't know about England, but in Scotland there are several roads on which the snow gates are closed on several days pretty much every year.

In reply to skog:


Like the Cockbridge to Tomintoul road

In reply to skog:

Road Traffic Acts allow this in England . Not sure which current one is in force but 1960 RTA allowed roads to be close in hazardous conditions

In reply to martianb:

What if you're parked at Cairngorm and drive down to the gate after its been closed? I'm going to assume the Police wouldn't charge you as the other option would be to leave to freeze at the car park at the day lodge.

In reply to Father Noel Furlong:

couple of years ago we arrived at a road block from the 'wrong direction' after crossing a col - it had been shut on both sides but after we'd started, probably the most unpleasant die I can remember, partly due to the other cars, some of which had been abandoned & were partly blocking the road, & not helped by one of our snow chains breaking. Luckily there were a couple of gendarmes who moved the barrier to let us pass after asking us some questions about what other vehicles we'd seen.

Not sure what would happen in Scotland but I suspect a similar reaction

In reply to Doug:

I think there would be a common sense approach to any prosecution. If the road is closed while you are in between the barriers you'll not get prosecuted. That would go for the Gorms car park as well, you would not know the road is closed until you get down to the barrier. The Police also have to deal with Local access issues. I'm thinkingof the residents in Glen Coe/Glen Etive/ bridge of orchy, but I would imagine that local residents would only get past the gates if they are in suitable vehicles/ have snow chains etc

In reply to MG:

i would say in england there are emergency rules for closing roads due to snow.
at work i have the power to close a road if at an emergency.it will be something along the lines of public safety

In reply to MG:

I thought it means no insurance.. I used to drive around the bollards blocking the winnats or the snake a bit.. But was under the impression if I crashed I wasn't insured.

In reply to MG:

A guy I worked with took a chance on Snake Pass a couple of years ago and totalled his new car. His insurance company refused to pay out because the road was officially closed.

In reply to MG:

I'm heading to Aviemore on Wednesday, but if there is any indications of the road closing we will not even travel, as we will have the grandaughter with us. (and the wife)

In reply to mark s: our local transpennine road has snow gates (A635), though they only go half way across the road - so the handful of people who live beyond can get past, and so snow ploughs and our MR landrovers can get past to evacuate those people who think their urban4x4s with slick tyres can get through snow drifts a few feet deep.

In reply to MG:

My wife's Ibiza with the diesel engine over the front wheels and Avon Snow & Ice tyres can go anywhere, fact. No poxy barrier is gonna stop me....

*spits*

In reply to Rigid Raider:

And it's not your car, so who cares of you crash it anyway, bonus!

In reply to Rigid Raider:

I now drive a ford crown vic, one of those long US saloon cars, rear wheel drive, 4.6l engine.. if you turn sharply in wet the end really spins out, its just shit in any road condition which isn't dry.. fun to drive but not looking forwards to snow..

In reply to IainRUK:


Just had to google to find out what that was, my god that's a hideous lump.

Re. the OP and the insurance situation. Insurance companies are notorious for finding any possible reason to dodge a pay out so I wouldn't chance it if you have a posh car. My 13 year old focus is a different matter, it wasn't very powerful out of the factory and has probably lost most of that in the last 120 k miles so with snow chains fitted I think I'd be good for a couple of inches of snow.

And I keep a sleeping bag in the back when out in the winter so I'm ready if the worst happens.

In reply to gethin_allen:

Not by any means a posh car. Also I am not planning anything stupid. But sometimes going a short distance down a closed road is fine and useful, e.g. to get to the start of a walk. If I hit someone, am I insured third part? Probably, it seems. Also wondering about using snowsocks or chains and where that fits in.

In reply to gethin_allen:

Yeah, it was a friends Grandmothers, just 60k miles on the clock, so I bought it. The problem is they were the standard police and detectives car for years, so people still drive slow when they see you behind them..

It's quite a comfy drive though but does 15-20 mpg, but as fuel is about 35p/litre at the moment its not too bad.

I used to carry a sleeping bag, or at least a big down jacket, as I'd regularly drive around the road blockages.. I once did it in my Dad's brand new discovery and was pretty scared about totaling it as I slid around descending winnats..

You'd just have to drive somewhere else and say it happened there..

In reply to MG:

How about if you drove through open snow gates on one side, and drove up to the other end to discover the guy had just locked it with you inside, got in his Land Rover with you watching, and driven away without so much as making eye contact! Happened to me and mates on the way south from Braemar one time, luckily you can get around that snow gate when it's locked! (Perth via. Aberdeen would have been a shift...)

In reply to IainRUK:

"The problem is they were the standard police and detectives car for years, so people still drive slow when they see you behind them.."

This used to be the case with driving a Peugeot 306 around Cardiff around 2002, people would come steaming up behind you, slow down as they pull level with you and then once they could see the car wasn't full of coppers they'd accelerate off in front.

In reply to MG:

I've had to regularly drive on closed roads to get to work. I'm not happy about it as I'm pretty sure if I pranged my car, or worse, broke my neck or someone else's, then I wouldn't have a leg to stand on (no pun intended).

I've driven through the closed sign before and then later come across a police officer who basically asked if I'd driven through the closed sign, he explained I wasn't insured and then basically shook his head and drive off. I imagine he was pissed off with hauling people back onto the road or rescuing stuck people when he could be doing something more useful.

In reply to MG:

I would be surprised if your car was uninsured. That would be detailed in your insurance booklet under exclusions.

Just because an area isn't open to the public wouldn't necessarily void your insurance. They would probably have to prove some negligence on your behalf. A properly equipped vehicle would probably be enough defence.

The council may well say that you're not covered by their insurance which requires them to maintain the road in good condition. They're essentially telling you they give up.

In reply to DancingOnRock:

I don't know... it's been shut because it has been deemed unsafe to drive due to local short term conditions. Seems the perfect get out for the insurance.

I think driving through a road block would be considered negligence. I do it but under the impression my insurance is void.. however maybe for local people needing access it would be different.

In reply to IainRUK:



I've no idea, but logically there must be exceptions, besides local residents. Up at Glenshee skiing yesterday. Snow gates closed overnight. Once they opened, we were allowed up to the ski area, passing a local gamekeeper on the road going about his business, and on arrival it was fully staffed with lifts running, cafe open, etc. (as you would expect for those arriving to ski). All those staff cars must have went through the closed gates to get to their work? They presumably have to be permitted and thus insured to drive along an otherwise closed road? Of course lots of the staff vehicles were 4x4s with chunky tyres ie fit for purpose.

Also, the BBC program about the Cairngorms ski resort last night shows some of the staff getting thro the gates to see if the road is passable and if the resort can be opened to the public. That said it did show some staff cars having to wait outside the gates before the decision was made if it was safe enough.

In reply to MG:

I had an accident on a closed Scottish road about a year ago after missing the sign. Neither the police or the insurance company criticised me in any way, although I criticised myself. The insurance paid up. It never occurred to me there would be a problem, and there wasn't.

In reply to the thread:

So have I got this right? Sorry if I've missed the answer to this, but...

If you drive on a road that the police have closed then (a) this might be illegal (because you're disobeying an legally authoritative traffic direction) and (b) you might not be insured.

But hang on. It's illegal to drive without insurance anyway, right? So if (b) does come into force, then driving on a closed road is illegal irrespective of (a), because you're driving without insurance.

In reply to Sophie G.:

Ah, but if the road is closed to the public then it is not a public highway, and hence you don't need to be insured for driving on it

In reply to Mr Lopez:

Ah. OK. That clears that up then

In reply to Mr Lopez:
You need insurance to drive on any land that the public could have access to. This includes closed roads like race tracks and open roads like supermarket car parks.

I think closing a road would be done by the police and it's not technically closing the road, it's the police directing you not to use it.

So the above example where other people are driving on the 'closed road' is because the police haven't directed them not to use it.

If you disobey a police direction then you're commiting an offence. That doesn't negate your insurance. It could be argued if you then had an accident, you contributed to it in some way by ignoring the sign so the pay out could be reduced.

It would depend; if you skidded off the road due to the snow, that might be contributory, if your car had a non snow related accident, that wouldn't be.

I guess it would have to be decided on a case by case basis.

In reply to MG:

Don't know about the insurance issue, but if you pass a sign saying the road is closed then that's illegal, similar to driving through a no entry sign. If a sign says 'road ahead closed' then you're ok until the point where the road is actually closed.

In reply to MG:

Recently a driver of a lorry was prosecuted for driving across the Forth bridge when the high wind warning/no high sided vehicles sign was up. His lorry was blown over.

In reply to estivoautumnal:

Banned for dangerous driving and failing to comply with road signs.

http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-edinburgh-east-fife-29697028

I still think he would have been insured. Your insurance doesn't stop just because you're committing an offence. What about people who crash while speeding?