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Debating with colleagues, what standard does Bear Grylls climb?
I know he's done Everest, plus a whole bunch of mountains in remote locations but trad UK rockclimbing, is he a Sev punter or an E5 don? Anyone know? Can't be deduced from his site. What's he done on grit?
http://www.beargrylls.com/welcome/
I know he's done Everest, plus a whole bunch of mountains in remote locations but trad UK rockclimbing, is he a Sev punter or an E5 don? Anyone know? Can't be deduced from his site. What's he done on grit?
http://www.beargrylls.com/welcome/
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In reply to Owen W-G:
The video in the old UKC article doesn't play on my browser, so here is another link to the wad in action:
youtube.com/watch?v=5t0mJ63Y8WM&
The video in the old UKC article doesn't play on my browser, so here is another link to the wad in action:
youtube.com/watch?v=5t0mJ63Y8WM&
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In reply to Simon Caldwell:
But, that's in some foreign location with funny foreign grades.
What's he done in UK?
But, that's in some foreign location with funny foreign grades.
What's he done in UK?
In reply to AdamCB:
@ Owen:
Climbed into a dead badger?
http://jimllpaintit.tumblr.com/post/87217188179/dear-jim-please-paint-ray-m...
@ Owen:
Climbed into a dead badger?
http://jimllpaintit.tumblr.com/post/87217188179/dear-jim-please-paint-ray-m...
Post edited at 12:32
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In reply to Owen W-G:
US 5.9 would appear to be in the HVS/ E1 region, which looks right for this route.
But what Bear does in this video (which I've just watched as lunchtime entertainment) is certainly not any sort of valid ascent, as far as one can make out. So many questions...
1) Why does he do it in trainers?
2) Why doesn't he wear a helmet?
3) Why does he deliberately smash rocks on the approach?
4) Why, if there's a top rope (and there is), doesn't the footage own up to this properly?
5) WTF is he doing placing friends when he's on a top rope?
6) Who, if anyone, is supposed to be seconding him?
7) If no one, why is he trailing a lead rope? Would it be too cynical of me to suggest that the bright yellow lead rope is supposed to distract our attention further from the stealth-black top rope?
I also have a question for the idiots who made this video:
8) Why on earth are you giving non-climbers (probably your main audience, I somehow think) such a completely, not to say dangerously, misleading picture of what climbing actually involves?
For as I can't be the first to have pointed out, there are obvious safety nightmares arising from this clip. And no one can say that there's no danger of ill-informed punters trying to do what Bear does. He's the Chief Scout. People will copy him, and when they do, they have every chance of getting hurt. It's just plain irresponsible for him to clown around like this.
US 5.9 would appear to be in the HVS/ E1 region, which looks right for this route.
But what Bear does in this video (which I've just watched as lunchtime entertainment) is certainly not any sort of valid ascent, as far as one can make out. So many questions...
1) Why does he do it in trainers?
2) Why doesn't he wear a helmet?
3) Why does he deliberately smash rocks on the approach?
4) Why, if there's a top rope (and there is), doesn't the footage own up to this properly?
5) WTF is he doing placing friends when he's on a top rope?
6) Who, if anyone, is supposed to be seconding him?
7) If no one, why is he trailing a lead rope? Would it be too cynical of me to suggest that the bright yellow lead rope is supposed to distract our attention further from the stealth-black top rope?
I also have a question for the idiots who made this video:
8) Why on earth are you giving non-climbers (probably your main audience, I somehow think) such a completely, not to say dangerously, misleading picture of what climbing actually involves?
For as I can't be the first to have pointed out, there are obvious safety nightmares arising from this clip. And no one can say that there's no danger of ill-informed punters trying to do what Bear does. He's the Chief Scout. People will copy him, and when they do, they have every chance of getting hurt. It's just plain irresponsible for him to clown around like this.
Post edited at 13:18
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In reply to Owen W-G:
It's a bit tiresome to analyse Bear Grylls again, but here's a video of him climbing a bit more reasonably. Doesn't look particularly difficult though, be interested if someone can figure out the route:
youtube.com/watch?v=-Hs8_Tu4sgg&
It's a bit tiresome to analyse Bear Grylls again, but here's a video of him climbing a bit more reasonably. Doesn't look particularly difficult though, be interested if someone can figure out the route:
youtube.com/watch?v=-Hs8_Tu4sgg&
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In reply to nclarey:
Hmm. That's not quite so bad. Still deeply misleading in all sorts of ways. E.g.: (1) Still no sight of the belayer, and therefore no explanation to the uninformed viewer of why Bear has a rope at all. (2) He suggests that in the desert you have to decide whether to go over things or round them, and this is essentially your call at the time. Well maybe, but what kind of idiot would you have to be, if you actually were lost in the desert, to go over any cliff that you could go round?
Hmm. That's not quite so bad. Still deeply misleading in all sorts of ways. E.g.: (1) Still no sight of the belayer, and therefore no explanation to the uninformed viewer of why Bear has a rope at all. (2) He suggests that in the desert you have to decide whether to go over things or round them, and this is essentially your call at the time. Well maybe, but what kind of idiot would you have to be, if you actually were lost in the desert, to go over any cliff that you could go round?
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In reply to GrahamD:
entertainment might be more entertaining if it gave you something like an accurate picture. And if it wasn't dangerously misleading. And if it wasn't the Chief Scout doing the misleading.
entertainment might be more entertaining if it gave you something like an accurate picture. And if it wasn't dangerously misleading. And if it wasn't the Chief Scout doing the misleading.
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In reply to Owen W-G:
I watched a video of him "leading" an impressive looking crack in what looked like one of the towers in Utah. I was talking to a friend about it, somewhat in the tone of "perhaps I've been a little harsh on him in the past" until he told me to watch it again more carefully. You had to look hard but there was a black top rope in the back of the crack.
Al
I watched a video of him "leading" an impressive looking crack in what looked like one of the towers in Utah. I was talking to a friend about it, somewhat in the tone of "perhaps I've been a little harsh on him in the past" until he told me to watch it again more carefully. You had to look hard but there was a black top rope in the back of the crack.
Al
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In reply to GridNorth:
Check the links in the first and second replies to the OP up there ^^^ at the top of this thread.
It is a video of him "leading", but if you can bear to listen to what he's saying he actually claims to be soloing. The man is a *colossal* bellend.
Check the links in the first and second replies to the OP up there ^^^ at the top of this thread.
It is a video of him "leading", but if you can bear to listen to what he's saying he actually claims to be soloing. The man is a *colossal* bellend.
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In reply to Owen W-G:
When I first saw this I wondered why he had so many cams on his harness given that he was top roping. But apparently he is a massive Collector Of Climbing Kit.
> Debating with colleagues, what standard does Bear Grylls climb?
> What's he done on grit?
When I first saw this I wondered why he had so many cams on his harness given that he was top roping. But apparently he is a massive Collector Of Climbing Kit.
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In reply to GridNorth:
His website says he started climbing "on the white cliffs of isle of wight"
There exists various footage of him climbing in US, greater ranges, elsewhere
My Q remains: is there any evidence that he is 'one of us' and has done any rock climbing in UK?
His website says he started climbing "on the white cliffs of isle of wight"
There exists various footage of him climbing in US, greater ranges, elsewhere
My Q remains: is there any evidence that he is 'one of us' and has done any rock climbing in UK?
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In reply to nclarey:
Smashing cam placements there...
But in response to the initial question. Id love it if he had a secret ukc logbook
Smashing cam placements there...
But in response to the initial question. Id love it if he had a secret ukc logbook
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In reply to ActionSte:
He used to come on here to defend himself but I think he ended up running out of time with the overhead of keeping all his sock-puppet accounts active.
> Smashing cam placements there...
> But in response to the initial question. Id love it if he had a secret ukc logbook
He used to come on here to defend himself but I think he ended up running out of time with the overhead of keeping all his sock-puppet accounts active.
Post edited at 14:19
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In reply to Sophie G.:
I'm gonna attempt to offer up a more balanced view.
After watching the second video, he appears to be using a Trango cinch at the very start, and goes on to say "If you're solo climbing, the points of protection you place, are your lifeline" OK, so it's not strictly 'solo climbing' in climberspeak, but this is for a TV audience, so it's just a simple explanation that he's climbing by himself.
So he appears to be rope soloing these routes. The presence of the camera would also explain the 'top rope' in the first video, those camera shots are right up his arse, so the rope could purely be there for the cameramen to hang off.
He probably learnt most of his climbing skills in the army, special forces no less, (a fact that remains true whether reservist or regulars) I would imagine that during some sort of combat clifftop assault, the gear gets left behind anyway. So he probably leaves all the gear in, abbing down for it once the route is finished, or getting the camera guys to collect it.
Let's not forget that he's a fit, young, strong, ex-military outdoors type. It's not unbelievable that he could do a bit of rock climbing and be reasonably good at it.
I'm gonna attempt to offer up a more balanced view.
After watching the second video, he appears to be using a Trango cinch at the very start, and goes on to say "If you're solo climbing, the points of protection you place, are your lifeline" OK, so it's not strictly 'solo climbing' in climberspeak, but this is for a TV audience, so it's just a simple explanation that he's climbing by himself.
So he appears to be rope soloing these routes. The presence of the camera would also explain the 'top rope' in the first video, those camera shots are right up his arse, so the rope could purely be there for the cameramen to hang off.
He probably learnt most of his climbing skills in the army, special forces no less, (a fact that remains true whether reservist or regulars) I would imagine that during some sort of combat clifftop assault, the gear gets left behind anyway. So he probably leaves all the gear in, abbing down for it once the route is finished, or getting the camera guys to collect it.
Let's not forget that he's a fit, young, strong, ex-military outdoors type. It's not unbelievable that he could do a bit of rock climbing and be reasonably good at it.
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I wonder if on kayaking forums, they share videos of Ray Mears in a coracle in the Vietnam jungle, and come out with statements like "He's holding that paddle wrong, what a tosser!"
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In reply to Owen W-G: If he wasn't 'one of us' do you think it might calm down the amount of wingeing about how wicked he is.?
Is he viewed as a traitor - is that the big problem?
Is he viewed as a traitor - is that the big problem?
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In reply to ActionSte:
I recall they last appeared on the thread about him paragliding over Everest (a flight in which he managed to save a whale and find a cure for cancer. Probably).
I recall they last appeared on the thread about him paragliding over Everest (a flight in which he managed to save a whale and find a cure for cancer. Probably).
Post edited at 15:43
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In reply to Dell:
Having climbed with fit, young, strong, ex-military outdoors types throughout the 1990's in Germany, America, Italy and all over the UK, I can say that E1 made you a god. They did have phenomenal (if slow and laborious) rope work on any climb up to Severe. None of them jogged in to routes though.
> Let's not forget that he's a fit, young, strong, ex-military outdoors type. It's not unbelievable that he could do a bit of rock climbing and be reasonably good at it.
Having climbed with fit, young, strong, ex-military outdoors types throughout the 1990's in Germany, America, Italy and all over the UK, I can say that E1 made you a god. They did have phenomenal (if slow and laborious) rope work on any climb up to Severe. None of them jogged in to routes though.
Post edited at 15:59
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In reply to Dell:
Brilliant!
> I wonder if on kayaking forums, they share videos of Ray Mears in a coracle in the Vietnam jungle, and come out with statements like "He's holding that paddle wrong, what a tosser!"
Brilliant!
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In reply to Dell:
Mears knows his shizzle.
> I wonder if on kayaking forums, they share videos of Ray Mears in a coracle in the Vietnam jungle, and come out with statements like "He's holding that paddle wrong, what a tosser!"
Mears knows his shizzle.
Post edited at 16:05
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In reply to Dell:
Thanks for being the voice of reason, Dell. A rare thing on UKC
Yes, Bear could be loads worse. My point is he could be loads better. My point is (typical bloody academic eh?) education education education.
I think a Chief Scout should be not only inspiring--which for a lot of young people Bear is, for sure--but also educational. He shouldn't just make kids *want* to go climbing. He should use his elevated position to help them to actually *go* climbing, by giving them (by the TV route) what information and know-how he can in order to help them to do it safely. A Chief Scout who actually did that would be having a hugely positive impact on society. I just think Bear is wasting a massive opportunity to help young people get into climbing and other outdoorsy stuff--because he's showboating, sometimes in dangerously misleading ways, when he could be teaching.
In short, I wish Bear spent his time being a teaching tool, instead of just being a...
Here endeth the rant.
Thanks for being the voice of reason, Dell. A rare thing on UKC
Yes, Bear could be loads worse. My point is he could be loads better. My point is (typical bloody academic eh?) education education education.
I think a Chief Scout should be not only inspiring--which for a lot of young people Bear is, for sure--but also educational. He shouldn't just make kids *want* to go climbing. He should use his elevated position to help them to actually *go* climbing, by giving them (by the TV route) what information and know-how he can in order to help them to do it safely. A Chief Scout who actually did that would be having a hugely positive impact on society. I just think Bear is wasting a massive opportunity to help young people get into climbing and other outdoorsy stuff--because he's showboating, sometimes in dangerously misleading ways, when he could be teaching.
In short, I wish Bear spent his time being a teaching tool, instead of just being a...
Here endeth the rant.
Post edited at 19:00
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In reply to Dell:
A fairly wealthy bell-end.
Maybe its a good job he doesn't actually instruct on any of his 'courses' but restricts himself to TV appearances.
> Don't get me wrong, I still think he's a right bell-end.
A fairly wealthy bell-end.
Maybe its a good job he doesn't actually instruct on any of his 'courses' but restricts himself to TV appearances.
Post edited at 19:20
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In reply to Dell:
If I was Chief Scout I'd do a series on the telly called "So you want to be a climber?" I'd take people all the way from the sofa to the greater ranges. Teaching and informing and educating at every step. And with loads of cracking footage of amazing mountains and crags and routes and boulder problems along the way.
I can virtually write the intro to one of these progs in my head. Cue some drone footage like the spectacular picture of the Aletschhorn in the top right of this very screen. Voice over: "Doesn't it look amazing? Think you could never climb it? No idea how anyone would climb it? Think it's probably just impossible? Well, it isn't. This programme is going to show you how people get there..." Cue info about rope techniques, glaciers, route selection, weather selection, fitness and training, the history and geography of the Alps... the lot.
It would be so much better than watching Bear arsing around doing things that nobody serious ever does. And it could actually transform some people's lives. In a good way
If I was Chief Scout I'd do a series on the telly called "So you want to be a climber?" I'd take people all the way from the sofa to the greater ranges. Teaching and informing and educating at every step. And with loads of cracking footage of amazing mountains and crags and routes and boulder problems along the way.
I can virtually write the intro to one of these progs in my head. Cue some drone footage like the spectacular picture of the Aletschhorn in the top right of this very screen. Voice over: "Doesn't it look amazing? Think you could never climb it? No idea how anyone would climb it? Think it's probably just impossible? Well, it isn't. This programme is going to show you how people get there..." Cue info about rope techniques, glaciers, route selection, weather selection, fitness and training, the history and geography of the Alps... the lot.
It would be so much better than watching Bear arsing around doing things that nobody serious ever does. And it could actually transform some people's lives. In a good way
Post edited at 19:22
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In reply to Owen W-G:
I've noticed that on a lot of the climbs he does he has a top rope (sometimes it's out of his sleeve) but I'd imagine this has a lot to do with insurance and the rigging expert they use, plus the fact they don't want to have to evac him out of some remote location when he falls off. I do like his earlier born survivor stuff but I kind of went off him when he started pissing about with celebrities and wearing the horrible orange b.g crappy kit.
I've noticed that on a lot of the climbs he does he has a top rope (sometimes it's out of his sleeve) but I'd imagine this has a lot to do with insurance and the rigging expert they use, plus the fact they don't want to have to evac him out of some remote location when he falls off. I do like his earlier born survivor stuff but I kind of went off him when he started pissing about with celebrities and wearing the horrible orange b.g crappy kit.
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In reply to Owen W-G:
If you remember the 80's you'll know the tune,
I've travelled this whole world of ours from Barnsley to Peru
I've had sunshine in the Arctic and swam in Timbuktoo
I've seen unicorns in Burma and the yeti in Nepal
I've danced with 10 ft pygmies in a Montezuma hall
I've met the king of China and a working Yorkshire miner
But I've never met a UKC Bear Grylls fan,
And that's not bloody surprising man
Cos he top ropes while pretending to lead
I've got served in Aldi after less than four days wait
I've had lunch with Mrs Num Num when she paid and wasn't late
I know a swimming baths where they don't piss in the pool
I know a bloke who got a job straight from leaving school
I met a normal merman and a fairly modest German
But I never met a UKC Bear Grylls fan
and that's not bloody surprising man
Cos they think he's an attention seeking bellend
If you remember the 80's you'll know the tune,
I've travelled this whole world of ours from Barnsley to Peru
I've had sunshine in the Arctic and swam in Timbuktoo
I've seen unicorns in Burma and the yeti in Nepal
I've danced with 10 ft pygmies in a Montezuma hall
I've met the king of China and a working Yorkshire miner
But I've never met a UKC Bear Grylls fan,
And that's not bloody surprising man
Cos he top ropes while pretending to lead
I've got served in Aldi after less than four days wait
I've had lunch with Mrs Num Num when she paid and wasn't late
I know a swimming baths where they don't piss in the pool
I know a bloke who got a job straight from leaving school
I met a normal merman and a fairly modest German
But I never met a UKC Bear Grylls fan
and that's not bloody surprising man
Cos they think he's an attention seeking bellend
Post edited at 19:56
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In reply to Andy Say:
Have you seen the price of his courses? If I paid a grand for 4 days 'survival training' in Wales.....I'd fully expect to meet my hero. Not only that I'd want him wiping my bum for me as well!
> Maybe its a good job he doesn't actually instruct on any of his 'courses' but restricts himself to TV appearances.
Have you seen the price of his courses? If I paid a grand for 4 days 'survival training' in Wales.....I'd fully expect to meet my hero. Not only that I'd want him wiping my bum for me as well!
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In reply to Wsdconst:
I can remember watching one of the earlier Born Survivor shows and seeing him climb a waterfall, which admittedly looked sketchy as f**#, but was so disappointed to catch sight of a top rope.
I can only liken the disappointment to the day I found out WWF wrestling was not "real".
Both shows now languish well off the bottom of my viewing priority list.
Andy
I can remember watching one of the earlier Born Survivor shows and seeing him climb a waterfall, which admittedly looked sketchy as f**#, but was so disappointed to catch sight of a top rope.
I can only liken the disappointment to the day I found out WWF wrestling was not "real".
Both shows now languish well off the bottom of my viewing priority list.
Andy
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In reply to ericinbristol:
Hope you mean the TV show idea and not the bottom-wiping one
If so--yes, wouldn't that be great? A TV show that actually tells people how to climb. Just imagine.
You could put in loads of interviews with interesting climbing people, obvs. Bonington, Joe Simpson, Andy Nisbet, Dave MacLeod, Stephen Venables, Mrs Num Num for gender balance...
> I love this idea
Hope you mean the TV show idea and not the bottom-wiping one
If so--yes, wouldn't that be great? A TV show that actually tells people how to climb. Just imagine.
You could put in loads of interviews with interesting climbing people, obvs. Bonington, Joe Simpson, Andy Nisbet, Dave MacLeod, Stephen Venables, Mrs Num Num for gender balance...
Post edited at 20:55
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In reply to Andrew Wilson:
Wrestling is much better when you grow up and find out it's not real, I mean how amazing is it that a 20 stone guy can jump off the top rope onto another 20 stone guy without either of them being injured.
Wrestling is much better when you grow up and find out it's not real, I mean how amazing is it that a 20 stone guy can jump off the top rope onto another 20 stone guy without either of them being injured.
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In reply to Wsdconst:
I was just about to say the same - pantomime that it is, the wrestling is a lot more 'real' than what BG does. The wrestling is fake of course, but the skill and athleticism of the wrestlers is not.
I was just about to say the same - pantomime that it is, the wrestling is a lot more 'real' than what BG does. The wrestling is fake of course, but the skill and athleticism of the wrestlers is not.
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In reply to Owen W-G:
Oh ffs, won't you all piss off, I get more of a hard time from you lot than the bloody Vegans do!
Oh ffs, won't you all piss off, I get more of a hard time from you lot than the bloody Vegans do!
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In reply to Sophie G.:
Definitely not the bum wiping one.
There have been some decent things along these lines
- Alex Jones of the One Show climbing Moonlight Buttress with Andy Kirkpatrick
https://www.thebmc.co.uk/alex-jones-moonlight-buttress-andy-kirkpatrick
- Jack Osbourne Adrenaline Junkie episode 3 being taken up Salathe by a Bristol posse (Mike Weeks, Bean Sopwith, Paul Twomey) http://www.climbing.com/news/interview-with-jack-osbourne/
Definitely not the bum wiping one.
There have been some decent things along these lines
- Alex Jones of the One Show climbing Moonlight Buttress with Andy Kirkpatrick
https://www.thebmc.co.uk/alex-jones-moonlight-buttress-andy-kirkpatrick
- Jack Osbourne Adrenaline Junkie episode 3 being taken up Salathe by a Bristol posse (Mike Weeks, Bean Sopwith, Paul Twomey) http://www.climbing.com/news/interview-with-jack-osbourne/
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In reply to deepsoup:
True, I once watched a documentary showing behind the scenes and those guys were suffering, taking steroids and painkillers was a normal Day to day thing just so they could keep performing,and sadly all the drug abuse seems to have taken its toll as a lot of them seem to have died in their fifties.
True, I once watched a documentary showing behind the scenes and those guys were suffering, taking steroids and painkillers was a normal Day to day thing just so they could keep performing,and sadly all the drug abuse seems to have taken its toll as a lot of them seem to have died in their fifties.
In reply to Sophie G.:
Have you ever watched any entertainment programs involving car chases or racing cars round ? is that where you get your guidance on how to drive ?
> entertainment might be more entertaining if it gave you something like an accurate picture. And if it wasn't dangerously misleading. And if it wasn't the Chief Scout doing the misleading.
Have you ever watched any entertainment programs involving car chases or racing cars round ? is that where you get your guidance on how to drive ?
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In reply to Owen W-G:
Coming to a mole-hill near you....
Bear Grylls in...The extremely terrifying production of..."Climbing the North Face of Hell Mountain"...
Sponsored by Craghoppers , & "No see um ropes", ...
Taxi!....
Coming to a mole-hill near you....
Bear Grylls in...The extremely terrifying production of..."Climbing the North Face of Hell Mountain"...
Sponsored by Craghoppers , & "No see um ropes", ...
Taxi!....
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In reply to GrahamD:
Might be a fair analogy if it was the director of the BSM doing the car chases. Don't you think being the Chief Scout brings responsibilities?
And whether or not you think that, don't you think it would be more valuable for Bear to do things in a way that's actually realistic?
Then (like I said above) he could be educating people about the outdoors as well as entertaining them. That is, using his huge production budget to help others do the kind of things he does. Instead of using his budget to show off, basically.
> Have you ever watched any entertainment programs involving car chases or racing cars round ? is that where you get your guidance on how to drive ?
Might be a fair analogy if it was the director of the BSM doing the car chases. Don't you think being the Chief Scout brings responsibilities?
And whether or not you think that, don't you think it would be more valuable for Bear to do things in a way that's actually realistic?
Then (like I said above) he could be educating people about the outdoors as well as entertaining them. That is, using his huge production budget to help others do the kind of things he does. Instead of using his budget to show off, basically.
Post edited at 09:22
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In reply to Sophie G.:
Since when was the chief scout supposed to be an authority on climbing ? in any case its a long way off the topic about what grafe can he actually climb away from the TV.
Since when was the chief scout supposed to be an authority on climbing ? in any case its a long way off the topic about what grafe can he actually climb away from the TV.
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In reply to GrahamD:
Scouts go climbing. If the Head Scout is going to go climbing and have his climbs broadcast, don't you think he should be climbing a manner which is in line with the way Scouts are supposed to go about things? Wearing a helmet would seem to be appropriate, at the very least. What's that Scout thing about being prepared?
That said, I doubt there would be much enthusiasm from TV companies for Bear Grylls doing less than hyped-up extreme. I can't imagine a TV pitch involving thrutching up a grit VS getting the TV executives very excited.
> Since when was the chief scout supposed to be an authority on climbing ?
Scouts go climbing. If the Head Scout is going to go climbing and have his climbs broadcast, don't you think he should be climbing a manner which is in line with the way Scouts are supposed to go about things? Wearing a helmet would seem to be appropriate, at the very least. What's that Scout thing about being prepared?
That said, I doubt there would be much enthusiasm from TV companies for Bear Grylls doing less than hyped-up extreme. I can't imagine a TV pitch involving thrutching up a grit VS getting the TV executives very excited.
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In reply to GrahamD:
Well how about this as an answer?: --"Since Bear did a load of things on telly where he poses as an authority on climbing."
> Since when was the chief scout supposed to be an authority on climbing ?
Well how about this as an answer?: --"Since Bear did a load of things on telly where he poses as an authority on climbing."
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In reply to Owen W-G:
This isn't really a reply to the original question posted, apologies to the OP.
However, I am sick of reading these 'pointless' threads that deteriorate into attacking Bear Grylls. He partakes in TV production to earn a living and supply entertainment. The average audience for the TV programs is not probably the same as the proportion of UKcers that apparently dislike him or his involvement.
You lot seem to enjoy bouncing reasons around why he's not doing this, that or the other thing right. He is producing entertainment (maybe not for you) and is probably bound by internal health and safety requirements as would be imposed by any large organisation that is compelled to do so by law.
Stop sniping from your chair or phone and go and do some climbing. You never know you might end up being interesting enough for millions of people to watch for entertainment and maybe even championing a cause like the scouts or some other worthy organisation!
Im going climbing now.......................
(Further replies to my post will be ignored as I'm not going to waste any more time on this post)
This isn't really a reply to the original question posted, apologies to the OP.
However, I am sick of reading these 'pointless' threads that deteriorate into attacking Bear Grylls. He partakes in TV production to earn a living and supply entertainment. The average audience for the TV programs is not probably the same as the proportion of UKcers that apparently dislike him or his involvement.
You lot seem to enjoy bouncing reasons around why he's not doing this, that or the other thing right. He is producing entertainment (maybe not for you) and is probably bound by internal health and safety requirements as would be imposed by any large organisation that is compelled to do so by law.
Stop sniping from your chair or phone and go and do some climbing. You never know you might end up being interesting enough for millions of people to watch for entertainment and maybe even championing a cause like the scouts or some other worthy organisation!
Im going climbing now.......................
(Further replies to my post will be ignored as I'm not going to waste any more time on this post)
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In reply to GrahamD:
The difference between films with car chase scenes is that they don't purport to be educational.
Bare Gyrlls regularly 'demonstrates' 'how to survive/do some activity' in his programmes.
You don't get Vin Diesel turning to camera in 'Fast and Furious' and saying "today, I'm going to demonstrate road driving practices that may save your life".
The difference between films with car chase scenes is that they don't purport to be educational.
Bare Gyrlls regularly 'demonstrates' 'how to survive/do some activity' in his programmes.
You don't get Vin Diesel turning to camera in 'Fast and Furious' and saying "today, I'm going to demonstrate road driving practices that may save your life".
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In reply to captain paranoia:
Ever since I found out that John Noakes didn't actually do the Penine Way on his Go With Noakes series, I realised that what you saw as reality on TV really wasn't reality. After all if you can't trust a Blue Peter presenter who can you trust. I just assumed people were more savvy about what they saw on TV these days than in the days of my innocent youth.
Ever since I found out that John Noakes didn't actually do the Penine Way on his Go With Noakes series, I realised that what you saw as reality on TV really wasn't reality. After all if you can't trust a Blue Peter presenter who can you trust. I just assumed people were more savvy about what they saw on TV these days than in the days of my innocent youth.
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In reply to GrahamD:
The chief scout is supposed to be honest. Honourable even. Some sort of a decent role model, y'know, for scouts.
Ideally wouldn't be the sort of posturing macho nobhead who refuses to wear a helmet or a buoyancy aid because he doesn't think it looks cool.
> Since when was the chief scout supposed to be an authority on climbing ?
The chief scout is supposed to be honest. Honourable even. Some sort of a decent role model, y'know, for scouts.
Ideally wouldn't be the sort of posturing macho nobhead who refuses to wear a helmet or a buoyancy aid because he doesn't think it looks cool.
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In reply to GrahamD:
Of course not, if you're an actor. The last non cringe-worthy Chief Scout, Grylls's predecessor, was both an actor and a Blue Peter presenter.
You're just being obtuse now. Of course there is a 'spin' to reality tv or whatever, that isn't the same thing as producing an honest work of fiction. An actor is an artist of sorts, not a bullshit artist.
Compare that laughable "Masters of Movement" climbing film with a couple of other films from the same promotional series:
Snowboarding: youtube.com/watch?v=JZvHk8QHgOo&
Base jumping: youtube.com/watch?v=phkyp2umOhY&
Rock Climbing: youtube.com/watch?v=5t0mJ63Y8WM&
You really can't see there's an odd one out here? Come on, it's just f*cking embarrassing.
Of course not, if you're an actor. The last non cringe-worthy Chief Scout, Grylls's predecessor, was both an actor and a Blue Peter presenter.
You're just being obtuse now. Of course there is a 'spin' to reality tv or whatever, that isn't the same thing as producing an honest work of fiction. An actor is an artist of sorts, not a bullshit artist.
Compare that laughable "Masters of Movement" climbing film with a couple of other films from the same promotional series:
Snowboarding: youtube.com/watch?v=JZvHk8QHgOo&
Base jumping: youtube.com/watch?v=phkyp2umOhY&
Rock Climbing: youtube.com/watch?v=5t0mJ63Y8WM&
You really can't see there's an odd one out here? Come on, it's just f*cking embarrassing.
Post edited at 15:20
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In reply to Iain(2010):
He probably isn't. Steve Backshall and John Arran of this parish didn't seem to be required to serve up top roping and bizarre abseiling stunts dressed up as dangerous adventurous climbing on their recent televised trip to the tepuis of Venezuela; they gave us the real thing, and it made for compelling watching.
Grylls isn't forced to do it by producers either, as other Bearophiles have suggested. He employs them, and has editorial control over how he appears.
He's not a victim of health and safety, or dishonest production staff. The content of his shows is like that because he wants it to be like that.
Given that other presenters seem to manage to cover similar ground, with prime time audiences, without the dishonesty, then it shouldn't really be a surprise that some people are disappointed in his plastic adventurer routine.
> You lot seem to enjoy bouncing reasons around why he's not doing this, that or the other thing right. He is producing entertainment (maybe not for you) and is probably bound by internal health and safety requirements as would be imposed by any large organisation that is compelled to do so by law.
He probably isn't. Steve Backshall and John Arran of this parish didn't seem to be required to serve up top roping and bizarre abseiling stunts dressed up as dangerous adventurous climbing on their recent televised trip to the tepuis of Venezuela; they gave us the real thing, and it made for compelling watching.
Grylls isn't forced to do it by producers either, as other Bearophiles have suggested. He employs them, and has editorial control over how he appears.
He's not a victim of health and safety, or dishonest production staff. The content of his shows is like that because he wants it to be like that.
Given that other presenters seem to manage to cover similar ground, with prime time audiences, without the dishonesty, then it shouldn't really be a surprise that some people are disappointed in his plastic adventurer routine.
Post edited at 15:38
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In reply to Iain(2010):
Don't read them then.
> However, I am sick of reading these 'pointless' threads that deteriorate into attacking Bear Grylls
Don't read them then.
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In reply to GrahamD:
Waaaaaaaat? No one to,d me this, you're destroying my childhood heroes .
> Ever since I found out that John Noakes didn't actually do the Penine Way on his Go With Noakes series, I realised that what you saw as reality on TV really wasn't reality. After all if you can't trust a Blue Peter presenter who can you trust. I just assumed people were more savvy about what they saw on TV these days than in the days of my innocent youth.
Waaaaaaaat? No one to,d me this, you're destroying my childhood heroes .
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In reply to ericinbristol:
There have been some decent things along these lines
- Alex Jones of the One Show climbing Moonlight Buttress with Andy Kirkpatric
Surely that was Alex Jones prussiking up Moonlight Buttress?
There have been some decent things along these lines
- Alex Jones of the One Show climbing Moonlight Buttress with Andy Kirkpatric
Surely that was Alex Jones prussiking up Moonlight Buttress?
Post edited at 17:31
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In reply to Root1:
Surely also that was Andy Kirkpatrick aiding a free route with Alex Jones prussicking along behind aided by the guides who were filming it ?!
Surely also that was Andy Kirkpatrick aiding a free route with Alex Jones prussicking along behind aided by the guides who were filming it ?!
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In reply to GrahamD:
Noooooooooooooooooo!!!!!
> Ever since I found out that John Noakes didn't actually do the Penine Way on his Go With Noakes series.......
Noooooooooooooooooo!!!!!
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In reply to Owen W-G:
How can we be calling BG a bell end while Boris Johnston still sullies our TVs screens?
How can we be calling BG a bell end while Boris Johnston still sullies our TVs screens?
Post edited at 22:05
In reply to Le Chevalier Mal Fet:
Hotels and staged camping shots with Shep I'm afraid.
> Noooooooooooooooooo!!!!!
Hotels and staged camping shots with Shep I'm afraid.
In reply to GrahamD:
It's worse than that. They even used a body double for Shep in most of the walking shots. They couldn't get him out of his trailer most mornings after he'd been up all night snorting kibbles with labradoodle bitches.
They had to pull strings to keep it out of papers- the Richard bacon stuff would have been nothing compared to the scandal if Shep's antics had got out...
It's worse than that. They even used a body double for Shep in most of the walking shots. They couldn't get him out of his trailer most mornings after he'd been up all night snorting kibbles with labradoodle bitches.
They had to pull strings to keep it out of papers- the Richard bacon stuff would have been nothing compared to the scandal if Shep's antics had got out...
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In reply to no_more_scotch_eggs:
And knowing about Shep's legendary soul-music all-nighters gives a whole new feel to the words "Get down, Shep".
And knowing about Shep's legendary soul-music all-nighters gives a whole new feel to the words "Get down, Shep".
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In reply to colinakmc:
Because Boris didn't pretend to be "cool" or "extreme".
> How can we be calling BG a bell end while Boris Johnston still sullies our TVs screens?
Because Boris didn't pretend to be "cool" or "extreme".
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In reply to timjones:
That's part of my point, he IS extreme (I grant you he isn't the least bit cool)
That's part of my point, he IS extreme (I grant you he isn't the least bit cool)
In reply to colinakmc:
I think we're talking about different types of extreme
> That's part of my point, he IS extreme (I grant you he isn't the least bit cool)
I think we're talking about different types of extreme
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In reply to Dell:
Oh, like you wouldn't believe. Kayakers are notoriously harsh with punters
> I wonder if on kayaking forums, they share videos of Ray Mears in a coracle in the Vietnam jungle, and come out with statements like "He's holding that paddle wrong, what a tosser!"
Oh, like you wouldn't believe. Kayakers are notoriously harsh with punters
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In reply to Rob Exile Ward:
Aren't they all punters by definition?
> Worse than DIY forums? I doubt it!
Aren't they all punters by definition?
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In reply to mrphilipoldham:
He probably does - that may have led him to reply up thread
> I really hope Bear Googles his own name from time to time!
He probably does - that may have led him to reply up thread
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In reply to Wsdconst:
So you know about his mega-bucks claim on BMC insurance whilst on a sponsored expedition, then?
> I'd imagine this has a lot to do with insurance and the rigging expert they use, plus the fact they don't want to have to evac him out of some remote location when he falls
So you know about his mega-bucks claim on BMC insurance whilst on a sponsored expedition, then?
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In reply to paul mitchell:
Possibly a few thousand routes and a few hundred mountains. And Edward Grylls would never have survived climbing with Don Whillans.
> What is the difference between Mr Grylls and Mr Bonington?
Possibly a few thousand routes and a few hundred mountains. And Edward Grylls would never have survived climbing with Don Whillans.
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In reply to Sophie G.:
The sad thing is that he *could* so easily make a climbing flick that would nail his credentials to the wall and earn him a tonne of respect. All he would need to do is play the belayer, not the climber.
Imagine this: BG as narrator and celebrity belayer showing off the adventure and grandeur of multi-pitch trad. The opening scene can show him in one of those spectacularly exposed "rainbows-and-unicorns" hanging stances in the middle of f'ing nowhere, demonstrating impeccable rope-skills and technique calmly and with confidence, his partner leading off a metre or two away. It's clear that he's the narrator and giving the narration from the side of the rock itself and, furthermore, because *he* is doing all the talking, it is suggested that he is the mentor and the expert - the other guy's just doing the demo. From then on, the real climber can show of real climbing with real (and safe) placements that instil confidence in the viewers themselves, making the sport look fun, safe and simple when one knows how, instead of creating "dramatic tension" and other such drek.
The sad thing is that he *could* so easily make a climbing flick that would nail his credentials to the wall and earn him a tonne of respect. All he would need to do is play the belayer, not the climber.
Imagine this: BG as narrator and celebrity belayer showing off the adventure and grandeur of multi-pitch trad. The opening scene can show him in one of those spectacularly exposed "rainbows-and-unicorns" hanging stances in the middle of f'ing nowhere, demonstrating impeccable rope-skills and technique calmly and with confidence, his partner leading off a metre or two away. It's clear that he's the narrator and giving the narration from the side of the rock itself and, furthermore, because *he* is doing all the talking, it is suggested that he is the mentor and the expert - the other guy's just doing the demo. From then on, the real climber can show of real climbing with real (and safe) placements that instil confidence in the viewers themselves, making the sport look fun, safe and simple when one knows how, instead of creating "dramatic tension" and other such drek.
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In reply to tony:
For the right amount of money, I'd swear he knows how to catch a fall. I'd probably drink my own piss for the right amount of money too - a fairly innocuous way to get rich.
For the right amount of money, I'd swear he knows how to catch a fall. I'd probably drink my own piss for the right amount of money too - a fairly innocuous way to get rich.
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In reply to Xharlie:
Where were you during my climbing career. OK it was often fun, but sometimes decidedly unsafe, and on other occasions bloody complex.
But maybe I wasn't indulging in a 'sport'.
> making the sport look fun, safe and simple when one knows how.
Where were you during my climbing career. OK it was often fun, but sometimes decidedly unsafe, and on other occasions bloody complex.
But maybe I wasn't indulging in a 'sport'.
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In reply to Andy Say:
Would that be the Antarctic one be any chance ? The one that pushed everyone's premiums up.
> So you know about his mega-bucks claim on BMC insurance whilst on a sponsored expedition, then?
Would that be the Antarctic one be any chance ? The one that pushed everyone's premiums up.
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In reply to Andy Say:
The chief scout should show the sport in its most polite and socially acceptable form. Nobody's going to take it up if you tell them they'll be rained on, benighted, puked on by birds, cold, tired, hungry, sore and often scared.
The chief scout should show the sport in its most polite and socially acceptable form. Nobody's going to take it up if you tell them they'll be rained on, benighted, puked on by birds, cold, tired, hungry, sore and often scared.
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In reply to Wsdconst:
That's the one. Broken collar bone is my memory. Can't remember the exact rescue costs; somewhere between a quarter and a half million pounds I think. He took a fall para-skiing. On a trip that was essentially an advert for a biofuel company if I remember correctly.
> Would that be the Antarctic one be any chance ? The one that pushed everyone's premiums up.
That's the one. Broken collar bone is my memory. Can't remember the exact rescue costs; somewhere between a quarter and a half million pounds I think. He took a fall para-skiing. On a trip that was essentially an advert for a biofuel company if I remember correctly.
Post edited at 18:37
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In reply to Andy Say:
And people wonder why ukc doesn't like him very much, surely now he's a multimillionaire he could throw abit of money back in the pot, I'll not hold my breath though.
> That's the one. Broken collar bone is my memory. Can't remember the exact rescue costs; somewhere between a quarter and a half million pounds I think. He took a fall para-skiing. On a trip that was essentially an advert for a biofuel company if I remember correctly.
And people wonder why ukc doesn't like him very much, surely now he's a multimillionaire he could throw abit of money back in the pot, I'll not hold my breath though.
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In reply to Andy Say:
Ooh. I would give GOLD to hear five minutes of Whillans on the subject of Grylls. GOLD. It would be eye-watering. It would be toe-curling. It would burn the paint off the walls. It would be an invective vindaloo.
> Edward Grylls would never have survived climbing with Don Whillans.
Ooh. I would give GOLD to hear five minutes of Whillans on the subject of Grylls. GOLD. It would be eye-watering. It would be toe-curling. It would burn the paint off the walls. It would be an invective vindaloo.
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In reply to paul mitchell:
'What is the difference between Mr Grylls and Mr Bonington?'
Take a look at the classic AC guidebooks to Mt Blanc from the early 70s, that will tell you pretty much all you need to know. Or climb a few routes in the Avon Gorge.
'What is the difference between Mr Grylls and Mr Bonington?'
Take a look at the classic AC guidebooks to Mt Blanc from the early 70s, that will tell you pretty much all you need to know. Or climb a few routes in the Avon Gorge.
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In reply to Rob Exile Ward:
Or climb a few routes in the Avon Gorge.
Or the particularly famous one in Cheddar Gorge.
Or climb a few routes in the Avon Gorge.
Or the particularly famous one in Cheddar Gorge.
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In reply to paul mitchell:
Both ex army,both tv types.
Grylls has made sure that everyone knows that he is 'Ex SAS'. The fact that it was TA SAS, is sort of hidden away by him... . As for Bonington, he was in the Army at the time of National Service and I don't think he makes a big deal of it.
Grylls is famous for being on TV and that is the only reason that he is famous...
Both ex army,both tv types.
Grylls has made sure that everyone knows that he is 'Ex SAS'. The fact that it was TA SAS, is sort of hidden away by him... . As for Bonington, he was in the Army at the time of National Service and I don't think he makes a big deal of it.
Grylls is famous for being on TV and that is the only reason that he is famous...
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In reply to paul mitchell:
One is more a climber at the age of 81 than the other one is at almost half that age.
Somehow this is the almost the exact opposite of the image that they both seek to project!
It might also be suggested that CB sought to promote the sport whereas BG only seeks to promote himself.
> What is the difference between Mr Grylls and Mr Bonington?
One is more a climber at the age of 81 than the other one is at almost half that age.
Somehow this is the almost the exact opposite of the image that they both seek to project!
It might also be suggested that CB sought to promote the sport whereas BG only seeks to promote himself.
Post edited at 10:54
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In reply to timjones:
CB is a professional climber, BG is a professional TV entertainer, so its not surprising they come over differently.
CB is a professional climber, BG is a professional TV entertainer, so its not surprising they come over differently.
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In reply to paul mitchell:
These two articles are well worth reading and illustrate the differences between the two men
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris_Bonington
http://en.uncyclopedia.co/wiki/Bear_Grylls
> What is the difference between Mr Grylls and Mr Bonington? >
These two articles are well worth reading and illustrate the differences between the two men
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris_Bonington
http://en.uncyclopedia.co/wiki/Bear_Grylls
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In reply to Sophie G.:
This. I doubt that he'd need 5 minutes though. One word and a look would probably suffice.
> Ooh. I would give GOLD to hear five minutes of Whillans on the subject of Grylls. GOLD. It would be eye-watering. It would be toe-curling. It would burn the paint off the walls. It would be an invective vindaloo.
This. I doubt that he'd need 5 minutes though. One word and a look would probably suffice.
Post edited at 22:53
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In reply to DaveHK:
That's because Whillans was a thug. If you're holding BG up as a bad role model DW is an odd person to bring up
That's because Whillans was a thug. If you're holding BG up as a bad role model DW is an odd person to bring up
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In reply to Owen W-G:
Personally I'd like to force BG to wear a Don Whillans sit harness for every climbing/abseiling/caveing etc stunt he does....
Lets see how hard he is then!!
PS..I've just got to go & pull my balls down as the memory of said harness has for some strange reason made them retreat!
Personally I'd like to force BG to wear a Don Whillans sit harness for every climbing/abseiling/caveing etc stunt he does....
Lets see how hard he is then!!
PS..I've just got to go & pull my balls down as the memory of said harness has for some strange reason made them retreat!
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In reply to GrahamD:
For me, that he (and Bonington) went up to rescue Brian Nally on the Eiger wipes every last misdemeanour off the slate. Heading up into such stonefall must have been like going through the gates of hell. There's a school of thought that both deserved the George Cross. I can't imagine BG (or many other people) doing that. But they did.
Mick
For me, that he (and Bonington) went up to rescue Brian Nally on the Eiger wipes every last misdemeanour off the slate. Heading up into such stonefall must have been like going through the gates of hell. There's a school of thought that both deserved the George Cross. I can't imagine BG (or many other people) doing that. But they did.
Mick
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In reply to GrahamD:
DW came from the slums and squalor of 1930s/40s Salford, unlike the privileged upper class prick that is BG.
I'm not really surprised he was a bit of a hard thug!
> That's because Whillans was a thug.
DW came from the slums and squalor of 1930s/40s Salford, unlike the privileged upper class prick that is BG.
I'm not really surprised he was a bit of a hard thug!
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In reply to Mick Ward:
+ 1 to this post. Well said.
> For me, that he (and Bonington) went up to rescue Brian Nally on the Eiger wipes every last misdemeanour off the slate. Heading up into such stonefall must have been like going through the gates of hell. There's a school of thought that both deserved the George Cross. I can't imagine BG (or many other people) doing that. But they did.
+ 1 to this post. Well said.
> Mick
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In reply to Lusk:
You really have a class chip on your shoulder don't you ? Plenty of people come from less privileged backgrounds without being quite so aggressive. Even when he'd made it to comfortable middle class
> unlike the privileged upper class prick that is BG
You really have a class chip on your shoulder don't you ? Plenty of people come from less privileged backgrounds without being quite so aggressive. Even when he'd made it to comfortable middle class
In reply to Mick Ward:
Plenty of people have done brave things in the mountains but still manage to be civil off them
Plenty of people have done brave things in the mountains but still manage to be civil off them
In reply to Owen W-G:
Just had a ticketmaster alert for a fantastic new show at the SECC. May have to queue for tickets though - they'll go quick...
"Get set for a mind-blowing live action and adventure show designed and hosted by Bear Grylls alongside a cast of expert aerial artists and stunt crew! Endeavour: Your Adventure Awaits will take the audience on a hair-raising, immersive, theatrical expedition across the globe using state of the art video mapping technology and stunning special effects"
Just had a ticketmaster alert for a fantastic new show at the SECC. May have to queue for tickets though - they'll go quick...
"Get set for a mind-blowing live action and adventure show designed and hosted by Bear Grylls alongside a cast of expert aerial artists and stunt crew! Endeavour: Your Adventure Awaits will take the audience on a hair-raising, immersive, theatrical expedition across the globe using state of the art video mapping technology and stunning special effects"
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In reply to bouldery bits:
Hmm... the sudden return from the dead of this thread doesn't surprise me very much. B.G. will always be a recurring theme. Hold that thought, though. We haven't had a good bolting-vs.-trad debate in a while. I feel positively deprived!
Hmm... the sudden return from the dead of this thread doesn't surprise me very much. B.G. will always be a recurring theme. Hold that thought, though. We haven't had a good bolting-vs.-trad debate in a while. I feel positively deprived!
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In reply to nclarey:
It looks a lot like Red Rock Canyon near Vegas and seems to be near Calico Basin, don't know the route though.
It looks a lot like Red Rock Canyon near Vegas and seems to be near Calico Basin, don't know the route though.
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