UKC

How much influence do you think they've had in the recent past and are still having now? I've just read about Duckenfield being a high-ranking mason, with the suspicion that the subsequent cover-up creates. I recently read about Thomas Hamilton and the suspected influence his Masonic connections had in him being granted a firearms licence despite a report advising he shouldn't have been given one. Are the transparent workings of our institutions influenced by Freemasonary, or is it all conspiracy theory?

In reply to Yanis Nayu:


You have answered your own question, albeit with another question.

In reply to Yanis Nayu:

For a secret society there seems to be an awful lot of info about them in the public domain.

In reply to DaveHK:


Except - perhaps - their membership lists?

In reply to higherclimbingwales:


I don't think the question's answered.

Do you know anything about these organizations? Are you a member?

What are these organizations about? Why do people join them?

In reply to Rob Parsons:


I know a couple of masons and a few rotary guys too.
Seems to me that some join for the connections (the ones I know are all small business owners and a lot on mutual trade goes on).
Some join for the perceived qudos of being a member and some join to do good works for the disadvantaged.
The rotary guys I know are always donating their time and resources for community projects both in the UK and abroad.

In reply to Yanis Nayu:

KRS1 (Sound of da Police) claims to be an L33 mason!

In reply to Dax H:

I think the masons are one of the biggest charity donors in the country, they quite like a good cause.
I also get the impression that just like rotary, lions, etc etc, many people just go for an evening out, a meal and some social time with others.
I bet the influence & business advantages between members is little different to those who belong to golf clubs or other such demographics.

In reply to Kevster:

I would agree. My dad is a Past Master of his Lodge and I am 99.9% certain that is was only a social club for him.

In reply to Kevster:




I discussed it with a recently-retired detective who reckoned the influence of the masons within the police was nothing compared to that of golf club patronage.

In reply to Kevster:


I'm not sure that is true, they like a good cause, but in my experience the figures are quite small.


That's certainly true.


We don't really know, I think the influence is less now.

I've been to the local lodge a few times, they host private functions and do tours. I always make a point of looking at the photographs and reading the lists of names on the walls. Quite a few Councillors, mainly Conservative, but some Labour are members, but perhaps unlike the past, very few senior Police Officers, Council senior management etc.

In reply to The New NickB:
The giving is not small, quite the opposite, but the brotherhood has its own as well as the ones you see

From the list of dignitary police council add the church, a big player, and the military.

Influence? its world class, the world over, and over the world

but not in Oldham the mother ship has left the town !

Pursued by a bear;; unlike Orwell not all masons are equal

In reply to Yanis Nayu:

Both of my brothers in law are Freemasons. The thought of either of them being involved in some high level secrecy or behind the scenes influencing both takes my breath away and reduces me to tears.

Once in a while it helps to have a really good laugh.

T.

In reply to DaveHK:

Not a secret society ,, but a ,, Society with secrets

In reply to Kevster:


The Masons are the second biggest giver to charity and only second to the Lottery Fund. They just don't make a song and dance about donating the money.


Yes its mostly a night out for a meal and a chin wag amongst friends.


There is no conspiracy or secret agenda. In fact practically everything that you find on the internet is accurate. If you google Duncan's Ritual then that will give a close account to a modern lodge.

There is quite possibly more advantages from belonging to an exclusive and expensive Golf Club than a group of elderly men who have retired from modest jobs or small businesses and want to get from under the feet of their wives.

In reply to Rob Parsons:


If you want to know who goes, you can see them arrive at your local Masonic Hall .
( so far, I have not seen anyone arrive at our local hall in blacked out cars and get sneaked in and out with blankets over their heads.)

In reply to Rob Parsons:

It says here the membership lists are not secret .

http://www.businessinsider.com/powerful-masons-2011-9?IR=T

Edit
"The one thing that is public about the masons is their member list "

In reply to The Lemming:


Not sure about that

http://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2012/apr/24/top-1000-charities-don...

(The three masonic charities are in that list)

And

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/10661581/Freemasons-millions-arent-t...


That's more like it.

In reply to Jim C:





I don't know if that claim is true, but, assuming it is: how does a member of the public access such lists? Or, more particularly: how can I find out whether or not any named individual is a member?

I guess you found the above by a web search. Here's one which answers the question in the reverse:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-17272611 :

"It's difficult to know whether anything has changed as the Freemasons do not make their membership list freely available, he says. Brown responds that to do so would breach data protection rules."

(Here, Brown = 'Nigel Brown, grand secretary of the United Grand Lodge')

I don't know the truth of the matter - hence the 'perhaps' in my original post.

In reply to Rob Parsons:

Like many clubs really. I would think data protection would cover this. I do not think non members are really supposed to Climbing Club handbooks with lists of members names. It always surprises me when I got to the odd hut and find the current handbook hung on the wall.

In reply to The Lemming:

I think that is a little dubious. The breakdown for the charities which they have donated to is available online. A quick google and I found this for 2014:

https://www.grandcharity.org/data/files/Charity_Leaflet_Web_LR.pdf

Almost 60% of the charitable donations went to members or their families. Personally I quite like this. You pay your dues as a member and if you hit hard times they help you out. Also they still donated over £2.5 million to other charities. For all I know this may still put them as the second biggest giver in the UK but it seems unlikely to me.

Edit: Realised this is only the Grand Charity so their total donations will be higher.