UKC

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-36259747

Another example of Jails bursting at the seams or general mismanagement?

If Jails are there to reform and not just punish then why are there not rehab wings for druggies? and why do drugs continue to have blind eye turned to them?

In reply to balmybaldwin:

The problem is that there is a very high criminal element in our jails these days.

In reply to balmybaldwin:

Prison healthcare. You'd be lucky.

D

In reply to balmybaldwin:

I've worked in prisons.

The prison population goes up every year. per person spending has gone down a lot in last 7bor 8 years.

Rehab costs money lots if it whether it's drugs or behaviour. prisoners really want drugs it breaks the tedium. prisoners have visitors. Apart from very serious offenders they're allowed to touch. drugs can be hidden in body cavities. drugs can be thrown over walls drugs can be delivered by drones.

Any more questions

In reply to alasdair19:

You forgot the most popular smuggling route; via prison employees...

In reply to balmybaldwin:

So why don't they get a dog and run it round the cells every night?

I get the budget problem, but surely by people coming out of jail free of drugs is cheaper in the long run? as for the tedium isn't that the point? why should chemical escapism be allowed?

In reply to balmybaldwin:


That may encourage gambling.

In reply to balmybaldwin:
I think the problem is insoluble. We need to lock people up in prison to keep them away from the rest of society, but I imagine being inside is both very depressing, and very, very boring. In which case, it's entirely rational to want to be off your face for as much of that time as possible. That's exactly what I would do.

So, there's a massive demand for drugs in prisons, for completely rational reasons. The cheaper and stronger and more easily available the better, hence 'spice' (synthetic cannabis) being the drug of choice these days. I think it's fair to assume that you don't want party drugs that make you sociable and horny when you're in prison, you want something that's going to take you away from the grim external reality into some different, internal world. Heroin would be ideal but it's expensive. Spice will do the trick as it's just weird, and gets you fully out of it for a bit. I'm surprised strong benzos aren't more in vogue (they probably are, but the press haven't picked up), as not giving a f*ck, and being asleep would be very desirable states to achieve in that environment.

If you think it's easy to keep drugs out of prisons, you're naive. If you think people won't desperately want to be f*cked up all day in jail, then you're naive. There's no money to keep the drugs out. You can't reduce demand without making prison an enjoyable holiday camp. The problem is intractable.

In reply to balmybaldwin:

Because a stoned inmate is quiet, sleepy and generally placid. If I was a prison warder on the night shift I think I might turn a blind eye as long as everyone was reasonably calm and quiet.

In reply to balmybaldwin:

Too many prisoners. Not enough money. Too much spice & subutex. Massive public disorder threat on the way with the smoking ban too.

You can get on the medical wing if there's drugs and/or withdrawal involved, but mental health problems will probably have to be evident too. And arguably, if there's a history of substance misuse/addiction and mental health there's an argument to be had that they shouldn't be in prison anyway.

In reply to balmybaldwin:

No money and to few staff. Staffing has been cut to a dangerous level. In the prison I worked in if you reported someone for drugs (or anything) there was not enough staff to cover you for the adjudicaton hearing so you couldn't be released to go to it and the prisoner go no punishment. You would see prisoners smoking drugs but not enough sraff to go on the cell and take the drugs off of them.
Also many private prison will turn a blind eye as every case of drugs being found etc will result in a financial penalty for the company so if they ignor it on paper there are no drugs.
I could go on

In reply to Jon Stewart:


I don't agree it's intractable. I think some (most?) prisoners, if given the chance to be respected through fair work opportunities - would prefer to do that, than to get s&(&faced every day. The frame of mind of many prisoners is that of despair, that society has given up on them - and when in that state it's easy to give up and revert to adolescent behavior. If that could be directly combated - and that could only be done through respect and opportunities (see the other thread about prisons, and giving them opportunities to work and save money) - then I suspect we would see a reduction in drug use.
Secondly some offenses need to be properly forgiven - getting caught with a bit of green in your pocket should not ruin your life. By sending these non-criminals to jail we are just exposing them to real hardened criminals and practically encouraging them that since they've already "crossed the border" (without a way to turn back) they may as well carry on.
There is also the large societal barrier too, and that is the "eye for an eye" mentality. It's still alive and kicking, and probably will be until I'm worm food.

In reply to james1978:

There's barely any prison officers on a night shift. Any trouble and they wait for the'reality orientation team' to turn up in a van.

Large section of the prison populations are f*cked out of their gourds on pain killers + opiate pain killers + and benzos and other mood stabilizers and will float through their time inside. Spice is an big issue in U.K. prisons but prescription drugs don't make the headlines of the 'my drug hell' type associated with Spice use.

D

In reply to Dauphin:

Is "spice" tolerated inside hm prisons due to being a legal high that can be bought on the high street?

In reply to james1978:

All street drugs are available in U.K. prisons. Spice is cheap and from my understanding very potent, i.e. its powerful and hallucinogenic. There's something of a bravado culture amongst the prison population in its use. Can you take it and still keep it together? Healthcare is very limited, anything like a loss of consciousness or collapse will get a ambulance called for it, they are not going to assume the prisoner is f*cked up on Spice and let them sleep it off. You have to remember that most of the prison population have had at least some drug history prior to conviction or remand, so it's an ideal environment to use. Especially since the money for drug rehab and the other kinds of rehab is drying up.

D

In reply to james1978:


No, it's not tolerated, it's just impossible to control. It's going to be illegal in a couple of days anyway when the new Psychoactive Substances Act comes into force (but obviously Spice won't disappear, only a complete f*cking idiot, e.g. Teresa May would believe that). It's just strong and cheap and very easy to get.