This topic has been archived, and won't accept reply postings.
Having done this for the second time in amazing weather yesterday, is there a better slabby mountain vs route in the uk? I've not done black mamba so can't compare to that.
As a sub point I've done hammer (HVS) also and although the first crux maybe be better than anything on Spartan I think Spartan is the better climb overall.
Post edited at 14:31
1
In reply to CurlyStevo:
Dogleg / Blank Linkup (VS 4b)
Yes I believe so. Also Scabbard on Creag an Coire Etchachan would be a contender.
Dogleg / Blank Linkup (VS 4b)
Yes I believe so. Also Scabbard on Creag an Coire Etchachan would be a contender.
In reply to Smelly Fox:
Yeah scabbard is good, one pitch in particular might be better than any of the Spartan pitches, but route as a whole not quite as good IMO especially from a slab climb perspective as it s only the middle pitch that is really a slab IIRC ( it's been a while)
I'll keep a note of dog leg I've not done it but I'm guessing it's pretty bold?
Yeah scabbard is good, one pitch in particular might be better than any of the Spartan pitches, but route as a whole not quite as good IMO especially from a slab climb perspective as it s only the middle pitch that is really a slab IIRC ( it's been a while)
I'll keep a note of dog leg I've not done it but I'm guessing it's pretty bold?
Post edited at 14:47
In reply to CurlyStevo:
Likely Story, Eagles Rock.....a grand day oot, for a Dundonian. Lovely slab climbing, and a nice wander over the hills, from Clova,
Likely Story, Eagles Rock.....a grand day oot, for a Dundonian. Lovely slab climbing, and a nice wander over the hills, from Clova,
4
In reply to CurlyStevo:
It has a bold top pitch, but the rest is just simply run out. One of the best easy slab climbs I've ever done for sure. Other routes like Blankest looked amazing too.
It has a bold top pitch, but the rest is just simply run out. One of the best easy slab climbs I've ever done for sure. Other routes like Blankest looked amazing too.
3
In reply to CurlyStevo:
It is a great VS slab route.
First did it back in the 70's on my first visit to the slabs in February. We'd gone up for the white stuff, and ended up getting sunburnt on Spartan instead in shorts and T-shirts on a glorious sun and blue sky day.
Ah, those were the days
> Having done this for the second time in amazing weather yesterday, is there a better slabby mountain vs route in the uk? I've not done black mamba so can't compare to that.
> As a sub point I've done hammer (HVS) also and although the first crux maybe be better than anything on Spartan I think Spartan is the better climb overall.
It is a great VS slab route.
First did it back in the 70's on my first visit to the slabs in February. We'd gone up for the white stuff, and ended up getting sunburnt on Spartan instead in shorts and T-shirts on a glorious sun and blue sky day.
Ah, those were the days
1
In reply to lummox:
Really? I haven't done Spartan, but I thought Great Slab was better than Longlands, and I've always been told that Great/Bow is quite a lot better than Great.
> I preferred Longlands to Spartan.
Really? I haven't done Spartan, but I thought Great Slab was better than Longlands, and I've always been told that Great/Bow is quite a lot better than Great.
In reply to Smelly Fox:
The top of blank is very runout but the friction is amazing.
I'll add salamander at creag Ghlas in as a contender.
The top of blank is very runout but the friction is amazing.
I'll add salamander at creag Ghlas in as a contender.
In reply to Smelly Fox:
It is adjectivally as the overlap is HS 4c IMHO and there are plenty of harder safe severe moves on Yorkshire grit.
On quality The Pause although a notch and a half up makes Spartan look tame ... as the latter has too much ledge shuffling with onoy a few classy sections and the former has two long out-there sustained pitches above the overlap and plenty of quality besides... it could almost be in Tuolumne. I thought Hammer was in-between quality wise.
It is adjectivally as the overlap is HS 4c IMHO and there are plenty of harder safe severe moves on Yorkshire grit.
On quality The Pause although a notch and a half up makes Spartan look tame ... as the latter has too much ledge shuffling with onoy a few classy sections and the former has two long out-there sustained pitches above the overlap and plenty of quality besides... it could almost be in Tuolumne. I thought Hammer was in-between quality wise.
2
1
In reply to Mike-W-99:
Is the climbing really good on blank though? The nice thing about Spartan is the variety of slab climbing, it's not all padding up a clean smooth slab.
Is the climbing really good on blank though? The nice thing about Spartan is the variety of slab climbing, it's not all padding up a clean smooth slab.
In reply to Offwidth:
I disagree on Spartan every pitch bar the last has some quality slab climbing on it, but pitches 4 and 5 are sustained high quality 3* vs slab climbing 1 and 2 HS ** and 6 a non event. 3 is probably **/*** VS IMO and does have a lovely vs slab section just before the traverse, the traverse which although easier is still quality smearing across a slab.
I disagree on Spartan every pitch bar the last has some quality slab climbing on it, but pitches 4 and 5 are sustained high quality 3* vs slab climbing 1 and 2 HS ** and 6 a non event. 3 is probably **/*** VS IMO and does have a lovely vs slab section just before the traverse, the traverse which although easier is still quality smearing across a slab.
Post edited at 15:37
In reply to Mike-W-99:
Interesting point, the hardest move is pitch 3, but as a leader i'd argue the overall crux pitch is either 4 or 5 as they are much more sustained vs climbing and with some more run out sections,.
Interesting point, the hardest move is pitch 3, but as a leader i'd argue the overall crux pitch is either 4 or 5 as they are much more sustained vs climbing and with some more run out sections,.
1
In reply to Gordon Stainforth:
Yup- I preferred the position on Longlands. Regrettably, I haven't done Great/Bow but it's on the list...
Yup- I preferred the position on Longlands. Regrettably, I haven't done Great/Bow but it's on the list...
In reply to CurlyStevo:
Neither is it on the Dogleg Blank Link.
> Is the climbing really good on blank though? The nice thing about Spartan is the variety of slab climbing, it's not all padding up a clean smooth slab.
Neither is it on the Dogleg Blank Link.
In reply to CurlyStevo:
I believe the move on pitch 3 is even harder when you get a hex from your harness stuck in the crack and can't work out why you can't move upwards...
If we can exclude the abomination that is the Y-Crack from South Ridge Direct then it's fairly slabby too and a damn fine route. My views on the Y-Crack are not publishable. I can jam a bit better these days but I suspect I'd still not enjoy it!
I believe the move on pitch 3 is even harder when you get a hex from your harness stuck in the crack and can't work out why you can't move upwards...
If we can exclude the abomination that is the Y-Crack from South Ridge Direct then it's fairly slabby too and a damn fine route. My views on the Y-Crack are not publishable. I can jam a bit better these days but I suspect I'd still not enjoy it!
In reply to lummox:
I thought Great Bow massively over-rated. Only a couple of reasonable pitches.
> Yup- I preferred the position on Longlands. Regrettably, I haven't done Great/Bow but it's on the list...
I thought Great Bow massively over-rated. Only a couple of reasonable pitches.
1
In reply to CurlyStevo:
Can't directly compare quality as I've not done Spartan Slab (would love to) but would highlight Kirkus's Route (VS 4c) as an alternative wonderful slabby mountain VS.
Can't directly compare quality as I've not done Spartan Slab (would love to) but would highlight Kirkus's Route (VS 4c) as an alternative wonderful slabby mountain VS.
1
In reply to Offwidth:
If there are harder severe moves on Yorkshire grit, that only suggests to me that they are sandbags and wrongly graded.
The Y cracks are solid 5a, and I am reasonably good at jamming (although I think there was only 1 move where a jam helped). I've done plenty of easier 5b sequences for sure!
> It is adjectivally as the overlap is HS 4c IMHO and there are plenty of harder safe severe moves on Yorkshire grit.
> On quality The Pause although a notch and a half up makes Spartan look tame ... as the latter has too much ledge shuffling with onoy a few classy sections and the former has two long out-there sustained pitches above the overlap and plenty of quality besides... it could almost be in Tuolumne. I thought Hammer was in-between quality wise.
If there are harder severe moves on Yorkshire grit, that only suggests to me that they are sandbags and wrongly graded.
The Y cracks are solid 5a, and I am reasonably good at jamming (although I think there was only 1 move where a jam helped). I've done plenty of easier 5b sequences for sure!
1
In reply to Offwidth:
It is rediculously good rock on etive, hardly at all granular / gritty and nicely consistent not too large granite crystals.
> It is adjectivally as the overlap is HS 4c IMHO and there are plenty of harder safe severe moves on Yorkshire grit.
> On quality The Pause although a notch and a half up makes Spartan look tame ... as the latter has too much ledge shuffling with onoy a few classy sections and the former has two long out-there sustained pitches above the overlap and plenty of quality besides... it could almost be in Tuolumne. I thought Hammer was in-between quality wise.
It is rediculously good rock on etive, hardly at all granular / gritty and nicely consistent not too large granite crystals.
In reply to Smelly Fox:
Yeah agreed Y cracks are defo vs 5a, S crack is HS / VS border defo eaiser than it looks, incidentally I thought the chimneys were nails for VD and not much easier!
Yeah agreed Y cracks are defo vs 5a, S crack is HS / VS border defo eaiser than it looks, incidentally I thought the chimneys were nails for VD and not much easier!
In reply to CurlyStevo:
Yes, because it's not a mountain route
> Is there a better slabby mountain vs route in the uk?
Yes, because it's not a mountain route
4
In reply to Robert Durran:
My thoughts exactly - it starts at sea level near enough
> Yes, because it's not a mountain route
My thoughts exactly - it starts at sea level near enough
In reply to Smelly Fox:
The pockets are not going to be an amazing surprise for anyone who reads your comment on Dogleg / Blank Linkup !!!
The pockets are not going to be an amazing surprise for anyone who reads your comment on Dogleg / Blank Linkup !!!
Post edited at 16:33
In reply to Michael Hood:
Ha fair play. I'll remove the comment. It does mention them in the guidebook though...
Ha fair play. I'll remove the comment. It does mention them in the guidebook though...
Post edited at 16:55
In reply to CurlyStevo:
I'm not arguing that Spartan is poor (2/3 stars is OK by me) just that it pales compared to The Pause... get on it.
I'm not arguing that Spartan is poor (2/3 stars is OK by me) just that it pales compared to The Pause... get on it.
In reply to CurlyStevo:
I've done Spartan Slab and whilst very good I'm not sure it's the best route at around VS the right side of vertical I've done. Kirkus's at Cwm Silyn is admittedly a bit steeper and not a friction slab, being more pockets etc, but is one of the best mountain slabby VS's I've done .
I've done Spartan Slab and whilst very good I'm not sure it's the best route at around VS the right side of vertical I've done. Kirkus's at Cwm Silyn is admittedly a bit steeper and not a friction slab, being more pockets etc, but is one of the best mountain slabby VS's I've done .
In reply to Offwidth:
True, but you can't compare a VS to an E1 on the Etives, it's not fair.
Personally, I reckon the best route grade for grade on the slabs is The Long Reach.
> I'm not arguing that Spartan is poor (2/3 stars is OK by me) just that it pales compared to The Pause... get on it.
True, but you can't compare a VS to an E1 on the Etives, it's not fair.
Personally, I reckon the best route grade for grade on the slabs is The Long Reach.
In reply to CurlyStevo:
The Pause is the best route of the eight that I've done on the Etive Slabs; making it ' the best seaside and bluebells slab route in Glen Etive'.
I thought Dogleg was a bit scrappy and nowhere near as good as a Blankist.
Hope is the best 'roadside mountain slab route in the U.K.' And it leads to Grey Arête which might actually best mountain slab route in the UK.
The Pause is the best route of the eight that I've done on the Etive Slabs; making it ' the best seaside and bluebells slab route in Glen Etive'.
I thought Dogleg was a bit scrappy and nowhere near as good as a Blankist.
Hope is the best 'roadside mountain slab route in the U.K.' And it leads to Grey Arête which might actually best mountain slab route in the UK.
In reply to alan moore:
Where was the scrappy bit? Unless you are talking about the original line, which wanders about. Blankist does look very good.
Where was the scrappy bit? Unless you are talking about the original line, which wanders about. Blankist does look very good.
Post edited at 17:19
In reply to Smelly Fox:
Yes, I did the original which dog legged all over the place. I've haven't done Blank though...
Yes, I did the original which dog legged all over the place. I've haven't done Blank though...
In reply to Smelly Fox:
True! But from what I remember you could say the same about Spartan
To the OP... S Ridge Direct is the best mountain VS I've done + it's pretty slabby overall. Thought Spartan was good, but don't think of it as a top mountain VS.
Y crack - I reckon people think it's hard 'cause they get tired going the wrong way (too much beta...?)
True! But from what I remember you could say the same about Spartan
To the OP... S Ridge Direct is the best mountain VS I've done + it's pretty slabby overall. Thought Spartan was good, but don't think of it as a top mountain VS.
Y crack - I reckon people think it's hard 'cause they get tired going the wrong way (too much beta...?)
Post edited at 17:41
In reply to alan moore:
The variation vastly improves the lines dogleg and blank. The four stars the SMC guide gives it is not far off.
The variation vastly improves the lines dogleg and blank. The four stars the SMC guide gives it is not far off.
In reply to ed woods:
Aye OK, it's just the "feel" of the route that made me say that. It does have plenty of slabs on it for sure.
Aye OK, it's just the "feel" of the route that made me say that. It does have plenty of slabs on it for sure.
In reply to Smelly Fox:
Fair enough if it's in the guide - wasn't criticising for real, just thought that your comment was amusingly ironic
Piccies of the routes on Rosa Slabs do look rather inviting though. Certainly better than Finedon Slabs - see "Can't believe I've never climbed on..." thread.
Fair enough if it's in the guide - wasn't criticising for real, just thought that your comment was amusingly ironic
Piccies of the routes on Rosa Slabs do look rather inviting though. Certainly better than Finedon Slabs - see "Can't believe I've never climbed on..." thread.
Post edited at 18:46
In reply to ed woods:
I've done s ridge direct but I don't think the s / y crack or chimneys are slabs, fair enough there are a few slab pitches on it that are quite tricky but still they don't define the climb for me and they aren't as good as the best slab pitches on Spartan. Overall is S ridge a better route - yeah sure...... But is it a basically a slab climb or a better slab climb - no on both counts
I've done s ridge direct but I don't think the s / y crack or chimneys are slabs, fair enough there are a few slab pitches on it that are quite tricky but still they don't define the climb for me and they aren't as good as the best slab pitches on Spartan. Overall is S ridge a better route - yeah sure...... But is it a basically a slab climb or a better slab climb - no on both counts
Post edited at 18:41
In reply to Offwidth:
Yeah for me Spartan is 2-3 stars but only as I prefer climbs nearer to vertical perhaps with some overlaps. Ofcourse maybe the pause is better but that's off piste this thread is about vs not e1 I disagree hammer is better mostly the climbing isn't as satisfying bar one section of about 6 meters.
Yeah for me Spartan is 2-3 stars but only as I prefer climbs nearer to vertical perhaps with some overlaps. Ofcourse maybe the pause is better but that's off piste this thread is about vs not e1 I disagree hammer is better mostly the climbing isn't as satisfying bar one section of about 6 meters.
In reply to CurlyStevo:
What about Botterill's; that's a better mountain slab VS than any of the Arran rambles mentioned above?
Spartan is the only big route I've done more than once; it's very good imo.
On the subject of the crux, there's a move at the top of pitch 1 (where a split block fell away sometime in the mid 90's) that feels a technical grade harder than anything else on the route. The big overlap feels like 4b at 5'11".
Sorry, forgot The Pause is E1 now!
What about Botterill's; that's a better mountain slab VS than any of the Arran rambles mentioned above?
Spartan is the only big route I've done more than once; it's very good imo.
On the subject of the crux, there's a move at the top of pitch 1 (where a split block fell away sometime in the mid 90's) that feels a technical grade harder than anything else on the route. The big overlap feels like 4b at 5'11".
Sorry, forgot The Pause is E1 now!
3
In reply to alan moore:
So yeah pitch 1 4a as per guide no way, the move after the initial crack, stepping down on to the slab and a few moves after that are worth more like 4c IMO and feel around as hard as the cruxes on pitches 4 and 5, I thought the pitch 3 crux although very different was harder.
The overlap I think is about 4c for me maybe 5a, I jammed my way rather ungainly this time until I could get a foot on the slab. I suspect with practice I could find a nicer way than the way it worked out anyways.
Botterill's looks nice, is it only 1 pitch of slab climbing though?
So yeah pitch 1 4a as per guide no way, the move after the initial crack, stepping down on to the slab and a few moves after that are worth more like 4c IMO and feel around as hard as the cruxes on pitches 4 and 5, I thought the pitch 3 crux although very different was harder.
The overlap I think is about 4c for me maybe 5a, I jammed my way rather ungainly this time until I could get a foot on the slab. I suspect with practice I could find a nicer way than the way it worked out anyways.
Botterill's looks nice, is it only 1 pitch of slab climbing though?
Post edited at 11:29
In reply to CurlyStevo:
I often thought about, but never got round to doing, a hybrid of Botterill's Slab followed by the upper pitches of Central Buttress (easily accessible from the top of pitch 2 of Botterill's). Surely that would be a superb classic VS outing?
I often thought about, but never got round to doing, a hybrid of Botterill's Slab followed by the upper pitches of Central Buttress (easily accessible from the top of pitch 2 of Botterill's). Surely that would be a superb classic VS outing?
In reply to CurlyStevo:
Fair enough, I took 'slabby' to mean something broader than slabs like Etive - not many of those around in the mountains. Another thought, I've always liked the look of that route above Idwal - is it Grey Slab/Lost Boot?
Fair enough, I took 'slabby' to mean something broader than slabs like Etive - not many of those around in the mountains. Another thought, I've always liked the look of that route above Idwal - is it Grey Slab/Lost Boot?
In reply to CurlyStevo:
My vote is for the Pause. Spartan nice but some veg, shuffling etc. For fun try Band of Hope. You get to carry a light rack...
My vote is for the Pause. Spartan nice but some veg, shuffling etc. For fun try Band of Hope. You get to carry a light rack...
In reply to CurlyStevo:
How about "the other" Hammer - the very good 3 pitch VS on Arran?
Finishes before the layback crack and 3-tier chimney for a great day out.
M
How about "the other" Hammer - the very good 3 pitch VS on Arran?
Finishes before the layback crack and 3-tier chimney for a great day out.
M
In reply to Smelly Fox:
Agreed. Great fun too, if you like jamming (like me!)
> The Y cracks are solid 5a ...
Agreed. Great fun too, if you like jamming (like me!)
In reply to george mc:
The pause isn't VS though
There is only a tiny bit of veg on spartan (bar the last crap pitch which feels like an escape to the descent rather than part of the route proper). Its on pitch 1 and should really be removed IMO. It would however make that pitch a bit harder and would be as solid as pitches 4 and 5 then most likely.
The pause isn't VS though
There is only a tiny bit of veg on spartan (bar the last crap pitch which feels like an escape to the descent rather than part of the route proper). Its on pitch 1 and should really be removed IMO. It would however make that pitch a bit harder and would be as solid as pitches 4 and 5 then most likely.
Post edited at 12:34
In reply to CurlyStevo:
Both very good routes. Beware Arctic Way is probably undergraded at VS, though. Crux pitch felt like run-out HVS; gave me a bit of a scare!
Both very good routes. Beware Arctic Way is probably undergraded at VS, though. Crux pitch felt like run-out HVS; gave me a bit of a scare!
2
In reply to ed woods:
Been a few years since I did Spartan, but did South ridge a fortnight ago and it's one of the best VS climbs I've done anywhere. 2 or 3 pitches with really high quality climbing and some positions higher up that would be fantastic even if the rock was crap. Which it isn't.
Been a few years since I did Spartan, but did South ridge a fortnight ago and it's one of the best VS climbs I've done anywhere. 2 or 3 pitches with really high quality climbing and some positions higher up that would be fantastic even if the rock was crap. Which it isn't.
2
In reply to Offwidth:
Agreed, I thought 4 stars for the Pause, 3 stars for Hammer/Spartan.
>
> On quality The Pause although a notch and a half up makes Spartan look tame ... as the latter has too much ledge shuffling with onoy a few classy sections and the former has two long out-there sustained pitches above the overlap and plenty of quality besides... it could almost be in Tuolumne. I thought Hammer was in-between quality wise.
> On quality The Pause although a notch and a half up makes Spartan look tame ... as the latter has too much ledge shuffling with onoy a few classy sections and the former has two long out-there sustained pitches above the overlap and plenty of quality besides... it could almost be in Tuolumne. I thought Hammer was in-between quality wise.
Agreed, I thought 4 stars for the Pause, 3 stars for Hammer/Spartan.
In reply to CurlyStevo:
Worth doing Angel's Edgeway if you haven't, finishing up the direct finish to Squareface (the jam crack). A brilliant outing, and quite slabby in nature
Worth doing Angel's Edgeway if you haven't, finishing up the direct finish to Squareface (the jam crack). A brilliant outing, and quite slabby in nature
In reply to Michael Gordon:
I'm not sure that "not very steep" means the same as "slab" in climbing terms. If you're climbing a crack you are not slab climbing (though the crack might be in a slab). To me slab climbing means that you are primarily relying on friction of the feet to make progress rather than pulling on holds. Quite a lot of the routes mentioned in this thread are not slab climbs!
> Worth doing Angel's Edgeway if you haven't, finishing up the direct finish to Squareface (the jam crack). A brilliant outing, and quite slabby in nature.
I'm not sure that "not very steep" means the same as "slab" in climbing terms. If you're climbing a crack you are not slab climbing (though the crack might be in a slab). To me slab climbing means that you are primarily relying on friction of the feet to make progress rather than pulling on holds. Quite a lot of the routes mentioned in this thread are not slab climbs!
In reply to Michael Gordon:
Is slabby climbing different from slab climbing?!
Anyway, if anything not very steep is allowed, then I reckon Integrity is a strong contender. Did it last week 34 years after I first did it and it was even better than I remembered!
> I quite agree but then the initial stipulation was 'slabby' not slab...
Is slabby climbing different from slab climbing?!
Anyway, if anything not very steep is allowed, then I reckon Integrity is a strong contender. Did it last week 34 years after I first did it and it was even better than I remembered!
Post edited at 12:05
1
In reply to Robert Durran:
I think 'slabby' can often just mean anything less than vertical.
Integrity might work but it's Hard Severe!
I think 'slabby' can often just mean anything less than vertical.
Integrity might work but it's Hard Severe!
In reply to Michael Gordon:
VS in the guidebook (and on here).
> Integrity might work but it's Hard Severe!
VS in the guidebook (and on here).
In reply to Robert Durran:
But the only parts of Integrity that are remotely VS-like are the start and the overlap preceding the belay. Neither of which are slabby. The joyous slab section is about Severe.
But the only parts of Integrity that are remotely VS-like are the start and the overlap preceding the belay. Neither of which are slabby. The joyous slab section is about Severe.
In reply to BnB:
I didn't claim it was a slab route! That was my kind of my point........
> But the only parts of Integrity that are remotely VS-like are the start and the overlap preceding the belay. Neither of which are slabby. The joyous slab section is about Severe.
I didn't claim it was a slab route! That was my kind of my point........
In reply to CurlyStevo:
South ridge direct is such a beautiful climb. G.C Curtis and G.H townsend must of been sick having missed out on the such a prize Arran route. Hammer(Arran) has improved some what from when I first did it in the 80s. It had clumps of turf that have gone now.
Although I have visited the South slabs numerous times they do seem rather featureless. It does puzzle me the staring system that seems to rate the nearby Angels pavement so low. I know its only Severe but I find it to be an amazing slab climb. It follows such a natural trail up beautiful rock linking a line of pockets that suddenly ends before the finish ledge. Deep breath then start peddling with the full length of the rope behind you.
South ridge direct is such a beautiful climb. G.C Curtis and G.H townsend must of been sick having missed out on the such a prize Arran route. Hammer(Arran) has improved some what from when I first did it in the 80s. It had clumps of turf that have gone now.
Although I have visited the South slabs numerous times they do seem rather featureless. It does puzzle me the staring system that seems to rate the nearby Angels pavement so low. I know its only Severe but I find it to be an amazing slab climb. It follows such a natural trail up beautiful rock linking a line of pockets that suddenly ends before the finish ledge. Deep breath then start peddling with the full length of the rope behind you.
In reply to The Ivanator:
Just what I was thinking
> would highlight Kirkus's Route (VS 4c) as an alternative wonderful slabby mountain VS.
Just what I was thinking
This topic has been archived, and won't accept reply postings.
Elsewhere on the site
Loading Notifications...