In reply to planetmarshall:
Wow, "automons"..."strictly defined criteria". It's not like I used photoshop to get the rgb value of the colour of the rock!
Yes, the "line of acceptability" is not solid, cast in in stone - each person has their own personal take on it. But, and here's where I think it matters - the vast majority of the people who spoke about conditions in the coirre on the day agreed - those guys were clearly on the wrong side of the line.
Bringing up the old "but it can be white and unfrozen" as a line of argument to allow frozen but black to be considered acceptable is missing the point.
.........................................
1) The fundamental "ethic" of winter climbing is the the route is frozen. No iffs, no buts. Turf solid, blocks frozen in place. No winter climbing can be done when it's > 0c. I don't think anyone will argue with that? ***
2) The
next step in the hierarchy of acceptability is: "is it sufficiently wintry enough for me (the climber) to consider it a valid ascent". This is the much more subjective, personal judgement and it seems to differ a fair bit depending on venue. Onlookers can't always tell how wintry it actually is etc. etc.
I think it's important to try to ensure
both points are met.
It is on this second point that I feel that ascent of Daddy Longlegs crossed the line. Yes, point 1 was satisfied, but the "general consensus" was that point 2 was not satisfied.
*** mixed routes! (clearly ice/neve routes can, on occasion, be climbable in warmers temps if you're that way inclined...)
Post edited at 10:28