UKC

There was a dusting of snow on the tops last night and freezing levels were below the summits today. I was on the Cneifion Arete and Clogwyn Du was looking white at the very top of the crag. Some way to go yet before we are climbing but there is cold weather forecast over the next few days so fingers crossed!

I have uploaded a photo of Clogwyn Du taken this morning to my UKC gallery. It will be online once the mods are happy with it and can be viewed here: http://www.ukclimbing.com/photos/author.html?id=36136

More photos also on my blog.

Rob

In reply to Rob Johnson: That looks more of a damp welsh grey than white. You are being very optimistic

In reply to stevev: Definitely white dusting on Carnedd Llewellyn today - we have to be optimistic in Wales !

In reply to Rob Johnson: thanks for the heads up and pic's!

In reply to Rob Johnson: lets hope this thread is as busy as last years monster...its a long drive to scotland!

In reply to Rob Johnson: nice one rob! I was hoping to start the forum this year but you beat me too it. I was out yesterday till mid afternoon and it must of come later on. lets hope it's the sign of things to come.

In reply to Rob Johnson:

that's in condition that, get the tools out!

Horrendous night last night. I was out doing an ML night nav re-assessment and it was 9 degrees at Pen Y Pass and wetter than a wet thing. Snow showers forecast on and off for the next 6 days though: http://www.snow-forecast.com/resorts/Snowdon/6day/mid

Got to keep being optimistic!

In reply to peetay: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=jNrdI1nUPmM

In reply to andyd1970: Baggy has started blogging so it must be winter! http://wwwbaggy.blogspot.com/

In reply to Rob Johnson: Its all gone again today!

In reply to Rob Johnson: More forecast for tomorrow. Very tempting to go for a bimble and get thrown around by the gales!

In reply to Mike Peacock: Yep, met office says: "snow showers are likely above 600 metres which may produce slight accumulations by the end of the day" More forecast each day this week too. I shall be going for a wander tomorrow.

In reply to Rob Johnson: MWIS seems to give a promising forecast for the next few days. 2-3 hours of blizzard conditions on Tuesday sounds good, with near or just below freezing temperatures to freeze the turf in the meantime!

Has anything been climbed yet?

In reply to Mike Nolan: I doubt it.

I had a wander out today. It was fairly wild. Stinging hail stones at road level in the Ogwen Valley, which turned to sleet/snow higher up. Cwm Lloer was very white, but the the turf was soft. Things may have been different higher up, but the strong winds didn't tempt me on to the summits. I'll upload some photos in a bit.

In reply to Mike Nolan: Not that I know of Mike. It looks set warm for the end of the week so it will be a quick hit for opportunists this week I think. Lets hope the freezing level drops to freeze the turf and then the mixed lines will be a goer!

In reply to Rob Johnson: Right, a few photos. The constant sleet/snow/hail didn't keep the lens too happy, so apologies for the blurriness. These were taken 11am-1pm, so I imagine everything looks a bit whiter now.

Tryfan
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mikepeacock/6453084151/in/photostream

Cwm Idwal
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mikepeacock/6453084699/in/photostream

Cwm Lloer
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mikepeacock/6453085285/in/photostream

In reply to Rob Johnson: nothing on y-garn yesterday , so we missed it by a day very windy though. leaving capel curig this morning there was a good dusting on moel siabod

In reply to Rob Johnson: I have a free day Wednesday, so hoping a mixed line might be in somewhere!!!!!

Needs a good freeze monday/tues!

In reply to CragRat_Trad: You can live in optimistic hope!! Good luck....

In reply to Winterbotty: Best to be optimistic i say...you never know

In reply to CragRat_Trad: Snow down to Pen Y Pass now and the freezing level is forecast to be at 600-700m for the next couple of days so we could be in luck.

In reply to Rob Johnson: Fingers crossed!!

In reply to Mike Peacock: Thanks for the pictures! When you say the turf is soft, do you mean not frozen at all? Or only slightly frozen?

Thanks
Mike

In reply to Mike Nolan: Not frozen at all at my high point of 670m. Like I say, it may have been different higher up.

In reply to Mike Peacock: Alright, thanks.

In reply to Mike Nolan:
There's no chance of a turfy mixed line being in condition in the next few days, sorry, and I'm normally pretty optimistic when it comes to conditions. If I'm wrong I'll eat my liner sock. I walked up to Clogwyn Du yesterday, black as the ace of spades, warm and wet. It'll take more than a few days of fluctuating freezing levels to freeze stuff up.

In reply to halfmanhalfbiscuit:

Forecasts are all over the place at the moment - current ones I've seen (this evening) imply a short milder period late mid-week (i.e. approx 10 degrees C at sea-level in England) before the cold pushes back down for the w/e - though whether we'll have a brief settled cold day, or just the constant 'conveyor-belt' of low-pressure systems with their wind and freeze-thaw oscillation isn't clear. It'll all be different by tomorrow; Northern hemisphere weather is distinctly 'undecided' at the mo...

PP.

In reply to PontiusPirate: Yep. For the past five years I've been using Unysis forecasting website which has proven the most accurate I've found, it's showing flucuating freeze/thaw cycles for Wales at 100Mb (near suface) with, like you say, a thaw late mid-week and a return of colder air for Friday into the weekend but anything beyond 3 days has proven to be speculation with low pressure systems as tehy can change track. Different story when there's a blocking high sittting there for 4 weeks.
Fair possibilty of hard-mixed conditions in Wales for the weekend.

In reply to Rob Johnson:
I was up there today around looking over to the snowdon horseshoe and it looked fairly white there.

In reply to darren lewis: This was the view from Pen Llyn this morning:

http://news.v12outdoor.com/gallery/

Certainly feels cold and the forecast is for more snow/lower freezing levels.

In reply to Simon Panton: good show ...I quick trip to Bonnie and fingers x'd when we get back she'l be apples

In reply to Simon Panton: I thought that, and last night the friday cold spell seemed a good bet but now a lot are forecasting thaws all week and not such a cold spell Friday.. heavy rain mid week, combined with high winds will remove a lot, just depends how much snow falls as well..

In reply to IainRUK: Well, if it doesn't come in there is always this:

http://news.v12outdoor.com/2011/12/05/the-deerhunter-m7-never-never-land/

In reply to Simon Panton: There's more there than I thought...

http://sarzmountainrun.blogspot.com/2011/12/monday-morning-mountain-run.htm...

In reply to IainRUK:

Thanks for that Iain. Might just go for a poke around tomorrow or wed.

I have been out with regular client and friend Mark today for a day of private guiding in the snow. We headed up the North Ridge of Tryfan (1) which gave a brilliant day out in the current conditions. We have had a reasonable dump of snow overnight and it has been snowing on and off all day down to about 500m. As we reached about 700m we hit the freezing level and where the route had been wind scoured it was quite icy. The turf was frozen above about 800m and we wore crampons for the upper third of the route. These are typical early season conditions the best sport is to be had on the ridge lines, the iced up cracks and unconsolidated snow make for good fun!
My friend and fellow instructor Huw Gilbert was also out today and climbed the Clogwyn Y Person Arete (III, 4). He reports similar conditions with crampons necessary for the entire route and plenty of good hooking action.
I have put a few photos on my blog.

In reply to Rob Johnson:

Nice first outing for the season..

In reply to PaleMan: It was a lovely day, really good fun.

In reply to Rob Johnson:

Nice one, looks like Baggy's blog is back in full swing

In reply to Rob Johnson: Thinking of coming up to Snowdonia on Thursday but the BBC forecast for the area is a bit ambiguous has there been any snow overnight?

In reply to deepstar:
big thaw forecast thursday!

In reply to deepstar: It looked similarly white this morning... I don't think much precipitation fell last night.

In reply to deepstar:

I use the webcam service to have a look at whats happening in real time, looks wetter and less white than yesterday but by Friday things could definitely improve and temps are set to fall.

Check this link:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/wales/northwest/sites/webcams/pages/snowdon.shtml

In reply to Joss:

I notice you're glossing over Thursday...

In reply to Joss:
"by Friday things could definitely improve and temps are set to fall."

apart from thursday when a major thaw is forecast.....

http://www.mwis.org.uk/lvqcktdgqxa/SD.PDF

In reply to CurlyStevo: Thursday not good. Early Saturday morning could be the one looking at these temps.

http://www.snow-forecast.com/resorts/Snowdon/6day/mid

In reply to CurlyStevo: Do you think it's worth bringing the winter kit this weekend?

In reply to Jimbob11: I'd bring it... Saturday could be a cracker and depending what survives it'll be a waste not to get out in it...

In reply to IainRUK: Grand, what's the general consensus. snowed up gullied i presume? Surely ice forming in Idwal is unlikely yet.

In reply to Jimbob11: No idea.. I think things will change a lot between now and then.. but its looking like a clear crisp day with a low freezing level and low winds... and a full moon...

In reply to IainRUK: Superb, just keep the clock ticking, only 2 days of work left..

In reply to IainRUK:
is there a lot of snow build up in the gullies just now then because thursday is forecast to be a full on wet and warm day. Can't imagine there will be much left on the butresses after that.

In reply to IainRUK:

so are you going to attempt a PBR?

In reply to Full moon addict: At the moment..

In reply to IainRUK: Hope it goes well and that you get a clear night. I'd thought of a trip up North but the night time weather looks uncertain and in any case I've been laid low with a cold. Its pretty hard work in the Lakes right now, but I guess all this snow will go. A shame as full moon and deep snow is ace, if not for 24 hour rounds.

In reply to Rob Johnson: I've been out on the tops today. Settled on Seniors Ridge but was unsure if any gear would be needed. Snow line was down to the lip of Cwm Cneifion, and not long up the ridge crampons were needed. The snow is deep in places, still soft, but there was a fair bit of ice around. The summit rocks were riming up nicely, and plenty of snow fell through the day. No ice forming in Idwal yet though.

Photos to follow.

In reply to Mike Peacock: how deep? a foot or deeper?

In reply to IainRUK: Higher up in the lee of some of the rocks on Seniors it was a foot or so, yeah. Not so deep at all on the summit. I thought the descent to Llyn y Cwn might be a bit treacherous, but that was just deep, soft snow too.

In reply to Rob Johnson: Hi All,

I'm looking to head out tomorrow, what if anything is climbable?

Thanks

I have been out working on Crib Goch today and had a brilliant day in some challenging snow conditions. The snow line has risen slightly since yesterday and this slight rise in temperature meant that low down the snow was quite soft and the ice was breaking easily away from the rock. As we gained height though conditions improved so that on the ridge itself we had some nice sections of harder snow. Generally though there was ankle deep graupel interspersed with sections of wind scoured snow and ice which all combined to make the route good value for the grade and meant that we had the rope on for most of it. It snowed all day with some beautiful big flakes at times and our tracks were soon being filled in behind us, a superb day in the mountains.
I have put a few photos on here: http://www.expeditionguide.com/blog.htm

As to what it will be like at the weekend who knows. If Thursdays forecast thaw is not too harsh it could be a good thing as it should be followed by a good freeze which is what is needed to consolidate all of the existing fresh snow and graupel. At the moment the gullies are useless as they are unconsolidated, as I said yesterday the ridges are the best bet. This could all change by the weekend though!

It is due to be cold from Thursday night onwards and they are forecasting some fresh snow on Friday so I would say there will be some sport somewhere on Saturday and winter kit will be required in the hills. Fingers crossed!

In reply to Rob Johnson: Great Report, Thanks Rob...Keep them coming

In reply to carrot_boy (North East Wales MC): Cheers. Out again tomorrow so will do!

In reply to Rob Johnson: Looks like a deffo for a drive up Thurs night then, cheers all.

In reply to Rob Johnson: Thanks for that! You're making me very jealous. I quite fancy doing Crib Goch on Saturday if the conditions are good.

Thursdays thaw isn't extreme as some people seem to be making it out to be. MWIS says 4 degrees, but decreasing to freezing throughout the day.

Mike

In reply to Mike Nolan:

This from MWIS Friday will then be very cold, with snow showers to a low level. With lighter winds centred on Saturday, hard frosts are likely over the weekend, and there will still be some snow showers on western hills.

I'm working Saturday and Sunday in N Wales, so a night time play on Crib Goch might be in order - yyeeeeeehhhhhaaaaaahhhhhh

In reply to Rob Johnson: Some pics from today.

Cwm Cneifion, Idwal, and Glyder Fawr
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mikepeacock/6466616119/in/photostream

Glyder Fawr summit
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mikepeacock/6466606665/in/photostream/

Clogwyn Du
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mikepeacock/6466605799/in/photostream

Seniors Ridge
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mikepeacock/6466606381/in/photostream/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mikepeacock/6466605453/in/photostream/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mikepeacock/6466607021/in/photostream/

In reply to Mike Nolan:

It's not the temperature that's the problem, it's the heavy rain and at-least-storm force winds - exactly the conditions to rapidly strip unconsolidated snow.

Fingers crossed thiongs change (though the forecast today is worse than it was yesterday)

In reply to Mike Peacock:
Some pics from today.
>


Wow, nice pics of Clogwyn Du. I'm danger of having to eat my liner sock but the turf won't be properly frozen on there yet so I think I'm safe. Weekend might be good for steep stuff.

In reply to Jimboandrews.:

At the moment gullies wont be worth bothering with, theyll be to thin and unconsolidated. Typical of Welsh early season conditions. Far better to head for rocky mixed ridges for a bit of snow covered hooking.
Just seen the BBC weather update, promising a short lived wet spell and more snow Friday even at ground level.

In reply to Rob Johnson:

I was out today & did Tryfan's N.Ridge. Not much more to add than Rob has already reported. Ridges are the way forward for the time being. No chance at all of gullies being in condition as things stand.

In reply to Andy Mountains: Thursday looks a great day to be out.. heavy rain.. 110 mph gusts according to MWIS or just a mere 90 according to the met officie.... that will rip snow away from the summits...

Stripped back and scoured this morning.

In reply to mynyddresident: Surprised how aggressive it was. I was out walking the dogs in Nant last night and it was a sleety/rain so thought it would be snow higher up... don't think much will survive tomorrow's wind and rain...

In reply to Rob Johnson:

Nipped up to Cwn Eigau this afternoon nothing up there to talk about.

http://twitpic.com/7psyhu

I have been out working again today and in an ideal world we wanted to play in the snow again as we did yesterday. Unfortunately the snow line has risen overnight as others have posted. We decided to head for Cwm Cneifion to get some shelter from 65 mph winds and some height. The whole Cwm has stripped back which is a shame as there is some ice starting to form on the Tower Slabs area. Nevertheless we climbed the Cneifion Arete as a summer scramble (carrying winter kit which must at least be good training!?) and had fun battling the winds. What a difference a day makes!

With tomorrows forecast heavy rain and higher temperatures I think we will be back to square one on Friday. More snow is then forecast so the weekend could be similar to the first couple of days of this week. It summarises the Welsh winter climbing scene to me, you have to be opportunistic and get out and have a look even if its looking unlikely from the valley floor. Tomorrow looks pretty grim though!

In reply to Rob Johnson: Tomorrow's horrific... I think its the only time I've ever cancelled the Thursday night run in Snowdonia due to weather... 90-110 mph gusts predicted.. so now I've cancelled no doubt it'll much much less severe...but it looks a short fast blast... but Saturday still looks stable...

In reply to Rob Johnson:

Looks like baggy has the bad news , looking at his pictures on his blog

http://wwwbaggy.blogspot.com/

In reply to playmobile: Hold on did Baggy just take pictures from a similar height to what I see walking out the front door....

I think when cliffs suddenly turn black you can say what you see from your front door or 600m... its pretty ruddy obvious... anyway Rich.. I'll write an article on my route for UKC should it come off... I know you'd love to read it from your arm chair...

In reply to IainRUK: Good man. I am running a nav course for the next 2 days so could do with a bit less wind or maps will become sails!

In reply to Anonymous:

Sorry, but as someone who is genuinely interested in the conditions in the mountains of Snowdonia, I don't find accurate, up to date, first hand posts from a guy who spends more time than most of us in the hills, tiresome.

Perhaps it's just me?

In reply to Anonymous:

Judging by a post earlier on, Crib Goch was looking pretty good. That might not count as winter climbing in everyone's book, but we've all been beginners.


Iain has said some very helpful and well-informed things about winter conditions on this thread. Amongst them was one in which, in response to a challenge, he offered his credentials as a (very accomplished) runner as a basis for his knowledge of conditions. And given that a runner covers more ground than most climbers on any single trip, and has to be relatively more sensitive to underfoot conditions (in addition to general hill conditions), his information is invaluable. And maybe other runners read this thread to find out about conditions that are relevant to them.

Since there are quite a few runners who comment on Lakes and Scottish conditions, perhaps you'd like to take your opinions on those threads too?

But let's look on the bright side: the more people there are who ignore Iain, the fewer there'll be on the hills when he reports that conditions are good.

In reply to Anonymous: Think you'll find a grade III 4 was also climbed in snowdonia this week. This is winter CLIMBING is it not?

In reply to Anonymous:

The thread is called Snowdonia Conditions, not Snowdonia Winter climbing conditions and is useful for all of us walkers, climbers and runners who will be out and about in the hills of Eryri this winter

It's also my favourite thread of the year and I wait eagerly for it. If it's not for you then no one's forcing you to look at it!

I'll be out on Saturday and if there's anything to report I'll be reporting it.

In reply to Rob Johnson: Back to reality - drove through Ogwen late afternoon. Temp 5 deg and what a change in a couple of days with more to go on Thurs - precious little to get excited about ! That's Snowdonia.

I have been out today but not up high for obvious reasons. The temperature was 12 degrees in the valley this morning, with winds in excess of 70mph, waterfalls blowing uphill and heavy, heavy rain.

At about 3:00pm the cloud lifted and the skies brightened. I was surprised to see that some of the snow has remained in the high North facing cwms such as Cwm Glas, Cwm Lloer and Cwm Cneifion. This will freeze overnight as the temperature is already plummeting and is forecast to drop below freezing. This could give a good base to the main gully lines but will totally depend on what snow comes in tomorrow. The forecasts suggest light showers becoming heavier as the day progresses and temperatures of -2 at 900m which could be good. We shall see!

In reply to Rob Johnson: Rob, did you see snow holding in the gullys? I understand that things will change between now and sat but I think a few lines might be possible if a base foundation has been kept. Will be there for ridge routes at the very least but would rather try a few gully lines even if very thin??????

In reply to Nicholas Livesey:
Ahhh relief no annonmouse, what happened, not that i really care!

In reply to Rob Johnson:

I'll be out for a quick explore tomorrow afternoon: probably up to Elidir Fawr as, if there are breaks in the cloud, I should get a good view of a lot of different summits - still reckon, from the information garnered already, that it'll be crampons and walking axe kind of day on Saturday...

PP.

In reply to Rob Johnson:

I will be out & about tomorrow & sunday, so will report back what I see/find.

In reply to Andy Mountains:

whereabouts are you heading tomorrow then? Or are you deciding on the morning?

I won't be there until about midday, hence the short sharp blast up Elidir idea.

Forecast freezing level is different between MetOffice and MWIS sites (but the former is an older forecast). I'll split the different and go with about 700m for tomorrow; a bit lower for Sat. Sunday's likely to be a lurk under a boulder sort of day... :-S

If I can get hold of some suitable technology and a signal, I'll update this tomorrow, unless I'm being over-plied with whisky!

PP.

In reply to PontiusPirate: I have a static caravan up in Bontywydd so heading up late tomorrow night. I'm then thinking of an extremley early (5am) start up into Cwm Cneifion, reckon something like hidden gully or tower gully might (just) be doable???

http://www.snow-forecast.com/resorts/Snowdon/6day/mid

In reply to smuffy: It's supposed to snow tomorrow, so imagine most of the gully lines will have unconsolidated snow in them (probably not even much of that). The problem is it chucked down today with very high winds, so i doubt they'll be much snow left from the last few days...

I like being optimistic, but i think it'll be a sloshy ridge at best this weekend. If the temps. stay down, maybe stuff will start to come in next week..

I'm out tomorrow, will post whatever i find.

In reply to CragRat_Trad: Will keep you all posted!

In reply to Rob Johnson: no snow at all here

In reply to rowen root: Where is 'here'?

In reply to Mike Nolan:

Given that the thread is titled "Snowdonia conditions", one would hope "here" is somewhere near there

In reply to Mike Nolan:

Hes just outside llanberis.
The webcams are showing barely no snow at all on the hills.

In reply to Joss:

Yeah, not a sausage. I'm starting to think a trip to the lakes would be more profitable. (looks much more wintery up there).

In reply to dogjogger: Apologies folks, but some people.................

In reply to Ava Adore: One would certainly hope! Snowdonia is a big place though - the conditions in Llanberis can be a lot different from the conditions in Cwm Cneifion etc.

In reply to Rob Johnson:

Ogwen webcam shows still some snow high up, but not a lot. http://www.bbc.co.uk/wales/northwest/sites/webcams/pages/ogwen.shtml

In reply to Andy Mountains: Did you not go out today Andy?

I have been out navigating on the Northern end of the Carneddau today. I have had about 15 emails over the last two days asking me if there will be winter climbing in Snowdonia this weekend. I generally only report the conditions that I find so that you the reader can make an informed decision as to where to go, I try to avoid naming specific objectives as that causes bottlenecks and also puts a weight of responsibility on my shoulders!

The turf was properly frozen above 700m today and there is still some snow in the high Cwms. (Very small amounts that would need to be sought out) The forecast suggests some light snow showers over night so I think there could be some mixed climbing to be had tomorrow. You will need to find routes that are not too reliant on turf, that are high up and it will need to snow overnight. They do exist! Where am I going? On a steam train ride to see Father Christmas with my kids!

In reply to Rob Johnson:

Rob, it looks from the radar and from web cams that above 600m or so there has been a fresh covering of snow today. I suspect only a couple of inches. Can you confirm this?

Thanks

In reply to bowls: Hi Bowls. There has been a fresh dusting. We only went upto about 750m today and I could not see higher because of cloud. What I saw was a dusting not a covering. It is raining now at home which will obviously be snow higher up.

In reply to Rob Johnson: I'm going to have a wonder up to crib lem/lech ddu spur tomorrow, hopefully it i'll be a goer, pretty high and comes in quite early..

If it's not in it's not in, will report back.

In reply to Rob Johnson:

good sign a freeze is on the way the gritters are out around the coast road Rhinogs

bring it on cold ...

In reply to Rob Johnson: Warming up the vehicle,dusting off the snow chains!

In reply to Rob Johnson: Frequent hail, sleet snow squalls today in strong winds (rain at valley level). Thurs stripped almost all of last weeks snow - so todays showers left a dusting over 2000ft. Snowdon has more cover than the Carneddau. Go for ridge routes on Saturday - Crib Goch, Crib lem etc

In reply to CragRat_Trad:

It will go in all conditions, as will Bristly Ridge, Clogwyn y Person Arete, Cneifion Arete etc as they arent reliant on snow, ice or frozen turf to get up them.
I can guarantee there wont be any gullies in condition.

In reply to Joss: I just ment hopefully it'll go at a reasonable mixed condition. i know it's climbable in any.

In reply to nige w: Doubt it too, but if anywhere will it's one of the more likely spots, cold and north facing..pretty high.

Either way it'll be nice to get out and i will of course post on here with any report i have.

Hope everyone else manages to get out and have a good day!

C

In reply to CragRat_Trad: aye its a good spot,might have a jog up 2moro

In reply to Rob Johnson:

Looking out the window it seems like light snow down to base of Cloggy but crag still black. A fair covering above Cloggy up to the top of Snowdon.

In reply to torquil:
Sounds like a good day for a walk.
Or indeed for a run - anyone know if Iain's going for it?

In reply to Toreador: I went.. another DNF..

Started around 9:30 last night, glyders went well at first but slow down the glyder fach descent, tryfan west gully wasnt too bad, but struggled to eat. White out conditions and the need to run in crampons on the carneddau really slowed me down and at capel i again struggled to eat. Laboriously climbed siabod and then started being ill, so canned it..

feel really beaten up.. the lower sections were so water logged keeping up right was impoosible, lots of deep boggy sections, super chilled.. then some technical snow sections on the ridges.

A few magic moments.. bit gutted as conditions were very wintry but self supported with the food didnt help.. also made me realise just how much time you lose by not having support...

some pics..

http://sarzmountainrun.blogspot.com/

In reply to IainRUK: Still an amazing effort Iain!

In reply to IainRUK:
Well done for trying anyway. You'll get there in the end!

In reply to carrot_boy (North East Wales MC):

No I didn't. Am going to head out tomorrow though, just waiting on todays reports to decide what to do.
---------
Nice effort Iain! How many miles did you cover last night roughly?

In reply to IainRUK: ah well - still time for another couple of attempts this winter! Know the feeling about being beaten up. I went out from the house right around longsleddale last night. brilliant moon and 6" snow, pretty much all the way round.

I remember feeling ill and not being able to eat anything going up siabod on my winter PB. I'm sure that you'll make it in the end. Maybe you'll get a big full moon and perfect snow next time. Have a good rest, eat some xmas pudding and have another go in the new year.

In reply to Andy Mountains: 25 ish? 4000m of ascent. Surprised if nothing is in, I had some dodgy moments descending large patches of old neve.. I was quite surprised how much had survived..

In reply to IainRUK: Good effort, nice atmospheric shots!

In reply to Rob Johnson: Good effort Iain, and good luck for next time!

I was out today. Just had a wander from Ogwen over past Llyn y Cwn to Nant Peris. The steps up the Devil's Kitchen were quite treacherous - very slippery with soft snow. There was ice forming at 700m. Met a couple of blokes who'd done Hidden Gully but said the conditions were pretty crap. They also saw someone heading for Tower Slabs, but reckoned that was optimistic.

So, I can't really be much use! Additionally, the camera died, so the only photo I have is one showing the snow in Cwm Cneifion:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mikepeacock/6487813223/in/photostream

In reply to Mike Peacock:

I think I met the same guys as they finished hidden gully. We went up seniors ridge, some very powdery snow. A bit of rime further up, very little ice, Didn't use the crampons or axe. Came down Y Gribin rain started back at Llyn Idwal. Warming up as the day went on. Not looking very good for tomorrow.

In reply to Rob Johnson: Out today with the intention of getting high as possible, we walked the PYG to Trinity face but it looked thin, soft, and not very entertaining, took a ridge walk across Lliwedd, cold and icy but snow conditions where rubbish, there certainly wasn't any proper in condition climbing to be had today, we ended up in warm weather getting rock routes done! Tommorow looks warmer and wetter, I'd say we need a whole new cycle from start to finish to get anything properly in!

In reply to Mike Peacock:
I got up to Capel at 5.30 on Friday, thinking it may have been a wasted trip. Dropped off my gear and went up East Ridge of Siabod in the full moon, ground started freezing in places after the quarry workings, but the bog was definitely not frozen! Only needed headtorch for the ridge. Some graupel acculumlations and a few icy smears but didn't bother with axe, crampons or gloves. Cracking night though, no other torches visible on other mountains, and a big cloud over Snowdon massif which didn't bode well.
Late start today and not optimistic. Went up Seniors Ridge, nothing forming in Cwm Idwal, some snow in Y Garn, Cneifon Arete was totally dry, Tower Slabs was starting to form some ice but nowhere near enough. High crags were rimed up all morning.
Some icy smears on Seniors', a fair bit of turf was frozen, but in other areas it wasn't as was insulated by graupel, there were patches of consolidated refrozen snow off the path on the east side of the ridge.

Walked round rim of Cwm Cneifon and spotted some decent ice in what I think was Nameless Gully, dropped down and did that -surprisingly fat, easily enough to get screws in if I'd not been alone, and some quite big chandeliers, which I left. Walked round to top of Hidden which looked lean, but was assured it was in, so dropped down Easy and did top pich of Hidden Gully, but it was pretty crappy really. Then dropped down Gribin. Only about 4 parties in the Cwm all morning. Cracking day, glad I went.

In reply to chiz: Thinking about what might be left tomorrow, it did feel very warm in the valley at 2pm, but it was blasting cold up on the tops. The fat ice in Nameless may be left, but its only about a 15-20m pitch at about I/II, but good to get the axes out. Hidden Gully is a bit smashed up now, but a really good freeze would certainly help it. If the cloud stays and theres not a hard frost then I'd worry about finding something in proper nick. But there are patches of snow/neve and still a fair bit of graupel about on some aspects that could do with a quick melt and refreeze.

In reply to Rob Johnson:

Has some of this thread been cut?

Sorry to ask but i've read through it and posts seem to be a bit..

cheers.

In reply to chiz:
It's due to rain tonight at all levels before getting colder again later tomorrow.

In reply to Rob Johnson:

Really helpful info from Mike Peacock & Chiz, thanks fellas.
My objective for tomorrow (until my partner cancelled) was going to be Golden Girl Ali (IV 5) in Cwm Cneifion. A mixed climb up 'The Tower' to the left of Tower Gully, as I felt it may be a good choice due to its high altitude & mixed nature.
However now due to being partnerless & less than optimistic reports on the weather I think I might just stay home.
See what happens tomorrow & then plan the rest of the week from there.

In reply to Andy Mountains: I'd partner up with you, I fancy doing Golden Girl Ali, but I'd need a lift and I don't think you live near the Wirral do you?

Mike

In reply to Rob Johnson: Managed to get out very early yesterday morning and do Hidden Gully.A first winter lead for my partner Ian who did a grand job in some fairly thin conditions. Unconsolidated snow made going tough on the way up but conditions were better in the last half of the gully.Lots of ice around the cwm but I do question how long this will last given the slight rise in temps. Good luck to anyone out today.

Looking from Llanberis all the snow has gone as far as I can see below the clouds, thats up to about 800m.... i'm guessing its all gone.

In reply to smuffy:
Think I saw you on the top pitch -it wasn't that early! Well done to your mate on his first lead, hope he gets better conditions in future, it must be a really good route with ice over the chockstones. I was surprised how much snow there actually was up high given the view into the cwm from Idwal Cottage and how warm it was until I reached the rim of the cwm.

If Golden Girl Ali is on the side/in the area of the summer scramble Maybe Tower Rib then it probably would have been in on Saturday as MTR looked grey and rimed up and was getting a blasting so any turf should have been frozen, I did think about doing MTR but I don't remember the upper bit being very positive in the summer and I was on my own!

I hope some snow/ice can hang on in there until the temps drop again, apart from anything it needs some super-cold water in the ground to allow it all to freeze up faster next time. And all that graupel is useless unless it melts and refreezes.

In reply to Darren09:


yes a lot of posts been removed.

In reply to Mike Peacock:

Mike it was good to talk to you yesterday after we had done Hidden Gully. I've often seen your posts on here for which I'm very grateful and good to put a face to a name although the balaclava hid most of it. Cheers.

In reply to chiz: Hi Chiz,I was going to post about conditions in the Cwm, but you have covered it well.It needs another couple of weeks of sub freezing before anything will be in. I met you up there, you pointed me and my mate towards that bit of ice in Nameless gully,cheers, at least we managed to have a little play, then we met again as you topped out of Hidden Gully. Good to have chatted.

In reply to Rob Johnson:

Got out with my climbing club on Crib Goch / Crib y Ddysgl yesterday, thin conditions with about 2-3 inches of unconsolidated grauple type snow. The turf was firm but not frozen, not much ice forming. On the decsent we noticed that a lot of the snow we'd walked up through had melted away.
Some pics :[IMG]http://i42.tinypic.com/xnax6w.jpg[/IMG]

In reply to chiz:


Tower Rib would make a good winter climb and would go in all conditions, Golden Girl Ali is on the sheltered side of the rib but Im sure that would also go in lean conditions as its predominantly a rock route.

In reply to Fiskavaig: yep, nice to meet you too, was surprised how quiet it was up there. I think it must have been Mike Peacock I chatted to at the top of Nameless.
Joss, do you know what name Maybe Tower Rib is known as in winter? Guessing its about III/IV in lean conditions at the top. I remember it being a bit sketchy in the wet with not a lot of positive holds for hooks. Golden Girl is the right hand-face of the buttress, beside the gully? It sticks out a bit so I guess hoars/rimes fairly quickly

In reply to smuffy: No worries, I was quite jealous of you getting something climbed!

I had a view to the Carneddau from the coast before. It looks like the thaw has been rather extensive on Carnedd Llewelyn and Dafydd, but you never get the full picture when looking from afar.

In reply to chiz: Nope, wasn't me. I didn't head up on to Glyder Fawr.

In reply to Mike Peacock: someone else then! What's left today? Puddles?

In reply to chiz:
The route was known as Maybe Tower Rib in the Ashton Scrambling guide (giving it G2/3) but this was superseded by the name Tower Rib in the last few Ogwen guides, which also upgraded them more realistically to Grade 3/Mod. We did it in the rain and were glad we'd packed a rope. In winter it would go at around 3 with tech moves of 4 through the crux, though like parts of Cneifion Arete Im sure youd climb it with your hands not axes- depending wether the slab was iced up. Its on the database with a winter grade:
http://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/c.php?i=211928
I put in on there a while ago with the mistake that its 'right of Tower gully' it is actually left of the gully so Ive just emailed the mod to correct it.

In reply to Fiskavaig:

It's unlikely to need a couple of weeks. If the temperatures drop and stay low routes come into to condition in a matter of days IME.

In reply to Joss: So Golden Girl Ali is just the right hand side of (Maybe)Tower Rib. Makes sense now, the addition of some (very good) harder scrambles as Mods in the new Ogwen guide confuses me sometimes, it all fits together better now you explain, I'd been thinking there must be another butress/tower.
Must do them both this winter...

In reply to chiz:
Thanks for the heads-up yesterday, Chiz.
Here's some photos of the conditions in Cwm Cneifion yesterday:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/25564038@N04/6493469241/in/photostream

In reply to Mike Peacock: The thaw has been aggressive today by the looks of it.

On Saturday am, around 3 am, there was a lot more snow on Carnedd Llewelyn than the Glyders. Much more old hard neve than I thought there would be.

The NE/E slopes seem to be much more covered so that high Cwm to the NE of the summit may be worth a look..fynnon llyfant, but not sure how much survived.. hard to see into that..

In reply to Grommetgrabber:

what a lovely view you had

In reply to Mike Peacock:
Hi Mike,
we didn't climb on Clogwyn Du - the freeze was very patchy, some neve, some very loose graupel and the turf was unfrozen. Decided that even Hidden Gulley wasn't in. Tower slabs had thin, delicate layer of ice. Rock just had a frost covering rather than rime. All stream lines were unfrozen. Only bit that was vaguely climable was 20ft of grade I/II'ish ice at the top of Nameless Gully. Felt too warm (except when in the wind!).
Hope this helps. Looks like its warmed up since then as well
In reply to Dr Strangelove: Ha! Must remember to lead to improve the view

In reply to Grommetgrabber:

Went up Snowdon yesterday via y Aran, frozen at about 700, 750 ish and bloody windy.

Met 3 chaps all kitted up who had just come off something but they couldn't remember what it was but they did remark that there was a few things in condition...................mmmmmm

In reply to Denni: That might have been us. Me and 2 mates went up clogwyn y person arete via a gully ish line to the west of the parsons nose. I was quite suprised how solid alot of the snow felt with ice in some spots and pretty well frozen turf too. Was in the pass this morning and last nights rain seems to have stripped alot of the snow off, there was very little left compared to yesterday.

In reply to Andy_B39: Was the same over the other side of the Glyders. Pitched the tent surrounded by snow Saturday night and awoke this morning to find the snowline had retreated a couple of hundred metres up the cwm.

In reply to Andy_B39:
Hi mate,
It may have been and in hindsight on my previous post, probably a silly comment with the mmm's so apologies but having had a peek around, looked pretty bare.
Green RAB top of some description?

In reply to Denni: Aye that probably was me.

Sat - Crib Lem, increasingly wintry with height, took crampons and ice axes but didn't used them. Walked along the top of the Ladders, looked quite wintry. Good neve / ice on the summit plateau.

Sun - Crib Goch, hardly any snow left but a good bimble as hardly any wind.

In reply to Rob Johnson: There was a fresh dusting of snow this morning on the Carneddau. Driving back through Ogwen at 4pm Col Gully (Cwm Lloer) looked almost complete, but it was hard to tell through the murk and torrential rain!

In reply to Mike Peacock:

Apologies for not reporting back on Friday evening as promised - I couldn't wrest anyone's technology off them (drink in one hand, smartphone in the other!) to check back in...

Anyway - I think all of the above about covers it, and vindicates our group's decision to not attempt a climb and just go for a snowy wander (was with Denni's lot and spoke to the chaps who'd done Clogwyn-y-Person).

Must say that the turf was only superficially frozen even above about 950m on exposed faces (to about an inch depth - about the only time I used the walking axe).

One thing to note is the fact that, on Friday and Saturday, the snow line was conspicuously lower just a mile further inland from the sea... I guess it's still relatively 'mild' at this time of year.

PP.

In reply to PontiusPirate:
>

A similar observation today. First thing this morning there was a dusting of fresh snow quite low on Arenig Fawr and Carnedd y Filiast (the Arenig one), yet this seemed to be lying higher up on the Carneddau.

I have been out today working. We headed into the mountains with an open mind and enough kit to cope with winter conditions if we found them as it all looked a bit bare from the road. Idwal stream is frozen but obviously not thick enough for climbing yet and ice is starting to form on the crags up high in the Devils Kitchen. We made our way up into Cwm Cneifion, making good time as the lack of snow combined with the frozen ground makes for quick easy progress. As we made our way up the Cwm we came across some impressive ice formations where a small waterfall had been blowing back upwards and freezing as it hit the ground, I had never seen ice like it before - very cool! The snow started in patches below Clogwyn Du and we enjoyed cramponing up some firm neve and into the base of Hidden Gully (I/II). We climbed this which gave some good sport and made our way to the top of Easy Gully (I) which we descended and then re-climbed just for fun! We then made our way down the Gribin Ridge to give a bit of scrambling fun in descent.
I have put photos on my blog: http://www.expeditionguide.com/blog.htm

We have had a reasonable covering of snow overnight down to about 600m and today I have been working in Cwm Lloer on Pen Yr Ole Wen to make the most of it. There is still quite a lot of hard neve in the main gully lines and with ankle deep fresh snow on top it made for good fun. We climbed the Headwall (1) and descended it again via a different line after visiting the summit. The Cwm was nicely sheltered from the wind and gave a nice mix of ground to play on. A cracking day in the snow with more forecast tonight.
Photos are here: http://www.expeditionguide.com/blog.htm

Another friend of mine went up Parsley Fern Gully today which also had some good neve in it, underneath the new stuff. There is quite a bit more snow forecast though so the ridges might be a better bet for the weekend.

In reply to Rob Johnson: I don't suppose you noticed if an ice has formed on the lower section of Broad Gully??

In reply to airbournegrapefruit: I did have a look but couldn't see any ice. Broad gully looked a bit bare to me. It was quite warm today too compared to yesterday so any existing ice in the back of the Cwm was dripping.

Fingers crossed for Monday/Tuesday!!

In reply to Rob Johnson: It's snowed down to the coast today, with a small amount sticking to the roof tops in Bangor.

In reply to Rob Johnson: Has there been any significant snowfall overnight and what are the prospects for next week looking like? Thanks,Martin.

In reply to Rob Johnson: Sat in an ogwen lay-by, hail coming down and pretty windy.
A dusting of White stuff low down, heading up to cwm lloer to see if it's a bit sheltered up there.

In reply to deepstar:

The Ogwen webcams are all working at the moment and giving reasonable views of Y Garn, Tryfan and the track up to Oggie base at road level. Updates are every half hour, unless the weather knocks out the internet connection.
http://www.ogwen-rescue.org.uk/oggi_cam/index.php

In reply to jezb1: Have a crack at North Arete in Cwm Lloer (it's a summer Diff), goes at III/IV in the new Winter Guide. Think I may have done the first winter ascent as I climbed it a good couple of years earlier than the first ascent listed in the guide (Andy Cave + a.n.other). Good route anyway, short first chimney pitch is a fun thrutch.
I'm hoping things are in good nick the week after Christmas as I'm hoping to get up to North Wales then.

In reply to deepstar:
theres a major thaw due monday/tuesday

In reply to rockcatch:

Mate, get someone to scramble onto the roof and wipe the snow off the top cam would you? Ta!

In reply to Rob Johnson: Anybody know what the conditions are like on the Trinity Face at present?

In reply to shingsowa: It looks thin, I didn't go high, just ran from PyP to Britannia mines and back this morning and there didn't look to be much there. More was falling as I finished the run.. snow level was around the Pass height.

In reply to yetimatt:

Looking at the web cams for Idwal there may wel be more snow in Wigan this morning

In reply to Rob Johnson: I will be heading down there tomorrow morning to have a look and try and get something done. I will report back with photos etc.

In reply to kevin stephens:

There's certainly more snow on the Clywdian range. Bloody irritating. Hopefully it's heading West

In reply to JBlackout: white over and still coming in cheshire

In reply to Rob Johnson: Went up to Cwm Lloer with an open mind. Met a very helpful UKCer who kindly helped me and my mate ID the routes.

So much loose, unconsolidated snow and turf wasn't frozen. Had a quick play partway up Broad Gully but thought better of it.

Everything is nice and white but not really "in".

In reply to Rob Johnson: Was on the Gribin yesterday and went up Daffydd today, theres a reasonable covering of snow and the groud was nicely frozen today on Carnedd Daffydd from around 800m up

I have put together a summary of the conditions and some ideas for the types of routes to look at this weekend here: http://www.expeditionguide.com/blog.htm

In reply to Rob Johnson:

I'm sure that first picture isn't idwal stream.... South Gully, methinks

In reply to ruaidh:
Erm... that's what it says?

Out on Tryfan and Glyder Fach today, some older snow about but a fair amount of fresh stuff on top. Everything seems quite loose and powdery, with accumulations especially on easterly aspects, and it seems to be getting a bit slabby on top. Didn't really have a look anywhere else but definately felt like a day to stick to the ridges, and seems to be looking much the same for tomorrow as the met office are forecasting more fresh stuff overnight and for it to stay windy. Be careful out there.

In reply to Rob Johnson: A few pics of Cwm Lloer on friday

http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10150466782359655.382547.645274896...

In reply to Rob Johnson:
was out in Cwm Lloer today; nothing frozen underneath the snow and gullies full of knee and thigh deep snow. was still fun to get out and about though and just pootled up broad gully. snow getting a little harder as you gain height but freezing level continuing to rise...

In reply to Dom Whillans: yes was in broad gully friday, turf not frozen, loose powder all over the place

In reply to Rob Johnson: Was out today and went into Cwm Cneifion to have a look at a couple of gullies lower down the Cwm. The snow was too powdery and full of hail. We went all the way up the Cwm to gain some height looking at a few routes on the way and found nothing in nick or anywhere near it. Eventually reaching Clogwyn du to find the viz was down to nothing and spindrift and hail was getting stupid so we opted for hidden gulley just to get out of the weather. The gulley was good fun but nothing is frozen and its just powder and lots of spindrift. There was a few guys on Cleft gulley I think and hats off to them as it looked dificult especially in the conditions. When we came down MRT guys got picked up by the RAF Rescue at Llyn Idwal and headed up to Y Garn area and seemed to be to something hope all is OK

In reply to andyd1970:

In reply to andyd1970:
Good to hear you got something done Andy. We were also heading toward Cwm Cneifion, but after seeing the low cloud up there we went for Bristly Ridge instead. When we got there the weather front really came in and the wind was blowing a real hoolie. We dropped back down into Bochlwyd and did one of the gullies on the east side of the gribin. Like you said- snow was too powdery really, completely unconsolidated and insulating the unfrozen turf beneath it. Shin deep though which is better than last week. Lets hope it doesnt get washed away and makes a solid foundation for things to come.
Video clip of conditions near the base of Bristly:
http://tinypic.com/player.php?v=2wf0r2x&s=5

In reply to Rob Johnson: I was up in cwm cneifion today, went to have a look at Golden Girl Ali which was in conditiond but was put off by the wind/spindrift so ended up doing bith tower gully and tower slabs. Both gave good sport but there'a a lot of unconsolidated power and graupel about, made things a bit interesting in places!

There has been a lot of fresh snow over the last 24 hours. Tragically yesterday a male walker fell approx 500ft down Banana Gully on Y Garn when a cornice collapsed. In his fall the gully avalanched. (Details of the incident are here:http://www.ogwen-rescue.org.uk/incidents/incidents.php ) Be careful folks.

In reply to Rob Johnson: Been upto Cwm Lloer today. Lot's of unconsolidated snow as expected.

We went to look at North Arete. We had made a few moves on the start but it was a mile off being in condition. Turf wasn't remotely frozen. Could have climbed it but would have kidding ourselves imo.

Quite warm up there, what little ice has formed was dripping.

In reply to jezb1: It's a good line when in nick though. We followed the chimney to the left of the foot of the arete to start (as for the summer route) there was some in situ tat at the top of the initial chimney then. Not sure if that is the line suggested in the new Winter guide, not got it with me, but think it suggests starting at the foot of the arete itself, shame as the chimney thrutch is one of the highlights!

In reply to The Ivanator: We wanted to start at the chimney and saw the tat at the top.

Looks a good route so will get it done when the conditions are better.

In reply to Rob Johnson:
Was up in Cwm Cneifon today. We did Right hand pinnacle gully, conditions were ok, a fair bit of unconsolidated snow but by no means a powder fest, just what to expect from most gullies early season.
From Gribin ridge we dropped down the other side and climbed up the False Gribin ridge which was brilliant mixed climbing with frozen turf in many places. We stuck right to the crest and it went at about II with the odd III move if you wanted to.

In reply to tompilgrem: I think we may have followed you up RH Pinnacle Gully - we saw two people near the top about 11.00ish. Is it the one to the left of Cneifion Arete, with a narrow col at the top, and then a right turn up some mixed ground to the football pitch? If so, thanks for breaking trail -it was a lot easier following footsteps!

Richard

In reply to Rob Johnson: A short account a few photos of conditions on Saturday: http://www.matthewforshaw.com/2011/12/snowdonia-winter-mountaineering.html

One to follow shortly for today.

In reply to richard s:
Yes that sounds like us, we definately broke trail anyway!
From the Col we descended down and left though into another gully rather than heading up the mixed ground to the right, seemed more interesting. Hope you had a good day!

In reply to Rob Johnson:
Links to photos of Cwm Cneifion / Tower Gully/ Clogwyn Du / Seniors Ridge on Sunday 18th: http://www.flickr.com/photos/25564038@N04/6536908177/in/photostream - mixture of old consolidated snow covered with loose powder (including graupel) and ice.

If you were climbing Golden Girl Ali (off Tower Gully)I have some photos of you: http://www.flickr.com/photos/25564038@N04/6536908761/in/photostream (mail me if you would like some higher resolution photos)

If you were climbing on Clogwyn Du on Sunday(several teams including those on Travesty, El Mancho and Pillar Chimney) I have a few photos of you taken from a distance: http://www.flickr.com/photos/25564038@N04/6536906899/in/photostream (mail me if you'd like higher res copies).
Well done everyone who got something done recently.
Condolences to the family of the man that died on Y Garn Saturday.
Stay safe

In reply to Grommetgrabber:

>

They've strayed onto the crux of Tower Rib in that picture. Golden Girl Ali climbs the corner-ledge system to the right of the climber.

In reply to Rob Johnson: A few photos and some words on the conditions on the trinity Face yesterday, improved from Saturdays. Not sure it will be worth much as I guess its all melting now...?

http://www.matthewforshaw.com/2011/12/trinity-face-solo.html

In reply to Rob Johnson: Any more updates? Webcams still show snow in Ogwen, bugger all on Snowdon.

In reply to JBlackout: That might be an aspect thing... They look at the western flanks of Snowdon which tend to be stripped a lot more due to Westerlies... whereas the Ogwen Cam looks West down Ogwen, into the NE faces..

A lot seemed to have gone from the flanks of Y Garn, viewed from llanberis, but being the SW flank you expect that to go quickest..

did one of the gullies on y garn, grade 2, snow was soft ,bit better at top. Enough snow in the higher gullies in ogwen but it needs a good freeze to consolidate it.

I have been out today in Cwm Cneifion and used the snow at the back of the bowl to refresh/teach some winter skills before climbing Easy Gully (1) to the summit plateau of the Glyderau. We roped up for the upper section as the mushy wet snow became hard and the turf frozen for the last 30 metres. We then descended Seniors Ridge (1) which added a bit of interest to the way off. It has generally been pretty warm but it was snowing above about 900m. I have pictures on my blog: http://www.expeditionguide.com/blog.htm
There is more snow about than this time last week but we could do with a good freeze and its not forecast unfortunately.

In reply to Rob Johnson:

I went out on Snowdon today. There was snow from just below where the Pyg and Miners tracks join. It was a bit more solid near the summit. I did meet someone who had climbed Central Trinity. He said it was OK but a bit thin in places.

A few photos are at http://www.flickr.com/rockcatch

In reply to rockcatch: Ut on Y Gribin yesterday (Tues 20th) good covering of snow from 650 but no real frozen turf to speak of. Very wind scoured on the tops and looking today, not surprisingly, massive thaw across most areas with only a few large snow patches in sheltered places. Temp is still pretty mild even now in The Pass and forecast looks poor.
;o(

Headed out early this morning down to Ogwen. When I pulled up in the car park at 6.30am it was 11 degrees which did not bode well. Really low cloud cover (from Ogwen cottage!) and drizzle. I headed up Y Gribin ridge with Holly the Collie, snow cover started from the 'football pitch' area but was wet & sporadic. I thought that higher up on the ridge the snow would be more consolidated but was wrong, snow was wet, turf was unfrozen & any ice whch had been forming was melting fast. Even on the Glyder Plateau the ground was saturated & very little snow.
Looks like winter has deserted us now here in N.Wales with no forecasts to suggest things will change anytime soon I'm afraid.

Pics on blog: http://andymountains.blogspot.com/

In reply to Andy Mountains: Andy. Glad to hear you have managed to get out and that you decided to carry on with your Blog. Let's hope the conditions decide to improve soon

In reply to Rob Johnson: I know it warmed up a lot this week, but has any of the white stuff fallen today?

In reply to carrot_boy (North East Wales MC):

Looked like a fair amount up high on the Glyderau this afternoon as it cleared. Not been up high though so I don't know if it's enough to be any use for anything.

In reply to tobykeep:

Is idwal stream in condition yet?

In reply to f4rter: are you a canoeist?

There is still some snow high up, particulary on NE faces. I had a wander up to Cwm Clyd, Y Garn as this is where the most snow cover appeared to be to have a look if any of the easy gullies (A,B or C) were vaguely anything like in condition (I was 99% sure they wouldn't be) I did go up A Gully which was the only one which had snow cover (albiet a thin strip!) from bottom to top, but snow conditions were mainly crappy. Better from around 800m or so, but not worth it really. No crampons were worn & I used one axe as a walking aid before anyone moans at me about turf damage!

Pic here http://andymountains.blogspot.com/

Merry Christmas everyone!

Got out up Seniors Ridge on Saturday, the pictures speak for themselves as far as conditions are concerned.

East wall gully of the slabs, leading onto Seniors's Ridge (click to magnify.)
http://i42.tinypic.com/291z76u.jpg

Higher up on Seniors's & Glyder Fawr summit, No ice in the kitchen yet
http://i43.tinypic.com/25k7lft.jpg

Video clip of Cwm Cneifion & Clogwyn Du
http://tinypic.com/player.php?v=6865h3&s=5

In reply to Rob Johnson:
Rain on the night of saturday to sunday and more rain and even more rain and higher temperatures made everything melt ... No snow to be seen from the pass except a bit on the back of the glyders and some patches (some = a tiny wee bit) on crib coch yesterday ...

Weather is shit and windy

In reply to Rob Johnson: Hi Rob - really helpful posts. Many thanks indeed and keep them coming, regards Charlie

In reply to Rob Johnson: looking fairly promising for the next week. fingers crossed

In reply to al123: Really...not at the forcasts I have seen!

In reply to al123: You are optimistic!!!!!! But hopefully in the medium term things will improve - after all, the conditions cant get much less wintry in north wales.

In reply to Anonymous: met office snowdonia says something about snow down to 300m for mon,tue and wed i think. hopeful but thats wales really no?

In reply to Rob Johnson:

Im off for a walk around snowdonia tomorrow but if anything is in condition ill put my winter boot's, crampons and axe in my bag.
Worth a shot or should I just stick to my walking boots?

In reply to Jones_88: Just pack your walking boots....

In reply to jezb1:
cheers

Anything new for Snowdon?

Looking at the weather for the end of the week, conditions are looking fine with maybe a bit of rain.

hows it been lately there?

whats been climbed?

In reply to SBMikeD:

If you mean what winter routes have been climbed, then none at all. There are no winter conditions in Snowdonia at present.

In reply to Rob Johnson: Left Llanberis yesterday after two weeks of crap weather and no climbing (just been up snowdon on new years eve) conditions are like october, crap wet and cold

In reply to sjarelkwint:
ye I knew there is no snow from checking out the weather cams etc. There looks like some fair weather coming in for next week so should get some rock climbing done at least

In reply to Rob Johnson:


Cornice alert on Parsley Fern!
Spotted this awesome amount of snow at the top of Parsley Fern gully yesterday!
Pic here: http://andymountains.blogspot.com/2012/01/cornice-alert-on-parsley-fern.htm...

In reply to Rob Johnson: ice? any climbable ice........no don't be stupid jim. don't even think about a trip at the end of the week, it wont be worth it...or will it?
So those that know, please tell me how stupid i am. ta

In reply to Andy Mountains:

Need to be careful up there Andy



Any ice in Idwal yet?

In reply to Rob Johnson: So there appears to be white stuff on the mountains.
http://www.ogwen-rescue.org.uk/oggi_cam/index.php

In reply to Mike Peacock:
There is. Cover down to about 600m. But its not so very cold and its landing on pretty wet ground. If it freezes...?

In reply to Andy Say: Oh, I'm not being optimistic for any kind of climbing conditions, but it's nice to see that Snowdonia is at least pretending it's winter!

In reply to Mike Peacock: Wahey does that mean the Devils Appendices are both in for this w/e!!!

Soooo....Is it going to be worth packing crampons and axes this weekend?

In reply to Mike Peacock: Nice to see the thread revived - well done!

In reply to Rob Johnson: Its good to keep it alive, because one day we may actually have Snowdonia Conditions!!

In reply to Winterbotty:

Currently snowing relatively hard (according to my radar) on the mountains: Will be heading up on Sat morning, conditions in/out you decide, either way always fun to be on the ridges when they are white, if Crib Goch etc is covered in snow it will seem fairly wintry to me!

In reply to Rob Johnson: The Ogwen cameras have gone on strike - hopefully because they're buried in fresh snow - hows it looking? Shall I set my alarm for tomorrow morning, or what?

In reply to bullandbladder:

http://www.5hort5.co.uk/webcams.html

In reply to smuffy: It looks much less white this morning, but it would be useful to have the OVMR cameras back - the Y Garn one is always useful.

In reply to Mike Peacock:

Unfortunately it appears our broadband has gone down as we cannot access any of the computers remotely at the moment. Hopefully it will start working again, but we are a long way from the exchange, meaning the connection is not very reliable.

In reply to Mike Peacock:

I don't think it was as cold as forecasted last night.. I ran over Faban, Gyrn and out to Moel Wnion last night. The summit of MW (just shy of 600m) had snow but there was plenty of unfrozen boggy ground, there was no icing evident at all really. The freezing level was meant to be lower than that.

In reply to Rob Johnson: Looking at the weather forecast things are looking quite promising nice n cold as far as weds quite a bit of snow forecast in mean time so I'm keeping mi fingers crossed for something nxt sat!

In reply to Rob Johnson: Has anyone been out today? I can't be much help, as I was out peak bagging in the Arenigs but at 600m the snow was firming up. Anyway, here are a few photos of the main ranges to show the snow level.

Snowdon:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mikepeacock/6777164863/in/photostream

Carneddau:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mikepeacock/6777165513/in/photostream

Carnedd Llewelyn
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mikepeacock/6777165789/in/photostream

In reply to Mike Peacock:

I was out on the Carneddau with Clwyd MC. The snow was good for the scenery, but was not hard enough to need axes and crampons. If the forecast snowfall arrives tomorrow and then we get a little freeze thaw it could be great though. Some photos from today are at http://www.flickr.com/rockcatch

Also, the OVMRO broadband seem to have started working again, so the webcams are back online.

In reply to rockcatch: I was in cwm idwal. No ice! Snow was wet n soft. Stick to the ridges

no ice or much of a winter wills but a warm brew at oggie base mate. lol see you friday

In reply to rhyd: Some hopefuls climbing near Gribin Ridge today. Clogwyn Du looking quite hoared up but doubt if the turf was fully frozzed.
Had a grand day myself, linking 5 scrambles from the road to Tryfan and Glyder Fach and finishing on Cnefion Arete. Some were quite challenging in the sometimes verglassed conditions and no spikes for the feet.
Pic loading up with wierd inverted rainbow - part of an incomplete circle presumably

In reply to Tim Sparrow:

Was out today walking, snow was frozen unconsolidated powder on the ridge above the Black Ladders and Pen yr Ole Wen. Spoke to a couple who had climbed Col Gully in Cwm Lloer. They said it was a real slog, wading up the snow, which is to be expected given conditions. Broad Gully was full of snow but will need a thaw/freeze cycle for it to be any good.

Also saw the strange inverted rainbow you saw, directly above us, that was weird.

In reply to Rob Johnson:

I see from the UKC winter logbook that Sinister Gully on Clogwyn y Ddysgl was climbed yesterday.
http://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/c.php?i=47794

In reply to Andy Mountains: yea, conditions weren't great though, poor snow, ice wasn't bonded to the rocks, and the turf wasn't frozen.

Maybe the right weather conditions would sort it out, but would be sticking to the ridges for now I think!

In reply to Joss: I saw a sundog above Arenig Fach:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mikepeacock/6781620015/in/photostream

Was what you saw similar, or something else?

In reply to Mike Peacock: Actually, I've just seen some photos from a friend who was in the Carneddau. They saw a sundog, but the 22 degree halo was also visible which will be the rainbow you describe.

In reply to Mike Peacock: Crib goch yesterday... Cwm Cneifion today.. Turf not fully frozen and no ice to speak of.. Plenty of snow though above 600m, and still falling

Was up on the Snowdon Massif today, there was lots of snow more was falling when we left, turf was not frozen however a chilly night might sort that out, snow was very powdery, ice on the paths however thats from people crushing snow under foot.....

In reply to Rob Johnson: Forecast for the next week seems to be saying really cold (Pretty much below freezing all week), but with hardly any precipitation. How will this effect conditions for next weekend if the forecast stays the same? Will it just be cold and no snow, or is there enough snow at the moment for things to come into condition with some freezing?

In reply to Mike Peacock:
This is what we saw on the Carneddau yesterday, after some google research its apparently a Circumzenithal Arc, there was a halo around the sun and this 'rainbow' was a mirror of the curve of the halo round the sun. stunning.
You can see the 22 degree halo faintly near my friends hand.

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7019/6781482303_7c88053ceb_b.jpg

Conditions:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7169/6781486797_2c0b4722dc_z.jpg
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7159/6781487615_3a669cf051_z.jpg
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7033/6781483827_0fd94ecaf7_z.jpg

Inverted rainbow info:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circumzenithal_arc

In reply to Joss: Check Baggys Blog...

In reply to Joss: THanks for that research Joss
Weird effect though, an upside down smile describes it perfectly. My photo is now up on my gallery. Will add the link later

In reply to Joss: Wow, that first photo is stunning.

In reply to Mike Nolan:

On y Garn today- lots of unconsolidated snow in the gullies - needs a thaw/freeze which is not on the cards this week.

Any one think we will be on for the weekend then ???? Forecast shows alot of cold temps and maybe some snow on fri/sat (met office mountain forecast)

Any ideas would be good to know

In reply to dgp:
Looks like possible thaw at the end of the week!
http://www.metoffice.gov.uk/loutdoor/mountainsafety/snowdonia/snowdonia_lat...

In reply to CurlyStevo: Forecast looks dodgy for the weekend but wondering what the conditions will be like now after 4 days at around zero or less. Does anyone know if there is any frozen water to climb? Any predictions for Thurs (before weather changes)?

In reply to DannyK:

Out tomorrow Wed for a look see. Yesterday I was surprised at unfrozen ground/turf conditions - guess the new snow fell on warmish ground and acted as an insulator. The cold easterlies should be bringing Idwal ice falls into condition over next few days

I have been joined for the day by regular client Andy who was able to wangle a last minute day off work to come and play in the snow. We parked at Pen Y Pass and headed up over Crib Goch. The snow is down to the car park and gets quite deep in the drifts higher up but has not consolidated and has no base to it at the moment. Ice is starting to form and it has been very cold all day with temperatures below freezing. Where the snow has been trampled it gives some nice conditions and there was a nice path making it way across Crib Goch to give a fine day out. The crags were nicely rimed up so there will be some mixed climbing to be had. The wind was a bitter Easterly and the clag unfortunately stayed in all day, nevertheless a cracking day out and nice to see a couple of snowmen out enjoying the weather! Photos are online here: http://www.expeditionguide.com/blog.htm

In reply to Rob Johnson:

I went for a quick bimble up Foel Grach from Cwm Eigiau today. Snow down to the car park, varying in depth from an inch where wind-scoured to a couple of feet in drifts. Snowshoes were useful, crampons not needed today. Bitter easterly wind meant some slab forming on leeward slopes.

Tomorrow could be good but don't expect perfect conditions...

In reply to shingsowa: Y Gribin and Lliwedd this eve.. Lots of powder (hard going)... Turf frozen from top of gribin up.. ice is fattening but not there yet..

In reply to wolf.leeb:

I've wandered over Crib Goch and onto Snowdon today.

http://www.tomripleyclimbing.blogspot.com/2012/01/crib-goch.html

In reply to Rob Johnson: Has anyone been out today? Any signs of the snowpack consolidating yet?

In reply to Migsy:
unconsolidated snow in the gullies - starting to firm up where there has been wind blow but no thaw/freeze - beatiful day today but very cold in brisk E wind. Couple of photos on Carneddau:- Mixed climbs should be good

http://www.flickr.com/photos/dgpsharedphotos/6802221513/in/photostream
http://www.flickr.com/photos/dgpsharedphotos/6802216047/in/photostream

In reply to dgp:

Git, the visual range yesterday was about 20ft...

In reply to shingsowa: Choose your day out carefully -thurs looks good !

In reply to Rob Johnson: I am down there tomorrow so I will report in.

Walked up Y Garn today,. Apart from the path up from the road to idwal(sheet ice), there wasn't anywhere hard enough to need crampons. About a foot deep drifting powder on the top.
And you could see for miles........

In reply to miami mike: Was there any ice forming in Idwal?

In reply to tompilgrem: I've seen photos from a friend who was in Idwal today. Looks like the ice is beginning to form. There was a party on the slabs climbing (presumably) White Hope.

In reply to Mike Peacock:

Craig y Rheadr in the Llanberis Pass was frozen today as was everything else but, think we need some thaw before conditions for ice will be good ! Forecast for Saturday is rain/showers, not sure how it will pan out for next week ?

In reply to mr mills:

Looks warm next week. Bad for climbing. but good for building! Yay!

Had a top day on Crib Goch today on Crazy Pinnacle Face. Snow doesn't seem to be consolidating much, I think the gullies would be grim.

In reply to Mike Peacock: coming down to Ogwen tomorrow thought of going on the Carnedds up through Cwm Lloer, has anyone any knowledge of routes in this Cwm ie Broad Gully etc

In reply to Mike Peacock: Serious? Did they have spike on then. Ive never seen white hope looking legit.

In reply to jimjimjim:

More like 'Hope' in the hope that it was 'White Hope'!

In reply to rodw:

In reply to rodw: There is snow in Broad Gully, has been there since the snow dumps over the weekend. I tool this pic of it on saturday, and there was more snowfall on Sunday;

[IMG]http://i41.tinypic.com/11i21cw.jpg[/IMG]

Dont expect neve, it will be loose, deep and grainy powder (and hard work to climb), it hasnt warmed up enough for it to consolidate during these last few days of very cold weather. If I was out Thursday/Friday Id be looking for a decent rocky route or ridge or Id be looking to see if any Ice was forming in the right places (If you dont know where that is Im not going to tell you!!)

In reply to Joss:

I've been out on Clogwyn Ddu today. Good climbing conditions for the non turf dependent routes. Give it a few days before climbing El Mancho or Blenderhead.

No ice worth climbing in the Kitchen.

http://www.tomripleyclimbing.blogspot.com/2012/02/clogwyn-ddu.html

HTH

In reply to Tom Ripley Mountain Guide:

On the snowdon side of things parslet fern Gully was 'swam up' yesterday with some ice steps noted & crazy pinnacle face was also climbed today in good condition.
Anyone one seen Trinity area at all?

In reply to jimjimjim:

Apparently they did, but this is second hand info.

Turf is frozen in Bangor this morning, and I'm off to Deaer Ddu on Siabod in an hour or so. Looks a fine day to be out.

In reply to tompilgrem: Not a climber, so wouldn't know if it's any good.

In reply to Rob Johnson: Would like to head out tomorrow, partner-less as things stand, where would i be best going to get some decent conditions? I imagine it'll be the usual suspects;

Crib goch,Trfyan N.ridge, bristly ridge etcetc?

Any info from anyone that was out and about today would be great!

Thanks.
C

I went up Y Garn this morning. There was no need for crampons on the NE ridge, although I did use them going down the Devil's Kitchen and around Idwal. There were fairly recent footprints heading up Banana Gully, and I saw a couple of people climbing the Ramp. Most of the ice looked a little thin, except on the path around Idwal.

Photos are at http://www.flickr.com/rockcatch

In reply to rockcatch: How did The Screen look?

In reply to Mike Nolan:

The Screen and The Curtain both looked quite poor.

In reply to rockcatch: Thanks a lot.

Does anybody have any suggestions for Saturday, around IV-V mixed?

Mike

Today Huw Gilbert and I headed up into Cwm Cneifion and climbed Golden Girl Ali (IV, 5). This is a "Baggy" route and turned out to be a cracker, well worth the stars in his guidebook. The main pitch was physical and interesting and gained whoops of delight from both of us, a mixed route that follows a line of corners and cracks through some off balance ground but still provides opportunities for good gear. After topping out we dropped down onto the main face of Glyder Fach and climbed another "Baggy" route, Lilas Chocolate Feast (III/IV, 4) which did not have much ice on and so felt at the top of the grade.

There were teams climbing Clogwyn Left Hand (which looked thin), and Cleft Gully on Clogwyn Du. On the way down we checked out Cwm Idwal and spoke to people who had climbed The Ramp and The Idwal Stream and reported climbable ice. Routes like the Screen and South Gully were still not quite there but are forming. We also met folk who had climbed Tower Gully & Hidden Gully in Cwm Cneifion and Arch Gully on Glyder Fach.

It was a stunning day, no wind, blue skies and temperatures well below freezing all day - fantastic.

In reply to Rob Johnson: I scrambled up Daear Ddu today. Stunning weather, and lots of snow, but there was no real need for axes or crampons. Photos here:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mikepeacock/sets/72157629145956121/detail/

Does anyone know if any of the obvious lines on the cliffs above Llyn y Foel have been climbed? The only routes in the guide are Lone Buttress and Embryo Gully, but there are a few other lines.

In reply to Rob Johnson:Hi Rob was that you, who kept laughing all the time on Golden girl Ali? It did make us chuckle, as you sounded as though you where having fun!

In reply to andyd1970: Yes that was us - a constant round of piss taking and giggling!

In reply to Rob Johnson:

Ive been out today & will post on blog later, but none of the Idwal routes looked 'in'. Idwal Stream had the most ice, but only 50% there.

In reply to Rob Johnson: Been up Moel Siabod tonight - still a bit powdery but starting to pack down - not that much changed since Monday http://sarzmountainrun.blogspot.com/2012/01/solo-night-run-up-snowy-mountai... - did a quick scoot up to Llyn Glaslyn last night - some ice forming but turf not frozen. Didnt need crampons at all and axe only needed on Y Garn on Monday as there were some scoured icy sections.

In reply to Rob Johnson: just wondering what people are thinking about tomoro I were hoping for something like central trinity or hidden gully but with what people are saying conditions arnt ideal n judging by the forecast there the possibility of not getting back out of valley cos there is a fair bit of snow forcast so I'm thinking do I wait for nxt wkend n hope for some freeze thaw n routes may b in better nick or with the rise in temp just gonna strip everything away any input would be much appreciated thank you

Cwm Cneifion & Idwal

I managed to get a free afternoon yesterday (Thurs) & was at Ogwen carpark for 1.30pm. My objective was to head up into Cwm Cneifion to have a look at Tower Slabs, Tower Gully & Hidden Gully, although I was aware that reports were saying that snow was still unconsolidated due to continued cold temps & no freese/thaw conditions. When I got into the lower cwm it was fairly apparent that the snow was not going to be in good condition in the higher gullies, & I suspected Tower Slabs would be very poor. So opting for Senior's Ridge instead I headed up in poor snow which was fairly hard going at times. Crampons were essential due to sections of ice, and one axe was sufficient. When high up on the ridge I could see across the cwm & although there is some ice on the lower section of Tower Slabs, it has not yet formed properly. I came back down via the Devil's Kitchen path which was very icy, and had a look at the Idwal ice routes. I am aware that there was a couple of ascents of The Ramp & Idwal Stream yesterday, but from what I saw these are still a fair way off being 'in' condition. The Screen looked at best 50% formed, as did The Ramp & South Gully. I would say that Idwal Stream looked closest to being 'in'. Bear in mind that this was on Thursday & ice should be building daily.
It was a beautiful day to be out, and I am just disappointed it is my only oppurtunity to do so until at least next week.
http://andymountains.blogspot.com/

In reply to Andy Mountains: Not much ice around yet.. none of the 'classics' in climeable condition yet so if you're heading out this weekend, please read the white guide first and remember that there is a lot of non-frozen turf under the snow.. You will cause damage if you climb on it..
Water ice in Seargents Gully if you feel the need but it's got a lot of wet sections too.

In reply to TheAndyBarker:
>

Good advice. No doubt there will be people there today and tomorrow whove climbed 'poor condition' routes regardless, trashing what could have been good foundations to some of the routes.

In reply to Rob Johnson: Managed to get out today, only plodded around the Glyders, up via seniors ridge due to poor snow. From what i observed, the ice in idwal (the screen,ramp,stream etc) are a while off being properly formed. Yes they're 'climbable' but as previously mentioned, this potentially could ruin the chances of it becoming properly formed!! It's not in good enough nick for masses to be climbing on it this weekend!! Also most of the gullies seem to be poor, unconsolidated snow, i heard this from parties heading up gullies all over Snowdonia this week. I'm hoping for a freeze/thaw to sort conditions out..

Has anyone managed to find anything in good nick? (apart from mixed lines) As i'm still trying to find something for tomorrow!

C

In reply to CragRat_Trad:
Went up to cwm cnefion today and did tower slabs. Didn't fancy the hollow looking icefall i was heading to so did a nice little mixed pitch to the left where the turf was well frozen, made a nice route.

In reply to CragRat_Trad: Looking at the forecast there won't be anything left after the weekend (freezing level over the tops for the foreseeable future) so if you can, go climb it before it melts. Some peoples not in is anothers in. Walked past several parties walking away from The Devils Kitchen last year in the middle of the freeze, saying it was not in - as far as we found after multiple ascents it was in and very fat. Agree take care with turf - if its not frozen, don't do it.

vimeo.com/36142453

In reply to Rob Johnson: we scampered aroynd idwal today for alook, ramp screen etc looked a bit shit and so we decided to trundle up the stream instead, it was a bit wet but we did manage to get a good bit of fun sticking to the steepest lines then scampering over the glyders and down bristly ridge, it was a gorgeous day out!

In reply to Rob Johnson: Did tower slabs, tower gully and golden girl Ali in cwm cnefion. The right hand line of tower slabs was brittle and not quite in so we opted for the easier lines in the middle, this took stubbie screws pretty well. Ice was slightly brittle but all in all decent enough. Tower slabs, snow had a hard crust to it but gave way under the larger members of our team. The ice step now resembles a rock step after the traffic, down climbed it after last route. Maybe 20 people went up this today.
Golden girl Ali, my first mixed route. Hard climbing, physical top crack. All in all a great route bomber gear and placements.

In reply to WILLS: was a fab day for sure! Did a run up over the Glyders and saw quite a few parties out in Cwm Idwal - was fantastic running from Glyder Fach to Glyder Fawr (usually a rock hop but nicely covered by fairly packed snow). Pretty crap run off down to Pen Y pass on the red dot however - snow too powdery so leg-breaking terrain in the boulders - also few patches of sheet ice that I came across a bit too quickly!

Pics on the blog: http://sarzmountainrun.blogspot.com/2012/02/best-day-of-year-so-far.html

Pretty grim today - drizzle in Nant peris right now and looked like there had been a bit of a thaw on tops from view earlier this morning.

In reply to Rob Johnson:
Was out in Cwm Glas/Cyrn Las last night. Met various locals on their way down who reported that Sergeant's Gully was in quite good condition, as were the Parsley Ferns, tho' with some powder in. We headed for Face Route which was in great condition, great ice & frozen turf. Not a breath of wind and great moonlight when the clouds cleared. On the descent it tried to snow a little. The snow on this side of the Cyrn Las ridge was a lot better, less dry, really good neve in places. It would be a great (II) route at the mo'. It only started drizzling in 'Beris at 10.30am.

We had intentions of climbing all through last night but by about 2.00am the temperature had increased significantly. The ice was melting rapidly with alot of water on the surfaces of the Screen Ramp etc. Ice breaking away too. Not sure of conditions on Clgwyn du but no nieve on snow and sorry to say conditions looking grim for the weekend.

In reply to Rob Johnson:

Looking at Baggy's blog, looks like a lot of climbers have been making the most of the recent conditions

http://wwwbaggy.blogspot.com/

In reply to playmobile:

Did North Ridge of Tryfan early this morning, weather began to close in when on the summit 10am, good mix of everything on the ridge, some mixed sections, some powder, some slightly harder stuff which would hold the axe. Got pretty windy on the summit, descending via heather terrace - looked like some decent ice forming in the gullies on the east face, hopefully the thaw won't be too bad, followed by a re-freeze, had a little play on the ice at the bottom of north gully, -kind of half there. Paths treacherousness low down on the mountains where they are following water courses. Raining heavily by midday by the A5

In reply to Rob Johnson: A few of us got out early to the northern side of Cadair Idris today. Conditions first thing were fantastic, ground fully frozen on all routes. As the day progressed things just went down hill, mmmmm sloppy wet run-out final pitch.

In reply to Rob Johnson: Photos from yesterday. Are you the lone belayer on top of clogwyn du late in the day?
http://www.flickr.com/photos/16641537@N02/?saved=1

Now this may seem like a stupid question, and I apologise when it is. I'm new to winter climbing, and hope to be able to get some in before the end of the season, when work allows.

Anyway, to my point, with the current weather, I'm sure many people are rushing off to Snowdonia, and Scotland too, but what's the travel like when conditions are 'in', so to speak? Are the roads round Snowdonia relatively well gritted, I suppose is what I'm wondering?

In reply to pjcusually: yes no probs getting there normally

In reply to Rob Johnson:

Hi

Having travelled to Snowdonia many many times in winter, it is quite rare to actually have any travel issues once your there . It tends only to happen after a decent dump of snow. I can only remember 2-3 days in the last 3-5 years when you could not access the main valleys. Gaining access to other areas may be an issue, say Cwm Silyn

One thing which is a problem is the National Park/NT do not clear the car parks. They still expect you to pay though. Mind you that is the National Parks problem, still stuck in the darks ages, have leaders at the top who are years behind and do not really know what is happening. Then their wardens mainly sit in the outposts. Very little education, no workshops, no local advice. I mean is there a decent weather station on top snowdon where walkers and climbers can access info for example.

I would not worry to much about getting around, often its getting to Snowdonia as the more inland you go the more the roads can be an issue

I

In reply to playmobile:
If there is a BIG dump of snow the main problem is not getting about, it is usually finding somewhere to park as the snow left by the ploughs can block access to the laybys. Take a shovel!

In reply to jasen:

Plenty out on Clogwyn Du yesterday. We did Hidden Gully and then the Right hand. Some soft snow which had been well ploughed by earlier teams, but some good axe placements too. Cloudy so visibility not great. When we dropped below cloud level there was a lot of snow that had been washed away. Heavy rain all the way back to the car park.

Somewhere between Cwm Cneifion and Ogwen cottage my blue Simond Naja ice axe slipped out of my borrowed rucksack. BOO!

In reply to Rob Johnson:

Did Crib Goch yesterday it was in good contition but wild, very windy and low vis we went along really slowly and steadily and had a great time.

In reply to Rob Johnson:

Anyone been out & climbed anything today? If so, whats it like out there?

In reply to Rob Johnson: Climbed Tower Gully the snows soft but the ice was good a nice little day out,Tower slabs looked good and fat and no one on it.We found the freezing level it was on the tops but still looking like winter in Cwm Cneifion,the low down ice routes looked very thin so will melt rapid but stuff high up may stay around for another freeze.

In reply to chiz: Or you need to find a bloke to give you a lift then share an epic day on Tryfan with...

How you doin old son... long time ..!

Went up to Cwm Cneifon on Saturday where things were still climbable but not great nic. Plenty of snow and bits of ice that will probably survive a short thaw. Did Bristley Ridge on Sunday which was pretty good higher up though snow was soft and sugary.

In reply to Rob Johnson: Anyone ventured out high up today to see what has survived? Temp has plummeted this eve in Llanberis Pass and currently crystal clear skies too. Wondering if after a thaw for yesterday and today the end of the week may see things come back in higher up?

In reply to Rob Johnson:

They will be in nick by tuesday

Had a wander up to Clogwyn Du this morning, it was melting rapidly and large chunks of ice were falling from all over the crag. Quickly gave up any ideas of climbing anything and walked up to the summit of Glyder fawr instead, where it was raining hard. Roll on winter 2013 !

In reply to TheAndyBarker:
>

Indeed! Not bad Andy, not bad. Off to Scotland for 9 days come Friday, can't wait. I was looking at those gullies we came down last winter, looked a long way down...

In reply to Rob Johnson:

Forget 2013, winter 2012 will be back on this tuesday, all you have to do is look at forecast

In reply to playmobile: Looking reasonable on the drive up Oggy from the coast this morning.. Cneifion and Ysgolion look as tho they have survived quite well.. Cooler this morning down low but I suspect slightly warmer up high.. Highest crags are a little frosty.. Good forecast..

In reply to Rob Johnson: is it likely tht the black ladders will be in with any ice?

In reply to Rob Johnson:

Some idea of conditions visit today

http://wwwbaggy.blogspot.com/

In reply to Rob Johnson:

I've set up a Twitter account called WelshWinter, tweet conditions or blog entries using the hashtag #welshwinter or @welshwinter and I will retweet.

Please follow this account and I'll keep it updated

Thanks
Dave

In reply to Rob Johnson:

I went up Hourglass Gully in Cwm Lloer yesterday, and D (Banana) Gully on Y Garn today. Both were in good condition with solid snow for cramponing up. It looks like the freezing level is going to rise tomorrow for a few days. Photos on http://www.flickr.com/rockcatch as usual.

In reply to Rob Johnson:

Up on snowdon today, lovely day but snow not as consolidated on Trinity face as i'd expected, we did Right-hand Trinity and it was getting softer the higher you went. All the turf underneath was well frozen though. (I think all the trinity gullies had ascents today).

+8c in the sun on the Pyg track but 0/-1c in the shade on the face.

In reply to Rob Johnson:

I have added some general pics, taken today, to my blog

http://wwwbaggy.blogspot.com/

In reply to torquil:
Some pics of Cwm cneifion today:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/dgpsharedphotos/6842429945/in/photostream
http://www.flickr.com/photos/dgpsharedphotos/6842424283/in/photostream/

Hard neve, plenty of ice, blue sky, no wind !!

In reply to dgp: We had an awesome day doing the winter traverse of the Snowdon Horse shoe today. On the hill at 07:30 snow well consolidated at this time on the eastern spur leading up to Crib Goch. Snow and ice well formed and consolidated on the ridge all the way to Crib Y Ddysgl.

Snow path well worn up to Snowdon Summit which we reached at 11:30ish. A mid day South East descent towards the col leading upto Y Lliwedd was resulting in slab movement of the top 3 - 4 inches of the snow pack. luckily it wasnt thick enough to avalanche. Y Lliwedd snow pack was breaking through at every footstep making the going very hard, but the turf was frozen. Good solid ice on the path down to about 530m on the descent path towards Cwm Dyli. 7 hours, not a breath of wind and 8c temperatures, an alpine day in Wales, who would have thought it...

In reply to christopher bate:

Been up on the Glyders today.

Plenty of ice and neve around, but the buttresses are black.

Photos on my blog: http://www.tomripleyclimbing.blogspot.com/2012/02/glyders.html

I did Left Hand Trinity today and conditions were not as good as I had expected. Mainly snow was a frozen top crust with soft underneath. There were patches of neve, but few & far between. Gorgeous day though.
Will post pics & more reports on blog later (or tomorrow morn)

In reply to Rob Johnson: Cwm Cneifion this afternoon. Tower Slabs were nice on the first pitch, great chewy ice. Then good neve until about two thirds the way up, then crust ontop sugary snow. Dropped down Easy gully which is stepped but solid. Up Hidden Gully, good snow, stepped, but good fun. Left Hand looked like it might go but a team did back off it. Ice in the Kitchen but nothing looked climbable. Beautiful, still, sunny day.

In reply to carld:

Hi were you the guy we met at the top? Cheers for the recommendation on Tower slabs. we did the variation that looked like an easy stepped gully and turned out to be almost 30m of fantastic steep ice. Very hard so was tough but good.

We did back of Left hand but were sandbagged on it. Our guidebook said IV and some guys told us it was the fattest they had ever seen it and it was an easy IV but it was quite obviously harder! I reckon it would go for anyone climbing V though, the ice seemed pretty solid.

Was a fantastio day though and probably worth taking a look tomorrow if anyone is planning on heading out.

In reply to dsh:

Well the steep bit was probably only around 15m but it felt good

In reply to Rob Johnson: Nipped up Parsley Fern Gully yesterday. Good neve most of the way up and not too stepped but had a lot of traffic behind us. Ice toward Sinister Gully looked good & more was forming as we descended.

Temp stayed close or below 0 most of the day in the Cwm but super warm on the summits and ridges.

Overcast today & a bit warmer in the pass.

In reply to Rob Johnson: Tower Gully was in good condition yesterday, Wed. I agree about the Alpine atmosphere in Cwm Cneifion, it really felt quite special. Rotten ice in the Kitchen area though.

In reply to Rob Johnson:

Some info on Trinity Face & Cwm Cneifion now on blog: http://andymountains.blogspot.com/2012/02/trinity-face-cwm-cneifion-report....

In reply to Rob Johnson:
We did Main Gully on Glyder Fach with the left hand mixed start yesterday, turf all solid good ice weeps on the mixed bit and fine neve once we rejoined the gully. the snow got a bit sugary with a crust once we got to the big ampitheatre near the top.

I can only agree with the alpine feel up high, we hardly saw a soul and came down in the dark with a wonderfully clear sky overhead.

All in all, fine conditions for easier grade stuff so get there before it all melts!

In reply to Rob Johnson:

Don't forget if you're on Twitter to hashtag #welshwinter @welshwinter with condition reports an blogs.

Dave

In reply to Rob Johnson:

Mike P and I went up to the Cwm Cneifion today. Bright start but clag quickly came in by 9pm and light drizzle. Reasonably sheltered in the corrie but v poor visibility and somehow we "lost sight" of the 400ft crag of Clogwyn Ddu (complete contast to yesterdays pics). Shame as we were hoping to do Right Hand Direct. Made up for it by doing Tower Slabs and the main pitch was brill with v hard ice (prob gd 111 at top). After that thaw started to settle in and next 3 pitches were on soft snow. Drizzling q hard on way down Y Gribin, and yet on reaching Bucks/Aylesbury on way back it was snowing hard. Weird weather sometimes!

In reply to Rob Johnson: Is anything still going to be in tomorrow if the weather allows me to get out?

Reports from today would be awesome!

In reply to CragRat_Trad:

Hi mate, was going to text you re tomorrow, but have decided to scrap that idea due to forecast & current conditions.
Long range forecasts suggest second half of next week may be good though.

In reply to Rob Johnson: Hi Andy,

That's a shame, seems i'll be scrapping plans for tomorrow as well. Drop us a text regarding next week? Free thurs/friday to get out, even if it's just a scramble or something.

C

some photos of Cwm Lloer yesterday
http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.296377593757164.70217.100001547780...

In reply to CragRat_Trad: was up Y garn on the Glyderau and it was very bare with only patches of wet snow on the summit slopes. it was rather chilly though!

In reply to higherclimbingwales:Thanks, think i'll swerve tomorrow and head out for some fitness instead!

In reply to Rob Johnson: I was out today for an easy bimble up Y Gribin. Met one bloke who'd done Tower Gully and said it wasn't in particularly good condition, but I did speak to two teams who'd been on Tower Slabs and reckoned the ice was still good.

In reply to dsh:

No it really was at least 30-40metres of solid ice because I remember you shouting that I had gone halfway through the 60m rope when I was getting towards the top section of the hard ice.

However, lower down you could deviate off the ice onto softer snow by heading leftwards, and higher up you could do it by heading rightwards if you wanted to do less.

PS I need a new user name because I am 37 now...

In reply to carld:

We only backed off it because we are crap ice climbers and it looks scary to us! - it looked like it was in excellent condition and would make a great day for people who are happy getting over a 30m section of steep grd5-ish ice.

I reckoned I could handle the first and third pitches ok, but the middle crux looked a bit ambitious for me - maybe next time!

In reply to Rob Johnson: any other reports from today?

In reply to al123: went up the Rhyd Ddu path today but turned back just below the last gate before Bwlch Main as there was a lovely coating of rime ice on everything above 650m and we stupidly didn't pack crampons.
Apart from that it was a pleasant day.