Mur y Niwl*** VS 4c
[John (Jud) Jordan on Mur y Niwl, 2 kb]Another stunning classic with sustained difficulties and breath-taking exposure at the grade. Care is needed to protect the 2nd adequately on the devious and highly exposed crux pitch 1) 4b, 12m. Climb up to the left side of the large grassy ledge. Walk along the ledge and belay beneath the flakes and corner 2) 5a, 32m. Climb the wall above the belay to gain the base of the large corner system. Hand traverse rightwards along the highest of two parallel ledges to gain a tough step-down. Follow an easing diagonal line rightwards to an awkward semi-hanging belay stance 3) 4c, 18m. Drop down rightwards from the stance and head right again under the roof to reach a ledge. Climb up and left, past an arete, to gain a grassy stance 4) 4c, 22m. Climb the groove above to gain the short cracked wall. Climb the crack. © ROCKFAX

Ticklists: The 100 Best UK VS routes?, Classic Rock Climbs of Great Britain by Bill Birkett, North Wales Rock Graded List, North Wales 100 Classic Climbs, ROCKFAX - Top 50 North Wales Climbs.

Photo: John (Jud) Jordan on Mur y Niwl © boje
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PUBLIC LOGBOOKS
This climb is in 204 logbooks, and on 95 wishlists.

I led crux traverse pitch. Gear behind not completely solid block, hand traverse confidently with nothing to speak of for feet - great route but glad VS isn't my max grade! Failed to find correct top pitch, did a HVS 4c version!
Lessworkmoreclimbing - AltLd - 13/Sep/14 with Kev

msoldn - AltLd O/S - 13/Sep/14 with Sam (tree surgent)

Led P2 & 4. Good gear is surprisingly rare on this route with many cracks being flared or hourglass shaped, and many spikes being loose. The true traverse line may be below the obvious top crack on P1. This lower line is on flat edges and doesn't have much gear, but it seems to have more footholds. I took the upper line and faffed for ages getting in the right size of cam before an awkward step 2/3 the way across.
Pete_Frost - AltLd O/S - 12/Sep/14 with Kin Choi

Hidden - AltLd - 05/Sep/14

Superb route we had to ab of the end of pitch 2 as it was getting late and we never had are head torches.
Ray Sparks - Lead - 16/Aug/14 with pero

Pero - 2nd - 16/Aug/14

Hidden - AltLd O/S - 09/Aug/14

Great, involving climb. Every pitch is interesting. I agree with North Wales Rock over grading
fizzychewitt - AltLd - 09/Aug/14 with Jayne

will moy - Lead O/S - 07/Aug/14

Hidden - AltLd - 26/Jul/14

Hidden - AltLd - 26/Jul/14

Matthew Robinson - AltLd - 20/Jul/14 with Rhys

Fantastic outing, even moreso when combined with pinnacle wall. Burly, intimidating and exposed, neither leader gets off lightly!
poeter210 - AltLd O/S - 11/Jul/14 with adrian voss

Led boulder style P1 and P3. P3 with short, exposed ascending hand traverse.
druss - AltLd O/S - 11/Jul/14 with Peter Ocampo

Superb VS... http://youtu.be/NwalmABk4xQ
caradoc - AltLd - 21/Jun/14 with Matt H.

Hidden - 15/Jun/14

Col Kingshott - AltLd O/S - 14/Jun/14

Rob Evans - AltLd O/S - Jun/14

Led P2 and 4. Traverse on P2 not as bad as all that (helps to be tall probably).
cathymiller - AltLd O/S - 31/May/14 with Mike Peak

Hidden - 2014

IanGilbertJones - 2014

Si - 2014

rbharries - 2014 with mat

guy757 - 24/Sep/13

switch - AltLd O/S - 20/Jul/13 with Kevin

Hidden - AltLd O/S - 20/Jul/13

Led P2 via high hand traverse, fun
TimKnight - AltLd O/S - 20/Jul/13 with Dave Marshall

HVS 5a in ground up, which seems more appropriate to me - it didnt occur to either of us that this was a soft touch. First pitch is not 4b - Ground Up 4c grading seemed much more appropriate.Ground Up and Rockfax grading of traverse pitch seems correct at 5a(rather than 4c)with spaced protection for the crux moves, though might well feel easier than that for the tall. all of the pitches great quality, big exposure on the two traverse sections. continued up pinnacle wall (listed as one continuous link up route in Ground Up at hvs 5a) me p2,4,6, Megan p1,3,5
pebbles - AltLd O/S - 14/Jul/13 with megan beaumont

Led P1 and P3. The first move on P1 was basically the crux. P3's finger traverse was a lot easier than trying to avoid rope drag: watch out for the rope-grabbing crack as you exit the roof!
useful - AltLd O/S - 13/Jul/13 with Steve E

lead 3rd pitch
pimpy - AltLd - 13/Jul/13 with clare muir

Led P1, P2 and P4. Highlight of the day, watching Alan go into scamper mode on the P2 traverse.
Jim Slater - AltLd O/S - 07/Jul/13 with James (Buxton MC), Alan

P2+4. Well worth the walk in. Sustained and exposed - brilliant!
stemill - AltLd - 06/Jul/13 with Chris Manasseh

Led 1+3
Chris Manasseh - AltLd - 06/Jul/13 with Ste Millington

Quite a testing route for the grade. P 1 is bold and serious and harder than guidebook suggests. P 2 traverse is really hard too and quite serious. Good route though, especially when finished via Pinnacle Wall. P 2 made harder as the hand traverse was liberally sprinkled with dry soil like ball bearings.
Rog Wilko - AltLd - 06/Jul/13 with Graham Phillips

Soil on hand traverse and lack of gear made it seem more like HVS
egg-man - AltLd O/S - 06/Jul/13 with Rog Wilko

Hidden - AltLd dnf - 30/Jun/13

Hidden - AltLd - 04/Jun/13

P2, P4 (possibly wrong groove - didn't go up the slab, quite tough!) We arrived another party had just started so we did Amphitheatre Buttress. Then abbed in from the large spike on the right (looking down by the holes in ground) 59m to the gully bed (past tat at 45m)
lithos - AltLd - 01/Jun/13 with Pete Bradshaw

Ows - AltLd - Jun/13

Hidden - Lead O/S - 31/May/13

I led pitch one. Wasn't sure quite how far left to start up, so started about 3m left of main ledge, and after initial climb up to ledge, traverse over is a bit scary with little protection. Pitch two is straight-forward, if you don't try and traverse high up by standing on the obvious ledge! Not fun with a large ruck-sac on! Led pitch three, and pumped out a bit trying to get some protection in before the step across, and ended up struggling a bit to establish myself on the ledge in the traverse.
kim.mulji - AltLd O/S - 25/May/13 with Patrick Goodwin

Led P1 & 4. Excellent route, but rather cold after we lost the sun on P2. Nobody else on the route, but watched a steady stream going up Amphitheatre Buttress.
Monkey_Alan - AltLd O/S - 05/May/13 with Lawrence Dudley, Julian Prieto

Led P3
Julian Prieto - AltLd O/S - 05/May/13 with Lawrence Dudley, Alan Blanchflower

Lawrence Dudley - AltLd - 05/May/13 with Julian Prieto, Alan Blanchflower

cballard - 2013

Hidden - 2013

Hidden - AltLd O/S - 13/Sep/12

Led P1+2 then P4. Finnsihed up pinical wall. Thought it was solid VS not HVS as in our guide, but Prav thought P3 was hard for the grade. One move wonder but difficult for VS.
jayrenegade - AltLd O/S - 08/Sep/12 with Prav

Did high level hand traverse on P2, seemed logical with good pro (poss 5a). The whole route is solid and hard going, loved P3 dangle then up to ledge!. Lead all pitches, with rucksack then finished up P'wall.
Jams Crwca - Lead O/S - 21/Jul/12 with themadbrown

My longest climbing day so far and a superb one. Thank god for the 'rock god' that is my climbing partner who hauled me up all but one? of the pitches! Climbed 6 pitches instead of the 4 in the guide book-the hefty hand traverse using the crack on the2/3 pitch was going well until a foot slip which actually landed me onthe right endofthe original pitch-handy! Def the most challenging climb ive done to date with great exposure and views over adjacent Ampitheatre ,which looked tiny!
themadbrown - 2nd O/S - 21/Jul/12 with james

Hidden - AltLd - 20/Jun/12

alan moore - 2012

alan moore - 2012

captain dringo - 2012

Hidden - 2012

Hidden - 2012

Hidden - 2012

Stone Idol - 2012

Great route! Led pitch 3 and part of 4. Start of 3 with 'exposure snapping at heels' very exciting!
mes32 - AltLd O/S - 01/Oct/11

chrisallan - AltLd O/S - 01/Oct/11

Third time for me but first for Steve. I have always hand traversed the higher diagonal line and directed Steve to do the same. Onlookers correctly pointed out that this is not how the route is described in the guidebook but Steve completed the diagonal line anyway. This probably increases the overall route grade to HVS.
Falko - 2nd O/S - 30/Sep/11 with Steve M

MoWalker3 - 30/Sep/11 with Cormac

Hidden - AltLd - Sep/11

Hidden - AltLd - 23/Aug/11

Enjoyed pitch 2, then it all went wrong - resorted to prussiks for the hard move onto the block/ledge on P3.
Becky E - 2nd dog - 30/Jul/11 with Graeme Hammond

excellent, wanted to this for ages, did in 3 pitches
Graeme Hammond - Lead O/S - 30/Jul/11 with Becky E

Exposed, committing and truly, truly excellent. Lead Pitches 1 and 3, Diccon led 2 and 4, then I led pitches 1 and 3 of Pinnacle wall to finish while Diccon did the scary walk along the sloping ledge (far more bravely than I seconded it!)
teflonpete - AltLd O/S - 24/Jul/11 with Diccon

Graham Westbrook - AltLd O/S - 23/Jul/11

Just beaten to the start by another party, which was a bit frustrating. The Amphitheatre has a fantastic mini-Alpine ambience.
Rob Exile Ward - Lead - 09/Jul/11 with Sam Ward

Hidden - 2nd - 09/Jul/11

Hidden - Lead O/S - 09/Jul/11

Hidden - AltLd O/S - 02/Jul/11

myoung - AltLd O/S - 28/Jun/11

Roger Cruse - AltLd O/S - 28/Jun/11 with Mark

scorky345 - AltLd - 24/May/11 with Tim Oates

tim20 - AltLd - 24/May/11 with sam corcoran

Hidden - AltLd - 30/Apr/11

Lenny - AltLd O/S - 25/Apr/11 with John

Hidden - AltLd O/S - 25/Apr/11

Hidden - AltLd O/S - 24/Apr/11

Hidden - AltLd - 24/Apr/11

Hidden - AltLd O/S - 22/Apr/11

John Postlethwaite - AltLd O/S - 22/Apr/11 with liam

Cool climb. Rained half way.
Adam Booth - AltLd O/S - 22/Apr/11 with Tom Jumar

Led first pitch to open groove. Then alternating pitches after that.
Will Hunt - AltLd O/S - 09/Apr/11 with Dan Matthewman

jshields - Lead - 09/Apr/11 with Ed James

Hidden - AltLd O/S - 09/Apr/11

Hidden - AltLd O/S - 03/Mar/11

Hidden - AltLd O/S - 03/Mar/11

Hidden - 2011

pasbury - 2011

Steve Woollard - AltLd - 04/Sep/10 with Bob Dawson

tedburt - AltLd O/S - 03/Jul/10 with Aaron Burdett

Hidden - AltLd - 03/Jul/10

monika paprzycka - 2nd - 03/Jul/10 with Matt, Jeremy Axford

Hidden - AltLd O/S - 27/Jun/10

Ed Griffin - 2nd O/S - 26/Jun/10 with Alaric

Led all the pitches this time around. Pitch 2 seemed quite straight forward this time.
Alaric - Lead rpt - 26/Jun/10 with Ed

Hidden - AltLd - 25/Jun/10

Hidden - AltLd O/S - 25/Jun/10

Hidden - AltLd O/S - 05/Jun/10

A great route through steep terrain
Pilch - AltLd O/S - 05/Jun/10 with Mel

mikelaing - AltLd - May/10 with Ian Whitehead

On the second pitch I took the 'higher of two traverse lines' This was a rising crack. After 20 feet of handtraversing I could find no way of stepping down, there were no footholds and it got harder. This clearly was not a VS. I continued using a somewhat suspect flake in the crack, which I assumed must be safe after so many ascents,eventually arriving at what transpired to be the correct 'perch' belay. I would highly recommend this variation, about E1 5b, 40 feet of sustained hand traversing on a sharp edge with minimal lichen covered footholds, well protected by med wires to start then 1.5 friend and later 2.5 friend. The rising traverse is clearly visible in photos leading directly to 4 feet above the perch belay. I imagine this variation is climbed by about 1 in 10 ropes as it is the most obvious traverse line, just above the correct horizontal ledges. What amazes me is that it is not in the guide book for one of the best hand traverse in Wales. OK, so I have not done all the other contenders --- no point now really.
Oliver Hill - Lead - 15/Apr/10

Whether this is top end of the VS graded list or bottom end of the HVS graded list doesn't matter much, this is not one to do as your first VS lead. As already mentioned by Mrs W, the crux is not so cruxy if you are tall, but there are still some vicious little cracks waiting above.
JiveWeasel - AltLd - 18/Sep/09 with Mrs Weasel

Great route. We had a truly epic day: what with taking walking in past llyn Eigiau and a few unintended detours it took us nearly 3 hours to the bottom of the climb. We got to the top (of the crag) in the dusk, with one torch, so took the (much) longer but safer route down, getting back to the rucksacks 3 hours later. Back to the car at 1am - but better than a night out! The climb itself was truly memorable -either top end VS or easy HVS. Pitch 1, not too tricky but no gear (me). Pitch 2 (5a) led by JW dead easy for him (6'3'') but terrifying for me at 5'4'' what with not being able to reach the top ledge from the bottom one. Pitch 3 (me) has a really scary traverse move with nothing under you except miles of empty air, and pitch 4 (JW) a tough little corner crack. We'd thought we should be able to ab down from the top - but it didn't seem like that good an idea when we were there so carried on up Pinnacle Wall.
Mrs Weasel - AltLd O/S - 18/Sep/09 with JiveWeasel

Led pitches 1 & 3.
lucasp - AltLd O/S - 12/Sep/09 with Dave C (Lmc)

Great climb, well worth its reputation as the best VS in Wales. The gully descent is quite desperate though...
Jim Walton - AltLd O/S - 08/Aug/09 with Mike Owen

Hidden - Lead O/S - 08/Aug/09

Hidden - Lead O/S - Jun/09

Daniel Wrightson - AltLd - 31/May/09 with Steve Gould

Dave Thompson - AltLd O/S - 31/May/09 with John Evans

Pitches 2 & 4
bullwinkle - AltLd O/S - 30/May/09 with Paul

jamie ward - AltLd O/S - 30/May/09 with simon fairman

Absolutely top class route. Top end VS.
Conan - AltLd O/S - 24/May/09 with Philippa Reader

I got the traverse pitch and the last pitch--all very nice
alicia - AltLd O/S - 02/May/09 with Jamie

Hidden - AltLd O/S - 21/Sep/08

Hidden - AltLd - 21/Sep/08

Hidden - AltLd - 21/Sep/08

Hidden - AltLd O/S - 15/Jun/08

Danhan - 2nd - 14/Jun/08 with Nick

I led first pitch, Dave the rest. Move onto 3rd pitch off belay is hard. Awsome route.
bridget143 - AltLd O/S - 24/May/08 with Brown

Brown - AltLd O/S - 24/May/08 with Bridget

Theeni - AltLd O/S - 10/May/08 with Sven Hassel

Marcus - 2008

Hidden - AltLd - 25/Aug/07

The Bad Cough - AltLd O/S - 11/Aug/07 with John Nesbitt

JGW - AltLd - Aug/07 with Matt Tilley

Gman - Lead O/S - Aug/07 with Eamon

BenTiffin - AltLd - May/07 with Matt Collis

fran04 - AltLd - 2007

timmy-ts - 2007

Had an off day, backed off 2nd pitch & wibbled for ages on the 3rd, then couldn't do the 5th. I hate climbing. :O
KeithW - AltLd dog - 14/Oct/06 with Corky

Si dH - AltLd O/S - 04/Jun/06 with Andy Morris

AJM - AltLd O/S - Jun/06 with Simon de Haas

Ian McNeill - 2006

mikelaing - 2006

Stig - AltLd O/S - 24/Sep/05 with Jonathan + Louise Teale

rob1 - AltLd O/S - 21/Aug/05 with Jonny Martin, andrew clark

Chesh - Lead - Aug/05 with ScotsPaul

Hidden - Lead O/S - 16/Jul/05

Hidden - AltLd O/S - May/05

Clucky - AltLd O/S - 09/Sep/04 with Paul Dickson

John Pickles - AltLd O/S - 08/Sep/04 with Jon Bracey

Hidden - Lead dnf - 06/Jun/04

One of the best routes I have ever done.
Jamie B - AltLd - Jun/04 with Kris Quayle

Led pitches 2 and 4
Alaric - AltLd O/S - 27/Sep/03 with Nigel M

Hidden - Lead - Aug/03

Bill led a rope of 4!! me somewhere in the middle.
Ann S - 2nd - Jun/03 with Bill Harrison/John Carlin/Shaun Shaughnessy

The Pylon King - AltLd O/S - May/03 with steve c

John Kettle - Lead - 2003

Hidden - AltLd - 03/Sep/02

unfit - AltLd - 03/Sep/02 with john Norman

Hidden - AltLd - 29/Mar/02

Top route.
Darragh - Mar/02 with Rob

Hidden - Lead O/S - 2002

nickdonohue - AltLd - 2002 with Jim Barradale

NeilGriffiths - AltLd - 23/Sep/01 with Simon Frost

frost - Sep/01 with N Griffiths

Hidden - AltLd - Jun/01

alan moore - 2000

iskra2000 - AltLd - 31/Jul/99 with Matt Kingsley

Hidden - Lead O/S - 31/Jul/99

Mark Riley - AltLd - Sep/98 with Stuart Greenall

Lead 1st to the base of the V-groove, 3rd, & 5th piches.
Paul-Michael - AltLd O/S - 18/Jul/98 with David Jupp

what an out there climb for the grade.absolutely superb well worth the walk in.kicked myself ever since for not bothering to do the pinnacle wall finish
dickypips - AltLd O/S - 1998 with john richards

zero six - Lead O/S - 1998

lead pitches 1 and 3
John Marsland - AltLd O/S - 14/Aug/97 with Ian Manocha

Richard Weller - Lead O/S - 19/Jul/97 with Simon Currin, Sally Currin

Brian Rodgers - AltLd - 1997 with Dave Oldacres

Marti999 - Lead - Jul/96

Tim Bateman - AltLd - 15/Jun/96

Chris Ellis - AltLd O/S - 06/Aug/95 with Louise Pellett

Nigel R Lewis - 2nd - 20/Jul/95 with Gary Lewis

2,2,L,L,L.
charlesmfrench - AltLd O/S - 05/Aug/94

Cowflinger - AltLd O/S - 17/Jul/94 with Andy Sharp

Hidden - AltLd - 13/Jun/94

Budge - AltLd O/S - 1994 with Richard Teed

Derek Ryden - AltLd O/S - 1994 with Glynne Andrew

Roget - 2nd O/S - 06/Jun/93 with jon

Hidden - AltLd - 1991

Ched - Lead O/S - 1990 with Glyn

Led P1, P2, P4
stewart murray - AltLd - 1989 with Martin Willey

hazeysunshine - 2nd O/S - Jul/87 with Andy K

Nick Biven - 1986

With my Dad - great day out
Backinthegame - Lead O/S - Oct/85 with Dad

Nigel Bond - AltLd - 16/Jun/85 with Charlie Leverton

RichardMc - Lead O/S - 16/Jun/85 with Angel Vila

Hidden - 2nd - 13/May/84

nigehughes - Lead - Sep/82 with Jim Hindman

Mark Kemball - AltLd - 16/Jul/82 with Dave Abbey

babymoac - AltLd - 10/Jul/82 with MTW & Paul R

leland stamper - Lead O/S - 07/Nov/81

Done about 3 ascents of this fabulous climb.
Sean Kelly - AltLd - 1980 with Bob Millward

Hidden - AltLd - 1980

Chris Craggs - 1980

mikej - AltLd - 29/Jul/77 with Mike Byles

solo
Mike Owen - 15/Jul/77 with Chester Dent

Bolt Phobia - AltLd - 01/Jun/77

Hidden - AltLd - 25/Aug/75

Another Bill Briggs sandbag! I led pitches 1, 2 and 3 as one but did the higher-level rising hand-traverse to reach the perch belay! I have done this twice during the intervening years and was very grateful for the protection provided by a couple of small Friends in the hand traverse. No Friends in '75!
Falko - Lead O/S - 08/Feb/75 with Roger Edwards, Bill Briggs

Hidden - Aug/73

granitbahn - AltLd - 1973

David Smith - Lead - Jun/65

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Voting
Total votes cast 182
hard HVS1 of 60
HVS2 of 60
easy HVS11 of 60
hard VS33 of 60
VS13 of 60
easy VS0 of 60
hard HS0 of 60
HS0 of 60
easy HS0 of 60
hard 5a1 of 60
5a5 of 60
easy 5a15 of 60
hard 4c27 of 60
4c12 of 60
easy 4c0 of 60
hard 4b0 of 60
4b0 of 60
easy 4b0 of 60
3 Stars57 of 62
2 Stars4 of 62
1 Star1 of 62
0 Stars0 of 62
Bag of .....0 of 62
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Style of ascent

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Followed
Alt Leads
Unknown
Climbed
Clean O/S
Clean rpt
dogged
dnf