UKC

Hi everyone, I'll be heading to the Ecrins massif soon and plan to bivvy near the refuges in a tent. Does anyone know if this is frowned upon, particularly around the Refuge des Écrins and Refuge du Pelvoux?

My plan is to have dinner at the refuges so I can chat with other climbers and the guardians about the nearby routes. Is this feasible, or is dining/other facilities at the refuges typically reserved for those staying overnight?

Any tips or advice on the positives and negatives of bivvying, especially over 3000m, would be greatly appreciated as this will be my first time doing it!

Thanks in advance!

Rob of Ecrinscollective is a local so will be able to give better advice but my initial thoughts are:
- You say bivvying but then say you want to camp.  They are different. 
- Currently  heavy snow from about 2,000 - 2,200 upwards in Ecrins. When do you plan to go? 
- Refuge des Ecrins, I have seen people camping on glacier below hut but don't think you can camp near the hut, is on a ridge above a steep slope
- Pelvoux refuge, I have bivvied there after arriving very late and was fine but was a bivvy, not  a tent. 
- Above 3,000m only hut in the area I know of is Ecrins hut.  In general you can certainly find bivvy places higher up, but these are generally stone ovals to provide shelter from wind. 

Presumably you want to bivvy for cost purposes?  In that case how about getting AAC membership which gives insurance and half price for overnight stay in hut (around €10) and then cook in the  hut. 
 

https://ffcam.fr/index.php?&_lang=FR&alias=bivouaquer-responsable

Which there's refuge temple ecrins and ecrins refuge? I've bivi'd outside the latter to the west, quite close by. But we ate in there, which may have softened any guidelines. 

"Bivouac" has a different meaning for the French than the English.  To the French it means an overnight stay (with or without a tent) but packing up at sunrise.  I know for Brits "Bivouac" means an overnight stay without a tent.  

Follow the official advice from Kimberley. A small tent is fine, but remove it in the morning. Book in advance for meals and to let guardian know you'll be camping nearby (if they say no, don't - trust guardians know best. It won't be a financial decision for them: the sleeping money goes to the CAF, the one for meals to the guardian). At busy times there might not be room as there are limited bivvy spaces.

Positives: no snoring so potentially better night if you have good gear. Marginally cheaper (not much. It's meals that's the most expensive).

Negatives: the additional weight to carry is the main drawback. This year the amount of snow, you'd need gear to sleep on snow for all mountain huts as snow line below 2,500. None of the huts are currently reachable without snow gear.

Thanks so much for the info! I actually have AAC insurance and was aware of the 50% hut discount. My reason for bivvying was to save costs but after going on the hut websites, prices for overnight stays which I wasn't initially aware of aren't that bad. 

I am currently reconsidering so I may leave the bivvying for more remote areas!

Edit: I cannot find any info about the 50% discount applying to huts in the Western Alps...? 

[It applies and is referred to as Reciprocal Hut Rights (Gegenrecht)]

Huckleberry, 
Hut tariffs with reciprocal rights prices for Pelvoux hut are shown here.  Ecrins nut is CAF as well so probably very similar. 
https://refugedupelvoux.ffcam.fr/tarifs.html  


Good to know you have AAC already but, if you are a member take your BMC card as well.  Although it strictly doesn't offer reciprocal rights I have had some guardians accept it in preference to AAC because they recognize BMC better!

btw On further reflection I do remember some people camping near Pelvoux hut but, as Juan says, best to check with guardian and follow rules.  The last couple of times I was there the guardian was very helpful and flexible, unlike some of the busier huts.

You have lots of good advice here. When you say soon, how soon. there is still 2-3m of snow around the 2500m level here in the Ecrins. 

I think you might be better going in the hut if you can afford it, saves a lot of hassle especially if you new to alpine stuff, but don't forget to take ear plugs .

Thank you for the information! I think my mind is set with the huts, definitely more suitable for our group. 

I’ll be in the area sometime between mid to end of June- I hope for good conditions and weather 🙏

My plan is to go up Pointe des Arcas, Traverse of Mont Pelvoux and Barre des Ecrins. I am new to mountaineering and I believe those routes will be a good introduction! 

I did want to ask, what are the conditions of the North-West ridge around this time? Is trad gear needed for the ascent or are there sufficient places for natural anchors?

Thank you!

Thanks for the info! In regards to the sleeping conditions at the Ecrins and Pelvoux hut, are blankets provided or would I have to bring a sleeping bag up with me?

Blankets provided at both huts. You just need a sleeping bag liner.

Blankets provided. Dorms are usually too hot if anything. Don't take a sleeping bag.

Thanks Troy! How packed do the huts get? I am thinking of booking on the day instead of online (weather dependent) Is there a chance they may have run out of beds?

Depends on time of year, day of week , weather and hut! 
From my previous experience going mid-end June; Pelvoux hut no problem with space, Glacier Blanc can get busy because easily accessible, Ecrins hut, fine apart from once after several days of bad weather when everyone was trying for Barre and was rammed. 

Generally though we ring up in the morning and is fine.  If you are eating there, do make sure you allow enough time to get to hut well before meal served!  And most people will go to bed pretty soon afterwards because of early start.   Guardian will check where you plan to go and suggest wake up time. 

"My plan is to go up Pointe des Arcas, Traverse of Mont Pelvoux and Barre des Ecrins. I am new to mountaineering and I believe those routes will be a good introduction! "

I don't know Pointe des Arcas but, if you are new to mountaineering Pelvoux traverse and Barre are both big outings!  You may wish to get used to glacier travel, crampons, altitude etc on something a bit easier first.  From Ecrins and Glacier Blanc hut huts there are some nice easier peaks you could attempt like Roche Faurio, Pointe Cezanne, Neige Cordier etc