UKC

I need to get some snow shoes for the alps this winter, anyone have any reccomendations?

Cheers,

George

In reply to g taylor: yeah, get some short skis

In reply to g taylor:
i use the grivel violino i think thay are called. they are good as you wear your crampons while they are on your feet thus cut down on weight. they come apart so can fit in a climbing sack no bother.
another interesting pair to look at (which ive not used) are the yowies i think that they are called. these are like big teva sandles and i think needlesports sell them.
james e

In reply to g taylor: Are best avoided, get yourself some ski touring gear, it's thge future.

In reply to g taylor: My sister has the Camp ones. Very light with removable front and rear crampons. I think they were about £95 in a nice bag.

In reply to Frank4short: Unfortunately that would involve being able to ski. May take some lessons tho!

In reply to g taylor: Well failing that if you've got grivel crampons go with the grivel ones as they retrofit to the crampons so are lighter & less bulky.

In reply to g taylor: Don't expect too much from them - in deep fluffy snow it feels like they hardly make an difference. I'm sure they do, but its still a hard slog - don't expect to be running over powder fields. Even with large Tubbs ones I was amazed you could still end up thigh deep. In the mountains with harder snow conditions the smaller ones may be good though.

I'm about to get a pair of MSR lightening ascents. I'll report back once I've given them a good go.

In reply to g taylor: I'd like to throw in my vote to get skis. I gave my snowshoes away after my last trip I was so pissed at them. I can imagine very few uses where skis wouldn't be highly preferable...

In reply to g taylor:


if you do get them remember to inculde an estimate of your pack weight otherwise you really will have to slog.

In reply to g taylor:

I prefer snowshoes, probably because I have used them all my life, whereas skiing has been occasional and recreational. I would also rather not break my leg on the approach, falling on skis with a 70 lbs pack. I prefer to use snowshoes winter camping in Canada, for example, where I come from, including with a pack comparable to a mountaineering pack.

A rule of thumb is to look for adequate floatation, measured in square inches, matching your own weight, plus that of your gear and pack, to the capacity of the shoe.

Here is one measure to use:

Weight ............... Floatation

up to 155 lbs ........ 170 sq.inches
up to 170 lbs ........ 200 sq.inches
up to 220 lbs ........ 270 sq.inches
over 220 lbs ........ 360 sq.inches

Snow quality, ie powder versus packed or wet, makes a huge difference, but these numbers are a starting point.

Many modern snowshoes have all kinds of modular ways of adding and subtracting floatation, with tails, etc. They are light-weight and easy to carry, and they don't absorb water (and hence, weight) the way other materials do.

Personally, I prefer older-style shoes, as they are easier to repair in the bush, if you are out for several days and have to depend on your shoes to get you back to civilization. This is not so important if you are in a large group, breaking trail, or close to home/car.

Whatever you buy, bring a variety of bolts, nuts and washers, and material to replace straps, if you are using synthetic shoes, as straps and rivets will break or pop, regularly, with the offending part disappearing in the snow, usually a step or two before you notice the problem.

I have used Tubbs snowshoes during a multi-day backcountry ice climbing trip in Western Newfoundland (deep snow, wet climate), and found they couldn't take the beating that comes with the terrain, bindings and rivets breaking due to the ever-changing angle of the ground. I don't know if it is the design or the nature of the beast.

Good luck!

In reply to g taylor:

Its quite possible to rent snow shoes quite cheaply in the alps so if its a short trip I would spend the money on renting and some ski lessons.

In my experience snowshoes are good in reasonable flattish snow but a bit useless for things like traversing steeper slopes or if it gets icy.

They are good comedy value though - worth a try once - it will encourage your skiing.

Enjoy

In reply to g taylor:

Firstly, if you are not able to ski down PD in the Alps then snowshoes are waht you need. They are lighter than skis and as fast as skis on the uphill.

Secondly, climbing with skis on your back is difficult - that much is obvious. I've climbed two long couloirs with skiers and my snowshoes were not a burden. Skis are. If you can control miniskis then get some and enjoy the descent but otherwise don't bother. James's comment about the Yowies may be worth pursuing if you don't have Grivel crampons.

Thirdly, it's harder to break a snowshoe. If you break a ski on a climb then you will have to ski-limp down. You can fix a snowshoe with tat.

I use Grivel Violinos and they are fine if you have the right crampon. My partner did - I didn't (CM 12 points). They don't quite fit properly on some crampons so take your boots and crampons and try before you buy in this instance!

In reply to g taylor:

I have used both mountaineering skis with skins and blades and snow shoes. I bought the ski gear - new many years ago then second hand quite recently to get more modern gear, so I am quite keen on making skis work - the problem is they don't! Or at least I don't, I can get by going up but skiing down in soft deep snow is beyond my ability, and can be both knackering and humiliating. I shall persevere but as I'm getting past my youth and can't get off skiing that often I doubt that I will ever be very good.

Other points to consider: skis are heavy and cumbersome so if you have to finish the summit in crampons and can't leave your skis on the glacier to come back down to, they do get in the way a lot more than snow shoes.

I have hired snowshoes and they are really good for wandering about in the hills in deep snow, on or off tracks; they are light, comparatively cheap (no need for special boots either) and anyone can use them with no training - all my family used them last winter and they can't ski at all and have never used crampons even. When you take them off they can be conveniently strapped on to your rucksack and don't get in the way - if you are used to cramponning you don't even need to bother with ski-poles on easy and moderate terrain.

Just a few comments, although the Canadian above would seem to have more technical things to say - an interesting post, thanks Peter.

On the other hand, when you get to the top and it's a lovely cold sunny day and the conditions correspond to your level of skiing I don't think there is anything so pleasant as whooshing down a deserted glacier well covered in snow! Nearly everyone I see on the ski-slopes does seem to manage so I think in the long run it is worth learning to ski - the earlier you start the better.

In reply to Bruce Hooker: Yup - thanks Peter. Good to see some original thoughtful advice for a change (ie not just "learn to ski").

Anyway, my £0.02 - learn to ski - telemark

In reply to g taylor:

whats peoples general feelings regarding the grivel violino? I've read very mixed opinions. They also dont seem to be available anywhere now.

In reply to g taylor:

i have some violinos. bought a couple of years ago in italy. think i saw some this summer in chamonix?

have used only a couple of times. agree with what said earlier: if soft powder i dont think they are much cop (maybe others with less air space around the feet would perform better?). On that kinda windpack where every step you break through I think they are invaluable! They are light and very simple but worth experimenting with settings to make sure they fit your crampon well!

I'd hire a few different sets first and try before you buy. Good luck.

In reply to g taylor:
In reply to g taylor:
I had Tubbs and have Grivel snowshoes. I find the heel hooks of the Grivel Violino not very stable; they get loose so your heel is down going up hill or going down hill they pop-up visa versa. Not easy to adjust with a heavy pack. But the Grivels are lighter then the Tubbs. You can enlarge the surface of the Violino. They are not very comfortable talking about floating quality. Tubbs is better from that point of view. I don't know if the Violino is not produced any more due to the hook problems? I still like the concept of the Violino. But I would consider buying TSL's, 170 euro's snowshoes or MSR's, which are probably less delicate then the Tubbs.

For myself I am thinking about the Kong Grimper ski. Has any one experience with them? In Austria they are not that expensive. 350 euro's.

Buy, buy for now.

In reply to g taylor: It's a lot easier to use ski poles, preferably adjustable ones, with them. If you didn't know that already.