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After spending many years as a vegetarian I've been eating meat for a year or so. It's great.
I've come to the conclusion that not only is eating meat morally justifiable but that the only form of vegetarianism that can be justified morally is veganism.
Lacto-vegetarianism is a half-way house which does little for animal welfare and exists only for people to make themselves feel better.
Vegans look at egg and milk production and say "I don't want any part of that". Fair enough.
Lacto-vegetarians happily drink milk and eat eggs ignoring what happens to the male animals which must be produced as a consequence of their actions. They're saying they won't kill an animal but are paying for a system which does precisely that.
I've come to the conclusion that not only is eating meat morally justifiable but that the only form of vegetarianism that can be justified morally is veganism.
Lacto-vegetarianism is a half-way house which does little for animal welfare and exists only for people to make themselves feel better.
Vegans look at egg and milk production and say "I don't want any part of that". Fair enough.
Lacto-vegetarians happily drink milk and eat eggs ignoring what happens to the male animals which must be produced as a consequence of their actions. They're saying they won't kill an animal but are paying for a system which does precisely that.
In reply to brothersoulshine:
if I wasn't still 2 hours off finishing my 3rd assignment for the week I'd be inclined to come up with an argument. but in the circumstances I'll accept that in reality you're probably right.
I hate meat anyway mind.
if I wasn't still 2 hours off finishing my 3rd assignment for the week I'd be inclined to come up with an argument. but in the circumstances I'll accept that in reality you're probably right.
I hate meat anyway mind.
In reply to brothersoulshine:
What the hell is wrong with making yourself feel better?
Are you some kind of masochist?
> Lacto-vegetarianism is a half-way house which does little for animal welfare and exists only for people to make themselves feel better.
What the hell is wrong with making yourself feel better?
Are you some kind of masochist?
In reply to brothersoulshine:
for me vegetarianism isn't just about animal welfare. It's also about my health and environmental issues
for me vegetarianism isn't just about animal welfare. It's also about my health and environmental issues
In reply to willow:
I aim for organic but sometimes settle for free range.
> (In reply to brothersoulshine)
>
> d'you just eat organic meat?
>
> d'you just eat organic meat?
I aim for organic but sometimes settle for free range.
In reply to brothersoulshine:
i find forerib of beef blast cooked at 220 for first 1/2 hour then 15 mins per pound at 180 gives succulent pink roast beef..
mmmmmmmm
> After spending many years as a vegetarian I've been eating meat for a year or so. It's great.<
i find forerib of beef blast cooked at 220 for first 1/2 hour then 15 mins per pound at 180 gives succulent pink roast beef..
mmmmmmmm
In reply to brothersoulshine:
free range, bit of a cop out isn't it? doesn't necessarily mean that much to the animal's comfort while it's alive: it seems to me like a sop to a humanitarian conscious. Also free range doesn't mean the animal hasn't been fed/ treated with all sorts of crap that may damage the health of those who eat it.
free range, bit of a cop out isn't it? doesn't necessarily mean that much to the animal's comfort while it's alive: it seems to me like a sop to a humanitarian conscious. Also free range doesn't mean the animal hasn't been fed/ treated with all sorts of crap that may damage the health of those who eat it.
In reply to brothersoulshine: I am veggie, but i agree that unless you are a vegan then you have to accept that it is a bit hypocritical to be veggie, that being said i would happily be a hypocrit that is making a bit of a difference than someone who is making no difference at all to what is essentialy immoral. Only eating organic meat seems to be a similar compromise.
In reply to willow:
I feel guilty if I don't know the name of the bullock and buy it off the farmer who raised it or the butcher who killed it, although I often fail to keep to that ideal. I think it's wrong to eat anything you wouldn't kill yourself though, and that's one I stick to - insects and spiders are perfectly safe from me, anything fluffy seems easier...
I feel guilty if I don't know the name of the bullock and buy it off the farmer who raised it or the butcher who killed it, although I often fail to keep to that ideal. I think it's wrong to eat anything you wouldn't kill yourself though, and that's one I stick to - insects and spiders are perfectly safe from me, anything fluffy seems easier...
In reply to willow:
If you accept you're going to use animals, then accept that some of them will be killed and bring them up as decently as you can.
If you don't accept you're going to kill animals then go vegan.
If you accept you're going to use animals, then accept that some of them will be killed and bring them up as decently as you can.
If you don't accept you're going to kill animals then go vegan.
In reply to brothersoulshine:
.
Depends on your reasons for vegetarianism. If you follow a basically Hindu philosophy, you are likely to end up as a lacto-vegitarian. (My own position).
.
>
> Lacto-vegetarianism is a half-way house which does little for animal welfare and exists only for people to make themselves feel better.
>
> Lacto-vegetarianism is a half-way house which does little for animal welfare and exists only for people to make themselves feel better.
>
Depends on your reasons for vegetarianism. If you follow a basically Hindu philosophy, you are likely to end up as a lacto-vegitarian. (My own position).
I dont think there is any reasonable argument for being a vegetarian.
If you want to be one fine we should all except it and not give you (too much) hassel about it.
I can enjoy a vegetarian meal as much as the next carni/omni vore but its things like vegetarian bacon and sausages which get up my nose. Dont say your not gonna eat meat then squish up mushrooms roll them out spray them with ham smell and call it ham. Thats silly
But a good vegie meal, that can be a good thing.
If you want to be one fine we should all except it and not give you (too much) hassel about it.
I can enjoy a vegetarian meal as much as the next carni/omni vore but its things like vegetarian bacon and sausages which get up my nose. Dont say your not gonna eat meat then squish up mushrooms roll them out spray them with ham smell and call it ham. Thats silly
But a good vegie meal, that can be a good thing.
In reply to brothersoulshine:
You live in a very black and white world.
I see vegetarianism is a halfway house. It does some good to some animals (vegetarians are also likely to be more interested in organic and free-range food), but it isn't such a huge hassle as being a vegan.
All human activity has some effect on animals, it's virtually impossible to eliminate the detrimental effects even if you are vegan.
So you are vegan and don't wear leather shoes?
Well great but what about all the animals killed indirectly during the activity needed to produce the petrol in your car?
Or the animals killed when building the house you live in, or the animals eaten by the people who produced that DVD you bought.
Isn't a vegan indirectly supporting all that?
My point is that just by living you are going to have some detrimental effect on animals.
You've just chosen a different amount of effect from vegetarians and they've just chosen a different amount of effect from vegans.
If justifying things to yourself makes you feel better then that's fine, we are not here to judge
You live in a very black and white world.
I see vegetarianism is a halfway house. It does some good to some animals (vegetarians are also likely to be more interested in organic and free-range food), but it isn't such a huge hassle as being a vegan.
All human activity has some effect on animals, it's virtually impossible to eliminate the detrimental effects even if you are vegan.
So you are vegan and don't wear leather shoes?
Well great but what about all the animals killed indirectly during the activity needed to produce the petrol in your car?
Or the animals killed when building the house you live in, or the animals eaten by the people who produced that DVD you bought.
Isn't a vegan indirectly supporting all that?
My point is that just by living you are going to have some detrimental effect on animals.
You've just chosen a different amount of effect from vegetarians and they've just chosen a different amount of effect from vegans.
If justifying things to yourself makes you feel better then that's fine, we are not here to judge
In reply to willow:
Nor are any vegetables unless they're grown locally, which sadly isn't often true. Transporting apples across the world when there are plenty of UK orchards that you could scrump for free is just perverse, and hardly sustainable.
Nor are any vegetables unless they're grown locally, which sadly isn't often true. Transporting apples across the world when there are plenty of UK orchards that you could scrump for free is just perverse, and hardly sustainable.
In reply to Laffco:
Why do you care?
Look, people eat pot noodles and I think that's silly, there's no meat in them, no matter what the flavour says.
But, it gets up my nose not at all, let them eat pot noodle if that's their desire.
>
> I can enjoy a vegetarian meal as much as the next carni/omni vore but its things like vegetarian bacon and sausages which get up my nose. Dont say your not gonna eat meat then squish up mushrooms roll them out spray them with ham smell and call it ham. Thats silly
> I can enjoy a vegetarian meal as much as the next carni/omni vore but its things like vegetarian bacon and sausages which get up my nose. Dont say your not gonna eat meat then squish up mushrooms roll them out spray them with ham smell and call it ham. Thats silly
Why do you care?
Look, people eat pot noodles and I think that's silly, there's no meat in them, no matter what the flavour says.
But, it gets up my nose not at all, let them eat pot noodle if that's their desire.
In reply to Laffco:
You'll probably find that a lot of vegetarians only have some of these about so they can have a quick meal, maybe once or twice a week, just kept in the freezer for when you can't be bothered. At least, that's what I do, anyway.
I also prefer to buy plain quorn, neither meat flavoured, nor shaped to look like something it isn't. I don't buy fake bacon, or turkey/chicken slices (although my sister does, but she has kids).
But most days I don't eat quorn, tofu (and other soya type products) anyway.
> Dont say your not gonna eat meat then squish up mushrooms roll them out spray them with ham smell and call it ham. Thats silly
You'll probably find that a lot of vegetarians only have some of these about so they can have a quick meal, maybe once or twice a week, just kept in the freezer for when you can't be bothered. At least, that's what I do, anyway.
I also prefer to buy plain quorn, neither meat flavoured, nor shaped to look like something it isn't. I don't buy fake bacon, or turkey/chicken slices (although my sister does, but she has kids).
But most days I don't eat quorn, tofu (and other soya type products) anyway.
In reply to psd:
yes you are right. but if we all eat meat there is less time to change, how much grain, veg to produce each pound of meat?
it don't add up veggies are buying time for brains and maybe science to kick in ?
yes you are right. but if we all eat meat there is less time to change, how much grain, veg to produce each pound of meat?
it don't add up veggies are buying time for brains and maybe science to kick in ?
In reply to willow: the simple fact is whe're just top of the food chain, or the bottom pedin on the way you look at it
In reply to brothersoulshine:
It is impossible to live a life where your actions or diet have no effect on any living creature. And I dont just mean the cute ones either!
So why bother???
Go have some meat, it makes you cool!!
It is impossible to live a life where your actions or diet have no effect on any living creature. And I dont just mean the cute ones either!
So why bother???
Go have some meat, it makes you cool!!
In reply to willow:
how much grain, veg to produce each pound of meat?
I think it's something like 100kgs of grain to produce 1kg of beef - unless you feed the beef loads of anti-biotics and steroids, of course, as well (and some farmers do, 'cos meat is sold by weight, so extra poundage is extra profit, look at how pumping meat full of water used to be commonplace, for example)
When we really get into food shortages because of a growing population, and climate change starts kicking in, and weird weather patterns start ruining - animal feed - crops, then meat may well become a luxury that the world cannot afford. The world produces more than enough food to feed every human on the planet. It's just that lots of it goes to feed livestock so a small percentage of humans can eat 32oz prime beef steaks...
Another reason why I'm a vegetarian.
how much grain, veg to produce each pound of meat?
I think it's something like 100kgs of grain to produce 1kg of beef - unless you feed the beef loads of anti-biotics and steroids, of course, as well (and some farmers do, 'cos meat is sold by weight, so extra poundage is extra profit, look at how pumping meat full of water used to be commonplace, for example)
When we really get into food shortages because of a growing population, and climate change starts kicking in, and weird weather patterns start ruining - animal feed - crops, then meat may well become a luxury that the world cannot afford. The world produces more than enough food to feed every human on the planet. It's just that lots of it goes to feed livestock so a small percentage of humans can eat 32oz prime beef steaks...
Another reason why I'm a vegetarian.
In reply to simmo:
Alright simmo,
I got your mail. cheers. This is only a flying visit as Im off back to work in a minute. Ill keep you posted on what we talked about.
Have a goodun
Alright simmo,
I got your mail. cheers. This is only a flying visit as Im off back to work in a minute. Ill keep you posted on what we talked about.
Have a goodun
In reply to Dominion:
I've never really bought that argument. For a start, the numbers don't really add up. It takes 4-8kg of feed to make a 2 kg chicken (Ok so the whole chicken isn't eaten but the factor is more like 2-3 than 100).
And proper organic farming uses animals because they do stuff to the soil. If we don't use animal shit for nitrogen, phosphorous and potassium, what else do we use? I suspect we quarry it up out of the ground.
I've never really bought that argument. For a start, the numbers don't really add up. It takes 4-8kg of feed to make a 2 kg chicken (Ok so the whole chicken isn't eaten but the factor is more like 2-3 than 100).
And proper organic farming uses animals because they do stuff to the soil. If we don't use animal shit for nitrogen, phosphorous and potassium, what else do we use? I suspect we quarry it up out of the ground.
In reply to Pacific:
cool you to, 2 hours before i start work, wish i could sleep
would anyone of you good folk out there like to sing a lulabye so i could get 40 winks
to all sorry
cool you to, 2 hours before i start work, wish i could sleep
would anyone of you good folk out there like to sing a lulabye so i could get 40 winks
to all sorry
In reply to Dominion:
a good reason for being a veggie.
getting our energy from an animal that also needs energy is silly. eatbeansyouknowitmakessense
but it's ok to drink whisky and guinness
a good reason for being a veggie.
getting our energy from an animal that also needs energy is silly. eatbeansyouknowitmakessense
but it's ok to drink whisky and guinness
In reply to willow:
Not sure of the point you are making here.
Are you saying that if every day I eat a meat sausage for breakfast, the world will run out of food, but if instead I have a vegi sausage the world will not run out of food ?
> eating meat is not a sustianable food source
Not sure of the point you are making here.
Are you saying that if every day I eat a meat sausage for breakfast, the world will run out of food, but if instead I have a vegi sausage the world will not run out of food ?
In reply to Stuart Robinson:
I'm a bit too tired to explain dominion probably will do a better job.
take vegables we eat them we get the energy directly from them.
An animal eats vegatables but it uses quite a lot of the energy it gets from the vegatables in moving around, keeping warm and just maintaining it's body.
In other words the energy we could get direct from vegetables is diverted through the animal not all the energy the animal gets from eating the vegetable goes into it's meat so it is "wasted", t least as far as humans are concerned
I'm a bit too tired to explain dominion probably will do a better job.
take vegables we eat them we get the energy directly from them.
An animal eats vegatables but it uses quite a lot of the energy it gets from the vegatables in moving around, keeping warm and just maintaining it's body.
In other words the energy we could get direct from vegetables is diverted through the animal not all the energy the animal gets from eating the vegetable goes into it's meat so it is "wasted", t least as far as humans are concerned
In reply to brothersoulshine:
>If we don't use animal shit for nitrogen, phosphorous and potassium, what else do we use? I suspect we quarry it up out of the ground.
Or use a proper crop rotation system?
Hopefully a lot more organic waste will be recycled from household kitchen waste, and should be resold as fertilizer to farmers.
There may be problems with that as regards to organic farmers, and I also noticed the other day that Wales doesn't (at present) have organic waste composters that work at the 90deg Centigrade that is required for animal products in recyclable waste...
(http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/4152769.stm sort of implies this, despite the fact that is ostensibly about tea-bags)
>If we don't use animal shit for nitrogen, phosphorous and potassium, what else do we use? I suspect we quarry it up out of the ground.
Or use a proper crop rotation system?
Hopefully a lot more organic waste will be recycled from household kitchen waste, and should be resold as fertilizer to farmers.
There may be problems with that as regards to organic farmers, and I also noticed the other day that Wales doesn't (at present) have organic waste composters that work at the 90deg Centigrade that is required for animal products in recyclable waste...
(http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/4152769.stm sort of implies this, despite the fact that is ostensibly about tea-bags)
In reply to willow: are you veggie?
In reply to simmo: ps thanks n.a.r
In reply to simmo:
I don't describe myself as a veggie I can eat meat 3 days in a row and then not eat meat for weeks/months.
I don't like eating meat for lots of reasons but sometimes I like the taste of meat so I eat it. Luckily mostly I like vegetables.
However, I would find living without cheese very very difficult
I don't describe myself as a veggie I can eat meat 3 days in a row and then not eat meat for weeks/months.
I don't like eating meat for lots of reasons but sometimes I like the taste of meat so I eat it. Luckily mostly I like vegetables.
However, I would find living without cheese very very difficult
In reply to willow:
No I mean I bet your farts smell like an Afghan freedom fighters left ammo pooch!!!!!
No I mean I bet your farts smell like an Afghan freedom fighters left ammo pooch!!!!!
In reply to Pacific: nice time for a post
In reply to brothersoulshine:
Eat meat. Kill an animal.
Buy your g/f a diamond. Kill an Angolan.
Drive a car, use a computer, kill an Iraqi.
No-one's going to get it right. We all do what we all do to make ourselves feel better. We all seek absolution. But absolution slipped from our fingers long before we were born.
If there were a hell, then every single one of us in this horrific little country would be going there. We all cause suffering, simply by being.
I bought a new bike today for the price of a good few struggling families' food budget over a good few weeks. I suck. And don't we all?
James
Eat meat. Kill an animal.
Buy your g/f a diamond. Kill an Angolan.
Drive a car, use a computer, kill an Iraqi.
No-one's going to get it right. We all do what we all do to make ourselves feel better. We all seek absolution. But absolution slipped from our fingers long before we were born.
If there were a hell, then every single one of us in this horrific little country would be going there. We all cause suffering, simply by being.
I bought a new bike today for the price of a good few struggling families' food budget over a good few weeks. I suck. And don't we all?
James
In reply to Pacific:
Ammo pooch? They use dogs to carry munitions? What's wrong with mules?
> (In reply to willow)
>
> No I mean I bet your farts smell like an Afghan freedom fighters left ammo pooch!!!!!
>
> No I mean I bet your farts smell like an Afghan freedom fighters left ammo pooch!!!!!
Ammo pooch? They use dogs to carry munitions? What's wrong with mules?
In reply to brothersoulshine: "
Lacto-vegetarians happily drink milk and eat eggs ignoring what happens to the male animals which must be produced as a consequence of their actions"
are you aware of the processes involved in milk production? its far worse than killing a cow
Lacto-vegetarians happily drink milk and eat eggs ignoring what happens to the male animals which must be produced as a consequence of their actions"
are you aware of the processes involved in milk production? its far worse than killing a cow
In reply to brothersoulshine: How about vegetarians who don't eat meat because they don't like it and its cheaper? Surely thats as good a reason as any....
I have been told though that I am too 'normal' to be a vegetarian
I have been told though that I am too 'normal' to be a vegetarian
In reply to brothersoulshine:
I once had a long (slightly drunken, slightly tongue in cheek) debate with a veggie where I pointed out that domestication of plants and animals was a darwinian strategy for survival - by the plants and animals - some of the most successful plants and animals on the planet are those that are useful to humans - they are in effect expoiting us.
in darwinian terms there was a niche to be exploited (us) and they did that very successfully. The evolution (selective breeding) has now progressed to the point where the average domesticated animal could no more survive in the wild than your average urbanite.
If the world turned vegan overnight most domesticated species would simply die out.
Personally I would rather eat meat that has been treated well and slaughtered close to where it was reared because
(a) its better for the animal - I dont see why it should have to suffer unneccesarily (sp?) and
(b) the meat tastes better
Regards
Steve D
I once had a long (slightly drunken, slightly tongue in cheek) debate with a veggie where I pointed out that domestication of plants and animals was a darwinian strategy for survival - by the plants and animals - some of the most successful plants and animals on the planet are those that are useful to humans - they are in effect expoiting us.
in darwinian terms there was a niche to be exploited (us) and they did that very successfully. The evolution (selective breeding) has now progressed to the point where the average domesticated animal could no more survive in the wild than your average urbanite.
If the world turned vegan overnight most domesticated species would simply die out.
Personally I would rather eat meat that has been treated well and slaughtered close to where it was reared because
(a) its better for the animal - I dont see why it should have to suffer unneccesarily (sp?) and
(b) the meat tastes better
Regards
Steve D
In reply to Ali:
That's just part of the normal sneering jibes you get from "normal" meat-eating people, who sometimes feel as though they are being looked down upon by us morally superior vegetarians.
We always go out of our way to use our vegetarianism to prove to them that we have a conscience, and they don't....
honest...
> I have been told though that I am too 'normal' to be a vegetarian
That's just part of the normal sneering jibes you get from "normal" meat-eating people, who sometimes feel as though they are being looked down upon by us morally superior vegetarians.
We always go out of our way to use our vegetarianism to prove to them that we have a conscience, and they don't....
honest...
In reply to SteveD:
An interesting idea!
I don't agree that we are being exploited, or that they are exploiting a niche though. That implies some intent on the part of the animals and it just doesn't work like that.
It's just natural selection (and in this case that amounts to humans selecting animals to breed) driving evolution.
An interesting idea!
I don't agree that we are being exploited, or that they are exploiting a niche though. That implies some intent on the part of the animals and it just doesn't work like that.
It's just natural selection (and in this case that amounts to humans selecting animals to breed) driving evolution.
In reply to MeMeMe:
It's a symbiotic relationship.
In return for letting us eat it, the animal gets freedom from predators, decent shelter, regular food and a quick painless death (much nicer than the death it would have in the wild).
It's a symbiotic relationship.
In return for letting us eat it, the animal gets freedom from predators, decent shelter, regular food and a quick painless death (much nicer than the death it would have in the wild).
anyone know more about the environmental implications of turning over pastureland to, for instance, soya production?? a bloke i was chatting to suggested this would have a negative impact on birds of prey for instance.
In reply to brothersoulshine:
Like this?
http://www.netsoc.ucd.ie/~dscully/veg/broiler.jpg
> decent shelter, regular food and a quick painless death
Like this?
http://www.netsoc.ucd.ie/~dscully/veg/broiler.jpg
In reply to brothersoulshine: I agree. being vegertarian i.e. not eating meat & fish but still eating eggs and dairy products,is not morally superior (or whatever)to being an omnivore. The cruelty involved in the modern dairy production is at least equal to that of the meat industry. Personally I don't have any objections to eating meat,although I choose not to do so myself. What people should be bothered about is the way these animals have to live in order to produce our food. I have actually met people who belive cows naturally produce all this milk we consume and if we didn't help them out by drinking it they'd explode!
In reply to SteveD: check out memetic theory, that's even slightly more of a head ####
In reply to SteveD:
>> Personally I would rather eat meat that has been treated well and slaughtered close to where it was reared because
And, from my point of view,
(c) it's been raised on land where you couldn't grow anything that's edible by humans anyhow. Unless we've found a way of growing oranges of the Lakeland fells, it would seem to make sense to keep eating the Herdwick......
>> Personally I would rather eat meat that has been treated well and slaughtered close to where it was reared because
> (a) its better for the animal - I dont see why it should have to suffer unneccesarily (sp?) and
> (b) the meat tastes better
> (b) the meat tastes better
And, from my point of view,
(c) it's been raised on land where you couldn't grow anything that's edible by humans anyhow. Unless we've found a way of growing oranges of the Lakeland fells, it would seem to make sense to keep eating the Herdwick......
In reply to Carolyn:
But... But... Herdwicks look soo cute!
Swaledales, now there's a proper fell sheep and a completely different matter...
But... But... Herdwicks look soo cute!
Swaledales, now there's a proper fell sheep and a completely different matter...
In reply to Dominion:
Personally I try to avoid quorn - I believe it is made with non freerange eggs.
> (In reply to Laffco)
>
.
>
>
> I also prefer to buy plain quorn, neither meat flavoured,
> I also prefer to buy plain quorn, neither meat flavoured,
Personally I try to avoid quorn - I believe it is made with non freerange eggs.
In reply to Mark Kemball:
I prefer to avoid it as it's utter gop and I've heard bad stories of people becoming ill after eating it.
I prefer to avoid it as it's utter gop and I've heard bad stories of people becoming ill after eating it.
In reply to Dominion: Let us know what you find out please. Things may have changed - my info is probably a couple of years old. (I don't like the stuff myself, quite like Linda McCartney stuff for a quick meal and "Realeat Vegemince" for chilles etc.)
In reply to brothersoulshine:
I'm not for or against eating meat but I myself don't see myself giving up meat ever.
However, one discussion I recently had put some worries in my mind. At the moment I live in Canada (having moved there a year ago) and someone I was having lunch with a friend and their family. It was obvious and came up in discussion that there little brother was orders of magnitude taller than the rest of the family. The reason put forward by my friend was that most of the family had spent their childhood and growing years in Hungary but the youngest had spent his in Canada with the resulting effect of hormone growth affected meat. Holf f*ck! A lot of meat here is cheap as buggery i.e. of the order of 15 cents (6-7p) for a chicken wing on Tuesday (quiet) nights. How can that be profitable without the aid of chemicals?
Anyway, some of the opinions seem to suggest that your either for or against meat. The consequences of demand for meat are probably the result of things like the hormonal affected meat described above. I would suggest there is an inbetween of plenty of tasty vegie dishes placed between the 'necessary for good balance diet' meat dishes
Instead of creating a lot of demand for bulk meat every day, could we instead opt for good quality meat three or four days a week and eat some veggie goodies the rest?...
...but then I'm no nutritianist!
Graeme.
I'm not for or against eating meat but I myself don't see myself giving up meat ever.
However, one discussion I recently had put some worries in my mind. At the moment I live in Canada (having moved there a year ago) and someone I was having lunch with a friend and their family. It was obvious and came up in discussion that there little brother was orders of magnitude taller than the rest of the family. The reason put forward by my friend was that most of the family had spent their childhood and growing years in Hungary but the youngest had spent his in Canada with the resulting effect of hormone growth affected meat. Holf f*ck! A lot of meat here is cheap as buggery i.e. of the order of 15 cents (6-7p) for a chicken wing on Tuesday (quiet) nights. How can that be profitable without the aid of chemicals?
Anyway, some of the opinions seem to suggest that your either for or against meat. The consequences of demand for meat are probably the result of things like the hormonal affected meat described above. I would suggest there is an inbetween of plenty of tasty vegie dishes placed between the 'necessary for good balance diet' meat dishes
Instead of creating a lot of demand for bulk meat every day, could we instead opt for good quality meat three or four days a week and eat some veggie goodies the rest?...
...but then I'm no nutritianist!
Graeme.
In reply to willow:
You say that as though we should be trying to find a way of sustaining human existence by living in some kind of balanced harmony. NEWSFLASH - we are now that removed from a sustainable natural existence that it's no longer funny. Whether this is down to us being too greedy, too clever or having dextrous little digits, it makes no difference. The plain truth is that we have created a completely unnatuural way of living that, for our spiecies, can only end in tragedy. We have many liferafts to cling to in the wake of our sinking ship (religion and science spring to mind) but inevitably the sharks will eat us.
I'm sure that, in time, the planet will return to it's natural state of harmony and sustainability. We, of course, will not be around to see it (or mess it up).
> eating meat is not a sustianable food source
You say that as though we should be trying to find a way of sustaining human existence by living in some kind of balanced harmony. NEWSFLASH - we are now that removed from a sustainable natural existence that it's no longer funny. Whether this is down to us being too greedy, too clever or having dextrous little digits, it makes no difference. The plain truth is that we have created a completely unnatuural way of living that, for our spiecies, can only end in tragedy. We have many liferafts to cling to in the wake of our sinking ship (religion and science spring to mind) but inevitably the sharks will eat us.
I'm sure that, in time, the planet will return to it's natural state of harmony and sustainability. We, of course, will not be around to see it (or mess it up).
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