UKC

Hi All,

I have just started to learn to lead and am wondering what the norm is regarding replacing top ropes after leading.

At my local gym, every route has a top rope installed so to lead it needs to be removed first and then replaced at the end. I imagine there may be a different answer for different gyms, but I wondered if there is a standard used in this situation?

Thanks,

Clem

The lines at my local wall have the top ropes through separate gear at the top, so you can leave them in-situ as you lead up.

You could always top rope the route next to it and lean over to thread the top rope back in place.

At my local wall it is easy to reach the finishing hold and then retreat half a move and lower of the top quick draw without bothering to clip the belay. 

It very much varies.  Some walls are like you say.  Some have double sets of gear so you can lead and have a top rope at the same time (you just move it to one side if it's in the way).  Some have lead routes and top-rope routes separately, so if there's a top rope you use it but if there's not you lead.  Some walls have overhanging routes where top roping is not allowed (due to the risk of a large swing if you fall off) even if you lead to get the rope up there.  I'm sure there's another possibility!

Just one to ask about when you first go to a wall you haven't been to before.

Thanks for the replies and tips, much appreciated everyone.

This.

Or just look at what is there and figure out a sensible approach. The staff at the wall are sure to come over and ask you to do it differently if they don't like your chosen method.

Where's you local wall, I suspect you might be missing something.

Oakwood Climbing Centre in Wokingham - The routes have two chains with a single screwgate tying them together.

Weird! I've had a look a the photos of the wall but can't really work out what they have at the top.

It looks like you are right, a single screwgate, most places have two options at the top i.e. another clip in point for leading.

Most places don't like you pulling down the top ropes either!

It all seem a bit strange since there are obviously quick-draws for leading.

Maybe ask the staff at the wall.

IF you want to practice leading, clipping etc., then you could always top rope and climb with your rope attached to your harness. as long as you're not being pulled up the wall or on a tight rope, then it's almost the same.

It's an easy option for the wall, simply fit a maillon on the chains and put the top rope into that, then use the screwgate for leading

Not sure a UKC post is your best bet - the situation varies between different walls. Why not simply ask on your way in next visit?

At Kendal wall my mate was told to lower off the last clip where there are top ropes or clip one of the lower offs to the side so as not to damage the top rope. Seems like good practice to me.

Varies by wall... So ask the staff.

Some places don't want you to lower off the top draw because they use a steel top crab

Sorry, just noticed you'd already said this

Thanks for the reply and good tip on the practice idea. Yes I will ask at the wall for sure, but its was interesting to hear how other gyms do it.

Tie the ends of the 2 ropes with thin cord and pull through.

victory whipper as fall practice 

If the wall only has the one lower-off and you have to pull the rope, tape the end to your lead rope with some finger tape when you pull your rope, or tie them together with some cord (your prusik loops?), or you can sometimes get away with tying them together with a reef knot with long tails. Many walls however will have a separate krab to clip if leading, in which case you just need to pull the toprope aside while you lead.

I've climbed at one wall not-to-be-named which didn't allow you to pull the toprope, and didn't have a separate krab to clip. Their recommendation was to downclimb to the last bolt, which I thought seemed a little unreasonable. Eventually embraced it as free fall practice (hopefully not to be confused with freefall practice) and just started lobbing from the finishing hold instead. Still patently ridiculous though.

Most of the walls I go to, and there are about 4-5 we regularly use, have a maillon for the top rope and screw gate in the same chain, or have two separate anchors.

I dare say you could simply lead and clip your rope into the same screw gate as the top rope just make sure the top rope isn't jambed underneath yours.

Does seem a weird system though, are you sure they're OK with leading? If every route as top ropes maybe they not insured for it, I can see QDs in the pictures though.

If you pull the in-situ rope to lead a route with your rope, then yes, you need to put the centre's rope back up.  

A small length of cord, clove hitched the end of the centre's rope and to the end of your rope, then you can pull the rope up and through the top crab.

Unless the wall forbids it, I would pull the top-rope down, lead the route on it, lower-off and repeat until tired,

Chris

At my local wall, you can pull down the top ropes to lead on and then put them back in place. I think this is quite unusual it it seems to work.

lou 

Surely this would leave the centre's rope through all of the quickdraws?

Generally we go up on a nearby top-rope (you can keep the rope tight if you just want to do it fast) with the centre's rope tied to a gear loop. Once you are at the top just reach across and thread/clip it through. You could also send your belayer up on second.

What do you do if you don't make it to the top?

Given that you (and others) have given them that information why not ask on UKC?

Well if he can't get up the line using all the holds it was a poor choice in the first place. He will need to top rope one to either side at a guess

Chris

Ha ha, you're probably right, still I have made some poor choices before

Free solo back up and put the top rope back. Seen a film about it somewhere, looks easy..

Use the other end of the rope. 

No, just unclip the draws as you descend. 

Nifty, though I'm bound to forget this step.

I don't know where OP is but I was told by a member of staff at the new Warwick Uni wall that pulling the top ropes and leading those lines is acceptable there (lucky as otherwise there are very few non-overhanging lead lines).

Surely the answer is to send your second up with the centre's rope on their harness. They then make themself safe at the top, tie the ropes together and abseil off.

I suspect almost every wall in the country would have an issue with people abseiling from the top of their routes. Ignoring the fact that, having unnecessarily tied the ropes together, how are you going to retrieve your own rope?

I had hoped it was obviously a joke, realise now I should have made that clearer.

You would be able to retrieve you rope by pulling through until you can untie the knot

My apologies - pre morning coffee reply, sense of humour hadn't been engaged!