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The Breck as had a face lift , does anybody know anything about this?
https://www.facebook.com/29thwallaseyscoutgroup/posts/647883582074070
page has been restricted but it appears the "(the Wallasey Scout Group have painted the back wall of the Breck!
Post edited at 21:15
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In reply to Pekkie:
The photos were available when the posting was first made; they appear now to have been restricted.
However, try this: https://29thwallaseyscouts.wordpress.com/2017/06/08/pictures-from-our-night...
> And the point of this post when there's no photo is?
The photos were available when the posting was first made; they appear now to have been restricted.
However, try this: https://29thwallaseyscouts.wordpress.com/2017/06/08/pictures-from-our-night...
Post edited at 15:20
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In reply to Rob Parsons:
Because painting over graffiti is always a long term solution.
Look on the bright side: At least the routes all get excitingly hard starts now.
Because painting over graffiti is always a long term solution.
Look on the bright side: At least the routes all get excitingly hard starts now.
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In reply to gd303uk:
It's worse than that. Granny rock looks to have been butchered with a grinder mechanical brush of some sort.
It's worse than that. Granny rock looks to have been butchered with a grinder mechanical brush of some sort.
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In reply to gd303uk:
It's worse than I first thought,
Positron traverse has been ruined , chipped and other routes painted over.
It's worse than I first thought,
Positron traverse has been ruined , chipped and other routes painted over.
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In reply to Rob Parsons:
Apologies. Lack of photo originally obviously not your fault. So this scout group have carried out an act of major vandalism. Why would you do that? Presumably from ignorance. Who owns The Breck? I thought it was the Council. Did the sprouts get permission? Actually, ignorance is no excuse - you just have to google 'The Breck' and you get the details of its importance as a climbing venue. Unbe-fxcking-lievable.
Apologies. Lack of photo originally obviously not your fault. So this scout group have carried out an act of major vandalism. Why would you do that? Presumably from ignorance. Who owns The Breck? I thought it was the Council. Did the sprouts get permission? Actually, ignorance is no excuse - you just have to google 'The Breck' and you get the details of its importance as a climbing venue. Unbe-fxcking-lievable.
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In reply to Pekkie:
Sorry my Link was broken, the group involved blocked me and removed the images after i asked about their "work"
Dave has been and taken some more shots, at first i thought it was only the back wall Haston Dyno area that had been touched but it appears Granny Rock and one if the best lines on it , Positron, have been vandalised also!
youtube.com/watch?v=mU83-uCosfA&
Sorry my Link was broken, the group involved blocked me and removed the images after i asked about their "work"
Dave has been and taken some more shots, at first i thought it was only the back wall Haston Dyno area that had been touched but it appears Granny Rock and one if the best lines on it , Positron, have been vandalised also!
youtube.com/watch?v=mU83-uCosfA&
Post edited at 20:10
In reply to gd303uk:
Overhanging wall is painted with masonry paint by the look of it. All crucial edges are fecked.
I was shocked by the images I saw of the painting but when I checked it out today and saw what had been done to granny rock. Holds have been damaged and probably more susceptible to weathering.
I hope the other two wall are left alone.
As you enter the Breck there's a notice board with some info on Al Rouse so the importance of the place and it's climbing history are common knowledge
Overhanging wall is painted with masonry paint by the look of it. All crucial edges are fecked.
I was shocked by the images I saw of the painting but when I checked it out today and saw what had been done to granny rock. Holds have been damaged and probably more susceptible to weathering.
I hope the other two wall are left alone.
As you enter the Breck there's a notice board with some info on Al Rouse so the importance of the place and it's climbing history are common knowledge
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In reply to daveyb:
Actually, paint wears off pretty quickly. A while back persons unknown painted Lady Jane Wall at Pex as high as you can reach with green gloss paint. Why? I can see the point of graffiti - it can be amusing, while not condoneable ( is that a word?) as in 'Crew pegs diffs' but why would you paint a rock face with green gloss paint? Anyway, it wore off and there is no trace of it now. But if someone has been using an angle grinder at The Breck to whizz off holds on classic problems then we face an existential threat. Call out the Climbing Revolutionary Guard! Ken Wilson, we need you now!
Actually, paint wears off pretty quickly. A while back persons unknown painted Lady Jane Wall at Pex as high as you can reach with green gloss paint. Why? I can see the point of graffiti - it can be amusing, while not condoneable ( is that a word?) as in 'Crew pegs diffs' but why would you paint a rock face with green gloss paint? Anyway, it wore off and there is no trace of it now. But if someone has been using an angle grinder at The Breck to whizz off holds on classic problems then we face an existential threat. Call out the Climbing Revolutionary Guard! Ken Wilson, we need you now!
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In reply to Pekkie:
Green Gloss on sandstone! what were they thinking, Farrow and Ball do a lovely colour, Radicchio, that might have complimented the earthy tones of Pex.
Green Gloss on sandstone! what were they thinking, Farrow and Ball do a lovely colour, Radicchio, that might have complimented the earthy tones of Pex.
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In reply to gd303uk:
Radicchio? Schmadicchio! What we need is some blood red, no, martyrs' blood red, red gloss to underpin our support for Corby and his freedom-fighters. Power to the people!
> Green Gloss on sandstone! what were they thinking, Farrow and Ball do a lovely colour, Radicchio, that might have complimented the earthy tones of Pex.
Radicchio? Schmadicchio! What we need is some blood red, no, martyrs' blood red, red gloss to underpin our support for Corby and his freedom-fighters. Power to the people!
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In reply to gd303uk:
I like the way they took one load of graffiti they didn't approve of and just covered it in their own (which looks worse). It doesn't even look like they had a proper plan of design for their painting.
perhaps someone worth contacting the district commissioner, could try:-
Matt Fitzpatrick - District scout network commisioner. wallaseyscoutnetwork@outlook.com
I like the way they took one load of graffiti they didn't approve of and just covered it in their own (which looks worse). It doesn't even look like they had a proper plan of design for their painting.
perhaps someone worth contacting the district commissioner, could try:-
Matt Fitzpatrick - District scout network commisioner. wallaseyscoutnetwork@outlook.com
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In reply to gd303uk:
I don't know the Breck, never been.
Can I ask, is it a place frequented by other users, besides climbers?
i.e. is it a picnic area, used by dog walkers, cyclists, runners, hikers etc?
I don't know the Breck, never been.
Can I ask, is it a place frequented by other users, besides climbers?
i.e. is it a picnic area, used by dog walkers, cyclists, runners, hikers etc?
In reply to Fredt:
For years it was used by dogs walkers and climbers, it's a very small.
The council did nothing to help clean it up when we started , the BMC. Helped and after the Cheshire guide was out, it became more popular with climbers, , there has always been a little bit of bother with the locals using the breck as a tip and local kids etc but mostly the breck was a great little urban crag .
But in all the years I have been going I have not noticed any old dear looking at overhanging wall, bar me
For years it was used by dogs walkers and climbers, it's a very small.
The council did nothing to help clean it up when we started , the BMC. Helped and after the Cheshire guide was out, it became more popular with climbers, , there has always been a little bit of bother with the locals using the breck as a tip and local kids etc but mostly the breck was a great little urban crag .
But in all the years I have been going I have not noticed any old dear looking at overhanging wall, bar me
Post edited at 09:47
In reply to winhill:
They keep removing posts as I find them, I have mentioned it to the crag mod now,
I will be there next week though to prevent bluebell wall getting painted and chipped.
They keep removing posts as I find them, I have mentioned it to the crag mod now,
I will be there next week though to prevent bluebell wall getting painted and chipped.
Post edited at 09:49
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In reply to gd303uk:
It looks like they thought they were doing some good by cleaning up what they thought was an eyesore. I think Scouts and their leaders are normally well intentioned, but on this occasion have made a big mistake. I expect they won't understand what all the fuss is about.
It would be a good thing if someone in the area offered to take the Scouts bouldering at the crag one evening, show them what it's about, tell them the history. They are more likely to defend the crag and respect it as a crag if they feel a connection with it.
It looks like they thought they were doing some good by cleaning up what they thought was an eyesore. I think Scouts and their leaders are normally well intentioned, but on this occasion have made a big mistake. I expect they won't understand what all the fuss is about.
It would be a good thing if someone in the area offered to take the Scouts bouldering at the crag one evening, show them what it's about, tell them the history. They are more likely to defend the crag and respect it as a crag if they feel a connection with it.
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In reply to Martin Haworth:
This link works:
https://29thwallaseyscouts.wordpress.com/2017/06/08/the-breck/
This link works:
https://29thwallaseyscouts.wordpress.com/2017/06/08/the-breck/
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In reply to Martin Haworth:
Very true,
And kind of ironic that a few weeks earlier the scout group was bouldering with Shauna Coxisey .
Very true,
And kind of ironic that a few weeks earlier the scout group was bouldering with Shauna Coxisey .
In reply to gd303uk:
I dont know this crag at all, but i would have thought the group might engage more positively if the BMC were involved. As it is they might just think its just someone with a grudge. The parents probably think the facebook page is just for arranging lifts and sleepovers and patting each other on the back. They might be quite shocked to find strangers criticising their "good" work out of the blue. A contact from an official body might be more helpful.
I dont know this crag at all, but i would have thought the group might engage more positively if the BMC were involved. As it is they might just think its just someone with a grudge. The parents probably think the facebook page is just for arranging lifts and sleepovers and patting each other on the back. They might be quite shocked to find strangers criticising their "good" work out of the blue. A contact from an official body might be more helpful.
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In reply to toad:
There was similar happened at Holmfirth cliff. The council painted over graffiti with black gloss. Once a bit off pressure was applied the crag was steam cleaned (removing all the paint) and was better than ever. Don't know who organised it all though.
There was similar happened at Holmfirth cliff. The council painted over graffiti with black gloss. Once a bit off pressure was applied the crag was steam cleaned (removing all the paint) and was better than ever. Don't know who organised it all though.
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In reply to BenedictIEP:
I organised it with the jovial support of local climbers in Holmfirth. It was a simple and straightforward process and this should be no different.
I organised it with the jovial support of local climbers in Holmfirth. It was a simple and straightforward process and this should be no different.
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In reply to gd303uk:
Apologies for the delay in responding. I'm the crag's moderator. I've made contact with the Scout group and will update later.
Apologies for the delay in responding. I'm the crag's moderator. I've made contact with the Scout group and will update later.
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In reply to BenedictIEP:
A similar thing happened to a sandstone wall near me. But it a few weeks ago somone (i presume the council?) Pressure washed all the paint off and its as good as new! I dont know if this would work on masonry paint though.
A similar thing happened to a sandstone wall near me. But it a few weeks ago somone (i presume the council?) Pressure washed all the paint off and its as good as new! I dont know if this would work on masonry paint though.
Post edited at 13:08
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In reply to DubyaJamesDubya:
Granny Rock has been chipped and "cleaned" using what looks like a wire brush/angle grinder,
the Over hanging wall area has been pained with anti-vandal paint.
https://www.instagram.com/p/BVIB8YtgqP9/
https://www.facebook.com/gd303uk/posts/10155338971394328?hc_location=ufi
Granny Rock has been chipped and "cleaned" using what looks like a wire brush/angle grinder,
the Over hanging wall area has been pained with anti-vandal paint.
https://www.instagram.com/p/BVIB8YtgqP9/
https://www.facebook.com/gd303uk/posts/10155338971394328?hc_location=ufi
In reply to gd303uk:
I have been contacted by someone from the scout group who, up to now, hasn't wanted to post here.
They say they were asked to do the clean up and that they didn't go anywhere near Granny Rock. It appears that the person/people behind this FB page - https://www.facebook.com/WallaseyBreck/ - is connected to it and may be a better place to voice your concerns than the scout group.
Alan
I have been contacted by someone from the scout group who, up to now, hasn't wanted to post here.
They say they were asked to do the clean up and that they didn't go anywhere near Granny Rock. It appears that the person/people behind this FB page - https://www.facebook.com/WallaseyBreck/ - is connected to it and may be a better place to voice your concerns than the scout group.
Alan
Post edited at 16:22
In reply to Alan James - Rockfax
I was just bringing to light what has happened , the people that need to know do now,
Thanks
I was just bringing to light what has happened , the people that need to know do now,
Thanks
In reply to Alan James - Rockfax:
Did they say who they were asked by? could you post a copy of their E-mail? (redacted for anonymity if required)
Were they asked to replace the graffiti with their own? I could vaguely understand someone painting over graffiti with a stone/brownish colour so that it looks a bit more natural from afar and doesn't stand out but, to then cover it in random doodles that make it look like a proud parents fridge is just stupid.
Did they say who they were asked by? could you post a copy of their E-mail? (redacted for anonymity if required)
Were they asked to replace the graffiti with their own? I could vaguely understand someone painting over graffiti with a stone/brownish colour so that it looks a bit more natural from afar and doesn't stand out but, to then cover it in random doodles that make it look like a proud parents fridge is just stupid.
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In reply to Alan James - Rockfax:
Crikey. Noticed that page had "liked"Shawna coxsey so presumably somebody there is a climber
ETA and indeed ukc and the BMC.
Crikey. Noticed that page had "liked"Shawna coxsey so presumably somebody there is a climber
ETA and indeed ukc and the BMC.
Post edited at 11:41
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In reply to gd303uk:
The breck has always been blighted by ne'er do-wells, leading it to be one of the very few crags in the country to render any guidebooks to it obsolete in a matter of weeks.
That said, bob-a-job week can go and whistle now. Eejits. (Well meaning, but eejits all the same).
The breck has always been blighted by ne'er do-wells, leading it to be one of the very few crags in the country to render any guidebooks to it obsolete in a matter of weeks.
That said, bob-a-job week can go and whistle now. Eejits. (Well meaning, but eejits all the same).
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In reply to gd303uk:
Spoke to the Council/Park Ranger today.
The Wallasey Scout Group didn't touch the granny rock area at all (and why the f*ck they didn't just say that when I spoke to them on FB instead of just repeatedly telling me to speak to the council I have no idea). They simply painted over the graffiti on the overhanging wall and then put their own paint on top of that. This was a joint venture between the Parks dept of the council and the scouting group. The issue was that the same graffiti 'artist' had been adding more and more graffiti to the overhanging wall over a period of weeks/months and the council were concerned that once that person was done with that wall they'd move on to the other walls as well, so this was a temporary solution to stop the original guy until they could decide on a way to clean the paint off the rock (since physical access to the base of the wall is impossible with vehicles).
The council arranged for a contractor to clean the back of the granny rock with a pressure washer *and supervised the work* as they know climbers use the back. Either the contractor simply pushed too hard and caused the damage while cleaning the holds or the chipping was done prior to the contractor going to clean the paint off. Either is possible really since there was a good amount of chipping done late last year on the back of granny rock. The contractor was only given the job after he confirmed he had pressure washed sandstone war memorials/graves and confirmed he knew how to avoid damaging the sandstone. Also worth remembering there was a serious amount of paint there (in terms of layers upon layers over decades of painting) and it may not have been possible to remove it without causing some surface damage. There was no paint on the Positron Traverse handholds anyway so dunno why they would have been washed.
Anyway, tl;dr is the scout group didn't damage granny rock and they aren't going to be doing any more painting.
Spoke to the Council/Park Ranger today.
The Wallasey Scout Group didn't touch the granny rock area at all (and why the f*ck they didn't just say that when I spoke to them on FB instead of just repeatedly telling me to speak to the council I have no idea). They simply painted over the graffiti on the overhanging wall and then put their own paint on top of that. This was a joint venture between the Parks dept of the council and the scouting group. The issue was that the same graffiti 'artist' had been adding more and more graffiti to the overhanging wall over a period of weeks/months and the council were concerned that once that person was done with that wall they'd move on to the other walls as well, so this was a temporary solution to stop the original guy until they could decide on a way to clean the paint off the rock (since physical access to the base of the wall is impossible with vehicles).
The council arranged for a contractor to clean the back of the granny rock with a pressure washer *and supervised the work* as they know climbers use the back. Either the contractor simply pushed too hard and caused the damage while cleaning the holds or the chipping was done prior to the contractor going to clean the paint off. Either is possible really since there was a good amount of chipping done late last year on the back of granny rock. The contractor was only given the job after he confirmed he had pressure washed sandstone war memorials/graves and confirmed he knew how to avoid damaging the sandstone. Also worth remembering there was a serious amount of paint there (in terms of layers upon layers over decades of painting) and it may not have been possible to remove it without causing some surface damage. There was no paint on the Positron Traverse handholds anyway so dunno why they would have been washed.
Anyway, tl;dr is the scout group didn't damage granny rock and they aren't going to be doing any more painting.
Post edited at 16:02
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In reply to gd303uk:
This is the response from the local ranger in full after I contacted him
Hi Mark
Thank you for your email. I can fully understand the concerns of the climbers but hopefully I can put peoples mind at rest. I believe there are two separate issues at The Breck:
a) The Overhanging Wall - Over the past month or so there has been one individual who has been creating a very large (and until recently, ever expanding) piece of graffiti. The graffiti in question was painted with masonry and spray paint and was built up in very thick layers over the rock. As the ranger responsible for the site I was concerned that once this piece of graffiti had been completed he would move onto other walls so felt that an immediate response was required to nip it in the bud. Consequently I asked the local Scout group to paint over the graffiti with brown masonry paint. I see this as a temporary solution and ultimately wish to remove both the graffiti and the paint over it in a manner that does not damage the holds etc beneath. As access with a vehicle to this part of The Breck is impossible I am currently unsure of the best way to proceed with this. Your advice would of course be very welcome.
I can also assure you that the Scouts have not been asked to paint any other area of The Breck and neither myself or the Scouts have any plans to do so.
b) Granny Rock - I arranged for the graffiti on Granny Rock to be removed professionally by a contractor who I was assured had experience of removing graffiti from sandstone war memorials without causing damage and would treat the rock sensitively. At no point was either a wire brush, chisel or angle grinder used. I was present on site as the contractor carried out the work and I believe that considering the thickness of the paint (laid down in layers over decades) he did an excellent job. If any damage did occur during this process I am sure it was only minor but I can only apologise.
More seriously there is undoubtedly damage to at least two hand holds on Positron Traverse. This looks to me to have been caused by deliberate chipping to enlarge the hand holds. Speaking to Martin (the Crag Moderator for the UKC website) this has been something that has occurred over the past year.
I would also like to assure you that I am very much aware of the importance of The Breck as a climbing venue (both historically and currently) and wish to manage and improve the site with this in mind. Climbers are and always will be a very welcome part of The Breck and I do not wish to do anything that impacts negatively on their sport and enjoyment. With this in mind, it would be great to meet on site at some point so I can seek your advice. I shall phone you at some to arrange a meet up in the not too distant future.
Thanks and regards
This is the response from the local ranger in full after I contacted him
Hi Mark
Thank you for your email. I can fully understand the concerns of the climbers but hopefully I can put peoples mind at rest. I believe there are two separate issues at The Breck:
a) The Overhanging Wall - Over the past month or so there has been one individual who has been creating a very large (and until recently, ever expanding) piece of graffiti. The graffiti in question was painted with masonry and spray paint and was built up in very thick layers over the rock. As the ranger responsible for the site I was concerned that once this piece of graffiti had been completed he would move onto other walls so felt that an immediate response was required to nip it in the bud. Consequently I asked the local Scout group to paint over the graffiti with brown masonry paint. I see this as a temporary solution and ultimately wish to remove both the graffiti and the paint over it in a manner that does not damage the holds etc beneath. As access with a vehicle to this part of The Breck is impossible I am currently unsure of the best way to proceed with this. Your advice would of course be very welcome.
I can also assure you that the Scouts have not been asked to paint any other area of The Breck and neither myself or the Scouts have any plans to do so.
b) Granny Rock - I arranged for the graffiti on Granny Rock to be removed professionally by a contractor who I was assured had experience of removing graffiti from sandstone war memorials without causing damage and would treat the rock sensitively. At no point was either a wire brush, chisel or angle grinder used. I was present on site as the contractor carried out the work and I believe that considering the thickness of the paint (laid down in layers over decades) he did an excellent job. If any damage did occur during this process I am sure it was only minor but I can only apologise.
More seriously there is undoubtedly damage to at least two hand holds on Positron Traverse. This looks to me to have been caused by deliberate chipping to enlarge the hand holds. Speaking to Martin (the Crag Moderator for the UKC website) this has been something that has occurred over the past year.
I would also like to assure you that I am very much aware of the importance of The Breck as a climbing venue (both historically and currently) and wish to manage and improve the site with this in mind. Climbers are and always will be a very welcome part of The Breck and I do not wish to do anything that impacts negatively on their sport and enjoyment. With this in mind, it would be great to meet on site at some point so I can seek your advice. I shall phone you at some to arrange a meet up in the not too distant future.
Thanks and regards
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In reply to mark hounslea:
That sounds like they are trying their best to respond sensitively, and I'd certainly like to express my appreciation for their efforts.
That sounds like they are trying their best to respond sensitively, and I'd certainly like to express my appreciation for their efforts.
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