UKC

I thought that there was on thread on here about avoiding ultra processed foods on runs/walks, but I clearly dreamed it.

Was chatting to a mate today about ideas of how you can get calories in on a long distance run/walk and avoid ultra processed foods - like in the rest of life! It seems a weird thing to fill your body with rubbish when it's working so hard.

It must be do able to cram the calories in and avoid ultra processed foods, it's not like Joss Naylor was smashing back the Jelly Babies and gels.

So any words of wisdom or improbable ideas for getting calories in with eating rubbish (without too much weight punishment)?

Very good point! Stole the below from Harvard.eu

• Unprocessed or minimally processed foods are whole foods in which the vitamins and nutrients are still intact. The food is in its natural (or nearly natural) state.  Unprocessed or minimally processed foods would include carrots, apples, raw chicken, melon, and raw, unsalted nuts.

•  Processed foods are essentially made by adding salt, oil, sugar, or other substances. Examples include canned fish or canned vegetables. Most processed foods have two or three ingredients.

• Highly processed or ultra-processed. They most likely have many added ingredients such as sugar, salt, fat, and artificial colors or preservatives. Ultra-processed foods are made mostly from substances extracted from foods, such as fats, starches, added sugars, and hydrogenated fats. They may also contain additives like artificial colors and flavors or stabilizers. Examples of these foods are frozen meals, soft drinks, hot dogs and cold cuts, fast food, packaged cookies, cakes, and salty snacks.

I got this book a while ago

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Feed-Zone-Portables-Cookbook-Go/dp/1937715000

It's very American so need to convert the units, and some ingredients may be tricky to get/need subsidizing. But there's a good range of different types of snacks and lots of info on nutrition. 

Don't make the school boy error I did, trying out a new food snack (savory beef rice cakes) while doing the Cuillin in a day. The rice cakes didn't sit with me at all, fortunately my friend got me through the last few miles feeding me jelly babies. 

Thanks that's brilliant, looks like a great book.

Lots of wisdom in that Cuillin ridge tale! 

I guess making stuff yourself is the obvious, if sometimes inconvenient answer. Time for me is the issue here. 

I have found some bars in supermarket that are just fruit and nut, date and cashew for example. Some of the nut bars are also just nuts and chocolate. 
there is also veloforte which I guess aimed more at cyclists. Unfortunately all seem more pricey but can’t have it all. 
 

Keen to hear other suggestions, as something I too have been looking at recently 

Part of the answer has to be flapjack, if mixing oats and sugar and butter (plus raisins, nuts, whatever) and heat doesn't count as processing. But every batch I make falls to bits. I would love to hear of a recipe for a really cohesive flapjack.

More honey. That's always the answer.

And really squash it down with the back of a fork. 

That book I linked above has quite a few flapjack recipes. I've tried a few and mostly had good results. 

Natural dates with the stone replaced with nuts of your choice - Brazil, walnuts, cashews etc.?

That's a good shout. As are the flapjacks. I'll get baking and experimenting. 

I know some of the American Ultralighters drink olive oil to get the calories in without a weight punishment but I'm not that committed to this idea yet.

Cheese sits in the processed (not ultra-processed) line according to this article from the BHF. That's surely a good go to.

https://www.bhf.org.uk/informationsupport/heart-matters-magazine/news/behin...

Apparently, on average, 56% of the calories consumed by UK adults come from ultra-processed foods

https://www.bbc.co.uk/food/articles/what_is_ultra-processed_food#:~:text=Th....

Guess it depends on how long the run is, but along with cheese a good quality salami/saucisson type thing is a good way to get a load of tasty fatty protein in. 
arguably counts as ‘ultra processed’ by the definition above, but some of them are really just lumps of salty flesh.

hmmmmmmm

∆∆∆∆∆ - this...got this too. And yes, the measurements can be a bit odd but I've defo had some good stuff out of it. 

If you make something using their measurements and it doesn't quite work as you expected, it's easy to adjust for the next time. Because as per MikeR tale, don't try something out for the first time in your actual event! 

Good stuff on this thread guys. Please keep it coming! 

Ordered. Thanks! 

It might be worth having ultraprocessed on runs/walks IF its the easiest way to get the nutrients. Is it actually much worse to fill one's body with "rubbish" when its working hard than when its not?

Possibly more valuable and convenient to just avoid ultraprocessed when not running ie the majority of the time.

How long and what level of exertion?

Are we talking multi-day or a couple of hours?

Agree with this entirely. When you’re active you basically just need to get carbs in, and the simpler foods are to digest the better IMO. This means “ultraprocessed” stuff is often best!

I wouldn't be so sure on the assumptions. Lots of evidence to indicate the negative health impacts of ultra proccesed foods add up pretty quick..

A while back I read a piece on someone doing one of the big American through hikes. Despite the exertion his cholesterol, amongst other metrics was far worse by the time he finished, largely through his reliance on ultra processed, quick and convenient foods, supplemented by 'real' foods (cheese, sausage)

(cheese, sausage) - lets have think here about these two foods and cholesterol. Technically both are also processed...

Multi day is probably more what I'm talking about as I feel the negative impact of such foods would  probably add up more over this time. But I'd also be interested in fuelling and avoiding things like Haribo and Gels on say fuelling 5/6hr + runs.

I think it was my thread and it yielded some good suggestions, including the feedzone portables.

https://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/running/home_made_long_run_snack_recipes-...

I'm operating on the power of baking banana bread - not sure if that counts as "processed" as it involves flour and white sugar (there is a "low fat" version too).

Dried mango is one of my go to energy snacks.

I take your point here, not totally disagreeing but there is a difference between digestibility, simple foods and UPF; something could be simple and digestible but not UPF, obviously lots of commercial things are all three.  

What is your definition of rubbish? Haribos or gels are quite a quick way to turn food into an energy source, if you are wanting to only eat whole foods then you may be making it harder for your body to fuel as it will need to break down the food first to turn it into fuel IMO. This applies to an ultra setting obliviously and not a multi day type thing. If you are walking the PCT then eating gels every day will be very very expensive and probably not good for you!
 

I think a mix of both is generally the best from a gut point of view for a one day event, and you don’t get sick of the taste of one thing being too bland or sweet. 

Macadamia nuts are 76g fat per 100g, so I think they must be about the densest source of energy per gramme after cooking oil.

Dried dates are natures energy gel surely? 75g of carbs per 100g. Taste way better than an energy gel with a similar effect on the gut if you each too many…

On ultras, I've used chocolate covered marzipan bars. Not as sweet and cloying as cake marzipan, and more calories than mint cake (482 vs 379 Kcal). You need a drink, but they sit well with me.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Carstens-Plain-Chocolate-Covered-Marzipan/dp/B081Q...

Also high protein nut butter sachets, several flavours to choose from. Lots of fats, carbs and protein, again higher than mint cake.

https://resilientnutrition.com/collections/all

The only caveat with the above, is the nozzle is a bit small. Its hard to get the product out of the sachet when cold. So I stick them in a pocket, or waist band of my shorts, and after 10 mins they work ok.

With both you can nubble as you go, unlike a gel which is all in one shot.

You’re really disadvantaging yourself if you limit to unprocessed foods. Apart from them being heavy, you’re either likely be eating lots of fiber (depends on your GI) or lots of fat. 

If the intensity is high, you just need simple carbs. There’s no way round it. 

I see you mentioned multi day events. Perhaps worth looking into your calorific needs and your goals. Out of all options, Lucho Dillitos, Chia Charge flapjacks and Spring Energy gels are the least evil. 
 

For a reference, I aim for 90-120g of carbs an hour for both training and racing up to 24hrs. Let’s say 100g/400kcal is a round number and let’s use calorie equivalents (as very few unprocessed foods will have carbs only). For a 20hr run, that’s 1.1kg of macadamia nuts or 2.5kg of dried mango (that also has 60g of fiber).  

I agree, avoiding them does seem to be a huge disadvantage, particularly in terms of weight. I think that your suggestion of 'the least evil', is probably a better way of looking at it.