UKC

Hi,

My mate and I are looking to fit in a 3 or 4 day winter climbing trip over the Christmas vacation or shortly after. We are looking at either North Wales or The lake District for ease of transport and to lower costs (we both live in the south). We both have access to good quality climbing kit (boots, crampons, axes etc) and have spent about 10/11 days in crampons in the alps and Scotland - but under the supervision if an instructor. We are both fairly good summer climbers and have a lot of summer walking experience. We are looking to do maybe a ridge and a couple of gullys, and were wondering what location people would  recommend then beyond that, any specific routes people had in mind.

Cheers, 

Ciaran 

It will come down to whatever the conditions are at the time.  Keep an open mind as to Lakes or N Wales and leave it as last minute as possible to get the best conditions (if there is any snow at all).  The route choice will then also depend on conditions.  You may be lucky and some neve may have formed for gullies but if not and there is snow then go for classic ridges.  Plenty of gullies and ridges to go for in both places.

This - 99 times out of 100 you'll be better off in Scotland, despite the extra costs.

The only option is to make your mind up on the morning of. Do some research as to the differing styles of routes (ridges, gullies etc) to see which may be in condition then keep an eye out in the days preceding for any ascents of them. Folk tend to leave helpful comments regarding conditions in the logbooks on here. This way you'll have an idea of where's best to head as conditions dictate. It's unlikely that any gullies will be 'in' come December however, they tend to need a lot of snow and repeated freeze/thaw cycles which can take a few weeks to complete.. they tend to be latter end of season routes come February/March, especially in Snowdonia and the Lakes.

You can never really 'expect' winter conditions in the Lakes or N Wales.  If it happens to happen when you are there consider yourself lucky (assuming winter conditions are what you are actually after!).  9 times out of 10 at Christmas they will not be in any kind of suitable climbing condition.

Based on past years, I think it's unlikely you'll get prime conditions in the Lakes in the Christmas holidays - though you never know.

Taking it as read that Scotland is the place to be for UK winter climbing, I live near the Lakes and I love it to bits, but I think you're more likely to get enjoyable wintry (that is: not proper winter conditions, but "wintry" conditions) days in Snowdonia than the Lakes due to the hills being higher and there being more options. For example, the North Ridge of Tryfan with just a dusting of snow a couple of weekends ago felt very atmospheric; you can happily kid yourself that it's got an "alpine" feel. There are also more and better ridges in N. Wales, if you're after ridges.

All the advice above is true but by way of a bit more help keep your eye on the Parsley Fern gully (Clogwyn Y Ddysgl) in N Wales and perhaps the Great end area in the lakes. They are amongst the first to come into some kind of condition. Think high and think north facing.