This topic has been archived, and won't accept reply postings.
Good for a first E2? Or, as it's a classic, should I save it to be sure of climbing it in good style?!
Not done many E1s but have done a fair bit of bolt clipping since then, and seem happy onsighting 6b+ when on walls/vert routes. Bit worried about becoming a full time sport fairy, and am looking for some good traditional routes to get inspired by.
Not looking for beta as such, but is there good gear around the tricky bits? From the logbooks it seems plenty of people fall off without serious consequences.
Not done many E1s but have done a fair bit of bolt clipping since then, and seem happy onsighting 6b+ when on walls/vert routes. Bit worried about becoming a full time sport fairy, and am looking for some good traditional routes to get inspired by.
Not looking for beta as such, but is there good gear around the tricky bits? From the logbooks it seems plenty of people fall off without serious consequences.
In reply to gareth uglow:
Almost bombproof but worth saving till you are sure you can do it. Do laps on Cobweb crack to build up stamina and the right sort of finger strength.
Almost bombproof but worth saving till you are sure you can do it. Do laps on Cobweb crack to build up stamina and the right sort of finger strength.
In reply to gareth uglow:
>but is there good gear around the tricky bits?
why? turning into a sports climbing fairy?
>but is there good gear around the tricky bits?
why? turning into a sports climbing fairy?
In reply to JonC: Hmm. So it would seem...
In reply to gareth uglow:
couldn't resist
one I'd like to do as well to be honest - a bit late in the season mind unless this weather continues..
couldn't resist
one I'd like to do as well to be honest - a bit late in the season mind unless this weather continues..
In reply to gareth uglow:
plenty of threads already on this route.....(and i'm not talking about protection).
plenty of threads already on this route.....(and i'm not talking about protection).
In reply to gareth uglow:
Perfect!
Very steady at the grade, great climbing and perfect protection.
If you have good stamina and can onsight most F6b/6b+ routes on bolts, you should cruise it.
> Good for a first E2?
Perfect!
Very steady at the grade, great climbing and perfect protection.
If you have good stamina and can onsight most F6b/6b+ routes on bolts, you should cruise it.
In reply to gareth uglow:
I'd say go for it, if your climbing steep sport then you should have left wall. Its well protected, heck even the upper crux has some good small wires before you commit. The whole thing's just steep is all.
I'd say go for it, if your climbing steep sport then you should have left wall. Its well protected, heck even the upper crux has some good small wires before you commit. The whole thing's just steep is all.
In reply to Silum:
Steep? - it's not even vertical is it?
> (In reply to gareth uglow)
>
> I'd say go for it, if your climbing steep sport then you should have left wall. Its well protected, heck even the upper crux has some good small wires before you commit. The whole thing's just steep is all.
>
> I'd say go for it, if your climbing steep sport then you should have left wall. Its well protected, heck even the upper crux has some good small wires before you commit. The whole thing's just steep is all.
Steep? - it's not even vertical is it?
In reply to 1234None:
Seemed pretty steep all those years ago. You are right, it is not quite vertical though
> (In reply to Silum)
> [...]
>
> Steep? - it's not even vertical is it?
> [...]
>
> Steep? - it's not even vertical is it?
Seemed pretty steep all those years ago. You are right, it is not quite vertical though
In reply to 1234None:
Think 'steep' must be in the eye of the beholder.
(Vertical is 'steep' to me!)
> Steep? - it's not even vertical is it?
Think 'steep' must be in the eye of the beholder.
(Vertical is 'steep' to me!)
In reply to petestack: trad steep and sport steep are not the same!
In reply to 1234None:
haha, I kinda thought someone might jump at that one.
Its pretty much vertical. I say steep a little tongue in cheek...It's near enough vertical for a solid ~50m, thats steep in my book for an E2. I don't think it gets its reputation as one of the most fallen off E2's in the pass simply because of the final 5c flake crack... and its not to do with the great jams all the way up to this point... it's the angle that most people arn't used to for 50m straight. So if your fitness is sport, left wall should be no problem provided you can not get pumped placing gear.
Just my opinion of course, if you found it like a slab well good for you.
haha, I kinda thought someone might jump at that one.
Its pretty much vertical. I say steep a little tongue in cheek...It's near enough vertical for a solid ~50m, thats steep in my book for an E2. I don't think it gets its reputation as one of the most fallen off E2's in the pass simply because of the final 5c flake crack... and its not to do with the great jams all the way up to this point... it's the angle that most people arn't used to for 50m straight. So if your fitness is sport, left wall should be no problem provided you can not get pumped placing gear.
Just my opinion of course, if you found it like a slab well good for you.
In reply to gareth uglow: Its noit an easy E2, its pumpy hvs too half height, a cruxy move while pumped too a hands off rest then the proper crux. Its well worth having a go though. Absolutely know way you will hurt yourself, if you accept the difficulties you will encounter and go for it you have every chance. do it . x
In reply to gareth uglow:
The gear is bomber all the way up. As long as you take advantage of the rests and are capable of going up and down a bit to fully work the the crux (ie up a few moves, place gear, back to the ledge for a rest), then I reckon it must be lower half E2. I founf it tough but noweher particularly desperate (felt more like several 5b moves on the trot rather than 5c) and Ive not done many E2s.
Dont under-estimate the bottom crack.
The gear is bomber all the way up. As long as you take advantage of the rests and are capable of going up and down a bit to fully work the the crux (ie up a few moves, place gear, back to the ledge for a rest), then I reckon it must be lower half E2. I founf it tough but noweher particularly desperate (felt more like several 5b moves on the trot rather than 5c) and Ive not done many E2s.
Dont under-estimate the bottom crack.
In reply to gareth uglow:
It depends on your style. If you're a strong fingered climber that is used to flying up sub 20m routes with vicious cruxes, then it'll feel hard.
But if you're used to long stamina routes with no real hard moves it'll feel about HVS. I fall into the latter category and would definitely recommend it as a first E2. I think most routes on the Cromlech up to this level feel soft if you're fit.
It depends on your style. If you're a strong fingered climber that is used to flying up sub 20m routes with vicious cruxes, then it'll feel hard.
But if you're used to long stamina routes with no real hard moves it'll feel about HVS. I fall into the latter category and would definitely recommend it as a first E2. I think most routes on the Cromlech up to this level feel soft if you're fit.
In reply to sutty:
Hmmmmmm
> Do laps on Cobweb crack to build up stamina and the right sort of finger strength.
Hmmmmmm
In reply to gareth uglow:
You have to trust instincts on this one. If you are feeling confident and don't mind moving quickly above totally bomber runners - go for it. If you are feeling at all tentative, leave it as you can't really rest and physche up once you start on the crux sequence.
You have to trust instincts on this one. If you are feeling confident and don't mind moving quickly above totally bomber runners - go for it. If you are feeling at all tentative, leave it as you can't really rest and physche up once you start on the crux sequence.
In reply to JonC:
The clues in the grade!
> (In reply to gareth uglow)
>
> >but is there good gear around the tricky bits?
>
> why? turning into a sports climbing fairy?
>
> >but is there good gear around the tricky bits?
>
> why? turning into a sports climbing fairy?
The clues in the grade!
In reply to Si dH:
I agree with all that.
> (In reply to gareth uglow)
> The gear is bomber all the way up. As long as you take advantage of the rests and are capable of going up and down a bit to fully work the the crux (ie up a few moves, place gear, back to the ledge for a rest), then I reckon it must be lower half E2. I founf it tough but noweher particularly desperate (felt more like several 5b moves on the trot rather than 5c) and Ive not done many E2s.
> Dont under-estimate the bottom crack.
> The gear is bomber all the way up. As long as you take advantage of the rests and are capable of going up and down a bit to fully work the the crux (ie up a few moves, place gear, back to the ledge for a rest), then I reckon it must be lower half E2. I founf it tough but noweher particularly desperate (felt more like several 5b moves on the trot rather than 5c) and Ive not done many E2s.
> Dont under-estimate the bottom crack.
I agree with all that.
In reply to Jus:
So you think 6a+ for the ususal way?
It would be 6b+ at Foredale Quarry 6c for the direct
> (In reply to snoop6060)
>
> with the direct finish, about 6b. a very long and sustained 6b at that.
>
> with the direct finish, about 6b. a very long and sustained 6b at that.
So you think 6a+ for the ususal way?
It would be 6b+ at Foredale Quarry 6c for the direct
In reply to Yorkspud:
don't know, haven't done it.
maybe the direct would be 6b+ but we're splitting hairs. But then Resurrection's 6c so it can't be.
don't know, haven't done it.
maybe the direct would be 6b+ but we're splitting hairs. But then Resurrection's 6c so it can't be.
In reply to Jus:
6b+. Good stuff, looks harder than that. I thought it would be 6c or 7a.
This is next on my tick list. Feeling pretty confident now! Thats half the battle won.
6b+. Good stuff, looks harder than that. I thought it would be 6c or 7a.
This is next on my tick list. Feeling pretty confident now! Thats half the battle won.
In reply to snoop6060:
It wouldn't be e2 if was 6b+ or above but that'simmaterial E2 5c tells you what you need to know and standing underneath the rest!
Enjoy it, it's really good. I haven't done the direct but Left Wall IS the e2 version.
> (In reply to Jus)
>
> 6b+. Good stuff, looks harder than that. I thought it would be 6c or 7a.
>
> This is next on my tick list. Feeling pretty confident now! Thats half the battle won.
>
> 6b+. Good stuff, looks harder than that. I thought it would be 6c or 7a.
>
> This is next on my tick list. Feeling pretty confident now! Thats half the battle won.
It wouldn't be e2 if was 6b+ or above but that'simmaterial E2 5c tells you what you need to know and standing underneath the rest!
Enjoy it, it's really good. I haven't done the direct but Left Wall IS the e2 version.
In reply to snoop6060: The E3 direct finish is superb; a few fingery cranks but nothing too ridiculous. That said, if you're feeling pumped at this point probably best to scoot off left.
In reply to gareth uglow:
Gear wise you cant ask for more - in fact you probably have to climb past many perfect runners if you want to get close to the top without running out of gear!
If you are used to long sport pitches then it shouldn't be too pumpy. It is the sort of route that you can struggle through and have a bit of a fight on if you are pumped because there is no real danger if you fall and the holds are good. You just have to avoid panic and keep it together with the footwork. The danger with classic routes is to leave them too long due to fear of failure and then find them too easy when you do get round to doing them. In my opinion you only really experience the best of a route if you have to battle a bit to get up it!
LW is probably a solid F6b route so I would say that if you regularly do stamina style sport 6b+/6c onsight then you should get on it asap.
Bruce
Gear wise you cant ask for more - in fact you probably have to climb past many perfect runners if you want to get close to the top without running out of gear!
If you are used to long sport pitches then it shouldn't be too pumpy. It is the sort of route that you can struggle through and have a bit of a fight on if you are pumped because there is no real danger if you fall and the holds are good. You just have to avoid panic and keep it together with the footwork. The danger with classic routes is to leave them too long due to fear of failure and then find them too easy when you do get round to doing them. In my opinion you only really experience the best of a route if you have to battle a bit to get up it!
LW is probably a solid F6b route so I would say that if you regularly do stamina style sport 6b+/6c onsight then you should get on it asap.
Bruce
In reply to gareth uglow:
The direct finish is more logical and better but, as not to blow your o/s do the original l/h finish first, good luck.
The direct finish is more logical and better but, as not to blow your o/s do the original l/h finish first, good luck.
In reply to snoop6060:
In terms of sport grades, I think 6b (for the normal finish) is over-egging it. I often struggle to onsight 6b even on bolts, I reckon LW is 6a+.
In terms of sport grades, I think 6b (for the normal finish) is over-egging it. I often struggle to onsight 6b even on bolts, I reckon LW is 6a+.
In reply to mr mills:
Not really - the original is the original line of least resistance f and the direct is more..well..direct but escapable! They're both slightly flawed as an overall route..but only very slightly.
The Bug on Toiladh is better!
> (In reply to gareth uglow)
>
> The direct finish is more logical and better but, as not to blow your o/s do the original l/h finish first, good luck.
>
> The direct finish is more logical and better but, as not to blow your o/s do the original l/h finish first, good luck.
Not really - the original is the original line of least resistance f and the direct is more..well..direct but escapable! They're both slightly flawed as an overall route..but only very slightly.
The Bug on Toiladh is better!
In reply to Bulls Crack:
I agree, the original certainly isn't flawed, it follows the most obvious line the entire way, and at the top the flake crack thingy trends leftwards toward where it becomes more of a flake. Climbing it seems like the obvious line, if anything the direct is both out of keeping with the rest of the route, and going direct for the sake of it. Hardly a better line.
Straight up doesn't mean more logical.
I agree, the original certainly isn't flawed, it follows the most obvious line the entire way, and at the top the flake crack thingy trends leftwards toward where it becomes more of a flake. Climbing it seems like the obvious line, if anything the direct is both out of keeping with the rest of the route, and going direct for the sake of it. Hardly a better line.
Straight up doesn't mean more logical.
In reply to Silum:
Most climbers I have spoken to prefer the direct finish as do I, this is the same finish as for True Grip. I never said the original finish is flawed. In my opinion the direct finish is the line, you might not agree with this but thats cool, I dont really give a s***t what YOU think !
Most climbers I have spoken to prefer the direct finish as do I, this is the same finish as for True Grip. I never said the original finish is flawed. In my opinion the direct finish is the line, you might not agree with this but thats cool, I dont really give a s***t what YOU think !
In reply to mr mills:
I guess I was taking the word 'flawed' from the previous poster, sorry.
As I've not done the direct i'll take it all back and reserve judgement. I quite like illogical lines afterall
I guess I was taking the word 'flawed' from the previous poster, sorry.
As I've not done the direct i'll take it all back and reserve judgement. I quite like illogical lines afterall
In reply to mr mills:
Most climbers you have spoken to who have done the direct you mean? Well, not having done the direct finish I can't offer a complete opinion - not that you care obviously!
Now, Cenotaph Corner - definitely unflawed.
Most climbers you have spoken to who have done the direct you mean? Well, not having done the direct finish I can't offer a complete opinion - not that you care obviously!
Now, Cenotaph Corner - definitely unflawed.
In reply to gareth uglow: Try to not place too much gear in the lower half and have confidence that the holds will keep arriving and that you can run it out a little more. Otherwise there is a good chance you will get pumped stupid and not make it through. If you can climb quarried grit cracks the top section will be a breeze.
In reply to gareth uglow:
On this similar topic though, I can't understand the reasoning on Cemetery Gates for the 2nd pitch to snake off right. The crack you follow the entire way to the ledge leads to a great finishing crack straight to the top at about 5b.
Done in 1 pitch it is a brilliant combination. Though Joe and Don probably don't agree!
On this similar topic though, I can't understand the reasoning on Cemetery Gates for the 2nd pitch to snake off right. The crack you follow the entire way to the ledge leads to a great finishing crack straight to the top at about 5b.
Done in 1 pitch it is a brilliant combination. Though Joe and Don probably don't agree!
In reply to middlevern:
Argh don't say that!
Right, had better get to millstone for some practice.
> If you can climb quarried grit cracks the top section will be a breeze.
Argh don't say that!
Right, had better get to millstone for some practice.
In reply to gareth uglow:
Would be a fantastic first E2 if you can do it clean as it's such a classic route. The crux is not nails for E2 but not a pushover either so you might want to do some other E2s first just to make sure you don't blow it. Up to you really, do you want to go for it knowing you might not manage it clean or do you want to get on it feeling pretty comfortable? Lots of gear. I got about seven pieces in on the crux as I kept thinking 'this will be my last gear placement for a while' and yet kept finding decent positions from which to place more gear.
Would be a fantastic first E2 if you can do it clean as it's such a classic route. The crux is not nails for E2 but not a pushover either so you might want to do some other E2s first just to make sure you don't blow it. Up to you really, do you want to go for it knowing you might not manage it clean or do you want to get on it feeling pretty comfortable? Lots of gear. I got about seven pieces in on the crux as I kept thinking 'this will be my last gear placement for a while' and yet kept finding decent positions from which to place more gear.
In reply to gareth uglow:
The direct finish is an absolute BARGAIN at E3; two or three moves gets you a bonus E point. If you get to the junction and feel ok, at least consider it. Save a couple of small wires just in case.
The direct finish is an absolute BARGAIN at E3; two or three moves gets you a bonus E point. If you get to the junction and feel ok, at least consider it. Save a couple of small wires just in case.
This topic has been archived, and won't accept reply postings.
Loading Notifications...