UKC

Hey

Going to try this route soon and wanted to get some information on the line it takes in relation to this photo; https://ukc2.com/i/20299.jpg

Apparently it starts up 'Prisoner of Conscience', moves into the crux of 'Bullworker' and then finishes up 'El Chocco'. The problem is that I've never done any of the individual routes so have no idea where the crux on bullworker is and I'm not sure where to cross from POC to BW and BW to EC.

As I've never climbed an 8a before I can't really judge if I've taken the correct line myself by its difficulty. Any information would be great, cheers.

In reply to cha1n:
Pass the LH end of the overlap on POC then head up rightwards to the break and join BW. Do the crux of BW to a good jug then move rightwards into EC.
Good luck.

In reply to cha1n:

Thanks Paul.

In reply to cha1n:

Hardest move for me was the move linking POC into Bullworker. Although, I've never really found the BW crux too hard. RP crux is the last move on Chocco. It's fine on the route Chocco but v.hard at the end of MBK.

In reply to JimmyKay:

Thanks for the reply. I take it you link POC into BW diagonally after the overlap as opposed to traversing at the break?

In reply to cha1n:

Yeah, the route should be pretty obvious when you get on it. Holds are small and the footholds are smaller. But some good hard moves on it.

In reply to cha1n: That's right Ross, Good luck, it's a massive power and stamina battle! POC crux is hard, Bullworker is powerful and slappy. I have seen solid 8a climbers falling off the moves after bullworker into El Chocco over and over and over again. Most people do all three routes individually first, then Prisoners of Bullworker which goes at a solid 7c+, then link everything up, that way you get all the beta inch perfect and the bonus of a few hard ticks.

In reply to Vertigo1:

Cheers Tomar, I might do the individual routes first, I just want to make sure I'm pulling hard and not just worrying about the quick tick!

I went there today and it was absolutely nails, the POC crux took me like 10 attempts to even comprehend what to do and then quite a few goes before I even did it! Tough for a 7b+, especially as I did all the crux moves on tide rising first go and that's a solid 7b+ (imo).

The line is pretty obvious from POC to BW but I'd still like some clarification of how to get into EC. I've done this crude picture to help me describe what I mean:

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8231/8451470164_36656838f0_h.jpg

Red line is (what I think is the line for) MBK, green line is EC and I just want to confirm that the yellow line is not how you get into EC. I couldn't see any way to traverse into EC along that yellow line, it has to be something like the red path I've drawn. I thought the mantel on EC was fairly straight forward once you figure out which crimps to use for the rockover/mantel, although if coming from the left it might need doing differently to EC?

Anyway, nails route, awesome moves.

In reply to cha1n:

Good work. Is the POC crux thin moves in the flake on polished smears/small holds? What did you think about the moves between POC and BW?

In reply to JimmyKay:

PS I thought the line linked slightly lower than the yellow line you have drawn on? The red line doesn't actually move into the EC crux?

In reply to cha1n:

Prisoner is well cruxy though isn't it, got to be hard moves as there's a rest in the break and then an easy top wall.

I'd agree with Jimmy that your red line looks a lot more like bullworker to me than a link into el choccos crux? I'm pretty sure when I've seen people on milky bar kid they've been trying to pull through to get feet above the roof whereas your line looks like it would avoid that entirely, might be perspective though - I'd have thought the red line nearer the 7c+s line.

In reply to AJM:

(on second viewing, red isn't bullworker, which I think goes up the groove and then right to the lower, but I'm pretty sure it isn't milky bar either)

In reply to JimmyKay:

Thanks but I came away feeling pretty deflated to be honest, didn't expect the individual moves to feel so hard!

I did POC with my left hand on the higher mini flake, right hand on the lower mini flake with my right side into the wall and my left foot high and around the bulge a bit. I then did a dynamic rock over/snatch move to the big flake above the first bold. Does that sound about right? I didn't try it with my hands swapped on the flake for some reason, maybe worth a try.

I didn't mind the POC>BW section apart from the crimps were the sharpest on the route. I got through it with a left heel around the top of the big flake and came into some small crimps then some unelegant slaps to get to the break where I assume you can fully recover? The break was sopping wet today so I never bothered fully working the BW crux as I assumed feet in the break would be necessary.

In reply to AJM:

You're right it's neither. BW goes up the easy groove up and left. What's drawn on is a line between the two.

In reply to cha1n:

I thought the bottom section was the hardest part of the route if that gives you any comfort.

In reply to cha1n:

Fair do's about the path from BW to EC, I'm really not sure which way to go atm but as someone said move right from BW once you reach a jug, there isn't a jug until you're level with my yellow line (I've written 'jug' on the image) and there's definitely no way of traversing with hands at yellow line height. It would either have to be lower or higher as I've drawn.

In terms of the line for BW, if this image that I'm using for a topo is correct ( https://ukc2.com/i/20299.jpg ) then I've definitely gone through BW, it might just be hard to tell from the image.

In reply to cha1n:

Brean topo with route names; http://www.ukclimbing.com/articles/page.php?id=81

In reply to cha1n:

Also bear in mind that I've drawn the line for EC central in it's mini roof as opposed to the far left. I mainly did that because I went central when trying the EC crux.

In reply to cha1n: I've only had one brief go on the full link-up, but your red line doesn't look too far out. There's a obvious pocket on the lip of the EC slab to the left of where you normally tackle the crux of that route. Can't remember which hand you take it with, but that's the height you should be moving right into EC from.

ps. POC isn't hard for 7b+, you just need the right sequence and some good shoulder strength. Try One Scream's Enough at Avon if you want to experience what HARD 7b+ is!

In reply to cha1n:

OK, would really love some beta for the Bullworker crux if anyone has some info. It doesn't really help that the break is wet at the moment but I can't quite figure it out.

Obviously, this is relating to getting to the big flake sidepull above the bolt. I can get the flake statically with my right hand but am unable to really move after without falling off. Also, I'd rather get it with my left hand but can't really see any other option that just launching up to it with a high (above the break) foot, similar movement to the POC crux. Thanks for any help.

In reply to cha1n:

Don't bother getting the flake with your right. Use the slopey things on the right, get your feet high (mine were below the break - just - but I've seen somebody use a heel toe cam in the break) and throw for the flake with your left. Move your feet up again (there's a good foot above the break for your left but you need to know where it is before the move as it's difficult to see at full span, you can then flag your right) and make tensiony moves up to a good hold above. Feels unlikely the first couple of times, but it's fine. You just need to find the foot placements that suit you.

Ollie Orange put his right hand on the flake and just shouldered his way up with high feet but I found that impossible.

In reply to gazhbo:

Thanks for the info.

I'd heard a couple of people mention that there was a method going with the right hand so I thought I'd feel it out.

I'll try slapping up with the left hand next time I'm there. My left shoulder is feeling pretty worked at the moment, trying the Wrist Business on Monday, POC crux to warm up then the prospect of another slap into a high sidepull was enough to make me wince a bit! Next time...

In reply to cha1n:

There is more than one way on POC too.
If 2 similar moves is one too much, change one of them (or both).

Good luck.

In reply to cha1n:


Totally off topic but how dry is the remnant? Is it worth going at the weekend for a look at right hand man? How's wrist business progressing?

In reply to AJM:

Have replied to your text Andy but incase anyone else is interested in condition as of Monday...

Home Grown - Wet
The Wrist Business - dry (one seeping undercut but dryable between attempts).
It's a kind of magic - dry.
Right hand man - Head wall dry, some small patches of wet around the top of the groove.
Every day lives - one wet foot near the start.
skullduggery - usual pocket seeping.

stuff further right looked pretty dry but didn't look properly, it has been dry since so would imagine conditions have improved since. Would be handy to get an update from you if you go Andy. Cheers!