UKC

If I have two seconds on a single rope, with one tied in at one end, what is the best way to tie the other in halfway along the rope?

In reply to chris20:

I just use a threaded figure of eight on a bight.

In reply to chris20:

I would say an Alpine Butterfly, but when I had to do this the other day did not have the courage of my convictions, so used a Fig 8 on the bight, so would be interested in the answer.

In reply to chris20:
Someone will probably be along in a bit to recommend the Chris Tan 'Death Knot' - pull a big bight of rope through the harness and step through it like a skipping rope, then pull the slack through and dress it up to make a lark's foot.

Better than that, and only very slightly more complicated, is a 'step through' bowline. It's a bowline on the bight, and again you step through the bight like a skipping rope before threading all the slack back through the knot.

For top-roping though there's really nothing wrong with clipping in with a screwgate, in which case you could tie a small fig-8, alpine butterfly or overhand loop to clip to.

In reply to chris20:

The best answer is use double ropes and a guide plate. Otherwise a figure of 8 on a bight and a locking screwgate works fine.

In reply to J1234:

There isn't really 'an' answer. I would almost always just clip in with a screwgate on a fig. 8 knot but some people seem quite paranoid about gates coming loose and cross-loading so would be reluctant to do this even in seconding situations with minimal chance of high loading. Then you get into knot-only options. In this case I would then use a stoppered bowline-on-the-bight, but some people seem quite paranoid about knots coming undone. The high-paranoia option is one of the step-through knots, such as a larks foot or bowline, but I'd be wary of using any knot I couldn't untie if necessary while standing on a small ledge, as ropes do get stuck from time to time and keeping the option to transfer easily to another one is a genuine rather than just a theoretical advantage.

Choose a knot to suit your own level of paranoia and experience!

In reply to chris20:

In what context? Simulclimbing easy rock will be different from glacier travel or scrambling with short steps of actual climbing.

In the majority of cases I would avoid the step through knots and go with something releasable, e.g. a bowline or butterfly and one or two screwgates, or a bowline on a bight clipped back to the harness.

CB

In reply to deepsoup:

The CTDK 2.0 is also an option https://tinyurl.com/yctte6un

I've used the CTDK a few times on easier routes, definitely not recommended for routes where falling is a possibility. The stopper for the 2.0 adds a bit of back up.

In reply to tspoon1981:
Interesting. I hadn't seen that before.

Seems a bit pointless tbh - it lacks the simplicity of the Mk1 CTDK, which is really its only advantage. May as well go with the step-through bowline. I'm perfectly happy* to lead on that where falling is a possibility (usually on short grit routes where doubling one half-rope saves a bit of faff flaking out the other one as well).

A re-threaded bowline on a bight, essentially identical, is the preferred tie-in for sport climbing for many European climbers.

* - Well not happy exactly, but as happy as I ever am when I think I might fall off.

In reply to john arran:

Thanks for the replies, figure of 8 with a screwgate was what I was thinking but did wonder about an alpine butterfly. It's just for easy single pitched routes, so not expecting any high loading. I did see a suggestion for a slip knot to help avoid cross loading on two screwgates http://ewhewellguiding.blogspot.co.uk/2012/08/strategies-3-climbers-one-rop...

In reply to chris20:

KISS. Use whatever knot you are happy tying 100% reliably. Much as I love the elegance of the Alpine Butterfly, I'd just plump for an overhand in this scenario.

In reply to tspoon1981:



Err if falling is not a possibility why do you need a rope?

In reply to DubyaJamesDubya:
To bring up two seconds who aren't comfortable soloing, using a single rope. I've lead easy climbs which I'd be more than happy to solo, using the CDTK because it's quick and simple, but I wouldn't want to use it on any climb I'd genuinely be concerned I'd fall on.

In reply to john arran:



My paranoia seems to increase with experience