UKC

Hi All,

I'm hoping that this doesn't need to be a premier post as it is a voluntary position.

We are hosting the first British Climbing Cup Championships on 26/09/20. It's shaping up to be a mega event and is basically riding on the goodwill of the climbing community as none of us are taking any payment for any of it. If we were to secure a sponsor then this may change but in a world where nobody has any money for anything we're trying to do our bit to help the competition scene in the UK.

The role is a typical head judge position. We'll need someone that has a good understanding of the competition environment but specific judging experience is not necessary. We will give all the info that's needed for the role and you'll have the support of our team for any awkward decisions etc.

If you are interested in volunteering as the head judge for the event then please email us on info@britishclimbingcup.co.uk or message on Instagram.

Thanks a lot!

???????

Can you be explain what this event is, what it is about, where it will be held and who is behind it. 

You should also make it clear this not a BMC organised event. The website also says nothing

And the BMC own the right to "British" in the context of climbing competitions.

Hi Both. It is not a BMC organised event. It is fully backed by the BMC/Team GB and they are very keen for the event to take place in order to give the team some much needed comp practice!

What is the event: An invite only Bouldering competition
What is it about: Bouldering
Where will it be held: Rockcity in Hull on their brand new comp wall
Who is behind it: A team of people keen to help the competition scene in the UK

Thanks for the interest.

Could you tell me more about what makes it a mega event?

Who is "we"? Who is "our team"? Do any of the "team of people keen to help the competition scene in the UK" have names?

I'm sure this is not your intention, but you're coming across as weirdly shady about who you actually are.

Maybe if you were willing to fill in the blanks a bit, people would be more enthused.

At the moment, for example, it's impossible to tell from this post (or your website, or your Facebook page) whether anyone involved has any experience running a comp before. You might all be awesome, but we have no way of knowing.

Wow, the negativity on here is truly impressive. I have no problem with anyone knowing my name, I'm Simon Wadsworth. Not that that really means anything to most people so seems slightly pointless writing it down. Mark English is the owner of the venue, the British team (and a few ringers) are the climbers and the setters are well known national and IFSC gang. The broadcast will be done by my company (for free) to provide exposure for the event.

So sad that the immediate response is "weirdly shady", "tell me more about what makes a mega event" etc. I expected things like "sounds great how can we help!". 

Maybe my faith in the climbing community was misplaced. I didn't come here for an argument, I came here to get people involved in helping the future of UK competition climbing. I know I can't transform things overnight but that's no reason to do nothing. In these tough times we should be pulling together not trying to shoot each down.

Hi Simon, you called it a mega event in your OP!  I was just curious as to what made it so.

Whilst your here, how come the head judge doesn’t need past judging experience?

I'm hoping the best climbers in the country, the best setters in the country, the best climbing broadcast provider, a new scoring system that actually makes sense and a brand new climbing wall built by one of the best wall builders in the country should add up to a mega event. Unless you don't like comp climbing, in which case you might disagree.

The head judge doesn't need past judging experience but they will need to have "a good understanding of the competition environment". For example, someone like Dave Barrans has enough comp experience to be considered for the role even though he may not have been a judge before (disclaimer, I don't know if Dave has or has not had any judging experience and he won't be considered for the role as he's competing in the comp).

It's not "impressive negativity" for people to ask simple, obvious questions like "what is this event and who is organizing it".

If that's enough to shake your faith in the climbing community, it seems rather fragile.

Hi Simon

Just to confirm when you say it is backed by the BMC and with reference to Graeme’s comment can you kindly confirm that you have express BMC approval for the title of the event.

Sounds awesome.  Will you be providing free popcorn?

I would have thought that some kind of judging experience would be required to be a judge, let alone a head judge. Were all the best route judges in the country busy? Might give rise to some good old controversial decisions though, bonus entertainment!

The problem is the lack of information in your website and your initial post.  You can't just claim to host the 'British Climbing Cup' without saying who you are.

Climbing is an organised sport these days with a recognised National Governing Body which is the BMC.   There's a highly experienced set of volunteers from BMC and Mountaineering Scotland competitions - including Chief Judges.   

Why not tap into the expertise and enthusiasm of the existing competition scene?  You've already got a good chunk of the BMC climbing team involved.

Call me cynical but it sounds to me as though the expensive new climbing wall in Hull needs some urgent publicity to get people through the doors and paying off an expensive bank loan.

Why don't you pay for publicity like everyone else?

Err, the wall that has been there since 1994?

‘Simon Wadsworth’ is the exact name I would choose if I were to choose a parody climber name. 
 

Also on this forum people don’t give a f*ck about anything serious it’s just a place to make dad jokes, and ignore serious issues, that is unless there’s a chance to prove someone wrong, so don’t take it personal. 

Rock City built a brand new competition wall earlier this year.

This doesn't make any sense at all. A head judge implies the presence of other judges; presumably an odd number overall to prevent split decisions.

Take the following recent and internationally important case: climber X appears to have briefly and accidentally stepped on a bolt. If in our case any video evidence is insufficient, then two things have to be ruled on by the judges: 1. Did he/didn't he? 2. If yes, did it give him an unfair advantage? 

Supposing we have two other judges, respectively equally convinced of "yes" and "no". It's obviously up to the head judge to make the final ruling; that's what he/she's there for. Here however, he/she has possibly no judging experience, and has to rely on "the support of our team for any awkward decisions". Result: a free-for-all of opposing opinions, with our Head Judge in the middle. 

I'd alter your application requirements, if I were you. 

Also: if your chosen judge is going to travel to Hull and back, staying there presumably for at least one night, he/she is not going to be enthusiastic about doing it all for free, especially if you are doling out "the largest pot of prize money in the UK" (or words to that effect), as advertised on FB. 

Not how it works. You have 1 (or poss 2) judges on each problem. The head judge / jury president will be in overall control of the judging and will only be called on to adjudicate should a dispute arise as to the score given by the route / problem judge.

Don't worry about experience; I reckon the head judge will have had significant experience (as will several of the other judges).

In reply to:

Jeez, if there wasn't 'impressive negativity' when Simon first made that comment people answering since have certainly made up for it!

Someone wants to set up a comp for climbers who want a comp in a wall that wants to hold a comp and all we get is a bunch of bumblies with no interest in comps (GA excepted obviously) concerned about the minute of the rules. What with this and and the BMC thread it seems people are more interested in burying themselves in rules, process and red tape.

So you have used the new scoring system before

Ive got 2 masters level qualifications; one in accountancy and the other in teaching Maths. I'll cope (should I end up doing it). You cheeky git.

The thread is about being a Head Judge at a comp, I think it is very approriate for that person to bury themsleves in Rules

I was thinking more of the lead competition, but in the case of the bouldering: the Head Judge would have to be observing several competitors simultaneously, not just one, which doesn't sound like a job for someone with no specific judging experience. 

I too am sure that they'll end up with a highly qualified and capable person, and that the initiative is to be applauded. However: these first contacts (website, FB, UKC) with the climbing community could have been better and more professionally thought through and presented. 

Absolutely it would be and if I thought, slab_happy, Tom in Edinburgh, McHeath et al had the remotest interest in being that person then I wouldn't have said anything. 

It works the same whether lead or boulder. Route specific judge, then appeals to the head judge, who will have briefed both competitors and judges pre- comp.

Agreed the PR so far as not been great, but let's at least try to let them run and broadcast a good comp, and support their efforts; it's being done for the benefit of the competitors, who are after all the most important people at any comp.

Nope, the head judge does not try and watch all of the boulders, they sit bit and have an overview of the event. They might focus on one particular boulder if there isan issue with that boulder eg a tricky start (from a judging perspective). But they don't watch everything.

OK, thanks (also to Graeme) for clearing that up for me! I'd always wondered exactly how the judging is divided. 

Would I need to send you my bank details?

I can confirm that Si Wadsworth is real, his company have done the webcasting at the CWIF for maybe the last 5 years, plus they have done the BBC a few times and they did the European Lead & Speed Championships last year in Ratho.

In climbing terms he is handy but not exactly a Wad (Sorry Si!).

The first three fundamentals of entering any competition are:

1. Read the rules

2. Read the rules

3.Read the rules 

If you are using a new scoring system and/or format, why are the rules not available via your  website?

Can you provide a link to them so athletes and the viewing public can become familiar with them.

will you be looking to do one for the gb para team in bouldering some of us love bouldering and it would be nice to see if we could also be included in invite only events... just asking ...