UKC

I feel I should know this but I was confused about it so any help appreciated.

As an old trad climber I have been going to Brimham for 40 or 50 years. I have climbed the same routes innumerable times. The VS's Birch Tree Wall (VS 4c), Rough Wall (VS 5a), Allan's Crack (VS 4c), and maybe even The Black Chipper (E2 5b) back in the day. I would roll up with all my trad gear and a partner and if someone was on the route already you just waited. Sure in the knowledge that soon they would move off and you would start to climb. You might even have a bit of banter with the climbers already on it.

For the first time ever the other day I travelled the 50 or so miles specifically to do some bouldering at Brimham. I have never gone to a crag before without my trad gear. And there was a boulder problem I specifically wanted to look at although I knew it would probably be way too hard. Groups of young boulderers were everywhere having a great time.

When I got to Whisky Galore (f7A) the bay it was in was crowded with pads and a group were trying that and other problems on the wall. They were all young and super fit.They looked like they were going to be there for the rest of the day.  I thought " do I just queue up nearby and wait or do I ask how long they are going to be? " In the end I couldn't get near because of all the pads. I just didnt know what the proper etiquette was and so feeling old, weak and self conscious I sloped off and messed about elsewhere. After a while I went back to look again but the group were still there.

A couple of old trad climbers who had just had a hard time on Rough Wall plodded past, probably en route to Birch Tree Wall. They were festooned with gear, helmets, ropes and rucksacs. They looked out of place. That's what I usually look like I thought. A relic.

So my question is what is the proper etiquette when you want to try a problem and others are on it for a long time?  

The phase you are looking for is 'hey guys, mind if I get involved too?' or 'mind if I stick another pad on the pile?'. They will almost certainly say 'yeah sure, go for it'. Banter will ensue as most of you fail to climb it to start with. You all share beta and have a jolly old time and maybe someone will get to the top.

I'm surprised that nobody asked if you wanted to get on the problem too, but sometimes when in a group you get so focussed you don't notice everything else going on around. I suspect it's mild thoughtlessness rather than willful exclusion.

Most boulderers are really friendly, just smile and go for it.

Agreed. For me, part of the joy of bouldering is groups of unconnected climbers working problems together. Indeed, would hope the group in the OP’s case would have welcomed him into that section of the crag had they asked. 

That said, can understand why some people might not feel comfortable even asking. 

I wish I had asked now, after reading what you just replied. I didn't know how they would react. Also I suppose I would have been embarrassed at not being able to get off the deck! But I just wanted to try it. 

I must say though it was great to see how climbing has developed into something young people want to do in these little groups and at how technically good they are. The old trad guys really did look like a thing from the past on this particular day.

Don't be intimidated. We see you guys as brave old pre cam man. Climbing things years ago that still intimidate today only with a piece of hemp and some weighty moacs. In our eyes you are already a hero, whether you can get off the deck on some 7A matters not.

Thanks for such a great reply! Very encouraging. I will go again and try the approach you suggest.....though I don't have a pad!

Just find a problem with a jamming crack in it.  That'll put all the strong youngsters firmly in their place

Indoors I take a fairly 'rigorous' view that next person to try a section of wall ( eg there may be two different problems on the same panel) is the person who's been waiting longest at the problem. 

So if I rock up at a problem I'll wait for all those present to have a go and then I'll have a go, and so on.

Outdoors it'll depend a bit on how busy it is, but quite often I'll take a similar approach if it's rammed, eg Elephant at Easter.  You'd be waiting all day if you weren't a bit pushy.

If it's not so busy and a group are obviously camped out on a project them I'll leave it longer, but would still go and try it at some point.

It is sometimes intimidating, and of course being pushy and failing ain't a great look, but most people are usually very friendly and engaging.

Haha. This is exactly what would have put me off. That moment of "I guess I'll take my mat off the pile now then".  But I reckon all sympathy would be friendly banter. 

Boulderers generally have loose, informal herd-like social structures but they're not super bright or observant.  Put a beany on, loosen your belt, join in the "bants" and in a few minutes they'll accept you as one of their own and you can get on the problem.

Would it help to throw in a few phrases like 'rad', 'send' or 'dude'?

Shoulda just bardged in and sent it with a bunch of hexes clanking off your Whillans. That woulda learnt them young whipperslappers. 

I'm relatively young and fit, and a boulderer, of the kind that might be found doing 7As etc. If an old chap or lady came up and asked if they could have a go I think my mates and I would be only too eager to encourage them, and we'd watch what they did with interest and a good amount of respect. Anyone going around at an age who is cracking at 7As is someone to learn from and probably going to have done mean, hard things that I wouldn't stand a chance on.

There are some nice replies here. The only thing I would add is that you shouldn't feel embarrassed if you can't get off the deck. If the group is projecting a 7A there is a real chance that people in the group won't have got off the deck on their first try. 99% of the time the group will be supportive and might even suggest different ways to approach the problem. 

Agree with this. It's paradoxical, typically the person joining the group and trying the problem will want to do well and not embarrass themselves, whilst most people in the group will instead be relieved when you don't just waltz up it first go and feel grateful that you make it look as difficult as they are finding it!

That fear of failure or looking stupid is really natural, but 99% of the time no-one except yourself will think you look like an idiot. Granted 1% of the time they may be arseholes, but then who cares what they think anyway! 

If I'm projecting a boulder problem, I don't mind if someone does it first time. There's a good chance you'll learn some beta from how they climb it. 

Sure, me neither. I guess most people don't mind either way. My point was simply that your negative projections of what other people will be thinking are almost certainly wrong, and no one will be looking down on you or judging. 

Funnily enough I benefited from this recently. Turned up alone and got chatting with a keen local. Super keen to share suggestions and beta. In the end we ended up with a small group of 2 blokes closer to retirement, 2 in their 30s maybe and a teenager. Good group sharing psyche with a fair spread of grades. Climbing's a wonderful thing.