/ BMC South West Area Meeting – Saturday 14 September 2013

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BMC Office - on 05 Aug 2013
Come along to the next meeting, to discuss the latest issues and get involved in the work of the BMC.

Saturday 14 September, starting at 7.00pm, at The Dolphin Hotel, Bovey Tracey

See the BMC Local Areas site for more details:
Derby Grit - on 01 Sep 2013
"Agenda and further information to follow in due course" ...

- so is the Agenda etc... available yet?

BMC Office - on 03 Sep 2013
The agenda and other relevant documents are available to download on the BMC Local Areas site:

1. Welcome and Apologies for Absence
2. Minutes of the Previous Meeting & Any Matters Arising
3. BMC Drilled Gear Policy (Feedback on the latest draft)
4. Dry Tooling Debate
5. 2013 Cornish Climbing Festival (review)
6. Access & Any Local Issues (bolts on Carn Gowla)
7. Any Other Business
8. Date of Next Meeting
steve taylor - on 03 Sep 2013
In reply to BMC Office:

Although I won't be around to attend the meeting, can I have an AOB item added?

A small number of routes at Blacknor South have been retrobolted outside of the guidance of the Dorset Bolt Agreement - i.e. FA permission has not been sought. These routes are in the Jutland area. As the FA is known for these (Ian Kestin and Murray Hodgson), the bolter should have attempted to make contact with them. Should this have proved impossible, then the retrobolting should have been proposed at a SW Area Meeting and voted upon. To my knowledge, this hasn't happened.

Really, the bolts should be removed as the correct process hasn't been followed. However, can I ask that a vote is taken to determine whether the bolts should remain, or be removed (cleanly)?

As I said, I can't be at the meeting, so would appreciate someone making this proposal on my behalf.

Steve Taylor

Derby Grit - on 10 Sep 2013
In reply to steve taylor:
They're going to ask which routes you're talking about Steve, will you post a list please
steve taylor - on 10 Sep 2013
In reply to Derby Grit:

Jutland (FA J Whitely) has been fully retroed. It has been climbed as a trad route several times as the gear is quite good.

Scoop (FA Murray Hodgson) has effectively been retroed by the claimed new routes "Eating Bush" and "Princess Bolting", claimed as new routes by "NG and PF" who are presumably the same people who bolted Jutland. These "new" routes have since been climbed many dozens of times (lots of ticks in the UKC logbooks).

Note that the route called "Well Done Poppet" in the Dorset Rockfax is a retro of Murray Hodgson's Scoup. If we are to be consistent, then the bolts in Scoup should also be considered, though they have been in there for 18 years and the route will have bene climbed in its bolted state 1000+ times.
Colin Knowles - on 12 Sep 2013
In reply to steve taylor: Steve, thanks for bringing this up. Real examples of this kind are a great help in discussing the general issue. I can't call what the meeting will agree to do about these specific routes.
steve taylor - on 12 Sep 2013
In reply to Colin Knowles:

Hopefully those who feel strongly either way will make the effort to attend.

Derby Grit - on 12 Sep 2013
In reply to BMC Office:
Are the minutes of the last meeting available anywhere to read before Saturday?
BMC Office - on 13 Sep 2013
In reply to Derby Grit:

The minutes of the previous South West Area Meeting (1 June 2013) are on the BMC Local Areas site:
Rob Kennard - on 13 Sep 2013
In reply to steve taylor: Just to be clear Steve, do we know that the first ascentionist haven't been asked? Is there anyone who knows how to contact them if they haven't?
Frank the Husky - on 13 Sep 2013
In reply to Rob Kennard: What about the proposal to put lower offs in at Brean Down (see UKC thread a week or so ago)?
steve taylor - on 13 Sep 2013
In reply to Rob Kennard:

Hi Rob - I've taken the initiative and contacted Murray Hodgson myself (it took 30 secs to find contact details online).

He's confirmed that the bolter didn't contact him. However, he's OK if the bolts stay in on his routes, but asks that the names he gave them should stick.

So "Well Done Poppet" should revert to being called "Scoup".

"Princess Bolting" and "Eating Bush", which cover the start and finish of "Scoop", should also be renamed - no idea how though - "Scoop Direct" and "Scoop Indirect" maybe or Scoop Left/Right?

John Whitely, FA of Jutland, is harder to find - all I know is that he used to work at Kingston Maurward. If the meeting could come to a concensus on this one, that would be great.

The CC Portland guide has all of this information in it. It's a bit naive of the bolter to consider that these lines wouldn't have been bolted 18 years ago for some good reason, and all he had to do was ask.

Rob Kennard - on 13 Sep 2013
In reply to steve taylor: Thanks for that Steve.
That's very magnanimous of Murray...and hopefully the retention of the original name will act as a deterrent to over-zealous new-routers. As you say it's all there in black and white in the CC book. Is it worth posting on here as to the whereabouts of Mr Whitely?
steve taylor - on 13 Sep 2013
In reply to Rob Kennard:

Hi Rob - if anyone knows of John Whitely's whereabouts, let me know. Doesn't Neal Burton work at Maurward - he might know. I'm happy to contact John if anyone can find his details.

The Ex-Engineer - on 13 Sep 2013
In reply to BMC Office: Two issues...

First - yet again, I did not receive a copy of the minutes of the last SW Area Meeting that I attended. I am not sure what the point is of taking a register of those attending, including email addresses if it is not to email out a copy of the minutes so that those who were there can check in a timely manner that they are a true and accurate record of the meeting.

Second - yet again, you have failed to detail the procedure for registering apologies. It is not listed in this thread, nor on the BMC website, nor on the agenda.

A SW climber currently somewhere in the Zagros Mountains
Frank the Husky - on 14 Sep 2013
In reply to Colin Knowles: Hi Colin, regarding lower offs at Brean Down. Will these be discussed?
Derby Grit - on 14 Sep 2013
In reply to BMC Office: Thanks "BMC Office" from me and no doubt a few others.
Might I suggest that minutes of 'the previous meeting' be made available alongside any other documents for a meeting? - thanks
Helen Heanes - on 15 Sep 2013
In reply to BMC Office:
Where and when is the next meeting going o be?
Helen Heanes - on 09 Oct 2013
In reply to BMC Office:

I've just looked at the meeting notes to see when then next meeting is. They say Saturday 14 Nov in Bristol. But 14 Nov is on a Thursday, so please can you confirm where and when this meeting is.
Thanks Helen
Ian Butterworth - on 10 Oct 2013
In reply to Helen Heanes: The meeting is on Thursday 14th November starting at 7.00pm at the Nova Scotia, Bristol BS1 6XJ.

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