UKC

Hi 

Can anyone shed some light on the Swedish grading system, I've noticed at Hallinden on UKC  that they list the routes as n6 or n7 etc, is the number equal to the french grading system number and the n means something in Swedish,although I thought a lot of it was trad so maybe that's their trad grading system, any help would be appreciated

Cheers 

In reply to riff156:

Different system. I'm sure somebody will shed more light, google it. 

Remember that lots of countries ( in fact everywhere but the uk) use the same system for both sport and trad. 

In reply to riff156:

The n stands for Norwegian. A lot of the Swedish crags were developed by climbers who came down from Norway. 

In reply to riff156:

See https://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/comptable.html - the Bohuslan grades are suposedly the same as Norwegian, but comparing them them to Lofoten, I found them harder, i.e, n6- in Bohuslan would probably be given n6 if it were in Lofoten.

In reply to Mark Kemball:

I used to think that but there doesn't seem much in it now that my jamming has improved.

In reply to Mr. Lee:

Well, we stopped off at Bohuslan on the way home from Lofoten, lots of jamming at both places, and found Bohuslan harder...

In reply to riff156:

I climbed there for a week a few years ago. I found the grades a little harder than the Rockfax chart suggests. N6- was usually E1, 6 E2, 6+ E3 and 7- E4. This was on well protected routes (most of the good routes were cracks and gives with lots of gear).

We did spend 1 day at a crag I forget the name of (home of Herrinfrukost and Silunchen) where everything seemed to be desperate for the grade, but well protected and very good. They were the earlier routes in the area.

In reply to Mark Kemball:

Norway's like the UK in that some places are harder for the grade than others. Maybe Lofoten is at the easier end. Generally on the whole though I'd say Bohuslän compares fairly similar to Norway.

In reply to riff156 Bohuslän is in Sweden and got Swedish grades (which is more less the same as norwegian). No idea why its says n6, n7 in ukc. It should read sv6, sv7.  As stated lofoten is soft and an outlier at least in northern norway. Ive found Lofoten n6 equalls 6- in Bohuslän (which should equal f6a but feels harder)

In reply to DanielJ:

I think n is for Nordic

In reply to harold walmsley:

Yes, albeit it should be Scandinavian (ie. Swedish or Norwegian) and Nordics also include Finland, and their grading is a bit off (plus or so).

As for grading, it's the same as is used in even Lofoten Rockfax... and Bohuslan really isn't harder, the difference is that Bohuslän tends to be steeper... so will wear you out (unlike say Nissedal or Lofoten slabs).

In reply to riff156:

We’ve been climbing in Bohuslan for couple of weeks now. Grades a bit random - n6- anything between HVS 5a and E2 5c, but usually about E1 5b. Have found some n6 routes easier than n6-. Haven’t done a poor route yet, great rock in really beautiful settings, with easy approaches. Take plenty of cams!

In reply to Gary Latter:

I've always thought of it a bit like climbing steep grit, it's often bang straight on the rock at that grade, no warming into it etc.. better to pick an easier line to warm up on and potentially keep a grade in hand until you get the feel for a given crag.  

In reply to HeMa:

Not so sure about this. Ive got a short sportsclimbing background climbing mostly steep-ish stuff and always hated slabs due to my crappy footwork. Still found n6 in Lofoten more or less same as 6- in Bohuslan.

 

In reply to DanielJ:

Bohuslän is indeed graded slightly harder. I found the easier routes (below 6) quite easy for the grade, but some of the harder quite hard. Even for an experienced crack climber. More on grades in Scandinavia:

https://www.norsk-klatring.no/Impulser/Ute/En-grad-til-begjaer

In reply to DanielJ:

It's not the steepnes per se, but steep and sustained that will get you. In Lofoten, the slabby nature means that you can rest almost anywhere, and with slab it's the angle of the rock, not the climbing (most of the lines in Lofoten still follow cracks, just like in Bohuslän).

And like I said, I have always found the grades to be more or less in line. Sure, some of the multipitch stuff might be a tad easier (not always), but single pitch vise they are about spot on.

That said, haven't climbed numerous 5s or 4s in Bohuslän (unlike in Lofoten), but 6s onwards it seems to hold true.

 

In reply to Harald:

Oh,

And perhaps one reason for the 'feel' that Bohuslän is harder might have to do with how the grading system is utilized... as in does it take into account overall pump or not.

Eg. Fire forsak (n7-) in Lofoten has maybe 2 hard moves before and after easier climbing. Where as Jum Jum (n7-) has a tad longer crux sequene plus also more sustained climbing afterwards. 

Still, both have the same grade of 7-, which is spot on for the crux... But overall, Jum Jum might feel harder due to the more sustained nature.

Oh, and most harder lines in Bohuslän are finger-cracks, which makes them much more size dependent than the wider stuff in Lofoten (hands, fists).

In reply to DanielJ:

Yes, I would say that Swedish grades are slightly softer, but not by much. I seem to recall that my old spiral-bound Göteborg guide had a conversion table for Swedish and Norwegian grades. The reason for the n is presumably to be clear about which of the two scales it is. There is no unified Nordic grading.

 

In reply to HakanT:

My understanding is that you all nicked them from the Germans - like many other bad ideas in Nordic history   so really they're all just bastardised UIAA grades. I've also found Norwegian grading massively inconsistent even crag to crag, let alone area to area.

My memories of the my limited climbing is Bohuslan is that the grades were fine, they are all considerably easier than Finnish grades of the same number, e.g. Bergkirstis polska (n6-) is 6- I reckon it would be 5 in Finnish grades. 

Anyway, hasn't Sweden caved to the hegemonic power of 27 Crags and just given everything a French grade now anyway?

 

In reply to DanielJ:

It's the same grading system in Norway and Sweden as far as I understand. Comparing Lofoten to Bohuslän is like comparing Pembroke to Swanage. It doesn't mean English grading is harder than Welsh just because most people find Swanage harder.

In reply to riff156:

The grading system in Sweden and Norway is definitely the same, and started off as sandbagged UIAA grades. More or less all important figures on the Scandinavian climbing scene has put up routes in both countries, applying the same system wherever they go. Did Doseth or Lundahl use different scales on different sides of the Scandes? Of course not!

Of course grades varies from crag to crag, as they do in France (e.g: anyone trying to convince themselves that a 7a on the left bank of the river Verdon is as difficult  as a 7a on the right bank is seriously deluding themselves).

The grades in Lofoten are way easier than in most places in Scandinavia.

In reply to TobyA:

The Bohuslan guidebook uses the Swedish grading system, but does give a conversion table to French and Yosemite Decimal.

 

In reply to TobyA:

Most things come from Germany, including your Royals . 

For sport climbing, we started moving to French grades decades ago. 

I dropped 27 Crags after their rather draconian update to their T&C and data policy.

In reply to TobyA:

27crags coverage of Bohuslän is very thin on the routes front as far as topos go. Borderline useless for planning a long trip. I'd say Gryttr.com is better for bouldering as well. 

In reply to riff156:

Well worth buying the guidebook https://www.vpg.no/dvd-b%C3%B8ker/187830/klatref%C3%B8rer-klatring-i-bohusl... It was on sale in the local supermarket when we were there.

In reply to Mr. Lee:

It's changing, as Petter and Hannah are gradually publishing all the topos from their guidebook onto 27crags as Premiums...

The main crags are already there... https://27crags.com/areas/bohuslan

That being said, at the moment, the paper topo is still the way to go.

In reply to HeMa:

Is that a bloody bolt on the front page picture!?! What is the world coming to! Moan moan moan.

 

 

In reply to TobyA:

Seems so... https://27crags.com/crags/sjohaller/routes/svarta-svanen

So around 6c+/7a trad with one bolt in 20m...