UKC

I noticed Decathlon's Simond range is much cheaper for climbing equipment than other brands. How does this compare to the main brands (DMM, Wild Country etc.)? Particularly in terms of safety? It is all so much cheaper but if there is any doubt in the quality of it then its just not worth it.

Thanks!

In reply to Rebecca Hazel:

If its got the right stamps on it (ratings etc) then why be concerned about the safety?

In reply to Rebecca Hazel:

It's fine.

In reply to Rebecca Hazel: All climbing equipment sold in the UK (and EU) is tested and is safe. The actual hardware isn't that much cheaper than the standard products other brands produce. You pay more for very light bits of kit, and subtle features some climbers may appreciate.

There's nothing wrong with it.

In reply to Rebecca Hazel:
Simond used to be an independent company based in Chamonix, although I suspect little known outside France. Not quite sure when, but in 2008 they were bought by Decathlon who now sell Simond products, see http://www.simond.com/

I've used some of their gear & it seems fine (both before & after the Decathlon takeover)

In reply to Doug:

Actually Simond were very well known in this country during the 1980s. Their Chacal ice axe was often the tool of choice for those of us doing hard mixed routes.

In reply to Rebecca Hazel:

I have a Simmond climbing helmet, also rated for bikes. It is lightweight and comfy... and cost me £30!
Nothing wrong with it as far as I am concerned!

In reply to Rebecca Hazel:

My £40 soft shell trousers are every bit as good as my £140 Mammut ones.

Al

In reply to Bob:

Should have remembered that, I still have one in the cellar (as well as a Barracuda) bought when I was living in Aberdeen in the 80s

But was any of there other gear imported? - I can only remember those two ice tools

In reply to Doug:

I had some Simond crampons around 2002ish. They were pretty good, but more suited to steep ice than I needed so I sold them on to someone who was actually a good climber.

In reply to Doug:

Seem to remember karabiners but not much else. No doubt there was stuff.

In reply to Doug: The Piranha ice axe was definitely also sold in the UK. The first krabs I bought (apart from my first beley krab) were Simond, bought about 1999/2000 from Nevisport.

In reply to Rebecca Hazel:

They are UIAA and CE rated, so no worries there.

They use more simple construction methodes. Easily seen on there ice axes, carabiners, etc. Looks like tubes and rods, bend and pressed to make the main shape, instead of fancy hot forging and such. So not as nice looking, but perfectly functional.

In reply to Rebecca Hazel:

Even for alpine weight weenies they do a 20L alpine sac for £13. Why spend a fortune of Arcteryx or Patagonia........

https://www.decathlon.co.uk/cliff-20-ii-blue-backpack-id_8302352.html

In reply to Rebecca Hazel:

It's nice to see that climbing doesn't come with the kind of snobbery that plagues other sports.

Maybe it's because most climbers are skint!

In reply to Rebecca Hazel:

Simond have clearly aimed at the budget end of the market in recent years providing some solid value for money kit, some of which I'd recommend above any competitors - namely their abolakov threader and their rigid, double karabiner ice screw racking device

In reply to Rebecca Hazel:

The only thing really wrong with it is that buying it supports neither Independent retailers or manufacturers, not that I'm a great paragon of virtue, my latest rock shoes where Simond as my difficulty and current regularity of climbing does not justify spending c £100 on shoes when 55 will do.

In reply to Bob:

In a 1981 Tiso ad. - Simond Chacal ('banana blade') £29.90. Also the Mustang (standard head, alloy shaft) £32.20

In reply to Rebecca Hazel:

I buy their stuff by choice and have some posh kit. In a few cases i prefer their stuff.

In reply to puppythedog:

yep, me too, nothing wrong with it and often half the price....

In reply to galpinos:


Mostly vanity, though Arcteryx gear does tend to be well designed and finished to a very high standard ( I don't own any Patagonia gear ). It's also worth mentioning that both companies put a lot of effort into ethical production methods, and Arcteryx in particular manufactures some of their gear locally (to them) in Vancouver, which accounts for at least some of the price premium.

In reply to Rebecca Hazel:

Worth noting Simond clothing is just rebranded Decathlon own brand (Quechua) stuff. My softshell troos are Simond while my wife's from a couple of years earlier are the same just branded Quechua http://lightfromthenorth.blogspot.co.uk/2013/03/simond-alpinism-pants-revie... Some independent shops still sell Simond hardware so I guess the original company still exists in some form, and does good gear, but the Simond branded clothing is now just Decathlon's mountaineering range.

Their helmets in particular look fantastic value.

In reply to TobyA:

I have a circa 20 L sac labelled Simond, a colleague has a seemingly identical, but older, sac labelled Quechua. But for less than €20 a bargain under any name

In reply to galpinos:
My OH has one of these bags and loves it

In reply to Rebecca Hazel:

When I've handled it in the shop their climbing hardware feels "cheap" compared to British brands but I'm sure there's nothing wrong with it - it must all comply with EN standards, and possibly UIAA.

In reply to TobyA:

I've always assumed that as Decathlon bought Simond, they are applying the label to clothing but the climbing stuff is still Simond. This is only my supposition and might be wrong though!

In reply to planetmarshall:

I owned a patagonia down jacket for many, many years and although it was very slightly less warm than a Rab equivalent and didn't pack down as small it was incredibly hard wearing and well built, lasting almost ten years of Scottish and alpine abuse.

In reply to Rebecca Hazel:

Hi Rebecca,

A lot of Simond kit is great. Had their axes in the '80's and now have one of their climbing helmets (Calcit II) and an alpine belay jacket. Both do the job and great value. Also have some extenders, some crabs, a cordalette, a chalk bag.....could go on.....

ANdy

In reply to Rebecca Hazel:

Have no qualms - if they do something you like at a price you like - get it. I've used their stuff along with many other makers for 50 years - before and after their involvement with Decathlon. A few years ago I was lucky enough to spend a wet morning touring their factory near Chamonix - yes, they manufacture in France. All the hard wear is made there, whilst, like all the others, the clothing is contracted out to China.
Much of my working life was spent supplying manufacturers with quality control equipment so I've seen a few factories. Simond's set up looked very professional to me.

In reply to Rebecca Hazel:

I like their stuff,I've got a small day sack,a helmet and a few screw gates.its really good gear and the low price makes it even better in my eyes.

In reply to Rebecca Hazel:

I still have simond axes, Naja I think or possibly anaconda, and before them I had piranha axes. Both were far more capable than the climber although you can't get the picks any more so if I ever wear down or snap one I'll be looking for new axes.

Hi. Does anybody know if the Edinburgh and/or Braehead (ie. Scotland) Decathalon stores have much in the way of mountaineering/climbing gear/clothing? I know some French stores don't, and it would be good to know if it is worth the long drive?

In reply to BruceM:

Edinburgh one has a small section. Not sure if it'd be worth a drive.
Off the top of my head:
Clothing-wise they basically have, a man's jacket and trousers (pants if you must) and the ladies equivalent. A lone pair of Simond boots, couple of rucksacks. Few pairs of rock shoes.
In terms of gear maybe a few harnesses, handful of ropes, karabiners, belay devices, chalk bags.

Popping in tomorrow after work so will take a look.

In reply to Rebecca Hazel:


Some of it doesn't meet the standards of the UK manufacturers but it still meets the CE standards. Some of their quickdraws for example that have krabs with an open gate rating of 7kn. DMM say they'll never produce a krab that weak but then the lightweight ones from other euro manufacturers are also rated at 7kn so it's not just Simond.

There's a perception sometimes that 'you get what you pay for' but if you look at prices in europe at the moment, you can get major manufacturers stuff for less than the UK manufactured stuff, so price isn't necessarily a measure of quality.

In reply to Rebecca Hazel:

They also make everyone's favourite climbing jean.

In reply to Rebecca Hazel:
Love their kit. As a father of twins under 2 years I can no longer bring myself to part with the cash for kit which doesn't seem to last that long. I personally own a couple of pairs of Alpinist trousers as well as the lightweight version and if I am honest they are better quality than the better known brands. So in response to your question, there is nothing wrong with their kit. Especially the price

In reply to nathan79:

Thanks Nathan. Good to know.

In reply to Rebecca Hazel:

If I remember correctly Simond were the first to market the now universal banana pick for climbing axes together with replaceable picks - both features subsequently copied by most other manufacturers. As stated elsewhere Simond still manufactures its own hardware near Chamonix. Although hardware companies will manufacture their own products many other well known companies are part of larger groups and often only top of the range items are made at home whilst the bread and butter items come from elsewhere. In front of me I have three pars of shoes (Sportiva, Scarpa and 5.10) - all made in China!

In reply to BruceM:

Glasgow's selection is a bit bigger, but not extensive, and seems to suffer from a lot of items being out of stock. Saying that, ellis brighams is 5 minutes down the road and triple the price.

In reply to Rebecca Hazel:

+1 for the 20l Cliff rucksack. I use my tonnes. Light and close fitting for Multi pitch, and better than plastic bags for groceries. €20, Brilliant.

In reply to Rebecca Hazel:

Thanks all. I have the 20l rucksack which is going well so far. I want to start building a trad rack so not sure I can afford snobbery. I'll look into their safety ratings but they sound pretty good.

In reply to BruceM:

My experience of my local store is that, if they don't have an item you're interested in in stock, they will order it in for you, at no obligation, for you to take a look at. They have done this for me a few times. And each time I've ended up buying the item...

The difficulty is finding stuff on their utterly hopeless website; even if you know the exact name of the item, and search for it, it often doesn't find it...

In reply to Mike Stretford:


I'm not sure that's true.

Rock empire?

In reply to JJL: What do you know?

Their kit is CE marked.

In reply to captain paranoia:


You're not wrong there,try ordering something to their store,it's a nightmare.

In reply to winhill:


Unless you want krabs with a gate open rating of more than 7kn...?

In reply to Timmd:



I guess you could try these, less than £6 a draw (!), 8kn opening, but DMM said they're sticking to 9kn IIRC.

http://www.outdoor-climbing.de/Climbing-Technology-Lime-Set-Nylon_1

In reply to Mike Stretford:

Is it now? It didn't use to be - it was certified by a Czech "institute"

In reply to BruceM:

Not worth the drive I'd say. At the mo they have 3 models of rock shoe (one of which is for kids), 2 harnesses, half a dozen ropes and chalk bags. Few carabiners and nowt much else.

In reply to winhill:
Blimey that's cheap.

The UK economy does need a helpful shove though...& 9kn is nice & reassuring.

In reply to JJL:

Rock empire stuff has been kosher for a long time iirc and it looks alright, and you possibly confusing it with that dodgy Gear 4 rock stuff from Ukraine? they used to claim to be tested by some institute but it was all proper dodgy kit.

In reply to gethin_allen:
Sometimes really awful cam lobes on the camming devices, a metal fatigue professor I know said the lobes on some of their cams looked like they already had it, pretty much, you'd only use them to weight gear to stop it moving.

No decent quality control.

In reply to JJL:


Yes. I think you might be confusing different brands from different companies. Alternatively, I imagine there would have been a time RE were emerging in the EU as they are Czech but that would have been some time ago.

To be sold legitimitley in the UK and rest of the EU kit must be CE rated for PPE. To get other kit you must import it yourself, which is much easier nowadays, and maybe has contributed to the confusion.

I would say it's a good idea to do a bit of research before making these claims.

In reply to JJL:



Rock Empire is fine and dandy quality wise, it's Gear 4 Rocks which is dodgy.

In reply to JJL:


Gear 4 Rocks
http://www.mountainproject.com/images/76/16/107187616_large_163515.jpg

Rock Empire
http://www.outdoorgearlab.com/Climbing-Cams-Reviews/rock-empire-robot-cam

It turns out Robot cams can walk and things in the larger sizes, but the QC is streets ahead of Gear 4 Rocks

In reply to nathan79:

Thanks for the Scottish store reviews folks. Sounds like the west coast has a tiny bit more choice if you were heading anywhere for a look.

In reply to climbwhenready:


It feeks cheap (whatever that means) and is cheap. That's a good thing surely?