Just a quick one for the collective, could someone recommend a decent all round Chef's knife (18 - 20 cm) that doesn't require a second mortgage.
Thanks
Global. I use these in the kitchen and they are great. £100-200.
For a cheaper option look at Procook.
I have a few, but the best value was one I got from Lidl (I think, possibly Aldi): Ernesto Stainless Steel/315107. Good deep blade so you don't bash your knuckles, full length steel with 3 rivets, stays sharp and easy to sharpen, cant fault it. Its nearly as good as my other main one which was about £40.
https://www.nisbets.co.uk/deglon-sabatier-chefs-knife-205mm/c005
Lovely knife.
I have small Ernesto knives and they definitely came from Lidl.
I have a couple of global knives, but my long time favourite (had it about 15 years now) is my Zwilling Henckels chefs knife. A superb all rounder.
A good offer here: https://uk.zwilling-shop.com/Kitchen-World/Special-Offers/Knife-and-Sharpen...
You need the sharpening steel - use it every time the knife comes out.
Astoundingly I got mine (one chefs knife, one Japanses style) from TK Maxx for not very much money. Seconds perhaps, but they look perfect.
what do you want to spend? I purchased a Wüsthof culinar chefs knife after this topic came up many moons a go on this forum. 20cm £89 from amazon. I would recommend any knife made in either Germany or Japan as will be of a quality that will last a lifetime. I bought my son a Zwilling Henckels 3 knife set as a moving out gift paid about the same for that set as the culinar. A good knife will be safer to use.
Had one of these for almost 20 years along with a few of its brothers, wouldn't consider anything else.
https://www.checkfrank.co.uk/chroma-type-301-chef-s-knife-p18-20cm/391873
Do get a proper whetstone and learn how to use it on a cheap knife first though. Sharpening steels not recommended!
Many thanks for your thoughts so far, some interesting suggestions, as has been said, German and Japanese steel seems to be the way to go (which is a little ironic given that I live in Sheffield). My budget is probably around £100 max.
Thanks
Some Sheffield made knives here:
https://www.sheffield-made.com/acatalog/Kitchen_Knives.html
Some cheapish, some very much not. Interesting...
Oh lovely.
> I have a couple of global knives, but my long time favourite (had it about 15 years now) is my Zwilling Henckels chefs knife. A superb all rounder.
> A good offer here: https://uk.zwilling-shop.com/Kitchen-World/Special-Offers/Knife-and-Sharpen...
> You need the sharpening steel - use it every time the knife comes out.
> Astoundingly I got mine (one chefs knife, one Japanses style) from TK Maxx for not very much money. Seconds perhaps, but they look perfect.
Pretty sure the Zwilling ones are the ones they use on MasterChef. Bought my parents a 3-knife set for Christmas a few years ago, on sale in Bentalls for ~£80. Pretty sure it was this set:
https://uk.zwilling-shop.com/Kitchen-World/Kitchen-Knives/Knife-Sets-Blocks...
The ones in our kitchen are Wüsthof and Richardson Fusion Edge.
For anyone German knife shopping, the city of Solingen is their equivalent of Sheffield in terms of steel implements.
> Global. I use these in the kitchen and they are great. £100-200.
> For a cheaper option look at Procook.
I have a couple of Procook knives and would recommend them - decent at an affordable price.
Wusthof make fantastic knives. I had this one in 10" flavour as my main knife until my other half bought me some silly Japanese thing that I never could have justified to myself. The balance, handle and blade are absolutely spot on. They do alternative, more traditional, grips with the same blade if that's more your thing. I preferred the comfort and easy-to-clean-ness of this handle.
https://uk.knivesandtools.eu/en/pt/-wusthof-grand-prix-ii-cook-s-knife-8-in...
I purchased a set of Global knives in 2004/5 from a department store sale. The knives are used everyday and have lasted very well.
Strangely one failed 6 weeks ago whilst filleting a salmon. I received a brand new replacement under their 30 year warranty. There was a £18 'admin fee' but I can wasn't going to quibble.
Not cheap but the return on investment has been well worth it and it take pleasure from using a quality tool every time I use them.
I got a couple of the Victorinox Fibrox knives to give as gifts to people who needed (to my mind) proper knives, but didn't share my enthusiasm for extravagance. They're very reasonably priced, and perfectly serviceable. They don't make my heart sing to use like the knife I bought as an indulgence for myself, but if that's not what you're after they're worth a look.
This might also be an interesting read, though I'm not sure if they'd all be available here:
https://www.seriouseats.com/2018/06/the-best-chefs-knives.html
While I own a couple relatively fancy knives having worked as a chef previously I tend to use a Victorinox one the most. Something like https://www.amazon.co.uk/Victorinox-Swiss-Classic-Chefs-Stainless/dp/B00WEH...
The more expensive ones often need extra care/maintenance, for example some Japanese steels are prone to rust and their hardness makes them difficult to sharpen and quite brittle. For most people it's not worth the hassle, something for ~£50 or so will do you fine. £100 max is a good budget if you want something a bit nicer, somebody already mentioned Wusthof which are a reliable choice.
Procook Damascus 7" Santoku knife £99.
Hands down the best knife I have ever used and at a decent price for top quality Japanese steel.
I've got a Zwilling 4 star knife that I've had for 15 years now and is still perfect - looks like you can pick them up for around £60 at the moment.
If you really want to go cheap, you could try a Kiwi/Kom Kom knife (Thai brand) for under £20. I found out about them from a Guardian article on "pro chef tips"
https://www.chopchopchop.co.uk/488KK.html
I've got one of these - it's a bit cheaply finished, and isn't as ergonomic/nice to handle as my Zwilling knife but you can get it incredibly sharp and it's lovely for very fine slicing/dicing.
> Procook Damascus 7" Santoku knife £99.
> Hands down the best knife I have ever used and at a decent price for top quality Japanese steel.
I don't know how they do that, the Damasteel I use costs more than that for the blank!
Steve D
I have to say the Wusthof steel is very impressive for the price. My advice:
Don't get any knife with a bolster. They are a pain in the arse to sharpen over time and need specialist attention.
Get something balanced and comfortable in your hand. Unfortunately you have to feel this before you know it.
Get a thin Japanese style blade. Any old knife can hack, but to cut through food easily and cleanly it needs to be thin. Think driving an axe into wood, which is like driving a thick stock chefs knife into an onion or squash. Thick = resistance, no matter how sharp it is.
If I had the money, I’d get a Stuart Mitchell. As I don’t, I’m sticking with my Zwilling chef’s knife for now.
What do you have against sharpening steels? They simply uncurl the rolled edge. If I took my knives to a whetstone every time the edge curled the knife would lose it's profile in a month
Well, actually Chroma explicitly warn against the use of sharpening steels. I expect they probably know more than you or I on the topic of how to sharpen their own knives. Far from being an expert myself, I seem to have managed to regularly sharpen my knives on a whetstone as pre Chroma's recommendation and I still have knife-shaped knives :p
> Wusthof make fantastic knives. I had this one in 10" flavour as my main knife until my other half bought me some silly Japanese thing that I never could have justified to myself.
A few years ago, I was in a kitchen shop and they had a Damascus steel carving knife reduced from £240 to £80. Beautiful knife, but I really couldn't justify the cost at the time.
I have been kicking myself ever since for not buying it!
From checking their website they suggest that steels can damage Japanese knives with very hard steel and don't work with their geometry. I would partly disagree, in that you have to know what you are doing with the steel (like any tool). You can just as easily ruin a knife with a whetstone and leave it needing a complete reprofiling. I am always very gentle with my steel, not like Gordon Ramsay who seems to think the knife and steel need to attack each other. I am also very respectful of the edge angle of the knife. I think knowing how and why to use any tool is the key.
Interesting how the internet converges, youtube recommended me a video on Ernest Wright scissors this a.m. The knife and steel tool industry used to support 40,000 jobs in Sheffield until globalisation struck, seems so very wrong, the loss of those jobs and skills in light of the situation we have going on right now.
They're just beautiful beautiful things, aren't they? I've a western style chef's knife and a nakiri (vegetable knife) both from Japan and, whilst not "Damascus", you can see where the steel has been folded over and over again. The nakiri has hammer marks on the spine-side half.
It's totally an extravagance in terms of performance but the craftsmanship is worth it.
I switched to a ceramic "steel" for prolonging the edge between getting the whetstone out and it's really gentle compared to a traditional or diamond steel. Thoroughly recommended.
https://www.knivesandtools.co.uk/en/pt/-opinel-no-07-pocket-knife-carbon-st...
Found mine in the Ecrins- sharpen easily as does the stainless version;
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Victorinox-Pocket-Knife-Ceramic-Sharpener/dp/B000A...
Decent and not dear. Feels good in the hand: https://www.robertwelch.com/kitchen/kitchen-knives/signature-knives/signatu...
> Well, actually Chroma explicitly warn against the use of sharpening steels.
A simple steel isn't for sharpening a knife (that's done with a whetstone).
A steel is for setting the edge of the blade. You should apply almost no pressure when running the edge down the steel. You are not trying to take any material off the edge with a steel.
I use Wusthof and Henckels knives; some given to me, some bought in TK Maxx. I actually have a stash of spares from TKM, and I've given away a few of them, or even sold some here, many moons ago...
I also have an Anolon kyotsu, which I like; it has the blade shape of a chef's knife, but with a snub nose a bit like a santoku. It came with a robust moulded sheath, so it's the one I take if I'm self catering. Also bought in TKM...
https://cheftalk.com/showcase/anolon-advanced-5-5-inch-kyotsu-knife-with-ho...
> I don't know how they do that, the Damasteel I use costs more than that for the blank!
There are faux damascene knives out there; normal steel knives, etched with a pretty pattern*... Seen them in TKM, too...
* same pattern on every knife is a big giveaway...
Economies of scale?!
> Found mine in the Ecrins- sharpen easily as does the stainless version;
Ah yes, forgot about Opinel - phenomenal value for money. My parents still have the little ones they've been using daily for over 40 years.
I've been guilty of collecting kitchen knives and sharpening parefenalia over the years but I still reach for my mums 7" cheapo chefts knife at least 50% of the time. Think it was a sabatier rip off probably about £20 but I've used it for about 15 years now, replaced the handle myself as a teenager and I just like using it despite having more expensive knives at hand.
Keeping it sharp is probably more important than the kinfe you buy. As purplemonkeyelephant said, buy a steel but don't use it like you've seen chefs using it, keep it somewhere it's not getting bashed in a drawer and if it will give you satisfaction then buy a few good whetstones and learn how to use them. If not buy a pull through sharpener. I've never used one but I imagine in conjunction with a steel they do the job well enough if you have no interest in anything other than your knife being usably sharp every time you reach for it.
I have used victorinox chefs knives, which someone mentioned. They're surprisingly cheap and seemed good to me. Thin, well balanced and hold a decent edge. Some of their smaller chefs knives are quite shallow bellied which might be an issue if you have big hands. There's a brand called kiwi knives, low price point but I've read they're quite good so might be worth a look.
Can second Global knives.
I've had a GS-3 for 15 years now and it shows no signs of deterioration despite my shoddy blade sharpening skills. Perfect allrounder knife which gets used every night without fail.
I am sure there are better manufacturers out there, but I think you get what you pay for with knives. Having decent knives makes cooking a pleasure and is well worth the investment.
Just don't believe the old adage about blunt knives being more likely to cause harm, my fingers prove that one false.
Someone doesn't like having the purpose of a steel explained...
You could do a lot worse than...
https://www.opinel.com/en/kitchen/parallele-wood-handle/santoku-knife-n119-...
with...
https://www.axminster.co.uk/japanese-combination-waterstones-ax22468
the 1,000/6,000 grit version, there are 1,000/10,000 available too which are a better option in my opinion but seem to be less popular for some reason. With your budget you could probably get a small Arkansas surgical stone to go with the above. You could save a few quid on razors then.
I'm just an enthusiastic amateur, but I've been using one of these (the same one) for over 15 years:
https://www.mychefknives.co.uk/tojiro-dp-series/7196-tojiro-dp-santoku-knif...
Super sharp, lovely to handle, and easy to sharpen on a ceramic wheel thing. It shows no sign of getting duller or wearing out in any way. A knife for life. Pretty sure I paid £35 at the time. Even at nearly £90 now, I'd say get one.
Personally, I'd start with a set of waterstones because even the most expensive Damascus steel blades are shit if you can't maintain a razor edge. I recommend ice bear 1000/6000 combination stones from Axminster tools for about £20. If budget allows get a 250 stone as well!
Then start looking at knives, TK Maxx have some really good knives for about a third of the high street price and there'll have loads for you to choose from.
I've got several knives in my kitchen ranging in price from £15-100+ and the real difference between them is how recently they were sharpened.
I've worked in plenty of kitchens over the years and sharpened a lot of knives including Global, Henckles etc and they're OK, but you can get a full set of knives for the price of one of them that are just as good.
If you want a specific brand to look at then I would recommend victorinox. I got one for my mum as I was sick of her knives and gave her my old whetstone too.
Damsteel is a powder steel, technically not real Damascus but far more consistent quality and products a repeatable pattern. Typically made by mixing RWL34 with another stain resist steel. Makes excellent blades, good stain resistance and edge retention with very fine grain.
Wusthof, about £90-100. Bolted handle. Had mine for over 10 years, and its brilliant!
Sainsburys generic. <£10. Works flawlessly. One piece design so nothing to go wrong.
I use Wusthof, the Chef's knife is great, I like the smaller knives less and always feel a little guilty living in Sheffield. I far perfer my Blok knives but would reccoment the Wusthof as a Chef's knive but not the smaller knives in their range.
I fell for some social-media marketing, and got the "Serbian" knife from Damas:
https://damas-knives.com/product/serbian-chef-knife/
It's not Damascas steel, and (i realised) it's not stainless either, so requires so maintenance (namely oiling), but I love it... Very sharp, nice weight to it as well so slices straight through squashes, and beautifully slices tomatoes without squishing them.
I've not tried the "slice a tomato sideways without touching it" test yet...
*edit* I do also realise they're not making these knives, and are likely overpriced for what they are, but I like mine