UKC

Not given to conspiracy theorising or ranting, but....

Had to take my 3 month-old Sony headphones back to John Lewis the other week. It had stopped re-charging. I was told it needed to be sent off to Sony for inspection (btw, though I bought it via JL online, I was required to return the headphones in person to their nearest branch - 15 miles away). I was also informed I needed top collect the item in person, once the issue had been resolved.

Yesterday Sony contacted me. They said that the headphones were 'water-damaged', and that a repair falls outside the item's warranty - a cost of £165. That was their final position, with the option of me collecting the 'damaged' headphones (in person) and getting it repaired independently.

The headphones have always been stored in its case, only ever been used by me, and have never been taken outside of my home (unless in its case & in my computer bag). I don't listen to music in the bath/shower, or whilst in the kitchen. Our house doesn't have any room or parts of a room which suffers from damp. I haven't spilled any tea/coffee or other liquid on the headphones (even caused by a startled reaction to yet another UKC thread on TPS, top-roping, Mt Snowdon or other such novel content).

I can't take this to Small Claims, as it's my word against theirs. I feel utterly hacked off. The headset wasn't cheap (https://www.sony.co.uk/store/product/wh1000xm5l.ce7/WH-1000XM5-Wireless-Noi... - about £250). They replaced a set of Bose headphones (stolen a short time prior to getting the Sony set - another tale of woe...is it me?).

This is simply an attempt to put my frustration, anger and sense of total disempowerment in a box. When a JL advert came on the TV last night my foot nearly went though the set. So catharsis is needed. Did the water-damage occur in transit from JL to Sony? Or did somebody simply decide to dunk the headphones in the bath to opt away from retailer/manufacturer responsibility? Such questions drift in and out as I come to terms with things.

But at least if you've got this far I can ask the question: has anyone on here had any issues with Sony WH-1000XM5 (or 4) headphones? And the supplementary - should I just suck it up, accept that there are worse things to post/rant about on UKC and move on?

Thanks for reading!

The problem is John Lewis's - not yours. Assuming you're not perjuring yourself then any fault within the warranty period is theirs to fix. (Which is fair enough - they took the profit, so they bear the responsibility.)

Personally I would go to a branch of John Lewis, in person, with the headphones, ask to see the customer service manager, take their name, explain the situation, and politely but firmly refuse to leave without a resolution. If they won't offer a refund or replacement, ask who their manager is and how they can be contacted there and then.

Sounds tough, my sympathies. Since you ask, my XM3s gave up after three solid years' use, with sound only coming through one ear (I might have dropped them too often); onto the XM4s now. As with the previous model I use them in a damp house, bath (not shower), kitchen, no problems. When they stop working I'll get another set as I prefer the design to the XM5s, but may also go for Bose QCs for a change. JL are usually very good with returns; you appear to have just had a run of bad luck. REW's advice above is good, but if you have to buy a new set, perhaps get a cream pair of XM4s, quite a lot cheaper than the 5s.

From memory under the circumstances consumers rights act within the first six months it's the retailer's responsibility to prove it's you fault.

You don't have to prove anything.

So my understanding is you would win. Unless they really can prove it was water damaged. Or lie.

I feel your pain, these "my word against a company" situations are really annoying. Yet they've worked for me in the past (IKEA damaged our delivery, which we didn't see at the time. A lawyer friend said "Write to the head of IKEA in Sweden, and send a copy of the letter to your local branch". Worked a treat. They were back a day later)

FWIW I agree with Rob Exile Ward's advice. But it's 15 miles away, I know. I would go, see the most senior person possible, and if that doesn't work, suck it up, forget it, move on

I'm not helping much, am I

Good luck

Seems you have been unlucky

XM2 's still working, although I had to repair the hinge, after many years and many travels around the world, my original reason for purchasing was to cut out noise on flights.

Currently on XM5's and have been faultless.

Both have had fairly hard life.

I have a pair of XM3s also bought from JLP several years ago. Never had any problems with them. I agree with the above suggestion to go into JLP in person and speak to someone there. I'd also ask them to advise what packaging precautions they took when sending the 'phones back to Sony and confirm that you've never had them exposed to moisture of any kind. So the only explanation for water damage occurring can have been during that step of the whole process, which was entirely JLP's responsibility. Good luck.

Interestingly, although probably not very useful for you, the XM4s are rated for IPX4 and so suitable for use in light rain etc. 

https://helpguide.sony.net/mdr/wf1000xm4/v1/en/contents/TP1000240497.html

The XM5s do not have a rating and are unsuitable for any water exposure.

Often electronics will have moisture indicator stickers that manufacturers can use to identify historical presence of water. Maybe Sony do for the XM5s, maybe they don't and just claim all faults are water damage...

In a spirit of seasonal generosity, I have a pair of the XM3 headphones that are sat in a drawer.  Nothing wrong with them, boxed and in good condition and they work perfectly it's just that, for whatever reason, they and I don't really get on and I haven't got round to selling them.  If you find no joy with your faulty headphones then you can have them for the price of a donation to your local MR team.

T.

Typically generous and informed advice from UKC. Thank you. I am galvanised to take the matter forward!

And thank you Tony - a lovely gesture - will mail you separately.

That's a pretty poor response from John Lewis, and if I was in your position I'd be pushing back against them.

I bought my Bose earbuds from John Lewis and I was really glad I did. One failed after about 6 months and the response from Bose was "send them to us and wait a month for us to get back to you". The response from John Lewis was: "I'm terribly sorry but we don't have the same colour in stock. If you'll accept them in black we'll send a replacement pair to your local Waitrose for you to collect tomorrow. Give them the failed ones when you collect them". So I did.

Alas John Lewis customer service isn't what it once was. I don't know why their standards have dropped, they were once a shining example of how things should be done.

My other half always swore by John Lewis and their great service until a terrible experience over a malfunctioning phone screen a couple of years ago. Dismissive attitude of the in-store member she spoke to (who effectively said "you must just be one of those clumsy women, my wife is the same") and the "ah but you must've dropped it" when she insists she never did. Really soiled them as a retailer for her.

In that situation always ask to speak to the store manager and complain in a loud clear non shouting voice that everyone in 10 yards can hear about your treatment.

I think the mistake is to speak to someone in store. My headphones were sorted instantly but I only dealt with John Lewis online, and I suspect if you do that their easiest option is to just replace them. If you go into a shop someone will actually look at them and try and make a judgement.

I had the same experience with Richer Sounds. We kept blowing some loudspeakers, and if I filled in a returns form online they just replaced them without question. One time I went into a shop to save on delivery hassles, but the shop assistant insisted it was our fault and wouldn't replace them. So I went away and did it online again... 😂

This is fairly standard unfortunately. If a company can raise a possible user error as a cause of fault then they will use this to absolve them of responsibility as it is your word against theirs. I would go back to John Lewis and push for them to sort it. Ask them to show you the smallprint that allows them to pass the buck.

I had a similar issue with a van propex gas heater which nearly burnt my van down. They stated it was my fault for putting 24v into it, despite it only being connected to 1 12v battery. No way to prove otherwise so it was my word against theirs 

Competition. John Lewis, like many other high street retailers, are struggling.

I have had XM5's for about a year now but no issues

If you were wearing the headphones just now, they'd be getting wet from the steam coming out of your ears.

Update on the headphones mullarkey:

Received the set back from Sony (unrepaired, as per my request); they reported 'coffee or tea damage to the re-charging port'.

This adds additional mystery, as I only ever use them to listen to music or podcasts as a sleep-aid in the evenings - I don't guzzle any beverages whilst in bed... I also don't use the headphones at my work-desk, or anywhere else really. 

Took them to a (recommended) local repair shop. They confirmed the diagnosis. But, on the up-side, indicated that they'd repair for £45 (compared with £165 quoted). So, after weighing up pros & cons, I decided to go for the local repair job (even though it invalidates my 'guarantee - which is about as much use as a chocolate fireguard).

I'm still writing to both JL and Sony, as suggested on here. And have resolved never to buy Sony or darken the doors of JL again.

Thanks again for all the inputs - thought this update would be appreciated.

Assuming the problem arose on your premises, couldn't this be about where they were when they were being recharged via USB lead, not where you were when you were wearing them? I recharge mine in the kitchen and it's conceivable that my kids could knock a half-empty mug over the relevant bit and get the port wet, then not tell me. Seems amazing that they can narrow the offending liquid down to one of two beverages.

Good point. I always re-charge mine in a socket directly alongside my bed. Given that I'm not given to drinking any beverage in bed (not even a glass of water during the night) I think it's unlikely. As I think I've mentioned, I'm pretty scrupulous in looking after my electrical kit.