UKC

Seeing as some people think survival bags are a good idea I wondered who had actually used one for real.

Two of us shared one on a bivvi in the alps and though it kept the wind off it certainly did not keep us warm.

Perhaps a word of warning should be given when they are sold, and people shoud try sleeping in one some summers evening to see how useless they are.

In reply to sutty:

did you survive?

;¬)

In reply to sutty: I used one for sledging down Mam Tor last thursday night, it was more than up to the job.

In reply to sutty:
I think the clue's in the name. Survival bag as opposed to 'warm and toasty' bag. Anything that stops the wind, even if it's not waterproof is going to improve your chances. I carry a couple of space blankets and my old army-issue gore-tex bag in winter. The bags a bit heavy, (and being army issue is probably knackered), but it doubles as a seat. Even a big plastic bag's better than nothing.

In reply to sutty:Good point about testing them.Blizzard bags are suppose to be okay or better than average,they're three season foil bags made from reflexocell or something,and pack as small as a cassette and can be reused,i think they're ment to be more durable than the foil bags that fall appart,i've never used one though.

In reply to sutty:

Not sure which type you are referring to but I spent a night inside one of those big orange things on the summit of the Ben one winter night. Altogether not a pleasant experience. The real problem is the amount of moisture one takes into the bag allied to that which one produces when in it. We were staying in the Hilton so wind wasn't an issue but I suspect it would have been good at providing protection against that.

Of the things I learnt that day the one that sticks with me is that I had had a spare (dry) set of thermals life would have been so much better.

In reply to Horse:

I've done quite a few planned bivis in those things. The trick to avoiding moisture is to use the larger size (4' x 8') and pitch them into the wind, propping the entrance open with a rucsack. That way you can get a good airflow so the condensation is much less. Rocks in the bottom corners stop the thing twisting up during the night.
I've done an unplanned bivi using a kisu (group shelter.) That was grim, because there was no flat area so we spent the night perched on a ledge with it draped over us. The worst thing was that every time the bloke at the far end rolled over, my bit got whisked away, so I spent the whole night playing tug-of-war.

In reply to sutty:

The only time I've used orange survival bags for real in an unplanned situation was on another group that had had an accident. The group I was in were first on scene, and we used the bags to keep the casualties warm whilst the rescue team arrived. Luckily we were also carrying sleeping bags. The combination of plastic bags and sleeping bags worked, in that the casualties condition did not seriously deteriorate even though it was too stormy for the helicopter and it was several hours before they could be evacuated. One problem with the placcy bags was stopping the casualties from whizzing off down the snow-slope.

In reply to sutty:
Yes i have, only once for a real MRT job in switzerland.
And then many times as a sledge. Too many have been ripped as a result

In reply to Graham Taylor:

ive used mine a few times , great for unplanned bivis, keeping ropes and kit dry outside tents, keeping kit bag dry in river crossings and obviously the use as a improvised stretcher or sledge etc if needs be.i keep my first aid kit etc wrapped up in it ,i would say it was an important peice of kit for anyone using the hills and mountains .
i also slept in one for 5 days at glastonbury one year(i was wasted mind) and was fine .

peace

In reply to daniel kinch:

Yes, that's a good point. I've used it for both of those too.

With the river thing you can stick all your gear in the placcy bag, tie the top in, and float your gear across. You can also float yourself across by lying on top. Both of these depend on there being air trapped inside the bag and choosing a safe, slow-flowing, low-risk river etc - hastily covering my back here as I did a water safety course last year and placcy bags are deffo not up to health & safety standards .

If I'm bivvying, or there are two of us squashed into a one-person tent I'll stick the rucksacks and as much gear as possible in a placcy bag outside. Works well with an Argos Pro Action.

In reply to sutty:

Ive got one of those sexy orange bin liners, and a space blanket. I guess with a duvet or sleeping bag probably be OK short term in UK

In reply to Alison Stockwell:

'Luckily you were carrying sleeping bags', on a day trip it may be worth leaders making sure they have more than one for enforced bivvis in poor weather. I know good leaders woud get kids off the hills ASAP in those conditions but a lot of climbers and walkers read the book that says carry an orange bag. It is more a talisman than a useful item for most.

My bag is a waterproof cover for a sleeping bag that opens halfway down. handy for bodies.

In reply to sutty: I carry a Blizzard bag these days as it should provide some warmth as well as being a wind break. Never had to use a bivi bag in anger yet thankfully but my orange bag has been used for storing gear outside the tent and for sledging more often than I care to remember.

In reply to Dave80:
I got a blizzard bag (next gen space blanket, is now a sleeping bag which is semi breathable but waterproof with elastic to keep it tight to you), the bumf you get with it suggests it's very warm, I've never used mine either, but reports are that they are pretty good. Also is small and light (comes vacumn packed so will be bigger once used). Not the sort of thing you'd use regulalry though more for exmergency use as I'm sure it's not as durable as a proper system, but still much smaller and lighter and supposedly warm.

In reply to Woker: Yeah if I'm planning on biviing out I'd take a sleeping bag and my wee single pole bivi bag/tent thingy. Even if the blizzard bag is over hyped I still recon its got to be better than an orange bivi bag of old. I see they are quite hard to get hold of at the moment though, my local Nevisport have stopped selling them and I haven't seen them in any of the other local shops either.

I have spoken to people who've used Blizzard bags in planned bivis and I've heard mixed reports, although that said the guy who complained bitterly that it wasn't warm at all went very quiet when I asked what sort of night he'd have had in the orange bivi bag he normally carried for emergencies. All in all I'd say they're great for unplanned bivi's as you'll be more comfortable than in an orange bivi bag and they can also be used for planned summer bivi's. Not that I intend to ever use it as it would then take up so much more space in my bag!

In reply to sutty:

Had to make to with a bin liner and 2 tesco's carriers bags once. My mates had those big plastic orange things. Apparantly I kept them awake by snoring all night

In reply to sutty:
Used one for an emergency bivvy last summer in the Alps when we lost the path and ended up up falling about in the dark on a seemingly endless boulder field covered with six inches of fresh snow. Had one survival bag between the two of us, no sleeping bags. My partner got into it; I put on all my clothes and cuddled up beside him under a big rock. Can't have been more than a few degrees below and it was dry, but there was an icy breeze coming off the snow. He snored away while I lay shivering beside him. Ended up getting into the bag with him. Bit of a squeeze and we trashed it completely when we tried to get out of it in the morning, but I can testify that a survival bag is appreciably warmer than no survival bag. Conditions weren't life threatening, so I can't say it saved our lives, but it made the difference between deep discomfort and mild discomfort. I actually managed to get some sleep.

Personally, I wouldn't go out without one in the bottom of my rucksack. It's small and light and it can make a big difference in an emergency, besides having all sorts of handy practical applications as described in some of the other posts.

orange survival bag: 190 g, £3
Rab pertex bivvy bag: 300g, £55
Ex-army, gortex (ish): 800g, £30

cost, weight, convenience - yer pays yer money i guess.
Waking up on a mountain side in the summer after a sleeping out in a bivvy-bag (with a sleeping bag of course) is great - one of life's simplest pleasures. the thought of orange-bagging it in the winter on the other hand is horrific...

In reply to daf:

I have one of the Rab bags and used it only last week in the Alps, we were inside an old building so out of the wind, but it was still bloody cold and it was fine.

Wouldn't have like to have been inside an orange bag, although I do have 2 that I just leave in the bottom of my day sacks just in case.

Got to say, I bought the Rab bag for the alps as a just in case and then end up using it. I think I will swap the orange bag in my popular day pack for the Rab, sure its lighter than the orange bag too daf?

In reply to sutty:
yes, one winter when i got "caught-out". cold, wet and miserable.

In reply to Eskdale massive:

could well be - i was just being lazy and googled 'rab bivvy weight' and went with the result!

In reply to daf:
you can get lighter and smaller plastic bags than the big orange ones, I think Lyon do one which is designed to be taped to a helmet, bought one in R&R in sheffield years ago so I'm sure D.Hunter can correct me if I'm wrong. have had unplanned post party kips in one and have to say the puddle of nicotine smelling sweat in the bottom was not pleasent. now carry blizzard bag. esp when out on my own with no route cards etc etc etc