UKC

Anybody got recommendations for a short, ultralight axe (e.g. DMM Flux) suitable for winter running? I always hesitate before bringing my old Glencoe axe on runs because it's 50cm long, carries almost as much risk of impalement as it saves from slips, and weighs a whopping 650 grammes. The dinky little 35cm Flux is a third of that and looks as if it would strap to a race vest without getting in the way.

I'm not contemplating technical work, maybe hacking up Y Gully on Catstycam and daggering the top of Swirral Edge, but the main purpose would be as a self-arrest tool when descending. 

Good thought, I was having similar thoughts but given it would be an emergency/possibly not used didn’t want to spend much. Saw this but 45cm is probably still longer than I’d want

https://www.climbers-shop.com/snow-and-ice/ice-axes/grivel-ghost-ice-axe--g...

I wouldn't strap any sort of tool on for running, unless of course your strapping it to a 40 ltr berghaus, more dangerous that the hazard. If you really need an ax when running carry it in your hand, without a leash is probably wise, alternatively alter your route, not too many days you really need full spikes and axes on English hills

That looks nice, Steve. But, while it's significantly lighter than my old Glencoe axe, it's only 5cm shorter.

Hi John. Yes, I've run with the 50cm in hand a few times, telling myself I'll toss it a safe distance away in the event of a stumble, so as not to kebab myself.  But there's also the engrained instinct, from my climbing years, to cling to the axe at all costs, so who knows how that would pan out?

I know what you mean about proper, hard-packed snow becoming a rarity on English hills - I've got by on ArcticTalons and guile for the last few winters. Still irrationally hopeful for decent conditions this season, though.

'Kebab yourself' - totally, you have reminded me. I managed to mangle a finger while trotting down the band carrying an axe. very surprised by patch of water ice, finger (still clutching axe) between mountain and the axe. I withdrawn my suggestion 

'Decent conditions'- it's good to travel hopefully, my wife currently snowed in

Petzl Ride or Petzl Gully, both lightweight ski touring axes.

I got a Simond Fox axe from Decathlon for that sort of stuff. Very light and very cheap.

Thanks Dave and Timy2

They look nice axes for weight saving - just not sure they're sufficiently easier to stow than the 50cm eighties antique I have.

I have the ghost and like it. I definitely run differently with it, maybe that would change if I did it more regularly than I do, but I do make sure I hold it away from me and run a little more tentatively.

Thanks, girlymonkey. Mind those foot placements and don't do any unscheduled pole-vaulting. 

V12 have the DMM flux in their cosmetic seconds sale on their website. I use a 45cm ski touring axe for running, but think the length of the flux would be better. My axe goes nicely on my Black diamond distance 8 running pack as it has axe attachments on the back.

I always think it's a pity the folding axe wasn't developed a bit more -I'm thinking of Climbing Technology's Alpico Emergency Axe for example ( a bit clunky at 650g)- as the remit for a fall arrest tool isn't too onerous and it would make a safe carry option when not needed. Even the Grivel Condor  or BD Whippet could do with some refinement for running poles.  

Good spot on V12, thanks, k_os

Absolutely, a lightweight folding axe would be the dream solution, Basemetal 

It seems like the Flux is 90% of what you need but have you considered simply cutting down a cheaper axe?

I'll add 'lightweight folding runners axe' to the long list of intriguing products to develop for single digit sales.

perhaps just a blade you could attach to a pole? Hmmm, if only I had a shed!

Goodness me man, have you been living under a rock? Go and watch some educational documentaries like the Tomb Raider series, Cliffhanger (Stalone), The Descent (despite being about caving they carry some ice tools at one point)

Nobody but nobody runs with an ice axe, you run with a pair!! One in each hand holding the bottom of the shaft and flailing them as you run. On each of these runs you will also be required at least once to jump a gap slightly further than you can land, so the ice axes *just* catch the edge to save you, otherwise what's the point of having carried them?

Asking about running with an axe -- in the singular? It just beggars belief.

If you plan on throwing it if you slip why are you carrying it?

Genuine question. If you are on the kind of terrain where a slip could be consequential or you need the axe to progress surely you want to keep hold of it?

Hi Rory. It's the level ground case where the balance of risk tips in favour of getting the axe away from you. There's nothing to be gained (and potentially a lot to lose) from clinging on to it.

Of course, an undulating ridge will alternate between patches of level and sloped ground, so you have to be ready for both.

I am a complete failure, CCT. I don't even wear a torn vest or carry a trench-knife between my teeth. Total loser, me.

Hi Ottawa. I've thought about sawing a longer axe but wondered if the result would be ill-proportioned (unless I shortened the pick too). 

When I'm retired, I'm gonna blow my pension on a 3D printer that can sinter titanium and I'll fab up a folding axe the size of a banana. As you say, a seriously niche market.

That's it, I've splashed out. Should be here in a couple of days. Might be a bit of a wait until the next cold snap but I'll be ready for it when it comes. Thanks for comments, folks.

I have a Petzl glacier literide that is my go-to for running, it's 50cm. Of I was buying again today I would get a Petzl Gully.

You don't have to put an axe on your pack "spike up". Even for general mountaineering, there's something to be said for attaching axes "spike down" using the side straps. I have two small loops of bungee on the outside of my OMM 20L that let me slide the axe in "spike down" with a diagonal slant. Keeps it well out the way. 

Hi morpcat. I agree, spike-down seems to work better for running. I had a gallop round the Coppermines circuit yesterday like that. As it happened, the snow was soft enough to rely on heel-power so the axe never came off the vest.

Well, it's here and it's ridiculously pretty. Map to convey scale (axe would probably look even smaller next to actual Cairngorms)