UKC

This is a handy tool for scoring your indoor sessions.

Basically you record indoor sessions by climb on this calculator and it gives you a total session score

Over time it is possible to see how you are progressing in terms of difficulty and wall session totals

In the near future a calendar facility will enable longitudinal graphs to be displayed

There is also an outdoor calculator under development but this requires some further tweaking

Feedback would be welcome

The calculator is here: http://www.ratemyclimb.com/?page_id=224

Regards

M

In reply to michaelc54: Firstly could do with a country/grading system setting. That's before I've even tried it.

In reply to michaelc54:

nice idea.

ditto to ^^ needs a grading system. could it have an option of sport or V grades?

also, Are you trying to record 'points' for a sucessful ascent, or points for effort expended and training done? It needs something for if you've worked a route and not finished it, and if you're using it as a training log the 'points' going down so dramatically for a rest doesn't work. working/resting on a route and working the moves is an essential part of training surely?

Hi guys,

Thanks for the input. As a Brit living in oz I am aware of the UK grading system but we have decided pot use the Ewbank Grading system for simplicity.

The system does calculate rests on a climb as a deduction. the main reason for the system is to try to maintain a record of effort spent at a climbing wall by session

As a consequence, the more difficult and overhanging a climb is the better the score.

Having also done a few outdoor sessions we might load the outdoor scores a little to try to create some equality in the scores for indoor vs. Out

What we hope to create is a system where eventually you can see a date related graph that sets out your ability

It would be good to be able to compare reasonably a day on the grit or in Snowdonia with an indoor session!

M

In reply to michaelc54:


yup, but making a climb overhanging isn't the only way to make it strenuous and difficult. This only notes one style of climbing difficulty.

In reply to nikinko:

Agreed, there are many criteria for input, height, difficulty, amount of overhang being, in an indoor climbing wall environment the major considerations. The number of rests taken is another

Clearly, it is very difficult to consider all inputs, but these are the main ones

We started off making the session calculator an indoor tool and having made something that seems to record the size of the session reasonably well now moved into the very tricky area of applying that to an outdoor environment

We appreciate that making the tool work outdoors is much more difficult...... For example, I recall the walk into Cym Silyn being a fairly pleasant stroll capped off with quite a long trudge up the scree. Outside Edge is an absolutely classic V. Diff with an easy walk off

Depending on the weather conditions the whole expedition could be a gentle summer's day outing or an absolute winter epic. Imagine trying to calculate the difference

However, essentially, www.ratemyclimb.com stats is an attempt to be able to track and compare the amount of effort that is going into your climbing sessions

And we are still working on it, so all input is greatly appreciated

In reply to michaelc54:


I don't know who your tool is aimed at and I can see how that's a simpler system but unless you have french grades for the indoor routes nobody (in the UK at least) is going to bother with it.

How about if we colour coded the numeric grades so that users got a sense of the comparative grades?

The system here tends to be Green, Blue, Yellow, Orange, Red, Black

Cheers

M

Here's a conversion table
http://www.mountaindays.net/articles/item/rock_climbing_grades_explained/#g...

In reply to charlieg0pzo: Yup, climbed in France, understand the grading system

Maybe we need something that does an international conversion!

In reply to michaelc54:

No objection to that but I think people would still want to put in the exact grade.
I mean it's just easier, the grade is either written on the wall or it's in the guidebook, having to convert the grade to either a colour or to a different system is a pain.

In reply to MeMeMe: Point taken, time to get a nifty converter in place

That will make the webmaster grumble....!

Tx

M

In reply to michaelc54: It's very simple, you just need to add more options to the select with values which correspond roughly to the eubank grades:

<option value="10">f3</option>
<option value="11">f3+</option>
<option value="12">f4</option>
<option value="14">f4+</option>
etc...

This already works with your javascript.

<-- Site developer here, a grading conversion is incoming - watch this space

As for the impact of rests - it helps to think about the best way of defining a rest. For the purposes of the calculator i think this one works best:

-> If you hang on the rope because you can't hold onto the wall any more, that's a rest.
-> If you fall off, but are able to get back to where you left off and carry on, that also counts as one rest.
-> If you hang there and flail about and eventually give up (even after a few attempts).. that only counts as one rest - and you just count the climb up to the point you managed (maybe 10 out of the 15 metres for instance).

This way you get penalised for climbing the route "less cleanly" but not in such a way that learning a route ends up giving you no points. I know it's not perfect - but any kind of quantification of this sort of data is going to be imperfect, we just aim for the best possible approximation

p.s. any data on what colours roughly relate to? I worry that it would vary too much from gym to gym... Rating systems are good because they are almost entirely objective.

Something like...?

Green: F4 and below
Blue: F5 to F6a
Yellow: F6a+ to 6c
Orange: F6c+ to F7a+
Red: F7b - F7c
Black: F7c+ and above


It would be useful to put in the name of where you are climbing because grades can vary a lot between places (You don't have to change the points per grade depending on the climbing wall, although maybe in the future you could!)

In reply to MeMeMe: Thanks for the data I will use that for the colour conversion.

As for the name of the gym - that would go in the session name, like in this session I had at St Peters in Sydney: http://www.ratemyclimb.com/session-overview/?session=37&category=0

Revised version is up now with Ewbank, FontaineBleau, UK Adjusted, Yosemite Decimal, and UIAA gradings

Conversion came from: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grade_(climbing)

I will be adding colours later today.

You can now also add names to each of your outdoor climbs - eventually these will also be linked to a topo entry for each climb.

Take a look - http://www.ratemyclimb.com/stats/

In reply to plumjam:
From your stats page.
If I do a vertical 6a+(20) I get 194 points. If I do an overhanging 6a+, (by 7metres ie Leeds wall) I get 648 points. About the same as doing a vertical 8a+(30). Which is frankly lunacy.

The grade is the grade, no need to add an overhanging aspect, it just works different muscle groups. It seems like your scoring system needs some "tweaking". Good luck

In reply to Robertostallioni: Yes it has occured to me recently that the overhang is being given too much of a weighting. I'm not sure that eliminating it entirely is sensible, but certainly I think I will dial it back a bit.

In reply to michaelc54: Why do the british grades go to E12? and they should be british tech grades if it is measuring progression.

A better chart for british tech
http://www.rockfax.com/publications/bgrades.html

Nice Idea though

In reply to Reidy: I have to confess I don't fully understand the British system, having only climbed in Australia. The reason I went up to E12 was that that was what wikipedia went up to!

I understand that the tech grading is the hardest move on a climb (similar to the Ewbank system) but the adjusted rating is.. well.. adjusted! But I don't quite see why some climbs are rated with an adjusted grade and some with a technical grade - maybe you could shed some light?

In reply to plumjam: Err can't claim to fully understand it myself but the tech grades are taking into acount the dificulty as for example a route could have a higher E grade but be easier to climb than a route with a lower E grade (like E1 5c and E2 5b).

But then that makes me think maybe it is the right way.

Sorry if that made no sense

In reply to Reidy:

Guys, The Rate My Climb Calculator has been tweaked again and now includes a variety of international grades

It relies on you knowing the wall heights, the climb difficulties and also maintaining a consistent degree of honesty or dishonesty......

It does seem to be a handy tool for monitoring your gym sessions, even if mine are going backwards!

Check it out at www.ratemyclimb.com under that Stats button

BTW, the rest of the site is very tongue in cheek, it's Australia!

In reply to michaelc54: Feedback would be welcome

The data training wads like Paxti use to record sessions are number of sets, number of repetitions, number of (hand) moves, % intensity, rest time between reps and rest time between sets.

Depends if your aim is to have a fun tool or a serious training tool. You could have both.

In reply to shark:

Thanks for that, agreed, a really complex and detailed tool could be developed. Right now we are focussing on a tool that is simple to use and yet gives good feedback on our progress

In developing the tool lots of inherent problems have arisen which we are gradually overcoming while still preserving a simple to use product

Simple stuff like wall heights and grades, different gym difficulty grading systems and so on all enter the frame, personal honesty and accuracy are all problems

Then there is the issue of actually remembering what you have done!

Eventually we might make it a Phone Application so that the data is recorded while at the gym so that a running total can be seen

One thing is for sure, more data means higher standards and performance - just look at F1 racing and the data acquisition systems they have

Let's wire up a human!!!!!!

M

In reply to michaelc54:

Surely the feedback your system provides is as subjective as the content it uses to calculate.

How does your system say take into consideration a 15m climb that is Ewebank grade 15 however has a V8 crux mid height?

Personally I think what you are trying to do is great, just there are so many obstacles!

In reply to michaelc54:> Thanks for that, agreed, a really complex and detailed tool could be developed. Right now we are focussing on a tool that is simple to use and yet gives good feedback on our progress


I listed 6 variables - the same as in your current tool - so it wouldnt be more complex but I'm sure it would be less popular.

In reply to michaelc54:
i dont get it, why is the grade font, but then has the length? boulder problems dont really take into the account of the length. and where is french grading?