UKC

Hey guys and girls,
I'm sorry if this has been asked before, I did search through the forums and other web pages but am still a tad confuddled.
I'm looking at buying my first set of quickdraws. I was looking at used ones, but thought it better to save some more pennies and buy new (thank you, student loan aha).

I was going to buy the WC Xenons as there are some great deals on at the moment, but then someone said they are more for trad climbing, is this true, or can I use them for sport and indoors? I'm not sure how to differentiate between sport and trad draws, so any help on that or any advice at all would be great.
The other QD's I was looking at was the WC Oxygen, and also, if it was worth the money for a novice such as myself, the WC Helium's.

Right, I'm sure you all get the point, I'm rabbiting on now, so I shall thank you all in advance and leave you in peace. Thank you.

In reply to poeticshambles: Trad draws tend to be longer 18cm/25cm plus. Anything around 12cm or less will be fine for sport and indoor use. To be fair just get a good deal you wont notice the weight/milisecond clipping difference until youre climbing hard anyway..

C

In reply to poeticshambles: If your just doing sport, 10cm is the standard. Trad draws vary between 10cm and 30cm, with 60cm extendables

In reply to poeticshambles:
Hi Poetic,
A reason that the xenons are less than perfect for sport climbing is the thin dyneema sling. If you get into redpointing a lot then you spend a lot of time pulling on the quickdraw, usually to pass a section you've already worked, to work the moves above. This is less of a problem with trad as you don't spend a lot of time sat on the rope anyway. For sport, having a chunky sling on the QD makes pulling up on them much nicer. This might sound like a small point, but if you're doing it a lot it makes a difference to your day!
If you're only just getting a rack together, then I'd not worry about this at this stage. Also, if you go sport climbing you're likely to want to do lots of onsighting, in which case you won't be pulling on the draw either.
As the previous poster stated, people tend to use short draws for sport, but you often need a selection of both for both trad and sport. I see from your profile that you're in Lancashire, the quarries there are fairly short, which means that you'll want more short draws, as extending is unnecessary and will bring you closer to the floor if you do fall off. When you're in the Lakes (as you also allude to) you'll probably want to extend things a lot more. Give this some thought before you buy any. As a guide, for longer trad routes I carry 6 10cm draws, 8 15cm, and 4 sling draws.

In reply to poeticshambles: Thanks guys, some really helpful info there. I just want to make sure that I don't buy a set and then 6 months later need to replace them. Yes, I'm at Uni right now in Preston, so I'm quite lucky really being so close to the lake district and the peaks.

Anywho, thank you very much guys

In reply to poeticshambles:
Hi,
I got my first set of quickdraws at the start of this year. I got the WC Xenons; ten for £80 is a bargain. If you look up review on them they are almost all excelent.
The only diference between xenon and helium are the nose but it is not worth the huge price increase in my opinion.
I got 2 x 10cm 2 x 20cm and 6 x 15cm but wish i got 6 x 20cm 2 x 10cm and 2 x 15cm instead.
I use them for indoor and outdoor sport and a little trad but they are great at it all. I have no problem holding the thinner sling. Extremely light and easy to clip and handle. I recommend them.

Stu

In reply to StuMsg: Yeah, Stu, I have to admit the price is great for 10 of them and they do look very well made and have good reviews. There are so many to choose from, gets a little confusing. I keep saying I'm not going to scrimp on the important safety stuff, but everything seems to be important haha; harness, rope, slings (cheap anyway), I'm still looking for the right pair of shoes cos I have quite wide feet, fed up of the rental ones now.

Thanks, Stu, much appreciated advice.

In reply to poeticshambles:
Hey

Xenons are fine for sport and trad. The only problem I find with wire gate QDs are that when cleaning route that is steep (overhanging) is that the nose on the wire gate can get caught on the bolt hanger and take a little longer to get off.

Other than that dogging on a QD on a bolt hanger can put sharp burrs into it. So I have a set of trad draws (phantoms and astros) and a set of sport draws to pull and work route on. (Cheapest one I could find).

If you have a GoOutdoors near by. there selling WC Astros for £6.99 each on the 18/07/11 till the 24/07/11.

Hope this helps

Chi Cheng

In reply to poeticshambles:

In that case unless you are really set on sport i would get some longer trad ones. You can use these fine for sport (and probably won't really notice an extra 10 cm fall) whereas short sport ones are a pain verging on dangerous for many trad lines. More rope drag and more likely for rope movement to pull gear out.

I would say WC xenons are fine though if your paying more then £9 each i'd take a look at needlesports' own as they are very cheap and good!

In reply to poeticshambles: If you are thinking of working Sports routes and might at some stage use a clipstick then it is worth bearing in mind that they work far better with wire gate draws.

In reply to poeticshambles: I have a selection of draws of varying makes, types and lengths, some where bought for specific purposes, eg lightwieght for alpine winter where I had to carry them a long way, long extenders for trad etc etc, other because where I live there is often no choice, others because they were a good deal. On alpine routes or trad I probably put more thought into what to take than when sport climbing when I just grab whats close to hand. I have recently noticed that all my lightwieght "I" section clips are showing excessive wear and in two case fatigue cracks. Many of my older round section clips are showing minimal or no wear. It appears the damage has been caused by repeated falls onto FIXE and similar type sport hangers. Obviously always check your gear and dispose of damaged or suspect items but for sure I will pay more consideration to what draws I use for sport routes equipped with such hangers.