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Anybody had any issues with this, I get a pain at the outside back of my left knee when and after climbing (partic noticeable with drop knees) the IB stretches seem to help, wondered if anyone had suffered similar and how they resolved it?
In reply to JimR:
Yep have suffered this, mainly affects running, burning sensation after about 30mins, have just about iliminated it by doing less heel hooking while bouldering...come to think of it just bouldering less.
Yep have suffered this, mainly affects running, burning sensation after about 30mins, have just about iliminated it by doing less heel hooking while bouldering...come to think of it just bouldering less.
In reply to JimR: a physio I worked with said to do single leg squats until the muscles start to feel tired and stretching
In reply to JimR:
What Hannes says.
What Hannes says.
In reply to Welsh Kate:
I was diagnosed with this a few years back. The physio went down the road of orthotics which didn't seem to do much. 2nd physio opinion was that it is tough to isolate but responds very well to stretching. That seemed to clear it up, and I have ditched the orthotics. Just make sure to keep stretching once the pain has gone, or else (in my experience) it will come back.
The best stretch for me was:
Touch your toes.
Put all your weight on one leg.
Twist round and try to touch the outside of the knee with the weight on it with your forehead, don't push too hard, just until you can feel it working.
Repeat opposite side.
Couldn't find a link so hope that makes sense!
I was diagnosed with this a few years back. The physio went down the road of orthotics which didn't seem to do much. 2nd physio opinion was that it is tough to isolate but responds very well to stretching. That seemed to clear it up, and I have ditched the orthotics. Just make sure to keep stretching once the pain has gone, or else (in my experience) it will come back.
The best stretch for me was:
Touch your toes.
Put all your weight on one leg.
Twist round and try to touch the outside of the knee with the weight on it with your forehead, don't push too hard, just until you can feel it working.
Repeat opposite side.
Couldn't find a link so hope that makes sense!
In reply to JimR:
I had something similar a few years ago, with the pain especially bad when walking downhill. I bought a foam physiotherapy 'roller' and rolled my outside thigh up and down it a few times each day for a few weeks. Hurt like hell initially but soon eased off, and the pain disappeared quite quickly. I seem to remember reading something about that exercise helping to reduce tension or break down scar tissue in the fascia surrounding the muscle, which causes ITBS when it become inflamed at the point of contact with the kneecap. That may be rubbish, but the solution certainly worked. Hope it improves
I had something similar a few years ago, with the pain especially bad when walking downhill. I bought a foam physiotherapy 'roller' and rolled my outside thigh up and down it a few times each day for a few weeks. Hurt like hell initially but soon eased off, and the pain disappeared quite quickly. I seem to remember reading something about that exercise helping to reduce tension or break down scar tissue in the fascia surrounding the muscle, which causes ITBS when it become inflamed at the point of contact with the kneecap. That may be rubbish, but the solution certainly worked. Hope it improves
In reply to JimR:
i got mine sorted by an Osteopath, who basically massaged it away (meaning he just gave the band some flexibility i guess) and sorted out a few posture problems into the bargain. 4 sessions cost me around £120 and i haven't had a recurrence for 7 years. "release the fascia!" is now my go-to mantra when things hurt
i got mine sorted by an Osteopath, who basically massaged it away (meaning he just gave the band some flexibility i guess) and sorted out a few posture problems into the bargain. 4 sessions cost me around £120 and i haven't had a recurrence for 7 years. "release the fascia!" is now my go-to mantra when things hurt
In reply to Dom Whillans:
Suffered badly over a few years, build your glutes up a bit. Physio can show you some good things to do, single leg squats keeping your back straight, lying on your side doing leg raises. Stretch as well pretty important. Some people use foam rollers on the it bands, did not work well for me but every one is different. Best bet is to see a physio they can advise you properly.
Suffered badly over a few years, build your glutes up a bit. Physio can show you some good things to do, single leg squats keeping your back straight, lying on your side doing leg raises. Stretch as well pretty important. Some people use foam rollers on the it bands, did not work well for me but every one is different. Best bet is to see a physio they can advise you properly.
In reply to JimR: I've suffered with this for about 10 years now (and anyone who has it bad, knows that i really mean suffer!) I sympathise with you Jim.
So, my two pence:
However often you're stretching it off, isn't enough, stretch it more!
The ITB itself wont stretch, however the TFL (big muscle, side of hip/bum)that's attached to it will (this is the key!)
Give it a couple of weeks with no running/climbing/anything else that antagonises it. This will make the gains much quicker and less painful.
If you get into the habit of doing the stood up, legs crossed stretch whenever you're static somewhere (queues/at the bar/belaying etc) then you'll soon see it ease off.
Once it's eased off, keep stretching! always! haha
Oh and see the physio, you'll maybe get a nice rub down and learn some new stuff
Hope that helps and i also hope that it eases of soon for you mate.
So, my two pence:
However often you're stretching it off, isn't enough, stretch it more!
The ITB itself wont stretch, however the TFL (big muscle, side of hip/bum)that's attached to it will (this is the key!)
Give it a couple of weeks with no running/climbing/anything else that antagonises it. This will make the gains much quicker and less painful.
If you get into the habit of doing the stood up, legs crossed stretch whenever you're static somewhere (queues/at the bar/belaying etc) then you'll soon see it ease off.
Once it's eased off, keep stretching! always! haha
Oh and see the physio, you'll maybe get a nice rub down and learn some new stuff
Hope that helps and i also hope that it eases of soon for you mate.
In reply to JimR:
Got this pretty bad whilst doing high mileage about 5yrs ago.
Physio, chiropractor whatever title he had went down the orthotics route and after 2 weeks of building from 5min runs to 20min runs was completed sorted.
I kept using the orthotics for about 12months and then lost them (doh!) but kept running anyway and the problem never came back!
Good luck.
Got this pretty bad whilst doing high mileage about 5yrs ago.
Physio, chiropractor whatever title he had went down the orthotics route and after 2 weeks of building from 5min runs to 20min runs was completed sorted.
I kept using the orthotics for about 12months and then lost them (doh!) but kept running anyway and the problem never came back!
Good luck.
In reply to JimR:
Could well be a sign of weak glutes and/or hip flexors,but then it is slightly different for everyone,if you see a physio and they don't mention glutes or hip flexors,see a differnt one,foam rollering will help as will stretching but if you don't address the route cause it will flare up again.
Hope you get it sorted
Could well be a sign of weak glutes and/or hip flexors,but then it is slightly different for everyone,if you see a physio and they don't mention glutes or hip flexors,see a differnt one,foam rollering will help as will stretching but if you don't address the route cause it will flare up again.
Hope you get it sorted
In reply to JimR:
In addition to icing, stretching, foam rollering and one legged squats which all helped me, have a search for "Pattstraps", which are basically a simple band that you strap tightly above the knee and which stop the ITB twanging over the knee and becoming inflamed. They allowed me to keep running while the stretching and squats were doing their thing.
In addition to icing, stretching, foam rollering and one legged squats which all helped me, have a search for "Pattstraps", which are basically a simple band that you strap tightly above the knee and which stop the ITB twanging over the knee and becoming inflamed. They allowed me to keep running while the stretching and squats were doing their thing.
In reply to Andyh83:
Any chance you could furnish a few more details?
>
> the stood up, legs crossed stretch
> the stood up, legs crossed stretch
Any chance you could furnish a few more details?
In reply to Andyh83:
It is possible to stretch the ITB. See my post above. Stretching the TFL is also good though.
> (In reply to JimR) I've suffered with this for about 10 years now (and anyone who has it bad, knows that i really mean suffer!) I sympathise with you Jim.
>
> So, my two pence:
>
> However often you're stretching it off, isn't enough, stretch it more!
>
> The ITB itself wont stretch, however the TFL (big muscle, side of hip/bum)that's attached to it will (this is the key!)
>
> Give it a couple of weeks with no running/climbing/anything else that antagonises it. This will make the gains much quicker and less painful.
>
> If you get into the habit of doing the stood up, legs crossed stretch whenever you're static somewhere (queues/at the bar/belaying etc) then you'll soon see it ease off.
>
> Once it's eased off, keep stretching! always! haha
>
> Oh and see the physio, you'll maybe get a nice rub down and learn some new stuff
>
> Hope that helps and i also hope that it eases of soon for you mate.
>
> So, my two pence:
>
> However often you're stretching it off, isn't enough, stretch it more!
>
> The ITB itself wont stretch, however the TFL (big muscle, side of hip/bum)that's attached to it will (this is the key!)
>
> Give it a couple of weeks with no running/climbing/anything else that antagonises it. This will make the gains much quicker and less painful.
>
> If you get into the habit of doing the stood up, legs crossed stretch whenever you're static somewhere (queues/at the bar/belaying etc) then you'll soon see it ease off.
>
> Once it's eased off, keep stretching! always! haha
>
> Oh and see the physio, you'll maybe get a nice rub down and learn some new stuff
>
> Hope that helps and i also hope that it eases of soon for you mate.
It is possible to stretch the ITB. See my post above. Stretching the TFL is also good though.
In reply to nufkin:
IIRC... cross your legs whilst standing up so that your feet are side-by-side but little toe to little toe. then lean forward to touch your toes, but stretch your legs and don't force the bend in your back. release and then cross legs the other way round and repeat...
> (In reply to Andyh83)
> [...]
>
> Any chance you could furnish a few more details?
> [...]
>
> Any chance you could furnish a few more details?
IIRC... cross your legs whilst standing up so that your feet are side-by-side but little toe to little toe. then lean forward to touch your toes, but stretch your legs and don't force the bend in your back. release and then cross legs the other way round and repeat...
In reply to JimR: I was told you never get over ITBS.. its always there. It sounds pessimistic but I like to keep that in mind. It keeps me thinking of it and I can now sense it when its just starting and get stretching. Basically loads and loads of stretches.. but not just the IT band.. gluts.. hip flexors.. quads.. hamstrings.. general tightness seems to be a factor. When I get it I'll run for 1 mile, then do 20-30 mins of stretching then run..
i also do more off road when I get a bout. It normally flares up after road marathons.
i also do more off road when I get a bout. It normally flares up after road marathons.
In reply to Dom Whillans:
Thanks, I'll give it a try.
> (In reply to nufkin)
> [...]
>
> IIRC... cross your legs whilst standing up so that your feet are side-by-side but little toe to little toe. then lean forward to touch your toes, but stretch your legs and don't force the bend in your back. release and then cross legs the other way round and repeat...
> [...]
>
> IIRC... cross your legs whilst standing up so that your feet are side-by-side but little toe to little toe. then lean forward to touch your toes, but stretch your legs and don't force the bend in your back. release and then cross legs the other way round and repeat...
Thanks, I'll give it a try.
In reply to nufkin: Foam rolers help..
There are loads of stretches on the web.. just do as many different types.. be careful though.. I know someone who overstretched and damaged the insertion area.
http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=it+band+stretches&hl=en&prmd=imvns...
There are loads of stretches on the web.. just do as many different types.. be careful though.. I know someone who overstretched and damaged the insertion area.
http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=it+band+stretches&hl=en&prmd=imvns...
In reply to JimR: http://runningtimes.com/Article.aspx?ArticleID=3528&PageNum=1
I found this article very helpful, citing literature, as to possible causes, and ways to prevent it from re-occurring. Some of the stuff seems to go against the orthotics idea anyway have a look and hope it helps.
Cheers
Chris
I found this article very helpful, citing literature, as to possible causes, and ways to prevent it from re-occurring. Some of the stuff seems to go against the orthotics idea anyway have a look and hope it helps.
Cheers
Chris
In reply to JimR:
I second the foam roller technique, works for me. Here's a link:
youtube.com/watch?v=n-I7OJTeGRY&
I second the foam roller technique, works for me. Here's a link:
youtube.com/watch?v=n-I7OJTeGRY&
In reply to JimR:
I have issues and it's a constant maintenance battle to keep it away.
There is more rubbish talked about ITBS than any other injury on the internet. People will tell you it's ITB when the symptoms clearly don't match AT all.
See a physio.
For what it's worth, outside is where ITB tends to present. Outside back would seem to be something else. Possibly hamstring tendonitis? Dunno. See previous paragraph.
I have issues and it's a constant maintenance battle to keep it away.
There is more rubbish talked about ITBS than any other injury on the internet. People will tell you it's ITB when the symptoms clearly don't match AT all.
See a physio.
For what it's worth, outside is where ITB tends to present. Outside back would seem to be something else. Possibly hamstring tendonitis? Dunno. See previous paragraph.
In reply to JimR:
You can roller it if you want. Yes it will hurt, and yes it will help, but eventually it will come back. The problem is, if you roller the ITB, you are trying to lengthen tissue that is already lengthened.
The reason for the pain is friction from the ITB as it is tightened over the pit of the knee where it hurts. Think about it like an elastic band. If it was tight, you wouldn't roll it out and stretch it more to fix it, would you? You'd slacken it off.
The Muscle that tightens the ITB is the TFL (tensor fascia latae) As pointed out above. if you roller the TFL, then the ITB *should* slacken off.
The reason for it being tight can be any number of about 7 or 8 possibilities, generally the most common seems to be weak glutes and lateral rotators (piriformis).
So, get a foam roller. See a physio, and if the physio only massages your ITB and doesnt look into WHY you are getting ITBS, ask them for an opinion, if they dont have an opinion, go to a better physio/osteo/massage therapist. And dont be talked into getting a pair of orthotics- Id only look at those as a very very very last resort.
You can roller it if you want. Yes it will hurt, and yes it will help, but eventually it will come back. The problem is, if you roller the ITB, you are trying to lengthen tissue that is already lengthened.
The reason for the pain is friction from the ITB as it is tightened over the pit of the knee where it hurts. Think about it like an elastic band. If it was tight, you wouldn't roll it out and stretch it more to fix it, would you? You'd slacken it off.
The Muscle that tightens the ITB is the TFL (tensor fascia latae) As pointed out above. if you roller the TFL, then the ITB *should* slacken off.
The reason for it being tight can be any number of about 7 or 8 possibilities, generally the most common seems to be weak glutes and lateral rotators (piriformis).
So, get a foam roller. See a physio, and if the physio only massages your ITB and doesnt look into WHY you are getting ITBS, ask them for an opinion, if they dont have an opinion, go to a better physio/osteo/massage therapist. And dont be talked into getting a pair of orthotics- Id only look at those as a very very very last resort.
In reply to JimR:
Hi Jim. I developed this about 6 years ago and you can shake it off. With it being a syndrome it can be one thing or many that cause it. i couldn't pin it down so just changed everything i was doing at the time involving my running. I reduced mileage, intensity, I changed my footwear, stopped running steep hills (especially downhill), stopped running on just one side of the road or uneven camber, warmed up thoroughly especially in the cold, stretched thoroughly holding ITBS specific stretches for 60 sec or more for 2 reps. Most importantly i rested completely for 6-8 weeks min before all this. This was hard but the advanced cases of this are horror stories involving cortisone injections and surgery.
Read a book called the Lore of Running by Tim Noakes which i got a lot of information from. I personally didn't seek medical advice and got rid of this and completed a half marathon under 90mins with no problems 12 weeks after the layoff.
Good luck
Hi Jim. I developed this about 6 years ago and you can shake it off. With it being a syndrome it can be one thing or many that cause it. i couldn't pin it down so just changed everything i was doing at the time involving my running. I reduced mileage, intensity, I changed my footwear, stopped running steep hills (especially downhill), stopped running on just one side of the road or uneven camber, warmed up thoroughly especially in the cold, stretched thoroughly holding ITBS specific stretches for 60 sec or more for 2 reps. Most importantly i rested completely for 6-8 weeks min before all this. This was hard but the advanced cases of this are horror stories involving cortisone injections and surgery.
Read a book called the Lore of Running by Tim Noakes which i got a lot of information from. I personally didn't seek medical advice and got rid of this and completed a half marathon under 90mins with no problems 12 weeks after the layoff.
Good luck
In reply to nw: I don't claim to be an expert and I suspect that few things are known as 100% certain along this line, but info recall reading a study at the time that indicated the unwillingness of the ITB itself to elongate under stress, based upon an experiment where a large weight was hung from one for a period of months, with no change in length recorded.
I'm lead to believe the gains from stretching are from the muscles it's attached to at the upper end...
Anyway, back to the important topic; Jim how's it coming along? Hope you're recovering.
I'm lead to believe the gains from stretching are from the muscles it's attached to at the upper end...
Anyway, back to the important topic; Jim how's it coming along? Hope you're recovering.
In reply to JimR:
Most have said it but:
Physio/deep muscle massage
Foam Roller
and the stretches in here: http://runningtimes.com/Article.aspx?ArticleID=6099
And don't run more than 5k until it goes or you'll have it for ages
Most have said it but:
Physio/deep muscle massage
Foam Roller
and the stretches in here: http://runningtimes.com/Article.aspx?ArticleID=6099
And don't run more than 5k until it goes or you'll have it for ages
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