UKC

Anyone willing to give me some pointers on purchasing a reasonable pair of binoculars, for occaitionaal use, fairly light and compact to take out onto the hill, with half decent optics but without breaking the bank ? Whats good and whats bad etc.
I realise that some of these criteria may be contradictory

Thanks

In reply to GravitySucks:

Literally asked this question recently of a birding friend. What's your budget?

In reply to GravitySucks:

I have these which are small, light and pretty well received. I'm no expert and didnt need anything high end so they suited perfectly. They are good for looking at nature but I also find them pretty good when I want to look into the sky at night.

https://www.birders-store.co.uk/celestron-nature-dx-8x42-binoculars.html

To push the boat out:

https://www.outdoorgearlab.com/topics/camping-and-hiking/best-binoculars

In reply to Graeme G:

Dont really have a fixed budget, just would prefer not to spend a small fortune if not absolutely necessary

In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:

Thanks for the suggestion, the Celestron ones are in more in the budget range I had in mind than some of those (if not all) in the second article (gulp ! $$$)

In reply to GravitySucks:

Might also depend on what you want to look at. If it’s mainly birds, I went into a RSPB visitor centre and got them to talk me through the options. I ended up with their Harrier 8x42, which for £230 was much better than the next cheapest. 
(There are some proper birdwatchers on here though who might be along soon.)

In reply to GravitySucks:

Such a huge range available. I've had a pair of Olympus 10x50 weather-sealed binoculars for about 20 years and they're still as clear and bright as the day I got them. I paid somewhere around £250 at the time. at Cambrian Photography in Colwyn Bay. If you have a good camera shop nearby, go and try a few out, see how they feel.  https://www.wexphotovideo.com/binoculars/?p=categoryPath%3A%22optics%3Ebino...

In reply to GravitySucks:

Depends what you want them for...

Small, light and compact, you're probably looking at 8x21 (magnification x objective diameter).

Then choice is roof prism, or porroprism.

Think about glass types (BAK-4 is good), and coatings.

I have two pairs of Pentax UCF-Mini 8x21. First pair bought from Dixons, so probably 35 years ago. Second pair bought from ebay, maybe ten years ago. Secondhand is a good option; look for original vinyl case to give you a clue as to how much use they've had, and how well cared for. I see the same Pentax model comes up regularly on ebay; two recently @ £25. One looked very clean. The other not so much...

In reply to GravitySucks:

Just bought a set of Hawkes. Really bright and clear.

https://www.ffordes.com/p/36205/hawke/8x42-endurance-ed-green

Loads more in their range, which gives you options for magnification 

In reply to rsc:

I have the exact same, but got money knocked off coz the box was damaged or something. 

In reply to GravitySucks:

if you get a chance try some out. I have used quite a few £50 pairs but before I went on a trip last year I got the vortex Diamondback 8 x 42 hd,  (about £200) and was very pleasantly surprised how much clearer and brighter they were than most cheap pairs.

Well worth the investment for something that should last you for many years.

In reply to mountain.martin:

Definitely recommended. I tried a pair of Swarovskis- £2,500 or so. Wasn’t that impressed.

In reply to mountain.martin:

Its all too easy to get used to good binoculars. I used to be happy with a cheap pair from Jessops but then had a very good pair of Zeis binoculars lent to me from work for a couple of years (my job at the time involved quite a bit of fieldwork). When I gave them back I found my old Jessop's binoculars terrible & ended up buying myself a pair of Leica Trinovids - much more expensive than the old pair from Jessops.

If you search the forums you should find a couple of similar threads, its a question that gets asked quite often.

In reply to GravitySucks: As you climb in the Peak District you should visit Harrison Cameras in Sheffield. They have a very wide range of binoculars to suit all budgets, very competitive prices too

In reply to GravitySucks:

I have a pair of Opticron Discovery 8x32 - intermediate between the typical 8x42 and the compact 8x21. I'd recommend them.

https://www.opticron.co.uk/our-products/binoculars/discovery-wp-pc-binocula...

In reply to GravitySucks:

I do a lot of walking/climbing/mountain and a fair bit of birdwatching. I have a pair of 8x25 (300g) which I carry with me all the time and 10x32 (600g) when I’m specifically looking  at birds/sea, probably a short walk. Both are very expensive Zeiss and they’re fantastic, but I wouldn’t recommend spending so much for occasional use. My advice would be to get a cheapish pair of 8x25 eg Hawke Nature Trek £89 are very good for the price. I wouldn’t get 8x40 because they’re much bulkier and heavier and much likelier to be left at home. If you then find you really like using bins for birds/mammals/landscape then you’ll probably want a bigger pair of 8-10 x 30-42, at that point you’ll have a much better idea of what you’re prepared to spend. But you’ll always find your pocket bins useful, even as a spare set for kids/partners/leaving in the car.

If you don’t know, 8 or 10 is the magnification, 20/21/25/30/32/40/42mm is the width of the lenses. I would go for 8 magnification first because that will give you a wider field of view.

In reply to GravitySucks:

Don't get hung up on magnification. X 8 is good enough.  When trying binos I'd suggest the difference between a good v bad pair these days is on brightness of image.  So look test a pair by looking at objects in shadows, (under trees, the back of the shop you are in! Down alleyways etc., etc.,   You'll notice some bins will show those areas up more brightly than the cheaper ones.

Do get something with  a larger ratio of 8 x 30.   8 X40   8 x 50  The bigger the difference the brighter the  object - you'll see colours better and you'll also be able see in duller conditions  and you'd be surprised how well you can see in the dark!!!

I'm assuming all bins now are waterproof, or/and have nitrogen filling.  You don't want them misting up.

If you know a friendly birdwatcher ask them - Most will have bins which cost several hundred pounds or more  and probably own much cheaper ones.  Comparing cheap and bad with expensive and good will allow you to use your own judgement when it comes to buying.

Like other suggested I'd definitely go to an RSP reserve with a shop - you can try them out and the bloke/woman selling them will have sound advice.

Price isn't everything.  I own a pr of Zeiss Conquests  10 X 40 which cost me aqround 600 quid 20 yrs ago.  My wife bought a pair of  RSPB branded bins 8X32 at the RSB shop on Bempton cliffs for about £250  10  years later.. They are smaller and lighter than my heavyweights.  For general use I can't notice any real difference.  Price isn't everything.

 

In reply to GravitySucks:

As above, I ended up finding 8 x 42 the best compromise between being properly good for wildlife watching, but light enough to take with me on day walks. Though they don't often go up proper hills to be honest. 

Mine are Nikon Prostaff 3S and cost about £160 maybe 5 years back. Seems the range has changed so not sure the models compare now. Either way, for me I was glad I went up from the £80-100 area I'd first looked, and I take and use them much more because of the quality. So I'd say the brands mentioned by others between £150 & 250 are probably a good balance between price and quality. 

Especially if you're a glasses user, you want the "eye relief" feature to be appropriate for you. This is where the eye pieces twist out and in, to allow the adjustment of the perfect sweet spot for the focal point when wearing glasses (twisted in and out of the way) or not (twisted out to move the eye away from the eyepiece to that perfect spot). Badly explained! Most in this price range should work well. 



 

In reply to kevin stephens:

We were very pleased with these, tried out lots of other options outside the shop door

https://www.harrisoncameras.co.uk/pd/hawke-endurance-ed-8x42-green-binocula...

In reply to Bottom Clinger:

Damn, there goes another excuse for being rubbish at birdwatching!

In reply to GravitySucks:

For hillwalking we use these 

https://shopping.rspb.org.uk/binoculars-scopes/birdwatching-binoculars/rspb...

They are compact and light. Any bigger or heavier I’m not inclined to carry them.

For low level walks we take a pair similar to these.

https://shopping.rspb.org.uk/binoculars-scopes/birdwatching-binoculars/harr...

In reply to GravitySucks:

I have a pair of Celestron Outland 10 x 42s, which are ~£90. Great value. No complaints at all.

In reply to GravitySucks:

Consider 2nd hand? Only quick read of the thread so not sure if anyone else has suggested this.

If only for occasional hill use - you will get the best value for your money if you have a look for a well kept 2nd hand pair in mid quality range. Seriously. Try a few pairs out to see what quality would suit you first.

I’ve got Zeiss binoculars that are now over 40 years old and still as good IMO as any current offerings in the mid quality range, and, to my eyes, still much better than those in the lower price range today. Mine are actually too big for carrying for occasional use on hill, etc, though so wouldn’t recommend my model. However, you would probably pick my model up in the right market for fraction of a new equivalent.

If someone can suggest a more compact, lighter pair though of a quality that suits you, then that would be my starting point for looking for a 2nd hand pair of an older equivalent model if just for occasional use. Different if you were going to use every day, needed high quality optics, or whatever.

In reply to Wimlands:

When I’m on a low level birdwatching walk, doing up to 8 miles clumping around in my Muck Boots, I have a camera weighing just under 3kg, bins, scope on a tripod, rucksack with stuff, often a dog, and a partridge in a pear tree.

In reply to GravitySucks:

For light and compact but with decent optics, fairly wide field of view, and brighter image than some, you could look for the Bausch & Lomb Audubon/Bushnell Elite 7 x 26 (same binoculars under different names).  Not sure of they're still available new but they certainly are secondhand. Mine were bought in Canada in the 1980s, have been up most of the Highland Munros at all times of year, been dropped now and then, and are still going strong. Some info here: https://www.opticsreviewer.com/elite-custom.html

In reply to captain paranoia:

Haven't been up into the loft to dig out the original box, where the receipt probably is. But the eBay pair I bought in 2011, for £15.

I recently picked up a pair of Nikon Aculon T01 10x21, roof prism, hardly used, in box, for £25 in a charity shop. The Pentax pair give a much brighter image.

Other things to look for when you have a pair in your hands is to check how straight edges appear at the edges of the image; look for bending that indicates distortion. Also look for coloured rings at the edge of the image, and variation in focus across the image. Good binoculars should not bend straight edges, nor have colour rings, and should have uniform focus across the entire image.

In reply to captain paranoia:

And for all of those you pay £.

One of the problems with bins (like a lot of stuff) is that the more you compare good bins (£) with very good (££) and with excellent (£££) the more you'll get sensitised to the differences with how well they deal with those 3 things (and all other optical "qualities") and the less easy you'll find it to accept only good (£) - law of diminishing returns as well of course,

So my advice would be to not initially commit too much money, for under a £150 you can get bins that are perfectly adequate and optically quite good for occasional general use. If you find you're using them for any particular activity (e.g. birdwatching, astronomy, marine) then you can always buy a better more suited (and more expensive if your budget allows) pair without having wasted much (if any since there's no harm in having a second pair - mine are my car glovebox pair - or you can sell them secondhand to get some £ back).

Buying secondhand is a good way of getting quality for less £ but modern optics are generally better than old optics (anything more than 15 years old) due to better computer modelling of lens & prism design to get better light paths etc.

In reply to GravitySucks:

Mentioned earlier in the thread, but another vote for the Celestron 8x42 Nature Dx.  I've had a pair for a couple of years now and have been very happy with them.

In reply to GravitySucks:

It is IMO essential that you try before you buy. One of the most important things is the binoculars have got to be right for you. Many binoculars in roughly the same price range will give you good view but there is likely to be one or two that just feel right.

If you have an InFocus( https://www.at-infocus.co.uk/ ) shop near you then have a look there. Many RSPB reserves have shops where you can also try many pairs.

Dave

In reply to mik82:

Another shout for opticron, I have a pair of old, now countryman 8x42.  I think 25 years old or so, still brilliant and maybe around £100 paid at the time.

In reply to kevin stephens:

I went to Harrisons in Sheffield. Very helpful. By trying several pairs you could see the improvements with price and where the marginal improvements in image didn't justify the exponentially increasing price.

The biggest things for me were overall brightness and eveness across the field of view. The latter increases rapidly as you head out of the budget range.

In reply to kipper12:

My "old" car glovebox pair are Opticron Imagic 8x32 of a similar vintage as yours and cost £120. You'd probably get similar quality for similar price nowadays because inflation has been countered by improved optical design. That pair aren't as good as my "best" pair (£600 Hawke's) but I don't think "wish I had my other pair with me" every time I whip them out or carry them up the hill.

You're probably not going to go far wrong in the £100-£400 price range with anything from the "major" makes; Opticron, Hawke, Celestron, RSPB, Vortex, and various less well known others.

Nobody's £100 bins will be as good as any of those £400 bins and you can tell the difference - but is the difference enough to affect your usage, will you actually notice the difference in use. Most of the time the answer's no. But if for example, you frequently go birdwatching at dusk then the answer's likely to be yes because quality (of components, construction and technical "features" which all translate into price) make a difference in low light.

The advice to try them out before you buy is critical - 2 very similar specification bins may be very different in how you find them (maybe one feels great, the other rubbish), and somebody else may find it completely the other way round.

I would only advise buying without seeing for budget bins. What £ does that mean - here's a rule of thumb - how much are you prepared to spend on a meal out at a restaurant you've never been to and know little about; i.e. the amount you're prepared to risk on an experience that may not be good. That's probably a good guide for up to how much you should spend on bins without trying beforehand.

In reply to hang_about:

If I'd won the lottery, I'd have no trouble spending £2,500 on Swarovski's best - but failing that, no chance. But to counter that, you see a lot of serious birdwatchers who have spent £2,000+ on bins (and probably another £3k on a spotting scope). If for example they're retired, go birdwatching 4 times a week and the bins will last no problem for 10-15 years, then that's only £1 a go - doesn't feel so expensive when you look at it like that (but the answer's still no chance 😁).

In reply to Michael Hood:

Trying a selection of bins at Minsmere years ago convinced me that nothing less than Swarovski would do for my eyes - and at the time they were less than a grand. Now I am trying to justify the price by potentially offsetting inheritance tax 🙂

Not as good an investment as a Rolex but probably says more about your priorities!

In reply to GravitySucks:

What will you be using your binoculars for?

Do you want to be able to identify distant summits or potential climbing routes on crags? Or will you be annoying your companions by stopping endlessly on the ascent through Caledonian pine forest whilst you peer into the trees looking for Crested Tits or Scottish Crossbills? Or maybe you'll be wanting to see the details on every barb of the feathers of that Dotterel that's running rings around you on the Cairngorm plateau?

There's really no substitute with binoculars to trying several different pairs in field conditions. Nature reserves with binocular shops, such as the "in focus" shops mentioned above, can be very useful for that. They will usually have a decent selection in stock and will allow you to take your time whilst you try several different models. They might even have some secondhand or ex demo bargains to try.

Weight is also an important consideration especially if they will be dangling round your neck all day. "Full size" bins eg 8 or 10 x 42 or 50 are likely to be annoyingly heavily and awkward for a long day walking or climbing. At the other extreme the little pocket types eg 8 x 21 may be frustrating in poor light.

My own hillwalking bins are 8 x 32 which I find are a decent compromise. Just be wary of looking through the alpha glass in any shop, ie the top of the range Zeiss, Leica, Swarovski. You might find yourself spending an awful lot more money than you intended. Mine cost a four figure sum but I really don't regret buying them. I'm the person peering into the trees every few minutes as soon as we've left the carpark.

In reply to GravitySucks:

Have you considered getting a monocular?  More compact and you only have to buy one set of lenses rather than two so you can get better lenses for the money.

In reply to GravitySucks:

I asked this very question a couple of years ago, and got some good advice, I have an infocus shop nearish to me so popped over and tried a few out.  The budget in my head at that time was up to £200, of course I ended up spending £350 or something for a pair of Opticron Traveller 8 x 32, the sales assistant knew he had me when he said "These will be your forever binoculars"!  No regrets, and many happy hours spent birdwatching with them since.  I've never regretted spending a bit more to get something that has given me, and continues to give me so much pleasure.

Now if anyone has any recommendations for a DSLR camera and zoom lens that won't break the bank...

In reply to Bobling:

OM1 with OM 12-100 f4 pro lens

In reply to kevin stephens:

Thanks, but you missed out the magic words about it being my forever camera : )

In reply to GravitySucks:

My answer to the same problem was a monocular rather than binoculars, on grounds of simplicity, weight and overall size. Leica 8x20 for me, but they seem to have become more costly. No surprise there then

great for spotting pegs, checking ice conditions from afar, very amateur birding, the races and what have you