UKC

this weekened on me and my good lady went off to Tenby for 'one of those weekends'.... Anyway, she said she'd like to start doing more outdoorsy stuff, eg kayaking and climbing etc. as she used to do them at school. she is however of a somewhat nervous disposition (sp?) and while i would be quite happy to introduce her to climbing and drag her up some routes on a top rope to get her started, i'm not sure whether i can really make her feel safe and whatnot, as like i say she is a bit nervous to say the least when i comes to these things. So, the question is, has anyone got their other half into our favourite pasttime, and if they were like my girlfriend how did you do so in such a way to ensure thay enjoyed themselves?

In reply to hereforded:

Don't do it. Before you know it, they climb better and harder than you.

In reply to hereforded:

My gf was not only nervous, but actively scared of heights. In less than a year, she's climbing more often than I am - she lives near somewhere to climb, I don't.

We just started off on easy stuff and scrambles, and worked from there. It helped that I'm quite happy not pushing my grade (indeed, I'm currently concentrating on not pushing my grade), and that spending time in the hills is fun for its own sake. The key moment was the first time we went - after two days of swearing at me on scrambles and easy climbs, she woke me up and demanded that we go climbing instantly.

In reply to hereforded:
I would start by sticking her on an assisted abseil on something easy and slabby - just to get her head for heights - then top rope her on some easy stuff but start by building her confidence in the gear - for instance let her climb a couple of feet off the floor and then let go just to prove how safe the system is and boost her confidence before she actually tackles the entire climb.

In reply to psd:

What I found really helpful was that there was someone soloing alongside me on these first climbs to give me advice what to do and where to put my feet (especially on that unneccessary traverse you put in just to make it a bit more "interesting").

I'm still actively scared of heights, but I can cope with it most of the time now. Practising falls on a toprope helped a lot.

In reply to hereforded:

System a/
You could try starting at 'Bleau. No ropes, lots of easy problems - do some yellow circuits, maybe even start on the kiddies whites.

Plenty of time lazing in the sun, nice restaurant in the evening.

When she starts to enjoy that then suggest a trip sport-climbing somewhere nice - Spain maybe. Spend plenty of time walking and seeing the region as well as climbing. Get her to second on short, really easy routes with a walkoff the top (not a lower) before progressing to lowering off and abseiling.

System b/
Or you could "drag her up some routes on a top rope" as an adjunct to your own day out ...

I tried b/ first and it took me about two years to recover to a position where a/ would work.

R.

PS. My wife absolutely hated trad climbing, she trashed her hands/nails getting the gear out (several women told me this is the most disheartening aspect of all forms of climbing for them) and almost divorced me on the spot at the top of the route.

In reply to hereforded:

wouldn't bother if shes a nervous type. Sack her off and find a new gf. Its not worth the hassle in the long term I reckon.
p

In reply to hereforded:

Got my old G/f (shes not old - just not my G/f anymore!) into climbing by taking her indoors first until she was confident of the basics i.e. tying in, belay systems etc.

Only once she was happy indoors did we progress to the great outdoors. First couple of outings, I asked another climbing buddy to come with us which meant at anyone time there was someone at the top & bottom of the face in case she needed advice or got freaked. I suggest the following:

* Show her how you have set up the top rope, emphasising multiple anchors for safety, and generally explaining how it all works.

* Next, climb the route yourself (with your climbing buddy belaying) pointing out good holds, resting points etc.

* Demonstrate the strength of the top rope system by falling a small distance.

* Wear helmets - it's amazing how much better a piece of plastic on her head will make her feel.

* Also, it is well worth getting her some proper climbing shoes so that she can feel more confident about her feet.

* Don't over do it. keep to easy routes, and don't do too many in a day.

* Go somewhere private (ish) - nervy, self concious people don't like to try new things when there are lots of "experts" around to watch her fail. - I went to Windgather as it has a nice selection of easy routes and was quite quiet that day.

In reply to hereforded: Wish i could get the GF in to climbing would definitly help me out in my serch for partners , but at the moment she is a little nervous about belaying

In reply to jay76: yeah i was wondering about that...it's not that i don't trust my gf but how do i know she just panic and let go? also she is on about 65% of my weight so i don't want her to twang up in the air or get stretched between me and an anchor...

In reply to hereforded: I am starting here easily, by using a gre gre and anchoring her to the ground

In reply to hereforded:

Like a few people have said you've got to take it really slowly and not push, the climbing that is. Most people are scared of climbing at first, the difference here is that your girlfriend is prepared to admit this to you. She’s probably also prepared to stop sleeping with you if you freak her out. Use this as an incentive to behave kindly.

Top roping is good, but it pisses the odd person off, so why not start indoors. A controlled environment away from people wanting to trad-climb your route can do the world of good. This will teach her basic belay techniques (something you'll appreciate as much as her) and to trust a top roped or sport environment.

After that it's about communication, ask her what she thinks she's capable of, and what she wants to achieve. Do not just say "oh it's a nice day, lets do your first trad route in Pembroke". Sea cliffs have been known to add an extra air of menace you know.

Best of luck.

Tom

Is a climbing girlfriend a good thing?

In reply to hereforded:

Practise belaying with her on the ground (walking away from her) and have someone to supervise her belaying/lowering off for the first couple of times, preferably while you are climbing something you are sure that you're not likely to fall off.

In reply to nickstephens:

Yep. Definitely. It's a great thing to share.

In reply to I am the God of Strathyre:

Can think of some things I'd like to share with potential gf but haven't found any to keep up with climbing/ travelling activities. Kind of given up and looking for alternative non-climbing ones!

In reply to nickstephens:

It certainly helps avoid the "oh but you are always climbing, can't we go shopping together today?" questions!

In reply to balmybaldwin:

No there's a very easy way around that one.

In reply to hereforded:
I am infact one of these girlfriends turned climber due to boyfriend influence. I started indoors, i am small compared to him and managed to belay fairly well... just make sure somebody watches her the first couple of times (i didnt exactly pick it up straight away). Eventually we went outside bouldering to get used to the outdoors, now i actively climb as much as i can. Dont worry if you think she'll eventually get better at it than you, you'll always have completely different styles.

In reply to balmybaldwin:
I feel really bad now, my partner comes along with me, he knows the basics but i dont think hes really into it, anyways, the way i get him up (the wall) is just dont let him down till hes got to the top...

...did i mention hes terrified of hights?!

In reply to balmybaldwin:

I have just got my slightly nervous bf into climbing. Agree with everything balmybladwin said, especially the bits about explaining everything and making sure she is happy belaying, and that you are happy with her belaying.

I found that weekend trips away to places where there are plenty of other things to do are good, that way you don't have to climb all the time, and it won't feel like a waste if she doesn't enjoy it. N Wales, the Gower and Cornwall have been good so far, lots of walking/surfing/beaches etc. Do one day climbing, and one day doing something else.

Other tips:

Avoid venues you have to ab in to.
Slabby stuff is good, it doesn't feel so exposed. Ditto routes up corners.
Try and climb straight-up routes with good abseil anchors at the top so you can retrieve gear if she wants to back off, there is less pressure on her then.

Don't make her do anything she doesn't want to. Don't take the piss if she backs off things or gets scared. Take it easy. Never say "one more route" when she has had enough.

Don't stop climbing with your other mates...you will get frustrated if you only climb with her and it'll all go pear shaped.


I haven't done any toproping with the BF, he's just seconded me up things, but it seems to work...I got him to belay me on lead lots indoors before we went out though. On the first couple of routes, where there weren't many people and there was a walk up, I took him to the top to show him the stance first so he could see it was safe. I also found it useful to let him place bits of my rack round the bottom of the crag so he knew how things worked.

Good luck!

M

In reply to hereforded:
From my experience, you've got an upside and and a downside.

On the upside you have an experience you can share, and there are no more of those awkward holidays where you want to dissapear with your mates, or where you go on a non-climbing holiday and spend most of your time you mates.

The main point where it all falls down for me- you're doing it because you love it. If you're lucky your partner will love it too, but if you don't share the same enthusiasm for it - well the whole experience of a days climbing is different for me. You want your (climbing) partner to share in what you feel and you both feed of that a little bit. Yeah they might like it a bit, but do you get a sigh and an eye roll when you get out the hard grit video to watch it for the nth time?

In reply to Max_01:

Get some other women climbers involved. That way it can break down the male dominant stereotype thing (should it arise) and role models womens abilities. Also gives an emotional foil if you are not dealing with things very well.

The big thing I think is that they have to want to do it, so you are part way there.

In reply to hereforded:

Do some scrambles with her first to get her used to heights then easy climbs that you can solo, but put runners on to show how they work.
If she likes it then work her grades up.

In reply to hereforded:

I agree with most of the above. Font is a good idea because it's the fun side of climbing wthout the paraphenalia, indoors is good to get used to belaying and the feeling of leading in a safe environment. Scrambling is a good idea too, to develop that feeling of freedom in the mountains. Personally I don't think top-roping is worth bothering with but leading with her seconding is OK as long as it is understood that hopefully she will be leading soon if she wants and leading up easy climbs is a good way to start. Climbing with other women is fun and if they are a similar build it acts as a better measure of what is realistic to achieve. Women are usually not competitive in the off-putting way that some men can be.
It's important that she always feels in control and understands the mechanics of what makes something safe or unsafe. If she's had enough don't push it and never call her a wuss or anything else patronising.
You sound like a considerate sort of bloke anyway so I'm sure it will be fine.

In reply to hereforded:

choose a sunny day and a clinb with a sunny aspect. Don't insist on camping - that can come later when she's hooked. B&B much better. Ignore hissy fits and whimpers.

In reply to hereforded:
Totally bizarre spelling on this thread.

Anyway! I kind of met my bloke through climbing. I'd taken it up off my own bat but only been doing it for a matter of weeks/couple of months or something. He worked at the same place and heard I was into it so offered to climb together. He was a lot more experienced and enjoyed showing me how to do things (he's a great teacher, v patient) and I enjoyed having someone to show me but not pressure me. We eventually got together but part of his attraction to me was his patience and teaching style (and yes, authority!).

I think as someone else said, try not to make her feel pressured, which ideally means going somewhere not very crowded. I started off at the climbing wall which is a good place to learn and feel safe. Then some easy stuff outdoors. To be honest, I was always pretty fearless so the being scared thing wasn't really an issue but it's more the messing up in front of people thing that was an issue for me. Being sensitive to how she is feeling will help - eg not talking to other people when you're belaying her etc, and not laughing when they fall off, and not saying things like 'that's not your best angle'... pretty obvious stuff!

Finally, don't try to pressure her into liking it. Sometimes it's good for you not to share everything. The bloke has one activity he does every week that I've never even tried to muscle in on. It's his time. (He also leaves me to do the grocery shopping, hmm, fair!). Consider whether you two can appreciate it as a non-competitive sport... I've improved a lot but we now hardly ever climb together. We just climb when we're both available but now we work at different places, we tend to climb with people in the area.

In reply to hereforded:

dont do it

she will want to come with you everywhere,

your time will not be your own

enjoy it for yourself like a true selfish git

In reply to jim@thecrag: a worthy point and definately one that has been considered and discussed with gf...ta for the advice everyone

In reply to hereforded:
When you two start climbing out side get her involed with setting up, saftey techniques, prusicing ect every thing that make us feel comfortable that we can get our selves out of most situations. confidence/understanding of the saftey is just as important as her climbing ability when it come to nerves.

I'm not saying make her feel climbing is safe but insdead show her that it's not a a game of luck and precusions can be taken.

Have fun Tom

In reply to hereforded:
Managed to get her up Shiehallion last Saturday - her first munro. I've built up to using stealth tactics, reverse psychology and buying her pretty coloured boots and goretex. Didn't stop her having a good moan about the boulder field on the summit (forgot about that).

In reply to hereforded:

I was introduced by a BF and I would say I have a fairly nervy disposition (although am also fairly adventurous and like a challenge!) Two years on and I'm addicted!

Give her a chance and be supportive and patient...

In reply to hereforded:

err, and I love camping, don't worry about nails (they are always short) like my grit rash, cuts, bruises and other bodily damage... & don't have pink boots (yet!)

the joys of climbing in some of the most beautiful parts of the country (sea cliffs do it for me), that I know I would not see if I had not started climbing more than makes up for any pain endured (v little so far even when falling/swinging off a traverse the other week).

(so does a nice pint or 3 of good beer afterwards!!!)

it's bloody fab - she'll probably love it!

still, I did once have the nickname 'scruffer' so perhaps i'm not ya 'typical gal'??? ; ))

In reply to Loopy:
once a scruffer always a scruffer.....

In reply to Loopy:



My soul Mate!!

In reply to hereforded:

Obviosuly, we can all only speak from experience, so here goes.

I think a lot of this depends upon your style of climbing or your way of life in climbing. If you're pretty hard core, train regularly and climb in quite a competitive 'elite' crew, then unless you're dating Josune or Lisa, it probably isn't going to work. I can only speak from experience, and in other situations, I could be wrong.

If, on the other hand, you're an HVS bumbly who's idea of paradise is a day in the mountains wandering up something you find very easy and relaxing on a mountain crag (I'm not judging; nothing wrong with that; different strokes, etc), then IMHO you have a much better chance of success.

I'm about to invoke the wrath of RT by (shock, horror) making a sex-based generalisation, but I think a higher proportion of guys take to the ultra competitive, soul-consuming, get-better-at-all-costs style of climbing (and most other things) than girls. That's not to say some don't... And it's also not meant to suggest guys are better than girls in some way, or vice versa.

In reply to hereforded: Me and the missus do everything together, even work together, but we are very similar, she didnt climb or do much in the hills when we met, but was already a runner and did lots of diving, so it wasnt a big thing really to get her to go up hills. just got her leading straight away, within the first day I think, just on easy slabs, thenw ent from there.

In reply to clivers: is that clive emerson? if so very unsubtle hint clive! Are you still going on Tuesdays?

In reply to hereforded:

Take her to Boulder Ruckle

In reply to Anonymous:
OR gogarth both excelent choices !!!!

In reply to Loopy:

I was also introduced to climbing by a boyfriend and it totally altered the dynamic in our relationship.

Much better to get your own climbing friends and learn without your partner's do-this, do-that all the time.

In any case aren't some of these suggestions a bit lame? Practice belaying on the ground walking away from her? I can't think of a more dull way to be taught. Easier to take her to windgather and lead soemthing you could solo so it doesn't matter if it takes her a while to get to grips with it. And that's not an intimidating venue either.

In reply to stubbed:

But this only works if there's someone next to her supervising what she is doing. If you just let her belay you on her own while climbing something easy, she might just get used to doing it wrong, because you can't point out mistakes while she's doing it.

In reply to violentViolet:

Not if you keep an eye on her. It's only a couple of metres high

In reply to stubbed:
"I was also introduced to climbing by a boyfriend and it totally altered the dynamic in our relationship. "

for the better or the worse ?

In reply to CurlyStevo:

Worse. I had to keep doing as I was told otherwise apparently I was going to die. And even now I climb better than him (years after we split up) he still does it.

Including: wearing ridiculous clothes (+ helmet, not so ridiculous but amongst his teachings that I now ignore) running backwards and forwards to pick up gear that he'd dropped, not using quite the right climbing call when a metre off the ground blah blah blah

Learning without a boyfriend on the other hand you get treated with a bit more respect and competence.

In reply to stubbed:

All depends on the boyfriend I guess. Or do you think his teaching would have been better if you weren't dating at the time?

In reply to violentViolet:

No, I think his teaching would have been the same so it misses the point really.

The thing is, you can learn elsewhere and then you can climb with your partner or whoever you want without having the master / apprentice situation arising.

I do climb with someone far more experienced than me now and it doesn't alter our relationship on or off the crag. it's just something that's always been that way.

In reply to stubbed:

Well the point I was trying to make is that there are good teachers and bad teachers, it doesn't really make a difference whether you're in a relationship or not as long as you treat each other with respect.

In reply to violentViolet:

True (I'm a good teacher for example!)

In reply to Anonymous:

Well, a friend of mine, who perhaps ought to remain nameless, did just that. Needless to say, the girlfriend (now wife) has not climbed since.

In reply to stubbed:

well of course it depends on the relationship and how you work together... it's nice to climb with other people but it's also nice for someone to take the time and patience to teach you well (which is how it was for me). There was also a lot of 'you don't wanna do it like that...' going on but to be fair, that was OK because I was learning - when I became more confident it was a bit irritating at times!

In reply to clivers:

Oh, that a good idea. Sharp intake of breath.

In reply to clivers: Came to CLimbing Club once....had sketchy guts from copious curry eating

In reply to hereforded: i took my girlfriend once and now she naggs me all the time to go. i used to like amazing her with stories of near death falls and dodgy belays and you could kind of say what you wanted but now i have to stick cloer to the truth as she knows what i'm talkin about. to be honest i hate her climbing with me. its my 'thing' and i think thats important to do different things from one another or else you live in each others pockets all the time.

In reply to nofx:

That sounds ideal to me. She can go off climbing with her friends and you can go off with yours and you'll have loads to talk about at the end of the day.