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Hello all, Im wanting to go and do milestone buttress on Tryfan, could anyone tell me the size and quantity on nuts i would need to safely complete said climb, i don't want to buy a set and find out i only need a few of the same size. Any help from people who have done the climb would be greatly appricheated. Thanks
In reply to balongworth: There are several routes on Milestone, all of which can be protected with a set of rocks/ wires and a few slings. Which one are you thinking about?
But I have to admit to being a bit confused by your gear buying plan. Is this the only route you ever intend to climb? Does your partner have any gear? It seems an odd strategy to only buy the exact gear you need for one route in North Wales.
But I have to admit to being a bit confused by your gear buying plan. Is this the only route you ever intend to climb? Does your partner have any gear? It seems an odd strategy to only buy the exact gear you need for one route in North Wales.
In reply to balongworth: Given that it's a multi pitch climb you will potentially need more gear than for single pitch as you'll have 2 belays rigged at any one time. The amount of gear you carry depends on how much protection you feel you'll need - if you're climbing several grades below your max then you may only want a runner every 20 feet "just in case". As a minimum I'd carry a wires 4 - 10, 2 or 3 hexes/rockcentrics and 6 - 8 extenders. You could double up with sizes 5 - 8. You'll also need 1 or 2 long slings and a couple of screwgates. The Needlesports website has suggestions for starter racks.
In reply to balongworth: No-one can tell you exactly what size nuts you need for specific placements as you probably will not place them in exactly the same place. If you intend doing more climbig you are best off buying a full set of nuts (1-10) at noce, as this will save you a lot of cash in the long run. FWIW I recently did it and just used nuts 1 - 10 and a couple of medium hexes. Some slings are useful to extend runners as the route doesn't follow a straight line.
In reply to balongworth:
You need a range of gear to climb most routes - particulalry multi-pitch ones and you need to develop your own skill in deciding where and how to place it. It's expensive stuff but don't stint on it - it may/will? save you one day!
You need a range of gear to climb most routes - particulalry multi-pitch ones and you need to develop your own skill in deciding where and how to place it. It's expensive stuff but don't stint on it - it may/will? save you one day!
In reply to balongworth:
I would suggest that with you asking such a question, then you have fairly limited climbing experience. In which case you'll probably want as much gear as you can get hold of. Personally for most easier routes in wales with reasonably long pitches i would take 2 sets of nuts 1-11 and a full set of hex's, with say around 8 quickdraws (more if using double ropes) and loads of slings of various sizes. I very rarely place cams upto severe but two or three might be usefull.
I would suggest that with you asking such a question, then you have fairly limited climbing experience. In which case you'll probably want as much gear as you can get hold of. Personally for most easier routes in wales with reasonably long pitches i would take 2 sets of nuts 1-11 and a full set of hex's, with say around 8 quickdraws (more if using double ropes) and loads of slings of various sizes. I very rarely place cams upto severe but two or three might be usefull.
In reply to balongworth:
This is a multipich route, that means you need to be able to retreat if needed. If you do not have either the gear, or more importantly the skills needed to do this think again.
This is a multipich route, that means you need to be able to retreat if needed. If you do not have either the gear, or more importantly the skills needed to do this think again.
In reply to balongworth:
A hex is a type of nut (nut being the old term as they were once...nuts).
Rocks and other types of 'chocks' (again the old term) are now usually referred to as 'wires'
A hex is a type of nut (nut being the old term as they were once...nuts).
Rocks and other types of 'chocks' (again the old term) are now usually referred to as 'wires'
In reply to balongworth:
I would suggest that with you asking such a question, then you have fairly limited climbing experience. In which case you'll probably want as much gear as you can get hold of. Personally for most easier routes in wales with reasonably long pitches i would take 2 sets of nuts 1-11 and a full set of hex's, with say around 8 quick draws (more if using double ropes) and loads of slings of various sizes. I very rarely place cams upto severe but two or three might be useful.
I'll second that, and take at least 5+ screwgates and a couple of prusik loops
I would suggest that with you asking such a question, then you have fairly limited climbing experience. In which case you'll probably want as much gear as you can get hold of. Personally for most easier routes in wales with reasonably long pitches i would take 2 sets of nuts 1-11 and a full set of hex's, with say around 8 quick draws (more if using double ropes) and loads of slings of various sizes. I very rarely place cams upto severe but two or three might be useful.
I'll second that, and take at least 5+ screwgates and a couple of prusik loops
In reply to balongworth:
It's also worth pointing out that the descent can be more problematic than the climb itself. You can scramble off up and left towards the north ridge which is arguably easier and safer, but requires good route finding. The alternative being a damp gully to the right of the crag which can be down climbed (for the confident) or abseiled.
It's also worth pointing out that the descent can be more problematic than the climb itself. You can scramble off up and left towards the north ridge which is arguably easier and safer, but requires good route finding. The alternative being a damp gully to the right of the crag which can be down climbed (for the confident) or abseiled.
In reply to asmith37: the downclimb/ descent gully is really horrid. Suprised there aren't more accidents there
In reply to balongworth:
Matey, it's a long "mountain" route- I'm assuming you're looking at http://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/c.php?i=5739
There's no particular gear that is useful beyond what most people consider requisite for multipitch routes. Have you ever done a multipitch route?
It's not really any different to a single pitch route, except you will need sufficient gear to build TWO belays. So a big part of it is quantity. If you've got a set of 10 nuts, placed 6 runners, that's only 4 left- and you'll have to be lucky to find they're the right size for a belays.
There's always going to be a bit of being lucky, and a bit of being unlucky, but I guess most people would look at having:
*Two sets of nuts
*some cams/ hexes
*a good selection of LONGER extenders (those 10cm sewn ones a lot of people seem to carry these days don't really cut the mustard on this sort of route)
*a few slings with a caribiner for each (for building belays or using over spikes/ threads/ extending runners that are way off line)
*2 or 3 screwgates each (on top of the one for the belay plate)
Cordlettes can be great, if you're used to using them, for building quick belays.
I hope you're also pretty switched on at belay building generally? You understand equalising, direction of pull (including upwards), the need to protect the belay (i.e. fall factors).
Can I also ask you- do you feel confident in your climbing 'procedure'? This can be important on long routes like Milestone Buttress, where there's every chance you won't be able to communicate with your partner at stances- and that means both of you have to be confident about what you're doing.
I'm assuming you're all helmeted up too?
-A
ps- if you don't really groove on any of the above, then I'm sure you'll still go out and have a great day- it's just you did specify 'safely'.
Matey, it's a long "mountain" route- I'm assuming you're looking at http://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/c.php?i=5739
There's no particular gear that is useful beyond what most people consider requisite for multipitch routes. Have you ever done a multipitch route?
It's not really any different to a single pitch route, except you will need sufficient gear to build TWO belays. So a big part of it is quantity. If you've got a set of 10 nuts, placed 6 runners, that's only 4 left- and you'll have to be lucky to find they're the right size for a belays.
There's always going to be a bit of being lucky, and a bit of being unlucky, but I guess most people would look at having:
*Two sets of nuts
*some cams/ hexes
*a good selection of LONGER extenders (those 10cm sewn ones a lot of people seem to carry these days don't really cut the mustard on this sort of route)
*a few slings with a caribiner for each (for building belays or using over spikes/ threads/ extending runners that are way off line)
*2 or 3 screwgates each (on top of the one for the belay plate)
Cordlettes can be great, if you're used to using them, for building quick belays.
I hope you're also pretty switched on at belay building generally? You understand equalising, direction of pull (including upwards), the need to protect the belay (i.e. fall factors).
Can I also ask you- do you feel confident in your climbing 'procedure'? This can be important on long routes like Milestone Buttress, where there's every chance you won't be able to communicate with your partner at stances- and that means both of you have to be confident about what you're doing.
I'm assuming you're all helmeted up too?
-A
ps- if you don't really groove on any of the above, then I'm sure you'll still go out and have a great day- it's just you did specify 'safely'.
In reply to balongworth: I did 2 or 3 routes on Milestone Buttress in 1965. I think we had about 4 slings, which was completely adequate.
In reply to Ken McCulloch: Probably wasn't like climbing polished glass in those days!
In reply to balongworth:
I think people are underestimating the climbing here. The Milestone Buttress is one of the longest and therefore hardest and most serious undertakings in Wales and indeed the Northern Hemisphere. I put together a team to tackle it siege style in the Summer of '07 and we took the following list and could have used more:
4 full sets of nuts 1-11
3 full sets of wild country hexes on wire
a triple set of cams from WC sizes 00-6 including all half sizes (it might be worth getting more of the micros as there are many blank sections of wall which will take nothing else)
a bandolier of 30 quickdraws
a bandolier of 10 pegs + hammer
20 slings & krabs
set of large big bros
5 skyhooks for aiding the hardest pitches
1000m cumulatively of static rope to fix along the way so that you can ascend quickly to your previous high point
You will also need to set up an appropriate base camp including mess tent and first aid tent. There are plenty of sherpas for hire in Llanberis, they tend to be found in the Vaynol Arms.
We attempted to make to wall go free but found that it was completely unjustifiable and would not be surprised if it was beyond the powers of any man. For that reason I also suggest taking a couple of strong chisels to chip a way if a pitch cannot even be aided.
I think people are underestimating the climbing here. The Milestone Buttress is one of the longest and therefore hardest and most serious undertakings in Wales and indeed the Northern Hemisphere. I put together a team to tackle it siege style in the Summer of '07 and we took the following list and could have used more:
4 full sets of nuts 1-11
3 full sets of wild country hexes on wire
a triple set of cams from WC sizes 00-6 including all half sizes (it might be worth getting more of the micros as there are many blank sections of wall which will take nothing else)
a bandolier of 30 quickdraws
a bandolier of 10 pegs + hammer
20 slings & krabs
set of large big bros
5 skyhooks for aiding the hardest pitches
1000m cumulatively of static rope to fix along the way so that you can ascend quickly to your previous high point
You will also need to set up an appropriate base camp including mess tent and first aid tent. There are plenty of sherpas for hire in Llanberis, they tend to be found in the Vaynol Arms.
We attempted to make to wall go free but found that it was completely unjustifiable and would not be surprised if it was beyond the powers of any man. For that reason I also suggest taking a couple of strong chisels to chip a way if a pitch cannot even be aided.
I know we want to help this chap, so I think the least we could do is spell out where all the gear placements are and the relevant piece of gear. I will start us off.
1. When you start off up the slab, a crack soon appears. In the bottom of that you can put a Wallnut 4 (made by DMM) with the convex bit facing right in the crack. If you only have a Wild Country Rock 4 that will do but you will need to tug that one a bit harder to get it seated.
2. [someone else's turn...]
1. When you start off up the slab, a crack soon appears. In the bottom of that you can put a Wallnut 4 (made by DMM) with the convex bit facing right in the crack. If you only have a Wild Country Rock 4 that will do but you will need to tug that one a bit harder to get it seated.
2. [someone else's turn...]
In reply to Will Hunt:
What about the copperheads and RURPs? Without them the route would be unjustifiable, even for a tiger.
What about the copperheads and RURPs? Without them the route would be unjustifiable, even for a tiger.
In reply to stewart murray: great stuff, thanks for the reply.
In reply to Will Hunt: Legend!!!
I think it a disgrace to the climbing community that when somebody asks for some assistance or guidance, that most people respond in such a negative and derogatory manner. I have only been climbing for a year but i go as often as possible and climb comfortably in the 6's. I find it appalling that people have such a snobbish attitude when asked for advice. I think it pathetic that people take the opportunity to offer put-downs rather than helping someone out. Great attitudes guys!!!!
In reply to balongworth:
morning.
aye, and you're right of course but it's the ukc and the pisstake replies are almost de rigeur it seems.
there are a few genuine replies in there though. i suppose for most folk the answer's going to be much the same for any multipitch of this ilk.
playing it safe- 2 full sets of wires, set of hexes, at least half dozen slings, micros if you're feeling flush, maybe 10 draws, as many 'biners as you can lay hands on and make sure you're confident with belay building and prepared to retreat if it goes pear shaped.
somebody linked to the logbook page: check the comment at the top of the log book and recognise that we newbies are likely to get bitten by a v.diff from time to time!
ignore the wide comments, pay attention to those who've tried to advise you and go have a good time :]
> I think it pathetic that people take the opportunity to offer put-downs rather than helping someone out. Great attitudes guys!!!!
morning.
aye, and you're right of course but it's the ukc and the pisstake replies are almost de rigeur it seems.
there are a few genuine replies in there though. i suppose for most folk the answer's going to be much the same for any multipitch of this ilk.
playing it safe- 2 full sets of wires, set of hexes, at least half dozen slings, micros if you're feeling flush, maybe 10 draws, as many 'biners as you can lay hands on and make sure you're confident with belay building and prepared to retreat if it goes pear shaped.
somebody linked to the logbook page: check the comment at the top of the log book and recognise that we newbies are likely to get bitten by a v.diff from time to time!
ignore the wide comments, pay attention to those who've tried to advise you and go have a good time :]
In reply to balongworth:
I dont know if they still do, but Plas y Brenin used to do a pamphlet for a fiver which contained amongst other things a basic rack suggestion that would be sufficient for most Welsh multipitch routes, and perfect for the easier multipitch routes at Milestone.
I dont know if they still do, but Plas y Brenin used to do a pamphlet for a fiver which contained amongst other things a basic rack suggestion that would be sufficient for most Welsh multipitch routes, and perfect for the easier multipitch routes at Milestone.
In reply to balongworth:
You are obviously new to climbing, you need time to appreciate the art of pisstake, you will one day revel in it.
> I think it a disgrace to the climbing community that when somebody asks for some assistance or guidance, that most people respond in such a negative and derogatory manner. I have only been climbing for a year but i go as often as possible and climb comfortably in the 6's. I find it appalling that people have such a snobbish attitude when asked for advice. I think it pathetic that people take the opportunity to offer put-downs rather than helping someone out.
You are obviously new to climbing, you need time to appreciate the art of pisstake, you will one day revel in it.
In reply to balongworth:
there's plenty of genuine replies on here, and after those there's a few jokes. There's no need for hundreds of people to repeat the sound advice further up, and the forum is here for entertainment as well as information. There's nothing on here that's offensive.
So careful you don't injure yourself jerking your knee so hard. Instead maybe get over it and don't be such a whinger
> I think it a disgrace to the climbing community that when somebody asks for some assistance or guidance, that most people respond in such a negative and derogatory manner. I have only been climbing for a year but i go as often as possible and climb comfortably in the 6's. I find it appalling that people have such a snobbish attitude when asked for advice. I think it pathetic that people take the opportunity to offer put-downs rather than helping someone out. Great attitudes guys!!!!
there's plenty of genuine replies on here, and after those there's a few jokes. There's no need for hundreds of people to repeat the sound advice further up, and the forum is here for entertainment as well as information. There's nothing on here that's offensive.
So careful you don't injure yourself jerking your knee so hard. Instead maybe get over it and don't be such a whinger
In reply to don macb:
yes, but it's nice to get to know people before taking the piss out of them, just like in real life. ;¬)
or if you've not done a route like this before you could always try one of the diffs first. Rowan Route is very enjoyable and gets a feel for the place. if you get on ok with this, you might well have time to try the Direct Route afterwards.
enjoy!
N
> (In reply to balongworth)
> [...]
>
> morning.
> aye, and you're right of course but it's the ukc and the pisstake replies are almost de rigeur it seems.
> [...]
>
> morning.
> aye, and you're right of course but it's the ukc and the pisstake replies are almost de rigeur it seems.
yes, but it's nice to get to know people before taking the piss out of them, just like in real life. ;¬)
> somebody linked to the logbook page: check the comment at the top of the log book and recognise that we newbies are likely to get bitten by a v.diff from time to time!
or if you've not done a route like this before you could always try one of the diffs first. Rowan Route is very enjoyable and gets a feel for the place. if you get on ok with this, you might well have time to try the Direct Route afterwards.
enjoy!
N
In reply to balongworth: A good choice of crag for multipitch. Good runners/belays and route finding is fairly straightforward.Start on Pulpit Route or Rowan Route- if you breeze these then the Direct Route which is excellent.
I choose to abseil down the wet gully on rhs of crag- a reasonable path at top of crag makes it fairly easy to locate - there is abseil tat in place at top of gully, and using double ropes allows you to safely reach bottom of gully.
Have fun.
I choose to abseil down the wet gully on rhs of crag- a reasonable path at top of crag makes it fairly easy to locate - there is abseil tat in place at top of gully, and using double ropes allows you to safely reach bottom of gully.
Have fun.
In reply to bobpilgrem: Expect ropes to get pretty wet on abseil though! Was like stream when we did it.
In reply to nikinko, excellent, thanks for the help
In reply to balongworth:
WARNING!!! On no account should you attempt a route such as this without employing the services of a fully qualified Mountain Instructor (reasonable rates - cash preffered )
Seriously - check out this website for some excellent advice :
http://www.psychovertical.com/?rockrackgear
Have fun. There are a lot of different route options on the Milestone from fun scrambles to classic beginners Mods and Diffs - the polished Direct, the quite hard Superdirect and the less visited but brilliant "back of the Milestone" where if the grades suit I could recommend WallClimb/Soapgut/another route whose name Ive forgotton combination.
Should imagine its gonna be nice and dry for the weekend.
Just to emphasise - the lower pitch of Direct is polished to a glass like sheen (but the gear is good)
WARNING!!! On no account should you attempt a route such as this without employing the services of a fully qualified Mountain Instructor (reasonable rates - cash preffered )
Seriously - check out this website for some excellent advice :
http://www.psychovertical.com/?rockrackgear
Have fun. There are a lot of different route options on the Milestone from fun scrambles to classic beginners Mods and Diffs - the polished Direct, the quite hard Superdirect and the less visited but brilliant "back of the Milestone" where if the grades suit I could recommend WallClimb/Soapgut/another route whose name Ive forgotton combination.
Should imagine its gonna be nice and dry for the weekend.
Just to emphasise - the lower pitch of Direct is polished to a glass like sheen (but the gear is good)
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