UKC

the 4 minute mile

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 goldmember 11 Aug 2016
At the weekend at part of my long run I had to run down a long steep hill. I was flying down however it was only after when I checked my watch I realised it hadn’t broken 4min/mile pace. Fastest was 4.10.
I was amazed that despite the assistance of gravity I was still slower than Bannister's record pace.

Anyone else been humbled lately? What is required to break the 4 minute mile?
 Michael Hood 11 Aug 2016
In reply to goldmember: talent, training, application, etc. Or another faster means of locomotion

A quick google shows 1303 at Oct 2013 so probably still under 2000. There are probably a load more who could but have only run 1500m.

However that's still a pretty small proportion of the world's population - approx. 25-30 millionths of a percent.

 Dan Arkle 11 Aug 2016
In reply to goldmember:

Does your watch take the the extra distance due to the drop into account, or just the map distance?
OP goldmember 11 Aug 2016
In reply to Dan Arkle:

Not sure. It'll be what ever garmin standard settings are
In reply to goldmember: "Anyone else been humbled lately? "

yes, I saw a horse take a p1ss whilst I was walking my dog last weekend

 Hat Dude 11 Aug 2016
In reply to goldmember:

> What is required to break the 4 minute mile?

A bike - and a downhill!
 Roadrunner5 17 Aug 2016
In reply to goldmember:

4:10 is rapid turnover bloody well done.

A friend has tried with huskies... she got close.

For me, impossible. Even running sub 5 minute mile for 400m is hard.
 Roadrunner5 17 Aug 2016
In reply to Bjartur i Sumarhus:

> "Anyone else been humbled lately? "

> yes, I saw a horse take a p1ss whilst I was walking my dog last weekend

I used to naked Sauna in Germany with my African mate, tiny 130 lb runner.. similar experience..

(sadly for me..)
1
 ablackett 17 Aug 2016
In reply to goldmember:

4 minute mile pace is faster than top speed for most folk, it's outragously fast. What I find staggering is how slow Mo Farrah and the like look when they are running 13 minute 5k pace, which is 4:12 mile pace and they look like they are jogging - If I am running that fast it is open palms, eyeballs out sprinting!

I am a decent fell runner - win North East races, top end in short lakeland races but my fastest mile is a shade under 5 minutes - that's downhill. I am always looking for the perfect hill to try and run a 4 min mile but haven't found it yet!
 Roadrunner5 17 Aug 2016
In reply to ablackett:
I just don't think we'd have the turnover.. Fairly much flat out I'll do 200s in 32-34s. Which sounds similar, probably slightly slower than your sprint.

That's still way off sub 4 pace.
Post edited at 16:21
 ChrisBrooke 17 Aug 2016
In reply to goldmember:

I have my Garmin set up in km, but a quick google says I'd need to go at 2'29"/km pace. The other day while bombing it down the Burbage valley at a sustainable sprint I was pleased to get 3'50"/km..... Yup, pretty humble.
 Patrick Roman 17 Aug 2016
In reply to goldmember:

I was a 4.10 miler when I used to run 8s and 15s on the track. Like most sports, when you start squeezing the margins you really want to have the perfect body shape. And I didn't. I was about 12st 5lbs, which is just too heavy for someone who's 6 foot. My body fat was super low but it didn't matter, I was lining up against guys 2st lighter than me (for the same height), and that just doesn't work.

Someone mentioned running 200 intervals. I used to do stacks of those with a good friend in 28secs with very little recovery between, and I found that pretty manageable. I ran 6 days a week, a mix of speed work, hill sessions, intervals, 10ks etc, as well as half marathons every week, however that extra 10 seconds that I needed was still a world away. In my own opinion, the actual physical work you need to put in is hard but not Olympian hard. But you really need that ideal body shape!

PS. I heard the other day, I think it was in the build-up to Mo's 10k, that he could run a 49sec 400m at the end of a hard training session, and that he's recorded last laps of 51secs and 53secs in major 5,000s and 10,000s respectively. If you think of that turn of speed, running a 4 minute mile doesn't seem so hard
 Tony the Blade 17 Aug 2016
In reply to ChrisBrooke:
2'29"/km? Bloody nora

My average trail pace is anywhere between 6 and 7 minutes depending on the terrain and distance, my average road pace is about 5'30" (I've never run a track so wouldn't know what my flat pace is)

I know I'm Capt. slow, but to run substantially more than twice my speed???

Edited to add substantially
Post edited at 17:12
 ChrisBrooke 17 Aug 2016
In reply to Tony the Blade:

Crazy huh?
 Patrick Roman 17 Aug 2016
In reply to Tony the Blade:

You've read that wrong! The figure is 2.29 per km, not mile. You need to be running about 3.43 for a 1500m to break 4 minutes for a mile (gives you 16secs for the last 109m).
 Patrick Roman 17 Aug 2016
In reply to Tony the Blade:

Sorry, I've just realised, maybe your avg paces are per km too, not mile?! I just assumed they were per mile, apologies if they're per km!
 Tony the Blade 18 Aug 2016
In reply to Patrick Roman:

Nope... they're Km paces. Like I said, Capt. Slow.

No such thing as a bad run though, eh?
 subtle 18 Aug 2016
In reply to Tony the Blade:

> No such thing as a bad run though, eh?

I dunno, I've had bad case of the runs though
 tingle 22 Aug 2016
In reply to goldmember:

according to strava my fastest is 6:14, so yeah pretty humble! Will have to find myself a hill
 john arran 22 Aug 2016
In reply to tingle:

It will have to be quite some hill to get you to under 4 from over 6.
I would suggest Mount Thor but, despite being well on target to achieve your goal with just a few hundred metres to go, the sprint finish may get messy.
 ianstevens 22 Aug 2016
In reply to goldmember:

> Anyone else been humbled lately? What is required to break the 4 minute mile?

When I realised that the Olympic Marathon is done at around 3:10/km - I can't even do that as a sprint at the end of a marathon! (PB of 3:16 btw)
 galpinos 22 Aug 2016
In reply to ianstevens:

> When I realised that the Olympic Marathon is done at around 3:10/km - I can't even do that as a sprint at the end of a marathon! (PB of 3:16 btw)

I couldn't do it in a ParkRun.......
 DancingOnRock 22 Aug 2016
In reply to goldmember:

It's close to 15seconds for each 100m of 1600m.

On Saturday I ran a 1500 in 6:15, one of the guys I was running with did it in 4:40. He didn't lap me, but he crossed the finish line 20seconds after I crossed it to begin my final lap.

A hard distance to pace right.
 steveriley 22 Aug 2016
In reply to DancingOnRock:
Watching the marathon yesterday the Mrs made a comment about their mile speed. I came back with 'I couldn't run a mile at that pace' ...then revised down to 800 ...then down to 400 ...then changed the subject! I doubt there's anyone in the club doing a single mile at that marathon pace and we've had a couple of age/fell England vests in recent years.
Post edited at 15:11
 Big Top 22 Aug 2016
In reply to goldmember:

With the aid of a bit of gravity, it is recorded that Craig Wheeler completed the Meltham Maniac Mile (over the full measured distance) in 1993 in a time of 3 minutes 24 seconds, which is faster than the track/road world record.
 DancingOnRock 22 Aug 2016
In reply to steveriley:

Yes. By my reckoning they'd be 5 seconds ahead of me after 100m if I sprinted off the line.
barrow_matt 22 Aug 2016
In reply to steveriley:

At a track interval session tonight I managed a sprint finish on the last 200m interval at 4'50/mile pace which seems to be around the required pace to contest the marathon. Maybe I'll just add a bit more distance each week! I couldn't do 400m at that pace, all my other intervals ranging between 600-200m were around 6 minute pace.

I saw something the other day about the 50km walk going through 26.2 miles in not much over 3 hours!
 DancingOnRock 22 Aug 2016
In reply to barrow_matt:
It's a funny race because there are no heats at the Olympics. Every person who qualifies runs in the same race. The Olympic qualifying time is something like 2:48. I think each country can send as many runners as they want as long as they qualify the time.

We sent 2, and the third was extremely close to our own criteria which was something like under 2:20 plus some other storage criteria.

There's some discussion on whether athletes that close should be able to pay their own way in order to compete.
Post edited at 22:33
 colinakmc 22 Aug 2016
In reply to DancingOnRock:

Just watched the re-run of Mo's 800m (was it?) - the one where he trips, lands quite heavily on the deck, then gets up and runs past everyone else and wins. And I the 1500m he shruggedoff two different challenges and just powered away the last 100m. Amazing. Would've given anything for that turn of speed!
 DancingOnRock 22 Aug 2016
In reply to colinakmc:

It was the 10km (6mile) and 5km (3mile) races.
Clauso 22 Aug 2016
In reply to Roadrunner5:

> A friend has tried with huskies... she got close.

I can't believe that the thread is prepared to let this one go!... In preference to Iain's self-professed inadequacies re. African athletes!?!

Woof!

 Padraig 22 Aug 2016
In reply to goldmember:

> Anyone else been humbled lately? What is required to break the 4 minute mile?

If you want humble....have a look at John Walker & Steve Scotts records and be impressed!

OH and if you REALLY want to be impressed google Daniel Komen. Still the only person to run sub 2 x 4 min miles!

 The New NickB 22 Aug 2016
In reply to DancingOnRock:

> It's a funny race because there are no heats at the Olympics. Every person who qualifies runs in the same race. The Olympic qualifying time is something like 2:48. I think each country can send as many runners as they want as long as they qualify the time.

The qualifying standard set by the IAAF was 2:19 and a maximum of 3 from any one country. Nearly 500 Kenyans ran the qualifying standard. Finishing top ten in certain designated races can earn you a place as well, I think a Greek athlete with a 2:29 PB and 10th place at a qualifying marathon was the slowest on paper.

> We sent 2, and the third was extremely close to our own criteria which was something like under 2:20 plus some other storage criteria.

We sent three, the first three British athletes at the London marathon. The third, Derek Hawkins, ran under 2:19, but not 2:14, which was the standard UKA set. He did not automatically qualify, but they decided to send him.
 DancingOnRock 23 Aug 2016
In reply to The New NickB:

Thanks.

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