UKC

Hi all,

Please can you recommend me some decent winter trousers for ice climbing in the Scottish Mountains. I currently have a pair of the Rab Alpine 1.0 and even though they are waterproof think i need something a little more hard wearing and windproof. Oh and i don't want to break the bank if i don't have to, so a few budget options are welcome

For £73.00 with postage, Hilltrek made me some Ultrafleece trousers. 
Wore them in a hoolie last night and they were great. Comfortable, warm, well fitting and a great price for this fabric.

Excellent customer service too.

Are you after a shell layer or something that you only need to put a shell over in hosing rain?

The ultra fleece ones are good in blizzards - they are very windproof and breathable but not waterproof. Alternatively if cost is an issue the Simon (Decathlon) schoeller-type ones are well regarded.

If after waterproof shell ("hard shell") then suggest a good trawl through sport pursuit options. 

b

Probably something to easily slip on over boots if the weather turns for the worse or an all day trouser that is fully waterproof.

I was just looking at the Simond Cascade 2 trouser. Do you know if this is rated well in comparison to say the Montane Resolve trousers?

I've tried various ways round this conundrum over the years and ultimately decided its all a bit of a compromise. Weatherproof trousers seem heavy, restrictive and, aren't truly waterproof. Goretex over-trousers are expensive and can be overkill for days when its just a bit miserable/windy.

My current set up is ME Kinesis trousers (they're great, seriously, just buy some) under a pair of ME Lhotse Goretex Pro overtrousers. The Lhotses come without braces, but I never really felt they stayed up that will with the built in belt, so I've added from braces to them which is a massive improvement. I really like this combination and would happily buy the same again if I had to. Ive also worn the Lhotse's in warmer foul conditions with lighter trousers or (heaven help me) merino leggings underneath. They seem to be pretty hard wearing and I've not managed to stick my crampons through them yet. 

In the past I've had Rab Winter Torque trousers and paired them with some cheaper goretex overtrousers to pull over as necessary. I've still got the Torque trousers and wear them in changeable conditions, they're not as warm/breathable/stretchy (the stretch could be the cut/design) as the Kinesis but they seem to shrug light rain off pretty well and don't wet out. 

Appreciate none of this is particularly budget, but I'm hoping that I can keep what I've got for several years and hopefully it'll work out as a more reasonable number of £'s per year in the long run!

Hope that helps,

Dicky

Haven't used them myself, so can't comment (someone else will be along I'm sure - I think captain paranoia is a big fan of the Simonds).

I have a pair of Mammut Champ winter trousers that get worn for most things (they were wrongly priced at a shop in Sydney so I got them less than half price, too good to miss!). If really grim I have some very old ME goretex salopettes to go over the top. 

b

Just out of curiosity - the kinesis trouser or the kinesis base?

The Simond mountaineering trousers with the braces are great. For a waterproof shell layer I find the bigger spend pays off. Sportpursuit can have some great deals but just make sure if you do buy some Goretex overtrousers, they have the hook for attaching the internal gaiter to your boot laces as the ski salopettes don't always have that detail and you can end up with snow going up your legs.

Bought a pair of Paramo Aspira salopettes (£220) about 13 years ago. #not-trousers.   Probably about 25-30 winter QMDs in them per year - at most 70p per donning so far.  Unfortunately no longer made (for you - pretty sure these will outlast me...) but http://www.cioch-direct.co.uk/waterproofs/salopettes.html

edit: hmm lavender...

The new model is called the Enduro and is of similar quality.

I've used paramo salopettes for winter climbing for about 15 years. Whatever paramo say they are NOT waterproof so there are better options it it's wet but for wearing in cold, snowy, windy conditions they are superb. They are also much more durable than many hardshell trousers. Definitely not a budget option though.

Snap. I had the seat fabric replaced on mine for twenty quid and will get some years more wear out of mine.  

OP may find some second hand on eBay, or could try the wanted forum to bring the price down.

I can't recall ever being wet in them or cold (in the salopette/leg area anyway) - and I usually don't wear other trousers underneath, running tights if it's proper cold maybe. I trust them way more than any hardshell I've ever had.

I guess I'm probably thinking value rather than budget - not having to buy a pair of trousers to wear/complete the system and with a spool of nylon thread and a leather needle - infinite repairs...

I asked recently about the Simond options here: https://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/gear/scottish_winter_troos_-_which_simond...

I ended getting the Cascades, as I wanted something reasonably waterproof but not too expensive for when I inevitably stick a crampon through them. Not used them yet, but they seem quite good. Quite slim in the leg for the given waist size, which is good for technical climbing but means they definitely aren't an option for putting on part way through the day. Will be interesting to find out how breathable they are! https://www.decathlon.co.uk/p/men-s-mountaineering-waterproof-trousers-casc...

These ones also look/felt pretty good, but are less waterproof: https://www.decathlon.co.uk/p/men-s-mountaineering-trousers-alpinism-black/...

Thanks for all your suggestions and I'm still researching what is available before buying anything. Has anyone had experience of wearing the Resolve pants by Montane (https://montane.com/products/montane-mens-alpine-resolve-waterproof-pants) and if they would be a good buy as a hardshell?

Are people mostly wearing separate soft and hard shell combinations or a trouser that essentially does acts as both. 

also these ME Tupilak versions

https://www.trekitt.co.uk/clothing/trousers-shorts/mountain-equipment-mens-...

If i need to spend more money to get something that's going to last, be weatherproof, easy to get on/off over boots, include snow gaiters and have the movability to climb I will

After trying Gore-tex salopettes, Paramo and various combinations of walking trousers and waterproofs, I took a punt on a second-hair pair of Mountain Equipment G2, and I think they're brilliant. Waterproof enough unless it's absolutely shitting it down and a little bit of give in them, they also breathe pretty well.

You need leggings on underneath them and then you're good all day.

I tried the Decathlon ones, which are a similar vibe at a cheaper price, but the cut is incredibly slim and I am not.

Edit: they've also got internal gaiters but they drive me mad so I've zipped them out.

I've decided to go for the ME Tupilak linked in my previous post

After trying everything from school trousers through moleskin breeches to goretex for Scottish winter climbing, my favourite was skiing sallopettes from C+A Manchester for about £5.

The original pair was given to a volunteer worker going to help in Bosnia .

I tried new alternatives but settled again on some light quilted ski trousers, cost £15 around 2005.

Usually carry a light over trouser , as back up, but never had to use them. Not overwarm on the walk in and warm enough on a belay.

I think it really depends what you plan to do. I mainly climb steeper mixed and ice routes, and more often than not don't venture out on drizzly days when you have to leave the car below the freezing level. 

I've not worn hard shells in 12+ years!  I've had various "winter weight" softshell pants over the years, which I usually pair with some fleece leggings. With this combo I'm rarely too to, too cold, wet.  It just works, is relatively cheap, repairable, stretchy and comfy.

However, if you want to, or need to go out in proper mingin weather it would maybe be better to go full hardshell.

I'm currently using the Rab Ascendor Alpine which seem to fit the bill nicely, but I've not had enough days in them yet to give the full thumbs up. Nothing to fault them yet.

Lucky you, I’ve been soaked in my paramo sallies.  Yet other friends report the ‘bone dry’ story.  So I think it’s not unreasonable for Dave to forewarn people considering them that they may not perform as might be hoped. But they do perform very well.