UKC

I am not a Bristol resident so I can't say if this is a good or bad thing, but presume locals would like to know: 

Indoor climbing wall group sells off Bristol sites after 17 years - Business Live https://share.google/znsgsP2ylxsTiUF9V

Becoming a bit of a Monopoly. Good luck to Bloc.

The Mothership, downstairs, is my least favourite wall in Bristol.  And too many problems that are just too steep.  I far prefer the more open aspect of Bloc.

Dave

And Flashpoint Swindon sold to Rockstar... :/

The reason for the upheaval being that none of the sites really make any money, and they definitely won't once TCH drops in Bristol. Potentially very sad for climbing centre diversity depending on what happens to them.

Why aren't they making money? The walls in Bristol are some of the busiest I've been to. 

That’s interesting. I went to TCA Mothership for the first time in March this year and thought downstairs was some of the best setting I had seen in years. 
It was like going back to a wall in the nineties, hard and powerful but interesting and technical, without the runny jumpy parkour style.

Most walls in the south east tend to favour the more modern compy style. Some is fun, but, as predominantly an outdoor climber, I do prefer more setting like downstairs in the mothership.

Big news. 

I am amazed that The Climbing Hangar thinks there is a market for yet another bouldering wall in Bristol: https://www.theclimbinghangar.com/bristol-coming-soon#:~:text=Introducing%E....

(and I see it will have a Kilter Board, Tension Board and strength training gym).

I'd guess that when you go they're busy as it's peak time, but at other times they're much quieter.

There's also the rising costs that are affecting all businesses right now, which I'd imagine is squeezing what was already a pretty thin profit margin.

It wasn't the route setting that i didn't like - it was the steepness and also the gloominess of the place.  The wildly overhanging walls meant i often struggled to do more than a few moves.  Yes, I'd like to be stronger but I'm not 25 any more....

Dave

PS.  I really enjoy the modern walls and think they have improved my climbing by improving my technique, rather than by helping me grow bigger muscles.

sadly I don't think that they think there is room for another either. I suspect they think they can put one of the others out of business

It’ll be interesting to see what happens. A wall without parking set within a horribly grim part of town is hardly going to take most people who need to travel to the gym/don’t want to go through a particularly dodgy part of town at night. 

TCA Bristol was a terrible wall. Dirty and crap holds. Lets hope it gets a make over.

Probably the best in the south of the country 

Why would the profit margins be slim? Flashpoint is £16 a pop with about 300 customers and 3 members of staff at peak times. Even off peak it's never empty given the large student population.

I get why roped climbing walls might have high costs from insurance, health and safety issues, replacing ropes, paying for specialist staff with rope access skills etc. But bouldering walls seem like they should be making a killing with the prices they charge these days - and the explosion of demand since Free Solo and Toby's Olympic win etc. 

What am I missing? Are there massive hidden costs I'm unaware of?

What interests me is why Flashpoint think they can see a commercial opportunity in the two walls when (presumably) TCA can't make a go of them.  Maybe they bought them relatively cheaply and intend to close the Mothership, hoping that many of the users will move to the current Flashpoint wall at Templemeads.

It seems like a solid business move to me. If you ignore the unattractiveness of the Hanger location for drivers you know that the new Hanger is going to be competing on the price of their monthly membership. You can compete with them on price which with them being backed by venture capitalists seems unwise. Or you compete on value and variety. Four walls for one membership seems an attractive proposition for me.

Is this just an example of the market for climbing expanding into the gym arena? There are plenty of gyms in the centre of town with no parking. Hopefully this will increase the customer base rather than cannibalising customers from the existing walls.

As part of a large group you would have thought the Hanger would have a pretty good idea by now of what makes a good location.

As an out of towner, I simply wouldn't go to the hanger. I have to drive over so a wall in the middle of an area with zero parking/parking at cost in a multistorey plus a walk seems like its pointless. I'd rather go to Bloc for bouldering, or UCR or Redpoint for lead. Both the Mothership and Flashpoint arr IMO some of the dirtiest, grottiest walls I've been to, and I have Frome Boulder wall near me so those options aren't really worth the hour drive and the extra money.

They have certainly expanded the customer base a lot in Liverpool where they started. I suspect the majority of people climbing there are only climbers because of it's existence. You always see lots of beginners, and lots of young people who just climb indoors with friends for fun. And as a paying parent I know they must make a killing from kids groups at weekends (and the food and drinks bought at the same time). The setting at the one near me is great so they attract committed climbers too, but I suspect that's not where the most money is made.

How much do you think it costs to set up a bouldering wall?  I reckon that's a pretty massive cost, though not exactly hidden!

Not sure why you've put insurance down as a specific cost to roped walls. I expect that insurance costs for bouldering walls are comparable (I wouldn't even be astonished if they were higher).

Accidents are certainly more common - whether that leads to more, or more expensive, claims though I wouldn't like to say.

That's very much the case with the new Hangar in Sheffield I think.  They don't seem to have made a significant dent in the custom at the Depot, and they in turn didn't seem to have a long term effect on the busy-ness of the Works.

It doesn't seem to be a zero-sum game, and contrary to comments above I don't think even the most ruthless investor would consider it worth the cost and the risk of setting up a new wall anywhere they thought their success depended solely on nicking customers from existing ones.

Yeah I was thinking that too - I've seen at least one case of somebody becoming paralyzed by having an accident at a London wall and anecdotally I've heard staff at The Castle say they have more accidents on the bouldering walls than the roped areas...

I don't recognise this characterisation of the new Hanger location on Union Street as being in a dodgy part of town. It's just the city centre, there's a Waterstones opposite it?

The no parking thing will just mean a different crowd go. There are a lot of offices around there, plenty of people cycle to work in Bristol and almost every bus in the city has a stop within 10 minutes of there.

Yeah, for me I need to decide whether I prefer to drive to Redpoint on a day I'm working from home or go to this new one on a day i am in the office in the centre. I assume there are lots of people who work some days of the week in the centre who would be in a similar position.