UKC

Don't ask me why, but there are definitely a few 'magic grades', and for reasons I find hard to explain - E3 is one of them. The quality of the routes at this grade in Pembroke is exceptional, with some of the finest routes anywhere, and they come thick and fast.

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In reply to UKC Articles:

Great list. Somehow, a lot of the great Pembroke E3s are steep, whereas there are more great E4s and E5s which are face climbs (though there are plenty of steep ones as well of course).

Alien World looks like a good adventure - it’s been vaguely on the list but will bump it up! Plane sailing is definitely on the list but there are still a few straight up offerings (to the Demon on Stackpole) left to do there and good conditions at accessible times are rare… traversing that break with any grease is going to be a mare! Will have to check out the Penally routes one day.

Got the new guide book. The photos and expanded selection are great. Ogmore looks interesting…

In reply to UKC Articles:

Copied from my comment on the E2 article thread. The fact (insofar as such things can be considered facts) that all of the routes mentioned are great, Rob’s actual list adds a handful more and there are plenty of other gems out there, just goes to show what an amazing climbing area this is (that’s not to diminish the stature of various other amazing climbing areas!)  

Wonder what the E3 list will look like. I reckon:

Zeppelin, Swordfish, Pleasure Dome, Gravy Train, Test Case

Next 5 - Stargate (or perhaps Galaxy for something a bit esoteric but brilliant), Deep Throat, Rollerwall, Mysteries.

Not done Wavelength but looks great. Not done Kitten Claws but it gets a good billing - though I’d argue that slabs aren’t really what Pembroke is all about.

The Leap really needs a top quality E3! Strap Up is good but not top 10 quality. Same for Ghost Ship and Mysteries.

Someone might cause mischief by adding Bloody Sunday. E4 in my book…

In reply to Misha:

Alien World is excellent. Its also possible to swim in and set up a Tyrolian traverse for the second and the rest of the gear to allow access earlier if tides are not ideal (or to beat other teams if its popular!)

Defiantly one of the best routes I've done at Pembroke.

Defiantly one of the most unlikely at the grade routes around as well. It looks totally unbelievable that it would go at E3.

In reply to UKC Articles:

IMHO Sunlover is harder now that the block has shifted, on account of risk of falling onto the block rather then into space should you mess up the sketchy moves with semi blown Rock 4 placement above the initial Entrance exam.

How could you miss out Deep Throat and Mysteries?

In reply to UKC Articles:

Can I be the first to preempt the next instalment?

Which Hunt, Meet the Monster Tonight.  Both done on the same day after "warming up" on Pleasure Dome, a memorable day trip to Pembroke and one of my best ever climbing days.

Star Wars - maybe should be in the E3 section?

In reply to Misha:

Bloody Sunday and Star Wars were the glaring omissions from Rob’s great feature. I’d add Conscientious Objector too

In reply to Matt Clifton:

Indeed but hasn't CO fallen down?

In reply to Pedro50:

Doesn’t stop it from having being one of pembroke’s finest e3s. Just that it’s more a series of boulder problems on the beach now

In reply to UKC Articles:

They’re really trying to flog the new guidebook with this series of “Finest routes”. By the time they get to E10 I think I can be confident of the list at least.

In reply to Matt Clifton:

Bloody Sunday is not E3… Star Wars, possibly…

In reply to kevin stephens:

E4 - Hyperspace (if it’s E4 - I think E5), Bloody Sunday, Tangerine Dream, Downward Bound, Salty Dog (not done it but it’s at Stackpole and so must be brilliant!). 
 

Next 5 - Meet the Monster Tonight, Witch Hunt, Suspense, Airship (it’s kind of upstaged by Zeppelin but still brilliant, struggling to think of more but must be loads more out there I’ve not done eg Wallbanger.

Star Wars if it’s E4.

In reply to UKC Articles:

I wrote an article on UKC, a long time ago (you can find the link in my profile), which was mostly about "getting better". And one of the main motivations for "getting better" was to be able to do these routes. 

Before I moved abroad, I only managed to tick a handful of the climbs mentioned in this article (and its siblings covering E1 and E2). But reading them makes me want to come back and do more!  

In reply to Misha:

Bloody Sunday just gets E4 due to greasy dangerous start, I think Witch Hunt is much better.  Star Wars should really be E3, and as such would be top 5

In reply to kevin stephens:

That start is quite tricky even when mostly dry (I guess it’s rarely bone dry) as the holds are fairly water worn (and perhaps getting a bit polished). I just love the way it flows nicely. It’s also my first proper E4 and I’ve done it a few times since, so perhaps I’m just biased! Witch Hunt is good fun though. 

In reply to Misha:

I've always been put off my witch hunt due to the reputation of the peg and that some people suggest it's more like E5 because of this. Am I overthinking it? How replaceable is the peg out of interest?

In reply to UKC Articles:

There's one pretty consistent link between most of these routes... a certain Mr Littlejohn and his legendary forearms...

In reply to duncan b:

I fell off onto the peg a few years back. It was rusty, presumably worse now. Not sure about replacing (a knifeblade from memory) but seem to recall there was other gear albeit the fall would be bigger. 

In reply to duncan b:

I’d say E5 without the peg, as Misha writes there’s other gear but, that which is reliable, is a bit lower - safe enough but a bigger fall. I think WH is rather cruxy; that, together with the naff peg, puts it quite far from one of the best in the Leap for me.

Please don’t even consider replacing the peg. That’s just a naff thing to do.

(Edit: sp. punc.)

In reply to Still-Graham:

I vaguely remember a nut placement higher and well to the right of the peg which seemed good but would have led to a big swing if falling off the leftward moving crux section. I quickly clipped the peg as I passed it without a close inspection. I had spent time watching others climb it so had a reasonable idea of where to slap for in the scoop at the end of the crux. This was a very long time ago so my memory may not be that accurate. 

In reply to Still-Graham: 

I get where you're coming from but Pembroke pegs do get replaced. I know for a fact that they have been on tide rising and zeppelin. Also, I think pegs may still be being used on first ascents in the modern era. I recall ecstasy has a wobbly peg on it, presumably placed by the first ascensionist in 2002? Why do you think witch hunt is different? 

Regardless, thanks to you and everyone else for the witch hunt beta. 

In reply to Still-Graham:

Although it is one of only six Pembroke routes in Extreme Rock 2, along with Darkness at Noon which I always fancied but likely too hard for me.

In reply to kevin stephens:

It was in the original and there is the grade distribution to consider. DaN is a really great route; and in these books it’s a compromise to avoid splitting routes across too many crags (which increases your word count as you have to include more crag text per route). There probably isn’t a better E4(ish) in the Leap. That would be my guess as to why it was retained.

In reply to Still-Graham:

Meet the Monster Tonight was very good, probably towards the other end of E4 than WH

In reply to duncan b:

They shouldn’t be but I can hardly argue against something that people don’t openly propose.

In my opinion fixed/in-situ pegs shouldn’t be; it’s just (IMO) short-sighted, selfish naffness. There is actually a 2014 BMC position statement on pegs, see https://services.thebmc.co.uk/use-of-pegs-in-british-climbing--bmc-position...

I don’t. However, WH was a product of its time. I think it should not have its peg replaced because I feel it is unnecessary. Others may feel otherwise but I think the discussion should be open and a decision reached on a consensus basis - rather than someone smashing in a new peg on the sly.

No worries, I don’t think it’s bad for E5 and I think Kevin is right about a higher nut in the groove (think I placed a couple) but I was less convinced how good they were - but it would be more of a pendulum onto them so perhaps they’d be fine.

In reply to kevin stephens:

I’m gonna say I was being a bit harsh on WH, the West Wall is just phenomenal and the runnel features on WH are especially funky.

In reply to Still-Graham:

Fair enough and thanks for the well argued response. Rest assured,  I won't be hammering a peg on the sly. Well not now anyway when there's an online paper trail leading back to me 😉