UKC

Back in the 70s, the government published a booklet called 'Protect and Survive', which described the precautions we could all take in the event of an imminent nuclear war.

One of the gems that provoked much hilarity was the suggestion we should all whitewash our windows. Haha haha haha!

Except ... the flash from a nuclear explosion precedes the blast, so the whitewash would provide considerable protection against blindness and burns, before the following shock wave blew the windows out. So ... perhaps not such stupid advice after all.

Awesome. So I wouldnt be blinded by the flash but just by the glass splinters ripping through my face?

Perhaps rather than whitewash it would be better to suggest something which might counter the shock wave as well to some degree?

Possibly hiding inside a fridge since the Indiana approach might be more motivating than skipping all the whitewashing etc and just bending over to kiss your arse goodbye.

I seem to remember you were supposed to build a blast shelter in the house, use a door as a lean to or something and pad it out with stuff forming a thick protective layer (earth etc)- a bit like the army individual protection kits. The whitewash was for the flash. 

don't forget a supply of plastic wrapping so you can put the parcelled dead outside to prevent disease.

presumably the Runrig song is based on that title?

Ah well, you'll note I said the windows would be blown out ... IIRC they can usually resist incoming pressure (they're designed to cope with wind) but in the following vacuum they get blown out, because they're not designed for that.

Obviously you're better off with NO nuclear explosion, but if there's likely to be one - consider the advice carefully before dismissing it out of hand.

Under the stairs was the recommended location- safest part of the house (apparently.) (Though not in a Wimpey home, obviously.)

there is going to be a very short time between the flash and the blast wave.  Perhaps the flash might not blind you if you had whitewash on windows and you were outside the blast shelter but not actually looking at the windows at that moment?

Then you'd at least be able to find the blast shelter in the moments before the shockwave came?  Assuming you could make sense of what was happening

I don't pretend to be an expert on the subject, and I'd rather not become one either!

I just thought it was an interesting example of advice that is easy to mock, but may not be so daft after all 

(Of course, the whitewash would also massively reduce the number of fires that the initial flash would cause as well )

the real question is would you be any better off surviving initially?  "Threads" tried to answer that ...

We were told we would get 8 mins warning. I remember often trying to work out just where I could get to that was safe within that time frame when I was out and about. Generally there wasn't a lot of choice..... If there was a pub nearby it would have given you just about enough time to sink a quick pint. They were scary times if you thought too much about it.

Time is an illusion. Lunchtime doubly so...

I don't think it's any less scary now, it's just they've stopped bothering with the ridiculous advice!

If anyone's not read this or seen the film it's a great, if depressing, read/watch - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/When_the_Wind_Blows_%28comics%29

I was told that the military NBC suits were just body bags, in the event of a nuclear strike, saves all the rotting corpses lying about

Brilliant film... Was really struck by this aged about 14. Funny in parts, but bleak in others. Any one who's seen the Snowman knows that Raymond Briggs nails sad endings. 

As a kid of about 9, I read Children of the Dust and it haunted me.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Children_of_the_Dust_(novel)

For years afterwards I feared imminent nuclear war, death and destruction at just a moment's notice, but was struck by reading it how in many ways death was better than survival...

Good cheery times (before Brexit and Covid!)

Jesus. Threads. Stuff of nightmares or what? 

I used to wonder same but nothing in the lyrics suggests it.

Actually you're not wrong. IIRC it was inspired by the building of a missile facility on North Uist.

Truest words were from Krushchev: “ the living will envy the dead”.

Wouldn't really work as they were just a thin layer of charcoal impregnated on to paper/cotton and were more for chemical as opposed to nuclear.
Get them wet and the charcoal would essentially dissolve and leave the wearer with a black residue all over their inner clothes, etc.
One trick was to purposefully wash your Noddy Suit beforehand so that didn't happen on exercise.
The Russian ones I believe were rubber based which must have been absolutely horrendous to wear for any length of time.
Mask in time, mask in nine... 
 

It was four minutes, but remember, there would have been an obvious escalation beforehand so there would have been a good chance that most people would be at home waiting for the inevitable because by that stage martial law would have been activated.
 

In reply to Rob Exile Ward:

Posted at 00:11, it has all the hallmarks of one of those late night inebraposts.

This is on point though:

youtube.com/watch?v=n36IA0c7eOU&

Back in the early 70s my school had a film society one of the shows was a Peter Watkins double bill "Culloden" and "The War Game"

This was still banned by the BBC and not shown until 1985

As  the Rugby Radio Station which used to transmit to the UK submarine fleet, was approx 12 miles away from where I live in one direction and MOD Kineton ammunition depot, the same distance in the other way; I don't think hiding under the stairs or table would've helped me much

I saw the fairly shocking Culloden on TV at home when I was at school.

I missed "The War Game" but caught up with it at the Hack Green nuclear bunker a few years ago.  As well as seeing that you can have the very eerie and unsettling experience of sitting in a dark concrete blast shelter with a dim electric light that is on the blink and a fizzling static carrying speaker straight out of 1984 waiting for a simulated blast that will come at some time within the next minutes after you enter.

It is pretty thought provoking to be in there thinking what it would be like in the real event.

The darkened underground hospital ward complete with horrible moaning from radiation casualties is fairly stark too.

when you park on arrival you get what sounds like a genuine announcement over the tannoy that a missile attack is imminent and that the outer blast doors will be closing in a very short time ...

the rotating large radar antenna gives that sense of urgency

The Noddy suits were mainly seen as a way of preventing contamination from fallout, rather than protection from direct radiation (not that the average NBC instructor knew that).

Also the 1959 Book/Film "On The Beach" by Nevil Shute. Sobering reading/watching in the early 60s

it's worth reading about Tsutomu Yamaguchi

he survived witnessing both the Hiroshima bomb and Nagasaki

i'd put in a wikipedia link if i knew how...

I live on a boat and don't have any stairs. What should I do? Will the 4mm steel afford me enough protection, or am I going to end up a twisted mess between two sheets of twisted metallic mess?

Stupid question, really. Should obviously buy an entrenching tool and dig in everywhere I go!

Approximately equivalent to 1mm of lead in terms of shielding. Radiation from the blast drops off rapidly with distance (inverse square law), and hypothetically standing a mile from ground zero at Hiroshima when the bomb went off you'd only get the equivent to a CT scan in terms of direct radiation dose.

If your boat survives the blast, fireball and shockwave you'll be fine*

*Unless it's a neutron bomb. They were designed as an anti tank weapon. Neutron irradiation of steel causes the formation of cobalt 60, which means your boats going to be very, very radioactive...

If you want properly depressing watch Threads. It's even set in Sheffield

I grew up between Farnborough and Camberley. I remember us musing at sixth form on the number of high value military targets around us; Aldershot, Sandhurst, Church Crookham, RAE, Burghfield, etc. and trying to estimate the optimum strike point for an airburst warhead.

If you remember the preferred locations you can check it here.

https://nuclearsecrecy.com/nukemap/

Factor 50 all day sun cream

Crewe got a mention. Presumably vaporised.

The first fall-out dust
settles on Sheffield.
It's an hour and 25 minutes
after the attack.
An explosion on the ground at Crewe
has sucked up this debris
and made it radioactive.
The wind has blown it here.

It worked out just fine for those nice old people in When The Wind Blows so I guess it was good advice

You say that as if being set in Sheffield isn't depressing enough in itself...

Well, the good news is that Crewe got vaporised...

Come friendly bombs and fall on Slough! It isn't fit for humans now ...

a friend of mine was involved in devising and programming computer scenarios for NATO wargames where the top brass/politicians played Nuclear War games

I seem to remember him telling us about the wrong tape being loaded at the wrong time causing some kind of incident.  This was a long time ago (1970s/80s?) and he's pretty old now so who knows ...

What a blow to the UK's rail infrastructure - effectively cutting the country in half! I'm sure Reading and it's ancient monasteries wouldn't have been of much interest to the Soviets so you'd have been quite safe...

Reading is a major rail interchange, too. And has its own significant targets nearby... The Abbey got it thanks to Henry VIII... its just a few flint wall cores left now.

Fair enough.

Those leaflets were something else. Ours was kept under the stairs. My father said in the event of a strike he'd euthanise us. Tough love and this was another time.

I think disarmament is eminently sensible.

Don't be so sure. Russian FSB types apparently love visiting Salisbury on their days off to admire the architecture. I bet they'd kill for a few days in Reading.

Lucky you didn't grow up in the 1970s

You know what I mean you facetious git 😜

I guess he's referring to this incident: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_nuclear_close_calls#9_November_1979

Have to say I'm struggling to see the funny side of your post and the accumulating likes. Infanticide combined with nuclear war being patently unhilarious to anyone with even just an ounce of decency.

I’m reminded by a young ones episode, where Neil painted himself white, to protect himself from the flash of a nuclear wepon which had somehow fallen through the roof the shared house.

bless

I don’t think much has changed since then.

This kind of thread always gets me pondering my mental plans for a proper blast and fallout shelter - buried, reinforced, metal lined, bottled air to give positive pressure for a week and battery / post EMP installed solar + hand cranked HEPA for a month, a good supply of needful things.  If I was carefree and single, it would see me through to a world of opportunity - worst case I die later than I would have done without the shelter.  

Seen from the perspective of looking after a family, I’m not going to build the shelter.  The weapons are still there.  Several of the nuclear states are significantly less rational than they were.  Que sera, sera, and I can understand where your father was coming from.  I suspect the air burst over Newcastle would get us so I don’t need to worry about it.

Narrowboat?  Convert it to be submersible; water tight seals, bottled air and oxygen, CO2 scrubbers, ballast tanks, snorkel with HEPA filter with battery and hand crank options.  Then submerse yourself under the water, ideally in a full lock or under several meters of ocean.  

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tsutomu_Yamaguchi

Yes thanks for reminding, as some forget the Nuck days are with us sorry behind us 

I pray

Ah! OK. Just back from Uist and learned about the range. I didn’t realise the song was connected. It’s South Uist though - just south of Berbencula.

"Punching a shark on the nose and sticking your thumbs in it's eyes"

I'm sure it probably is good advice, if you are Mike Tyson or a dry stone waller.

"If a dog is attacking you, pull it's front legs apart"

Again, having seen youtube videos of fighting dogs attacking other dogs/humans, I suspect our ability to pull this off to be remarkably slim.

At the time, Threads caused more of a sense of dread in me than anything in the news.

They haven't really changed except we're no longer regularly primed to expect it.

jk

An interesting self defence technique that combines causing intense pain to an already aggressive dog whilst simultaneously bringing your body in close proximity to it's teeth...

Combat and Survival Magazine (remember that from the 80s?) led me to believe that the best course of action was to pad your weaker forearm with your jumper and encourage the dog to clamp on to it so that you can safely and effectively bludgeon the dog over the head with your stronger arm with that convenient & pocket-sized cudgel that you never leave home without (!!!) 

I find that a pocket full of scoobysnax a far superior method of control when dealing with off lead doggos on my daily traipse around the parish.

Whilst on the subject of inappropriate advice here's a classic from the early days of South Parks. (Seems all the more inappropriate given what's going on in La Palma... Sorry about that!)

youtube.com/watch?v=x5lv-56_KHk&

Erm..I'm just pleased to see you...

I understood the technique is to render the dog unconscious as swiftly as possible, not causing them to collapse in fits of giggles. 😉