UKC

Remember the frog sitting in water and the temperature slowly rises till its too late?

Well the water is bubbling and Putin should have been dealt with a long time ago, preferably by his own Party.

Colin Furze on YouTube has a great video about building a bunker.

Just need a sponsor, 12 million subs and two years to create a bunker.

And a tie

Apparently this is a myth and a frog will jump out of water if slowly heated (don't try this at home).

So it turns out, the chap who did the original experiment removed the frog's brain. Don't ask how a frog stays alive without a brain or what he was trying to prove.

I suspect this is why you got so many downvotes. Making false claims about frogs.

I dunno, no-one's doing drills like they were in the cold war.

I think everyone is just too tired and/or farked off.

Step 1. Assume the blast position: Head between legs and kiss arse goodbye.

What kind of drills?

Yes there are a few old ROTOR with their funny bungalow in use and people have been seen around at least one of those (on south coast) recently, also Pindar, High Wycombe etc are presumably being hoovered, polished and stocked with big roll and tea bags, but there aren't actually so many places extant to drill, not like they used to be.... Even the great Burlington (or however you want to call it) is sitting a shadow of its former self. There's little to drill!

Normally, when something remarkable is happening, like a novel pathogen or the moon landings, hordes of delusional naysayers come crawling out from beneath whatever rock they live under, making out that it's some global conspiracy or other. Where are they now I wonder, because "nuclear weapons are a fictional construct designed to preserve the world order by proliferating fear" is something my enfeebled mind could buy into!

And not one of those Safety clip-on ties either.

Waste of their time, and stupidity on their part then because I can't see the voting.

If they disagree then tell me and enter into a discussion because otherwise they are just pissing into the wind voting on something that I can't see.

Never actually noticed you could turn it off. 

I've often felt that to downvote you should have to provide a comment. But then the amount of comments I would get would be unmanageable I suppose. 

Bunker no use, no ROC anymore no civil defence infrastructure so just hope the unexpected sunrise is on you or not too far away

You could always take up residence at Hack Green or buy yourself some IPKs and learn how to use them ha ha

I don't see a problem.  Plenty of humans appear to survive without brains.

Currently Russia has a "special military operation" to Ukraine, but any conflict (by and large) is not happening in Russian territory. So attacks on Russian troops in Ukraine are outside Russia and not a direct attack on Russia

But now... Putin plans to formally announce the annexation of Eastern Ukraine following a "fair and impartial vote" that people there want to be part of Russia. Once he has done that he will claim that Eastern Ukraine is in fact Russian territory, as that's what annexation is.

Once it is "Russian Territory" he will obviously claim any fighting there is fighting in Russia to "defend the Russians and Russian territory" and that "Russia is under attack". This will in the eyes of the Russian media justify *anything* including full mobilisation, declaring NATO is attacking Russia itself - and so justify any means for Russia to "defend itself" from NATO's (and the Ukrainian Nazis) attack, including Nuclear "self defence".

Annexation will by far the biggest escalation since the invasion started, he knows exactly what he's doing.

I don't think this will result in nuclear attacks on NATO countries however, far more likely to result in nuclear attacks on Ukraine.

The question then is how does NATO respond. I suspect we will see an escalation of the types of weapons NATO countries supply to Ukraine, if Ukraine still has the will to fight.

I don't believe we will see NATO countries fighting in Ukraine as a response to a Russian tactical nuclear attack on Ukraine and certainly not attacking Russia directly.

In other words, Putin can pretty much do what he wants. 

Not any more. And that's the scary thing. Putin either backs down or this goes nuclear. 😯

I agree that the Kherson etc 'referendums' are a worry, but there have already been multiple attacks on Belgograd area (definitely in Russia) and Crimea (which Russia has already annexed).  The annexation of new territory doesn't seem to give them any excuses for escalation which didn't exist before.

Not just any tie though, a safety tie.

Wow, Putin's  "trouble" stirring has gone into overdrive, unprecedented levels. By an amazing unlucky coincidence Nordstream 1 *and* Nordstream 2 suddenly developed leaks, AFAIK there were no seismic events. Sabotage is being speculated. Who could be sabotaging Russian interests like that, who could be so dastardly? (sarcastic question)

Now, not sure how many folk here are familiar with a Russian "survey ship" called the Yantar, it is a very interesting ship. For scientific research and the benefit of humanity it surveys the oceans. Oddly... by total coincidence clearly... it has spent a lot of time surveying in the same areas as other countries deep telecoms cables. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_research_vessel_Yantar

So where is our friend the Yantar? has it been recently, surveying the Antarctic? Looking about the depths of the pacific? Discovering deep trenches and catching lots of fish?   Some kind of fault has meant it's "transponder" (AIS) has been offline for a while, where could it be now. Anyone want to take a guess..?

https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2022/sep/27/russia-ukraine-war-live-...

"Swedish seismologists registered explosions near the Nord Stream pipelines – reports

The Swedish national broadcaster SVT is reporting that seismologists registered explosions near the Nord Stream pipelines in the last 36 hours. "

And just to add some more papier mâché to my tinfoil hat, several drones of unknown origin have been buzzing North Sea and Norwegian Sea oil installations during the last week. 

One of the explosions on Nordstream registered at 2.3 on the richer scale apparently. 

Yes but... firstly I can't see Putin courting war with NATO, it'll be 'Ukrainian aggression' in 'Russia', not NATO. There is no win possible for Putin against NATO, he doesn't want to start that one any more than anyone else.

So confining ourselves to Ukraine, sorry 'Russia', what next? We'll see how effective the mobilisation is, if they're as poorly equipped and deployed as their more regular cousins, it seems they'll just be mouths to feed for one side or the other depending whether they're sent forward to be captured or not. And with autumn upon us as the land gets boggy Russia's supply lines will become better defined, easier to disrupt with Ukraine's new longer range capabilities. I doubt the manpower will help Putin much in pressing forward. It might consolidate physical control of the new territory and that might be what he'll settle for. But Ukraine won't.

Next option? An escalation of the hidden/economic war against Europe in the hope of pressuring Ukraine to settle for losses in the east? Maybe if a long hard winter plays ball. It's not obvious we won't double down in response though.

A diversionary curveball, a limited operation on the border of Lithuania or Moldova/Transnistria? Risky and to what end other than maybe to expose weakness which may or may not be present in Euro/NATO resolve, to prompt infighting which may simply turn out to be fighting! Also, are they capable?

A nuclear strike. On what, to what end? It'd be in Ukraine or on any assets Ukraine has remaining in the Black sea. Destroying Kyiv's command and control capability would require a big hit on Kyiv and it probably wouldn't work, Ukraine has had years to prepare and extensive preparations from earlier conflict. Also after a hit on Kyiv, what next. Maybe it beheads the government, almost certainly not. Striking directly at those in power is unlikely to prompt them to negotiate when the threats of further strikes arrive. So a strike on a small-medium, military heavy Ukrainian settlement as a show of intent and capability followed by holding further populations hostage under a nuclear hammer? Maybe, it seems like one of the few options which might for now at least settle the new border. NATO wouldn't respond directly in retaliation or to provide direct aircover and the time to channel a meaningful non-nuclear response through Ukraine's forces could be limited by Putin, he'd set the pace of strikes and threats. Putin is already a pariah, does he have the authority to make his whole regime so?

My guess for what little it's worth is the annexation and mobilization is about moving back toward an entrenched stalemate, no peace, just a tightly contained long thin border war the west will eventually tire of bankrolling. Holding what remains of the Russian gains in the South and East. The nuclear-defence sabre rattling is part of that forcing Ukraine to second guess themselves, maybe give up their momentum but I suspect for now we're still looking at a bluff. They've had many an attack on 'Russian' soil as pretext for escalation to date, they don't need to fabricate new opportunities. If Russia and Ukraine can cool this all down in the coming years then Russia is back toward normal relations with the world in no time. If they stamp Ukraine into the ground with nuclear aggression then all bets are off I'm not sure even China, India or the myriad smaller nations with no love for European power will stand by them as protectors or clients.

jk

Belgorod in Russia has come under attack a dozen times or more since the invasion started.

Crimea, annexed by Russia 8 years ago, is constantly coming under attack.

There has been no escalation for either of these.  No justification given for a nuclear self defence - although state TV is calling for nukes to fly for any reason imaginable with no connection to Russian doctrine...

I suppose one might think the media aren't encouraged to report attacks on Russian territory (legitimately held or not) and that other territory is needed that's less embarrassing to have attacked, so that attack can be publicised to justify retaliation.  It's all getting more than a bit convoluted at this point.

The difference is that the Crimean 'operation' was a 'success' - Putin didn't 'lose' anything - he set out to annex Crimea and managed it enough. It's not the same now - if he gets pushed back out of Ukraine or near to, his grip on power and reputation will be diminished. This then becomes unknown territory in terms of his potential behaviour afaik.

source?

https://defense.info/re-shaping-defense-security/2022/09/drones-operating-w...

thanks.  that is interesting and a matter of concern.

I could well see escalation by Russia as consisting of a series of unfortunate events

It's been widely reported that the USA has given warnings of major response if Russia used a nuclear weapon.

My guess (based on nothing whatsoever) would be massive cruise missile strikes on ever significant Russian combat unit operating in Ukraine and possibly use of USAF drones over Ukraine to stop anything else moving about. 

There are probably enough sensible people on the Russian side to resist a nuclear strike order being carried out (they have been making a big point of maintaining regular contact with their American counterparts with regards notifications). 

A bigger risk in my view would be a conventional strike on a Ukrainian nuclear power plant causing fallout and mass panic but falling short of a nuclear strike.

There was an article linked on the other thread (?) that made a good case for USA/NATO using cruise missiles in huge force to completely cut off Crimea, which would make Putins objective null and void, and demonstrating what could be done even without nuclear.

And the good citizens of Ukraine were convinced Putin was all bluster. I think Mr lemming has a point. But then with imminent disaster on all fronts I wonder if it's not denial but resignation in the face of catastrophe. 

Given how crap his army is I feel that his nukes have probably not been looked after so that if he did have to press a button that they would explode underground.

A wise frog might regard the voting system as a form of thermometer that allows them to test the "temperature of the water" when posting on a forum

Putin doesn' t need to nuke UK. Tory gavernment is a walking WMD

It is more toxic than what is stored at Sellafield.  It has done far more damage to this country than Al Quaeda or Saddam Hussein ever did.

Not related in the thread but interesting anyway. An old ROTOR station (Skendleby) has been converted into a data centre and my previous work had presence there. The bunker itself is largely as it was and they have only converted 1 floor into data centre works. We had a good look about one day and found a broadcasting studio and switchboard still intact from back in the day. 

Great for looking around - less great for carrying 100KG SANS into.

Just when you need an aircraft carrier..oh wait ours is in the dock.

It can keep the 6 Type 45s company… Or have they managed to make any of them go yet?

Plenty naval SF between denmark, Sweden and the fins. The danes are rather cutely called Frogmen. 

Uk waters should be easier as a Russian flagged fishing boat will stand out like a dogs di.... not so easy in the Baltic where they are russian ports etc..

I remember having a friend studying honours physiology at uni, in the days when vivisection was still uncontroversial. He used to talk with unsettling glee about the decerebrate frogs and rats used for their lab work. Apparently if you leave the brain stem intact the frog/rat will “live” for several hours, longer than the lab experiment at any rate.

Just make sure your house is tidy and all will be fine!!!!!!!

youtube.com/watch?v=pGJcwaUWNZg&

We're doing ourselves a favour. The world will be a much better place without us.

Looking at the blast damage to the roofs, the scruffy house sits between the tidy house and ground zero; seems like this might have been a rigged test.  If you can believe such a thing.

I think the difference between houses would be the least of your worries, if you were sat in either house you're cooked. 

The condescending tone of the commentary is something else! Don't worry about the nuclear war just make sure the neighbourhood looks good.

For sure; I just have an issue with people biassing experiments to support their unrelated agendas…. The idea that the conditions of a nuclear test were dictated by a pre-conceived distaste for “slums” and for people who *gasp* leave their newspapers out on the coffee table is not how science is supposed to work…

Unbelievable, it's like a modern day parody piss take of a 60's "public service" film. Just feels so alien that it's actually being serious.