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There is definitely a discourse in climbing that technique > power. It's all about footwork, body position and if you want to climb well then try to climb like a woman.
I realise that fingers play a very large part and not just shoulders. However, I'm curious if there's any relation between number of pull ups someone can do and their climbing ability. As a metric I would like to choose 'regular redpoint sport grade' the kind of difficulty you would expect to redpoint in a day (possibly two) but certainly not be a freak project because it suits your style. The pull ups should be wide grip, palms facing away.
I can squeak out 10 pull ups and climbing about 6c/+
Anyone an outlier? eg 2 pull ups and climbing 7c or 50 pull ups but disco legging on 5's?
I realise that fingers play a very large part and not just shoulders. However, I'm curious if there's any relation between number of pull ups someone can do and their climbing ability. As a metric I would like to choose 'regular redpoint sport grade' the kind of difficulty you would expect to redpoint in a day (possibly two) but certainly not be a freak project because it suits your style. The pull ups should be wide grip, palms facing away.
I can squeak out 10 pull ups and climbing about 6c/+
Anyone an outlier? eg 2 pull ups and climbing 7c or 50 pull ups but disco legging on 5's?
1
In reply to Kemics:
I suspect regularly doing pull ups will quickly lead to an increase in the number you can do, so the results will be impacted by whether people actually do pull up exercises. I don't and so can only manage about 10. I don't put in all day red pointing sessions on sport routes either but a few goes will get me up 7a+ or 7b, I guess higher if I actually spent a day or two. The only siege style redpointing I do is dry tooling, where I've done M8, if that's any use for your survey! So I suspect my climbing level is relatively high compared to pull ups ability. Anyway, I'm mostly a trad climber, where technique, stamina and size do cojones are far more important!
I suspect regularly doing pull ups will quickly lead to an increase in the number you can do, so the results will be impacted by whether people actually do pull up exercises. I don't and so can only manage about 10. I don't put in all day red pointing sessions on sport routes either but a few goes will get me up 7a+ or 7b, I guess higher if I actually spent a day or two. The only siege style redpointing I do is dry tooling, where I've done M8, if that's any use for your survey! So I suspect my climbing level is relatively high compared to pull ups ability. Anyway, I'm mostly a trad climber, where technique, stamina and size do cojones are far more important!
In reply to Kemics:
Red pointed 7c, maybe 20 pull ups if I'm lucky. Back in the day, when VS was a big deal, I reckon I could have managed 30.
Red pointed 7c, maybe 20 pull ups if I'm lucky. Back in the day, when VS was a big deal, I reckon I could have managed 30.
1
In reply to Kemics:
Here's an old post from Dave MacLeod about how few pull-ups he could do at the time - http://www.onlineclimbingcoach.blogspot.com.au/2007/12/24-pull-ups.html
Here's an old post from Dave MacLeod about how few pull-ups he could do at the time - http://www.onlineclimbingcoach.blogspot.com.au/2007/12/24-pull-ups.html
In reply to robin mueller:
Interesting. More than 20 pull ups appears to be irrelevant, but I think the main thing it says is that the sample size was too small. Shame, as some effort has clearly been made.
Interesting. More than 20 pull ups appears to be irrelevant, but I think the main thing it says is that the sample size was too small. Shame, as some effort has clearly been made.
In reply to Kemics:
When I led Our Father I could just about squeeze out one pull up. I started training and got up to about eight, knackering both elbows in process.
Chris
When I led Our Father I could just about squeeze out one pull up. I started training and got up to about eight, knackering both elbows in process.
Chris
In reply to Jonny2vests:
Well the initial roof is very powerful, I spent an hour or so on it one day and eventually managed to do it. I came back the following week, did the start a couple more times then led the whole thing,
Chris
Well the initial roof is very powerful, I spent an hour or so on it one day and eventually managed to do it. I came back the following week, did the start a couple more times then led the whole thing,
Chris
In reply to Kemics:
I can do 2 or 3 and when I actually take the time, have "redpointed" up to 6b+ (a few goes on a top rope or leading with rests; so I might be able to climb a bit harder if I spent a day working something).
I've been thinking of starting a thread about training for pull ups as I think I need to be a bit better to be more confident leashless ice climbing.
I can do 2 or 3 and when I actually take the time, have "redpointed" up to 6b+ (a few goes on a top rope or leading with rests; so I might be able to climb a bit harder if I spent a day working something).
I've been thinking of starting a thread about training for pull ups as I think I need to be a bit better to be more confident leashless ice climbing.
In reply to Kemics:
Almost no correlation whatsoever is my guess. They domy really matter. My pb for pullups was in the run up to an ice trip, I could do about 18 and climb about 6a/b. I don't have a bar any more but might squeak 10 on the big holds on a newsmaker and in 1-2 days I'd hope to do 7b+/c depending on style.
Almost no correlation whatsoever is my guess. They domy really matter. My pb for pullups was in the run up to an ice trip, I could do about 18 and climb about 6a/b. I don't have a bar any more but might squeak 10 on the big holds on a newsmaker and in 1-2 days I'd hope to do 7b+/c depending on style.
In reply to TobyA:
I did loads of weighted pullups on ice axes as my most dedicated phase of ice climbing training - enough weight that I could do 3 pullups or so. I also did weighted frenchies, enough that I could do one (3 pullups with the 3 positions of lock).
Offset pullups might be helpful too.
That does you a strength phase. Then, remove the weight and start doing interval sets, with insufficient rest, say half a dozen a minute for 20 minutes or a set every 30s aiming to do 5 minutes, ditto maybe a frenchie a minute or something depending on your level. That shwould get the endurance working relatively well.
I guess for you actual climbing probably takes away a lot of the need for specific endurance training allowing you to mainly focus on strength...?
I did loads of weighted pullups on ice axes as my most dedicated phase of ice climbing training - enough weight that I could do 3 pullups or so. I also did weighted frenchies, enough that I could do one (3 pullups with the 3 positions of lock).
Offset pullups might be helpful too.
That does you a strength phase. Then, remove the weight and start doing interval sets, with insufficient rest, say half a dozen a minute for 20 minutes or a set every 30s aiming to do 5 minutes, ditto maybe a frenchie a minute or something depending on your level. That shwould get the endurance working relatively well.
I guess for you actual climbing probably takes away a lot of the need for specific endurance training allowing you to mainly focus on strength...?
In reply to AJM:
I remember Steve Bancroft demonstrating one finger pull ups on either hand when I could just do a full hand one arm pull up. Mind you Steve could climb a bit and he was a skinny bugger.
I remember Steve Bancroft demonstrating one finger pull ups on either hand when I could just do a full hand one arm pull up. Mind you Steve could climb a bit and he was a skinny bugger.
In reply to Chris Craggs:
Similar tale , did Rat Race early 70s then a few days later bumped into friend who was going to train at YMCA , went along and found I could not do 1 pullup .
Similar tale , did Rat Race early 70s then a few days later bumped into friend who was going to train at YMCA , went along and found I could not do 1 pullup .
In reply to Kemics:
Would hope to crack 6c in a day, can probably do 5 chin ups before my elbows start hurting!
Would hope to crack 6c in a day, can probably do 5 chin ups before my elbows start hurting!
In reply to Kemics:
Hey dude, long time no speak.
I've not redpointed properly at all. The nearest I got to redpointing was having a go on a 7a+ at ban-y-gor and not managing to lead it, hvaing a go on top rope and blasting through the crux only to wrong hand myslef. I went home after but do think that at that time I could have climbed it in a day. At that point I could do 7 pull ups.
PS if you fancy a redpointing weekend in the Wye valley at some point I can make the journey
Hey dude, long time no speak.
I've not redpointed properly at all. The nearest I got to redpointing was having a go on a 7a+ at ban-y-gor and not managing to lead it, hvaing a go on top rope and blasting through the crux only to wrong hand myslef. I went home after but do think that at that time I could have climbed it in a day. At that point I could do 7 pull ups.
PS if you fancy a redpointing weekend in the Wye valley at some point I can make the journey
In reply to Kemics:
Pull-ups are very specific. I hadn't done any for years (a few years ago I could do about 20 I think) and could do a handful when I tried this autumn. I did them twice a week for 3 weeks and then I could do 15. No impact on climbing throughout this.
Pull-ups are very specific. I hadn't done any for years (a few years ago I could do about 20 I think) and could do a handful when I tried this autumn. I did them twice a week for 3 weeks and then I could do 15. No impact on climbing throughout this.
Post edited at 08:43
In reply to Jonny2vests:
Not at all. The main pitch is quite short and powerful, with a decent rest in the middle - that's if eyeballing the shit-looking peg doesn't interfere with your resting!
At the time I did it, I used to crank out three sets of 10 pullups on the swings, every time I passed Endcliffe Park, i.e. every day, often several times. After doing OF and some stuff at Curbar on a cold, miserable day, I came back, feeling pumped and tired. Just out of interest, passing by, got on the swings - no difference! (So I was climbing nowhere near my physical limit? Or, as AJM suggests, pullups are pretty irrelevant??)
Could do 15, hang there, do another five, hang there, squeeze out another three to five, pretty well irrespective of grade. Certainly, for me, I don't think they're very relevant.
Mick
> Surely the main qualification for that is being long.
Not at all. The main pitch is quite short and powerful, with a decent rest in the middle - that's if eyeballing the shit-looking peg doesn't interfere with your resting!
At the time I did it, I used to crank out three sets of 10 pullups on the swings, every time I passed Endcliffe Park, i.e. every day, often several times. After doing OF and some stuff at Curbar on a cold, miserable day, I came back, feeling pumped and tired. Just out of interest, passing by, got on the swings - no difference! (So I was climbing nowhere near my physical limit? Or, as AJM suggests, pullups are pretty irrelevant??)
Could do 15, hang there, do another five, hang there, squeeze out another three to five, pretty well irrespective of grade. Certainly, for me, I don't think they're very relevant.
Mick
In reply to Kemics:
7b and at a guess 5-10 pull-ups though it may be more, I've not tried for years.
jk
7b and at a guess 5-10 pull-ups though it may be more, I've not tried for years.
jk
In reply to Kemics:
With a day or two to redpoint one route I could probably pull off a 6b+ to 6c. There isn't much difference between my redpoint and onsight grades as I tend to either be able to get something first or second go or not at all no matter how much I try it. I can do about 10 pull ups. Better hip flexibility would do far more for my climbing than being able to do loads of pull ups.
With a day or two to redpoint one route I could probably pull off a 6b+ to 6c. There isn't much difference between my redpoint and onsight grades as I tend to either be able to get something first or second go or not at all no matter how much I try it. I can do about 10 pull ups. Better hip flexibility would do far more for my climbing than being able to do loads of pull ups.
In reply to turtlespit:
I can't say I've ever found my ability to do pullups useful, but then I don't climb at those kind of grades. That said, I do have a setup at home where I can do ice axe pull ups, which I find genuinely useful. I'm particularly interested in what Dave has to say about practising pullups on different kinds of grip. He said something similar to me at a bouldering workshop last year - I still can't even do 1 on a sloper.
I can't say I've ever found my ability to do pullups useful, but then I don't climb at those kind of grades. That said, I do have a setup at home where I can do ice axe pull ups, which I find genuinely useful. I'm particularly interested in what Dave has to say about practising pullups on different kinds of grip. He said something similar to me at a bouldering workshop last year - I still can't even do 1 on a sloper.
In reply to Kemics:
2 day redpoint grade is F7b. At the moment I can do 20 pull ups. Can do one arm pull ups on a jug.
When my RP grade was 6b+ I could do 30 pull ups.
Sometimes pull up strength comes in handy but I think it's really all about technique, fingers and core.
2 day redpoint grade is F7b. At the moment I can do 20 pull ups. Can do one arm pull ups on a jug.
When my RP grade was 6b+ I could do 30 pull ups.
Sometimes pull up strength comes in handy but I think it's really all about technique, fingers and core.
In reply to Kemics:
10 when climbing 7a.
BUT doing lots of pull ups at the moment - in fact training to do one arm pull up - due to a move to a country with no rock. What is clear from that is it is doing very little for fingerstrength. To me, that is the important factor in climbing.
10 when climbing 7a.
BUT doing lots of pull ups at the moment - in fact training to do one arm pull up - due to a move to a country with no rock. What is clear from that is it is doing very little for fingerstrength. To me, that is the important factor in climbing.
In reply to Martyn Maltby:
I can do about 3 or 4 and climb (indoor) 6a. Might prove your point - certainly lack of arm/grip strength[1] does limit what I can do on overhangs.
[1] Or more specifically power-weight, I'm no weakling but I'm also rather heavy.
Neil
I can do about 3 or 4 and climb (indoor) 6a. Might prove your point - certainly lack of arm/grip strength[1] does limit what I can do on overhangs.
[1] Or more specifically power-weight, I'm no weakling but I'm also rather heavy.
Neil
Post edited at 09:40
In reply to Kemics:
I recently took part in a study measuring how strengths / weaknesses across your physiology affect climbing grade. Although the full results have not yet come back it was suggested that strength generally and also, surprisingly, finger strength were not necessarily determinative in relation to your climbing grade when taken objectively.
It was suggested you only have to be strong enough to cope with the loads determined by your own body composition and it follows that anything beyond that may in fact be dead weight.
This should be taken with a pinch of salt as the full results aren't back yet. However, it is interesting from the perspective of this debate.
PS. I can do 26 pull ups and have only climbed F7A+ / E3 (though I suspect I'm capable of more with just a little work on power endurance as the tests revealed my power output drops by as much as 50% in less than 20 seconds of continuous effort).
I recently took part in a study measuring how strengths / weaknesses across your physiology affect climbing grade. Although the full results have not yet come back it was suggested that strength generally and also, surprisingly, finger strength were not necessarily determinative in relation to your climbing grade when taken objectively.
It was suggested you only have to be strong enough to cope with the loads determined by your own body composition and it follows that anything beyond that may in fact be dead weight.
This should be taken with a pinch of salt as the full results aren't back yet. However, it is interesting from the perspective of this debate.
PS. I can do 26 pull ups and have only climbed F7A+ / E3 (though I suspect I'm capable of more with just a little work on power endurance as the tests revealed my power output drops by as much as 50% in less than 20 seconds of continuous effort).
In reply to Kemics:
Don't sport or trad climb but can boulder up to Font 7C on a good day. I reckon I can manage about 10 pull-ups, probably no more and definitely no one-armers.
Don't sport or trad climb but can boulder up to Font 7C on a good day. I reckon I can manage about 10 pull-ups, probably no more and definitely no one-armers.
In reply to AJM:
I'm embarrassed/intrigued to ask - what is a frenchie, weighted or not?
Your training sounds a bit hardcore for me considering my general rubbishness at pull ups on a bar, but I can easily set up my tools to hang under our stairs https://twitter.com/TobyinHelsinki/status/267771359453671425 (that was last autumn but winter came quickly and I never did that many as I got to climb outside plenty!), so was thinking I can do hangs, and maybe offset pull ups or moves between handles etc. I might need some bungees to foot stirrups though at least to start with pull ups?
> I also did weighted frenchies, enough that I could do one (3 pullups with the 3 positions of lock).
I'm embarrassed/intrigued to ask - what is a frenchie, weighted or not?
Your training sounds a bit hardcore for me considering my general rubbishness at pull ups on a bar, but I can easily set up my tools to hang under our stairs https://twitter.com/TobyinHelsinki/status/267771359453671425 (that was last autumn but winter came quickly and I never did that many as I got to climb outside plenty!), so was thinking I can do hangs, and maybe offset pull ups or moves between handles etc. I might need some bungees to foot stirrups though at least to start with pull ups?
In reply to Kemics:
Usually redpoint F7b/+ in a day and have redpointed a few F7cs.
12 pullups, 14 is the best I've ever managed.
Usually redpoint F7b/+ in a day and have redpointed a few F7cs.
12 pullups, 14 is the best I've ever managed.
In reply to Kemics:
I think there'll be no correlation until you hit about font 8a - i.e. the point at which natural ability on its own becomes insufficient to feed improvement.
I think there'll be no correlation until you hit about font 8a - i.e. the point at which natural ability on its own becomes insufficient to feed improvement.
In reply to TobyA:
Start from straight arms (well, slight bend in the elbows but you know what I mean) hanging, pull to the top of the bar, lock for 5 secs, lower to straight arms, pull to the top, lower to arms at 90 degrees, lock for 5 secs, continue to arms straight, pull to the top, lower to 135 degrees, lock for 5 secs, return to hanging. Basically 3 pull-ups, with each pull-up containing a 5 second lock - first at the top, second at 90, third at 135.
As with all training, it depends what you lack as to how your time is best used - if you're relatively ice fit already then using bungees or foot loops to do longer time period lower intensity stuff won't help as much as doing high intensity stuff with weights added, and vica versa if you can already crack out one armers but only hang on for 10 seconds. Only you really know if you're let down by strength or fitness.
I used to have slings set up in a similar way to your picture, clipped into the hole in the blade of the axe.
Start from straight arms (well, slight bend in the elbows but you know what I mean) hanging, pull to the top of the bar, lock for 5 secs, lower to straight arms, pull to the top, lower to arms at 90 degrees, lock for 5 secs, continue to arms straight, pull to the top, lower to 135 degrees, lock for 5 secs, return to hanging. Basically 3 pull-ups, with each pull-up containing a 5 second lock - first at the top, second at 90, third at 135.
As with all training, it depends what you lack as to how your time is best used - if you're relatively ice fit already then using bungees or foot loops to do longer time period lower intensity stuff won't help as much as doing high intensity stuff with weights added, and vica versa if you can already crack out one armers but only hang on for 10 seconds. Only you really know if you're let down by strength or fitness.
I used to have slings set up in a similar way to your picture, clipped into the hole in the blade of the axe.
In reply to Kemics:
Numbers as requested: A month ago I could crank out 40 odd pulls without breaking a sweat, and was climbing low 6s. Then I stopped doing pull ups and started climbing more often and am now happy on mid/high 6s and might fancy a 7a after a few tries, depending on style. I suspect I'd struggle to do 30 pulls now.
My thoughts: In my opinion I don't think being able to do more than ~15 pulls is advantageous over having good technique, flexibility, ability to utilise rests, good CV for efficient recovery, not over-gripping, slick clipping etc.
I also think it's much easier to train to do more pulls than it is to train to push your grade.
Numbers as requested: A month ago I could crank out 40 odd pulls without breaking a sweat, and was climbing low 6s. Then I stopped doing pull ups and started climbing more often and am now happy on mid/high 6s and might fancy a 7a after a few tries, depending on style. I suspect I'd struggle to do 30 pulls now.
My thoughts: In my opinion I don't think being able to do more than ~15 pulls is advantageous over having good technique, flexibility, ability to utilise rests, good CV for efficient recovery, not over-gripping, slick clipping etc.
I also think it's much easier to train to do more pulls than it is to train to push your grade.
In reply to Kemics:
don't climb sport much outdoors, but I've climbed 6c+ in a few goes. Indoor I 'redpoint' 7a+/7b. I can do about 10 pull ups on the beast maker jugs
don't climb sport much outdoors, but I've climbed 6c+ in a few goes. Indoor I 'redpoint' 7a+/7b. I can do about 10 pull ups on the beast maker jugs
In reply to Ben Snook:
Not for me - I seemed stuck on 20 - 25. Could never get beyond this.
Mick
> I also think it's much easier to train to do more pulls than it is to train to push your grade.
Not for me - I seemed stuck on 20 - 25. Could never get beyond this.
Mick
In reply to Kemics:
I'll throw in an outlier; 8 wide-arm pull-ups, "Euro" f8a+ in a day or two.
There are some neat correlations between "number of XXX" and your on-sight sport grade (resistance based route) - but pull-ups ain't gonna be one.
XXX could be = moves on "the lattice board" - can be seen behind Tom Randall's head at the start of the Wideboyz video - an assessment tool for the British team and Tom's fee paying clients. 70+ moves = 8a on-sight.
XXX could also be = moves on Steve Golley's "frog board". Search the UKB wiki and you'll find a nice neat chart showing on-sight sport grade v. moves v. angle of the board.
I'll throw in an outlier; 8 wide-arm pull-ups, "Euro" f8a+ in a day or two.
There are some neat correlations between "number of XXX" and your on-sight sport grade (resistance based route) - but pull-ups ain't gonna be one.
XXX could be = moves on "the lattice board" - can be seen behind Tom Randall's head at the start of the Wideboyz video - an assessment tool for the British team and Tom's fee paying clients. 70+ moves = 8a on-sight.
XXX could also be = moves on Steve Golley's "frog board". Search the UKB wiki and you'll find a nice neat chart showing on-sight sport grade v. moves v. angle of the board.
In reply to Kemics:
I don't redpoint, but I climb on sight at around 6c or E3 5c/6a. I can do 5 pull ups before i need a breather. When I was a skinny nipper I used to be able to do 20 or so. I wasn't any better at climbing then (30 years ago)
I don't redpoint, but I climb on sight at around 6c or E3 5c/6a. I can do 5 pull ups before i need a breather. When I was a skinny nipper I used to be able to do 20 or so. I wasn't any better at climbing then (30 years ago)
In reply to phil456:
Pull-ups covers a range of exercises, and depending on which and how strict you do them you'll get a massive range of answers as to how many people can do.
If people do palms facing them and do some half ones that look like bicep curls 20 is kind of easy.
Palms away, full extension arms, no body movement, chin above bar. 20 of them would be *very* good.
Pull-ups covers a range of exercises, and depending on which and how strict you do them you'll get a massive range of answers as to how many people can do.
If people do palms facing them and do some half ones that look like bicep curls 20 is kind of easy.
Palms away, full extension arms, no body movement, chin above bar. 20 of them would be *very* good.
Post edited at 12:58
1
In reply to Kemics:
20 pull ups and ~7c redpoint.
To add some more anecdotal evidence, there was a good article in one of the mags a few years ago about strength vs climbing ability. At the end was a little chart of number of one armers vs. max grade, the sample was a selection of proper strong people (i.e. 8B+ bouldering and/or 9a route), there was no real correlation, some could squeeze out 8-10 one armers, some just the one and several couldn't even do a single one. To use some actual examples, Dave graham couldn't do one for a long time (not sure if he's upped his game recently) and Adam Ondra is pretty shit at them (couldn't do one for a long time, there's a vid of him doing a couple of very sloppy ones recently) and they're certainly pretty strong when it comes to actual climbing.
20 pull ups and ~7c redpoint.
To add some more anecdotal evidence, there was a good article in one of the mags a few years ago about strength vs climbing ability. At the end was a little chart of number of one armers vs. max grade, the sample was a selection of proper strong people (i.e. 8B+ bouldering and/or 9a route), there was no real correlation, some could squeeze out 8-10 one armers, some just the one and several couldn't even do a single one. To use some actual examples, Dave graham couldn't do one for a long time (not sure if he's upped his game recently) and Adam Ondra is pretty shit at them (couldn't do one for a long time, there's a vid of him doing a couple of very sloppy ones recently) and they're certainly pretty strong when it comes to actual climbing.
In reply to Kemics:
I¡¦m not convinced there¡¦s a huge link I can only manage about 8 now but climbing the best I ever have (onsight 7a and E3 this year) whereas when I was younger I could do loads more but was a VS climber. However when I try powerful bouldering like the Chrunet I think ¡V I could do all these problems if I could just lock off so I guess it depends on type of climbing your into.
I¡¦m not convinced there¡¦s a huge link I can only manage about 8 now but climbing the best I ever have (onsight 7a and E3 this year) whereas when I was younger I could do loads more but was a VS climber. However when I try powerful bouldering like the Chrunet I think ¡V I could do all these problems if I could just lock off so I guess it depends on type of climbing your into.
In reply to Kemics:
Redpoint grade 7a+; number of pull-ups probably about four.
Shane Ohly always claimed he couldn't do a single pull-up when he was climbing his best; not sure what sport grade that would have been but I'd imagine it started with an 8.
jcm
Redpoint grade 7a+; number of pull-ups probably about four.
Shane Ohly always claimed he couldn't do a single pull-up when he was climbing his best; not sure what sport grade that would have been but I'd imagine it started with an 8.
jcm
In reply to Kemics:
I agree with Franco. There is likely to be barely any correlation. Perhaps a product-moment correlation coefficient of 0.4? FWIW I can redpoint about 6c regularly and can do 9 pullups I think. I can do quite a few with just one finger from each hand though.
I agree with Franco. There is likely to be barely any correlation. Perhaps a product-moment correlation coefficient of 0.4? FWIW I can redpoint about 6c regularly and can do 9 pullups I think. I can do quite a few with just one finger from each hand though.
8 months climbing here. So probably not going to say much for the results.
Can do 30-35 pull ups like you've mentioned. 6a lead max at the minute sport indoor.
I am intrigued by this because the the stereotypical hardcore climber should be able to do a million pull ups. I guess It all boils down to climbing style also?
Can do 30-35 pull ups like you've mentioned. 6a lead max at the minute sport indoor.
I am intrigued by this because the the stereotypical hardcore climber should be able to do a million pull ups. I guess It all boils down to climbing style also?
In reply to Kemics:
I've always used pull-ups as part of my training, since before there were climbing walls to visit, and living most of the time too far from the real rock for an evening visit after work.
I've virtually never done a single set to exhaustion. Trying that now (at 63) without a very solid warm-up would guarantee injuries I'm sure.
What I do is a pyramid. 1 pull up, 30 seconds rest, 2 pull ups, 60 seconds rest 3 pull-ups 90 seconds rest etc up to 6, 7, 8, or 9 depending how fit I am, then back down to 1 again. (And if I've gone up to my limit, every set on the way down is a struggle - no pain, no gain they say!). All done palms away. Used to be on a scaffold bar across my loft access, now on the large finger holds on a BeastMaker 1000. Oh, and all those resting seconds are put to good use as well, tidying my room mostly!
I don't do much sport climbing, and none above 6b, but I've never seen the pull-ups as training for that. What they have given me is the confidence to hang around a bit longer, on big scaffold-bar-sized holds, when placing gear on steep trad. And I do have a rough grade equivalence in my head. Pyramid up to 6 = OK for VS, 7 = HVS, 8 = E1, 9 = E2 - never got beyond that.
So there's a slightly idiosyncratic answer to your question. I don't know anyone else who does this but it's worked for me.
I've always used pull-ups as part of my training, since before there were climbing walls to visit, and living most of the time too far from the real rock for an evening visit after work.
I've virtually never done a single set to exhaustion. Trying that now (at 63) without a very solid warm-up would guarantee injuries I'm sure.
What I do is a pyramid. 1 pull up, 30 seconds rest, 2 pull ups, 60 seconds rest 3 pull-ups 90 seconds rest etc up to 6, 7, 8, or 9 depending how fit I am, then back down to 1 again. (And if I've gone up to my limit, every set on the way down is a struggle - no pain, no gain they say!). All done palms away. Used to be on a scaffold bar across my loft access, now on the large finger holds on a BeastMaker 1000. Oh, and all those resting seconds are put to good use as well, tidying my room mostly!
I don't do much sport climbing, and none above 6b, but I've never seen the pull-ups as training for that. What they have given me is the confidence to hang around a bit longer, on big scaffold-bar-sized holds, when placing gear on steep trad. And I do have a rough grade equivalence in my head. Pyramid up to 6 = OK for VS, 7 = HVS, 8 = E1, 9 = E2 - never got beyond that.
So there's a slightly idiosyncratic answer to your question. I don't know anyone else who does this but it's worked for me.
In reply to JayPee630:
Yes that, to me, is a proper pull-up.
Mick
> Palms away, full extension arms, no body movement, chin above bar.
Yes that, to me, is a proper pull-up.
Mick
In reply to JayPee630:
I'm sure you're right and I guess we should have defined a 'proper' pull-up right at the beginning.
Back in the day, in backstreet bodybuilding gyms, anything less than near-perfect style was generally regarded with derision - flinging weights around versus doing things properly. It instilled a sense of discipline - do it properly.
Mick
I'm sure you're right and I guess we should have defined a 'proper' pull-up right at the beginning.
Back in the day, in backstreet bodybuilding gyms, anything less than near-perfect style was generally regarded with derision - flinging weights around versus doing things properly. It instilled a sense of discipline - do it properly.
Mick
In reply to Mick Ward:
Yeah, I'd only count dead hangs with no swaying the body, or at least as little as possible until you're approaching failure.
I think the maximum of those I've ever been able to do would be 14-15. I've never led anything harder than HVS 5a or 6b.
I think there's little connection myself.
Yeah, I'd only count dead hangs with no swaying the body, or at least as little as possible until you're approaching failure.
I think the maximum of those I've ever been able to do would be 14-15. I've never led anything harder than HVS 5a or 6b.
I think there's little connection myself.
In reply to JayPee630:
Yeah man. Palms out, arms beyond shoulder width, all the way up and down.
Been training bw+weights for years, powerlifting etc.
If we are talking dead hang wide arm pullups then over 20 good ones anyway.
Yeah man. Palms out, arms beyond shoulder width, all the way up and down.
Been training bw+weights for years, powerlifting etc.
If we are talking dead hang wide arm pullups then over 20 good ones anyway.
1
In reply to Martin Hore:
Used to do it regularly in the early 80s. PB was up to 10. Saw it back then as a way to "train" for steep stuff whilst training fingers on vertical brick edge walls. There have been better ways to actually train for steep stuff for decades now though.
(Still not many bettter was to train finger strength though, for those whose tendons actually survived. The rare occasions when I burn off Kids These Days at modern bouldering walls generally involve little tweaky crimps)
> I don't know anyone else who does this but it's worked for me.
Used to do it regularly in the early 80s. PB was up to 10. Saw it back then as a way to "train" for steep stuff whilst training fingers on vertical brick edge walls. There have been better ways to actually train for steep stuff for decades now though.
(Still not many bettter was to train finger strength though, for those whose tendons actually survived. The rare occasions when I burn off Kids These Days at modern bouldering walls generally involve little tweaky crimps)
In reply to Kemics:
Well I don't redpoint and am a bit inconsistent at times but I can just do 1 pull-up and have on-sighted 6c+ on rock. No idea what my average redpoint would be, having probably only actually had multiple sessions on one or two routes.
At over 2m tall with a positive ape index I suspect I'm an outlier though
Well I don't redpoint and am a bit inconsistent at times but I can just do 1 pull-up and have on-sighted 6c+ on rock. No idea what my average redpoint would be, having probably only actually had multiple sessions on one or two routes.
At over 2m tall with a positive ape index I suspect I'm an outlier though
In reply to Kemics:
I remember reading something by Stevie Haston a few years ago in a mag about his training when he was at his peak and he was doing something like 500-1000 pull ups a day as well as running up to the half way midi station ¡V something to aim for!
And I¡¦m sure in high fast and light Twight says the only way to be a better climber is by doing pull-ups until you pass out while someone throws breezeblocks at your face and fills your pants with ice cubes ¡V or something like that.
I remember reading something by Stevie Haston a few years ago in a mag about his training when he was at his peak and he was doing something like 500-1000 pull ups a day as well as running up to the half way midi station ¡V something to aim for!
And I¡¦m sure in high fast and light Twight says the only way to be a better climber is by doing pull-ups until you pass out while someone throws breezeblocks at your face and fills your pants with ice cubes ¡V or something like that.
In reply to Kemics:
I would guess, to almost guarantee, there is a correlation -- despite what you may find in the data on here. What you will miss in the comments people supply is the large body of people who spend most of their time in front of a television with almost no fitness level.
Generally as people are able to climb harder levels, they are over-all stronger, and fitter. Less body fat, more strength... and this will also correlate with the ability to do more pull-ups.
Me, I don't tend to red-point much, but if I did, it would be about the 5.10c/5.10d range (F6b) sport, or 5.9-5.10a trad (VS/HVS 5a). I tend more towards on-sight climbing. I can do about 3 hands-out full-length pull-ups.
I would guess, to almost guarantee, there is a correlation -- despite what you may find in the data on here. What you will miss in the comments people supply is the large body of people who spend most of their time in front of a television with almost no fitness level.
Generally as people are able to climb harder levels, they are over-all stronger, and fitter. Less body fat, more strength... and this will also correlate with the ability to do more pull-ups.
Me, I don't tend to red-point much, but if I did, it would be about the 5.10c/5.10d range (F6b) sport, or 5.9-5.10a trad (VS/HVS 5a). I tend more towards on-sight climbing. I can do about 3 hands-out full-length pull-ups.
In reply to Kemics:
I can do one pull-up on a good day and can usually manage a few 6cs indoors per session.
However, I boulder at a much lower level, so maybe I'm using technique for the routes and when it comes down to sheer hard moves, my power could do with some development.
Hmm. Maybe I'll try to get a few more in tonight!
I can do one pull-up on a good day and can usually manage a few 6cs indoors per session.
However, I boulder at a much lower level, so maybe I'm using technique for the routes and when it comes down to sheer hard moves, my power could do with some development.
Hmm. Maybe I'll try to get a few more in tonight!
In reply to Kemics:
Which arm are we doing the pull ups with? Has everyone quoted their max pull ups on the left or right arm?
Which arm are we doing the pull ups with? Has everyone quoted their max pull ups on the left or right arm?
In reply to JayPee630:
Adding no bend at hips and micro bend at the elbows; 20 strict/6c+
Trained to compliment climbing (i.e. emphasis on climbing sessions over PU sessions), there is potential for improvement. As a substitute, I would expect poor results.
> Palms away, full extension arms, no body movement
Adding no bend at hips and micro bend at the elbows; 20 strict/6c+
Trained to compliment climbing (i.e. emphasis on climbing sessions over PU sessions), there is potential for improvement. As a substitute, I would expect poor results.
In reply to Kemics:
I tend to agree with a few others on here that climbing grade is more technique, perhaps bouldering grade correlates more with pull ups
Although Id say chin ups (hand over the bar) not pull ups (hand under the bar). I think pull ups are fairly useless for climbing training compared to chin ups.
15 pull ups / 12 chin ups
Indoor grade 6b
I tend to agree with a few others on here that climbing grade is more technique, perhaps bouldering grade correlates more with pull ups
Although Id say chin ups (hand over the bar) not pull ups (hand under the bar). I think pull ups are fairly useless for climbing training compared to chin ups.
15 pull ups / 12 chin ups
Indoor grade 6b
Post edited at 19:46
In reply to owena:
I find your variation definitions ambiguous as they don't follow that normally recognised, best stick to palms facing or palms away from the person. Based on that, I think palms facing is really only good training for underclings?
> chin ups (hand over the bar) not pull ups (hand under the bar). I think pull ups are fairly useless for climbing training compared to chin ups.
I find your variation definitions ambiguous as they don't follow that normally recognised, best stick to palms facing or palms away from the person. Based on that, I think palms facing is really only good training for underclings?
In reply to frqnt:
variety is the spice of life
wouldnt it be boring if we were all the same and all spoke just one language?
variety is the spice of life
wouldnt it be boring if we were all the same and all spoke just one language?
In reply to Kemics:
underhand pullups 1
overhand 0
indoor sport have climbed up to 7a on the slight overhanging wall and 6c flash on the mega overhangs
bouldering, flounder on V3 overhangs but generally find slabs and vertical pretty straight forward
i'm a girl though so I guess I already climb like one
underhand pullups 1
overhand 0
indoor sport have climbed up to 7a on the slight overhanging wall and 6c flash on the mega overhangs
bouldering, flounder on V3 overhangs but generally find slabs and vertical pretty straight forward
i'm a girl though so I guess I already climb like one
In reply to Kemics:
5 pull ups on jugs (not tried flat holds) more or less consistently with pb 7
Have rp'd 3 7as outside this year and a couple of 6c+ but I don't climb out much.
5 pull ups on jugs (not tried flat holds) more or less consistently with pb 7
Have rp'd 3 7as outside this year and a couple of 6c+ but I don't climb out much.
In reply to Kemics:
When I trained I could do 60 pull ups and could rp 7a+. Now I just climb, can do about 10 pull ups and rp 7c...
When I trained I could do 60 pull ups and could rp 7a+. Now I just climb, can do about 10 pull ups and rp 7c...
In reply to Mick Ward:
That's pretty good. More than I have managed. Well done Mick (or should I say strong Mick) especially when you think it doesn't help your climbing.
> Not for me - I seemed stuck on 20 - 25. Could never get beyond this.
That's pretty good. More than I have managed. Well done Mick (or should I say strong Mick) especially when you think it doesn't help your climbing.
In reply to Kemics:
I have noticed that on very steep (say thirty degree overhanging) juggy routes at the climbing wall which have long moves between good holds, climbers who can't do a single pullup seem to struggle.
Rather than basic pullups, I would suggest doing finger tip pullups. If you can crank out twenty finger tip pullups, you'll be better equipped to climb up steep stuff. Also, lock-offs, deep lock-offs, finger tip lock-offs should all help with climbing steep stuff.
If you can easily manage twenty pullups, then I would think you would get greater benefit from working on one arm pullups (rather than trying to do more basic pullups). If you can manage a pullup just using the tips of your fingers of one arm and can then lock it at chest level, you will be seriously strong.
I have noticed that on very steep (say thirty degree overhanging) juggy routes at the climbing wall which have long moves between good holds, climbers who can't do a single pullup seem to struggle.
Rather than basic pullups, I would suggest doing finger tip pullups. If you can crank out twenty finger tip pullups, you'll be better equipped to climb up steep stuff. Also, lock-offs, deep lock-offs, finger tip lock-offs should all help with climbing steep stuff.
If you can easily manage twenty pullups, then I would think you would get greater benefit from working on one arm pullups (rather than trying to do more basic pullups). If you can manage a pullup just using the tips of your fingers of one arm and can then lock it at chest level, you will be seriously strong.
In reply to GeoffRadcliffe:
Or they could train technique, finger strength, or something more relevant like that. Just saying, like. Momentum and technique are the key to climbing overhanging stuff, not being able to do pullups by the dozen.
Looking at the respondents so far, Ally has topped it I think at 8a+ and 8 pullups or something - which suggests to me that being able to do 20 is probably overkill for anyone if the rest of your climbing is up to scratch.
Or they could train technique, finger strength, or something more relevant like that. Just saying, like. Momentum and technique are the key to climbing overhanging stuff, not being able to do pullups by the dozen.
Looking at the respondents so far, Ally has topped it I think at 8a+ and 8 pullups or something - which suggests to me that being able to do 20 is probably overkill for anyone if the rest of your climbing is up to scratch.
In reply to Kemics:
Not sure how many pull ups I can do these days at the age of 65, and to be honest I can't be arsed to find out, but I'm sure that the more I could do the better I would be on overhangs especially the ones where there is practically nothing for the feet. My confidence and abilities (f6b+ and E3) seem to just disappear in those situations and I end up floundering in a very inelegant way.
Not sure how many pull ups I can do these days at the age of 65, and to be honest I can't be arsed to find out, but I'm sure that the more I could do the better I would be on overhangs especially the ones where there is practically nothing for the feet. My confidence and abilities (f6b+ and E3) seem to just disappear in those situations and I end up floundering in a very inelegant way.
In reply to Kemics:
On UKB these were the provisional results of a survey put together and analysed.
http://imgur.com/a/4i9TP#23
Basically on exactly this question (pull ups v redpoint grade). No-one climbing 7c+ could do 20 pull ups, and one person/some people climbing F8b could do less than 10.
Similarly not really much correlation apparent on Boulder Grade vs pull ups. http://imgur.com/a/4i9TP#12
My conclusion would be to look at a lot of other things first before assuming pull ups are the answer to improving your grade. In my experience I've often felt it was strength holding me back, when the answer was trying a different body position or sequence.
If your technique is *perfect*, finger strength, core strength and bodyweight are more worth looking at than improving the number of pull ups you can do.
On UKB these were the provisional results of a survey put together and analysed.
http://imgur.com/a/4i9TP#23
Basically on exactly this question (pull ups v redpoint grade). No-one climbing 7c+ could do 20 pull ups, and one person/some people climbing F8b could do less than 10.
Similarly not really much correlation apparent on Boulder Grade vs pull ups. http://imgur.com/a/4i9TP#12
My conclusion would be to look at a lot of other things first before assuming pull ups are the answer to improving your grade. In my experience I've often felt it was strength holding me back, when the answer was trying a different body position or sequence.
If your technique is *perfect*, finger strength, core strength and bodyweight are more worth looking at than improving the number of pull ups you can do.
When I was going to the gym, and in the first few months of climbing outdoors, I could do 20+ pullups and on sight 6b/E1. Now without the gym/training exercise I can manage 15, but haven't been pushing my grade much more.
Being an avid trad climber and never really getting into sport, I find that strength probably helps me when I (all too often) freak out and end up hanging around looking for gear or psyching myself up for a move, but I'm sure my climbing would improve greatly with a better head/technique as opposed more strength.
Being an avid trad climber and never really getting into sport, I find that strength probably helps me when I (all too often) freak out and end up hanging around looking for gear or psyching myself up for a move, but I'm sure my climbing would improve greatly with a better head/technique as opposed more strength.
In reply to Kemics:
I don't think I can do more than 12 in a row. I've climbed sport 8a redpoint and 7b onsight, onsight E5 on 4 different rock types and headpointed E7 and bouldered 7c+. Sometimes I think the ability to do more pull ups would help but very rarely. More useful would be the ability to lock at 90 degrees on one arm which I cant do.
I would add though that I could do those 12 pull ups off a door frame as easily as a jug suggesting its my arms that are limiting not my fingers.
I don't think I can do more than 12 in a row. I've climbed sport 8a redpoint and 7b onsight, onsight E5 on 4 different rock types and headpointed E7 and bouldered 7c+. Sometimes I think the ability to do more pull ups would help but very rarely. More useful would be the ability to lock at 90 degrees on one arm which I cant do.
I would add though that I could do those 12 pull ups off a door frame as easily as a jug suggesting its my arms that are limiting not my fingers.
Post edited at 12:50
In reply to AJM:
I am not advocating doing lots of pullups. What I am saying is that being unable to do a single pullup will limit you on very overhanging stuff when you have to do long moves between good holds. I have seen numerous climbers who regularly climb 6c/7a struggle or fail on a steep juggy 6b due to lack of arm strength.
Rather than doing lots of pullups, I would suggest doing deep lock offs or work on pulling up on the very tips of your fingers on small holds.
> Or they could train technique, finger strength, or something more relevant like that. Just saying, like. Momentum and technique are the key to climbing overhanging stuff, not being able to do pullups by the dozen.
I am not advocating doing lots of pullups. What I am saying is that being unable to do a single pullup will limit you on very overhanging stuff when you have to do long moves between good holds. I have seen numerous climbers who regularly climb 6c/7a struggle or fail on a steep juggy 6b due to lack of arm strength.
Rather than doing lots of pullups, I would suggest doing deep lock offs or work on pulling up on the very tips of your fingers on small holds.
In reply to GeoffRadcliffe:
If u must do chin ups, uneven ones have far better specificity for climbing!
can normally do 15 in one set and climb around 7a.
I typically use too much upper body strength with feet being a second thought! Find it hard to reimprint my brain that it's feet,feet,feet!
> (In reply to AJM)
>
> [...]
>
>
> Rather than doing lots of pullups, I would suggest doing deep lock offs or work on pulling up on the very tips of your fingers on small holds.
>
> [...]
>
>
> Rather than doing lots of pullups, I would suggest doing deep lock offs or work on pulling up on the very tips of your fingers on small holds.
If u must do chin ups, uneven ones have far better specificity for climbing!
can normally do 15 in one set and climb around 7a.
I typically use too much upper body strength with feet being a second thought! Find it hard to reimprint my brain that it's feet,feet,feet!
In reply to Kemics:
Maybe x5 pull ups on a good day. Lead E1 5b, used to be E3 5c and still only 5 pull ups. Pull ups obviously useful, but over rated??
Maybe x5 pull ups on a good day. Lead E1 5b, used to be E3 5c and still only 5 pull ups. Pull ups obviously useful, but over rated??
In reply to Kemics:
last summer, the shit hit the fan(family related) and I started to do pull ups at work.started slowly, about 50 a day. in 2 months I was doing 300/8hours 5 days a week. this was before I started climbing. then in september I started climbing and in 2 months I was leading 6b's on the first go. few months into climbing I had to choose: climbing or pulls ups - my elbows just went and could not do 1 pull ups for a couple of weeks. at the moment Im doing 30 every morning and 100 one day of the week climging 6c-7a
last summer, the shit hit the fan(family related) and I started to do pull ups at work.started slowly, about 50 a day. in 2 months I was doing 300/8hours 5 days a week. this was before I started climbing. then in september I started climbing and in 2 months I was leading 6b's on the first go. few months into climbing I had to choose: climbing or pulls ups - my elbows just went and could not do 1 pull ups for a couple of weeks. at the moment Im doing 30 every morning and 100 one day of the week climging 6c-7a
In reply to GeoffRadcliffe:
Have you? By which I mean, are you a very good movement and technique coach and have been watching them fail despite perfect technique, good core engagement, optimal use of momentum and so on? We see everything through the prism of our own strengths and weaknesses after all. If you try and climb steep stuff in the same way you climb vertical walls them you need lots of arm strength and you're more likely to assume people fail because of a lack of strength.
Personally I'd spend the time working on technique, tactics and power. On sport, most of the time, I end up locking off or otherwise using buckets of arm strength because I'm clipping stupidly because I'm scared, am not doing the move right, am moving statically because I'm not confident enough to throw, am failing to commit because I'm scared or something like that.
If you ever think of a move you're failing on, think "if the handhold were 5x bigger could I do the move" - for me and I suspect most people the answer is usually yes. Which means it's rarely a weakness in the upper arms letting you down. So focus on something else instead. Fingertip pullups are all well and good but why not just deadhang, you isolate the fingers more effectively like that.
> I have seen numerous climbers who regularly climb 6c/7a struggle or fail on a steep juggy 6b due to lack of arm strength.
Have you? By which I mean, are you a very good movement and technique coach and have been watching them fail despite perfect technique, good core engagement, optimal use of momentum and so on? We see everything through the prism of our own strengths and weaknesses after all. If you try and climb steep stuff in the same way you climb vertical walls them you need lots of arm strength and you're more likely to assume people fail because of a lack of strength.
> Rather than doing lots of pullups, I would suggest doing deep lock offs or work on pulling up on the very tips of your fingers on small holds.
Personally I'd spend the time working on technique, tactics and power. On sport, most of the time, I end up locking off or otherwise using buckets of arm strength because I'm clipping stupidly because I'm scared, am not doing the move right, am moving statically because I'm not confident enough to throw, am failing to commit because I'm scared or something like that.
If you ever think of a move you're failing on, think "if the handhold were 5x bigger could I do the move" - for me and I suspect most people the answer is usually yes. Which means it's rarely a weakness in the upper arms letting you down. So focus on something else instead. Fingertip pullups are all well and good but why not just deadhang, you isolate the fingers more effectively like that.
In reply to Kemics:
last year I did lots of pull ups (approx 100 per week); this had no effect on my grade. This year I am mainly doing 'australian pull ups' instead of standard ones and have added two grades to my bouldering.
I still do some standard pull ups (but only 2-3 reps using tiny edges) and have also improved my footwork, but believe that the australian pull ups have contributed to my grade gain particularly on overhanging routes.
These pull ups help because they also work core muscles. I do 30-50 in a session and balance them out with push ups.
last year I did lots of pull ups (approx 100 per week); this had no effect on my grade. This year I am mainly doing 'australian pull ups' instead of standard ones and have added two grades to my bouldering.
I still do some standard pull ups (but only 2-3 reps using tiny edges) and have also improved my footwork, but believe that the australian pull ups have contributed to my grade gain particularly on overhanging routes.
These pull ups help because they also work core muscles. I do 30-50 in a session and balance them out with push ups.
In reply to AJM:
Actually, I spend much more time doing deadhangs (on various types of holds including slopers) than pullups. I just generally do one set of pullups to get warmed up followed by a couple sets of finger-tip pullups to get my fingers working. I do a few lock-offs as I find this helps when trying to do those long moves when it is 30 degrees overhanging or more (twisting the body helps a fair bit). Then there's campussing...
Finger strength is what I try and work on most of the time. But there are those times when having strong shoulders and good locking ability helps.
> Personally I'd spend the time working on technique, tactics and power.
Power. Now you're talking...> Fingertip pullups are all well and good but why not just deadhang, you isolate the fingers more effectively like that.
Actually, I spend much more time doing deadhangs (on various types of holds including slopers) than pullups. I just generally do one set of pullups to get warmed up followed by a couple sets of finger-tip pullups to get my fingers working. I do a few lock-offs as I find this helps when trying to do those long moves when it is 30 degrees overhanging or more (twisting the body helps a fair bit). Then there's campussing...
Finger strength is what I try and work on most of the time. But there are those times when having strong shoulders and good locking ability helps.
In reply to jkarran:
lets lower the tone
When Ken Wilson, Pete Gillman & myself interviewed Maestri in 1971, he informed us that he used to make love whilst doing press-ups.....
lets lower the tone
When Ken Wilson, Pete Gillman & myself interviewed Maestri in 1971, he informed us that he used to make love whilst doing press-ups.....
In reply to leo:
But with Maestri we don't know whether he was just making that up or just couldn't stop drilling stuff.
> When Ken Wilson, Pete Gillman & myself interviewed Maestri in 1971, he informed us that he used to make love whilst doing press-ups.....
But with Maestri we don't know whether he was just making that up or just couldn't stop drilling stuff.
In reply to Kemics:
What about number of pullups/pushups and ice/mixed climbing ability?
Gadd goes on about pullups and pushups lots for climbing ice.
r
What about number of pullups/pushups and ice/mixed climbing ability?
Gadd goes on about pullups and pushups lots for climbing ice.
r
In reply to Kemics:
When I started climbing I could do 50+ pullups and 100+ pushups. I struggled to climb 5+ when I started as I was heavy with muscle. Four years later, having given up the gym and JuJitsu, I'm 6c+ climber in the same gym and struggle to do 20 pullups and 50 pushups are a real struggle.
So for me losing 15kg(mainly of muscle), and a vastly improved technique outweigh (if you'll excuse the pun) brute strengh every time.
When I started climbing I could do 50+ pullups and 100+ pushups. I struggled to climb 5+ when I started as I was heavy with muscle. Four years later, having given up the gym and JuJitsu, I'm 6c+ climber in the same gym and struggle to do 20 pullups and 50 pushups are a real struggle.
So for me losing 15kg(mainly of muscle), and a vastly improved technique outweigh (if you'll excuse the pun) brute strengh every time.
In reply to Kemics:
I do Crossfit where it's not unheard of to crank out 100 kipping/butterfly pull-ups during a WOD(!) Strict pull-ups I could probably do 25-30 unbroken, don't redpoint but climb HVS/Font 6b.
I do Crossfit where it's not unheard of to crank out 100 kipping/butterfly pull-ups during a WOD(!) Strict pull-ups I could probably do 25-30 unbroken, don't redpoint but climb HVS/Font 6b.
I can probably only do 6 or 7 wide grip pull-ups (strict form) as they are not part of my training anymore.
Redpoint 6c
Edit: Being too strong when I started climbing was bad for my overall progression.
Post edited at 14:50
In reply to Kemics:
This is an interesting one! I have never been able to do either pull ups or proper press ups - so a zero for me... when I was climbing regularly I used to be at the 6b/6c mark.
Perhaps once you get a big enough study group, and having looked for the initial correlation split your results by males and females and see if a different pattern emerges? (I am a girl - and willing to bet there is more of correlation amongst males than females)
This is an interesting one! I have never been able to do either pull ups or proper press ups - so a zero for me... when I was climbing regularly I used to be at the 6b/6c mark.
Perhaps once you get a big enough study group, and having looked for the initial correlation split your results by males and females and see if a different pattern emerges? (I am a girl - and willing to bet there is more of correlation amongst males than females)
In reply to Kemics:
I think you'll find those who are able to do, or were able to do lots of pull ups will climb harder grades than those who have never been able to do many pull ups. And I don't think this is to do with strength gains from pull ups but more an indicator of the level of commitment and individual shows towards improving at climbing (even if slightly misguided).
A tighter correlation is likely between the amount of hang-boarding someone does and the difficulty they climb. This is likely both because hang-board sessions are a better climbing specific exercise but also because those who hang-board have shown greater commitment to their climbing improvement by learning about how to train effectively.
I think you'll find those who are able to do, or were able to do lots of pull ups will climb harder grades than those who have never been able to do many pull ups. And I don't think this is to do with strength gains from pull ups but more an indicator of the level of commitment and individual shows towards improving at climbing (even if slightly misguided).
A tighter correlation is likely between the amount of hang-boarding someone does and the difficulty they climb. This is likely both because hang-board sessions are a better climbing specific exercise but also because those who hang-board have shown greater commitment to their climbing improvement by learning about how to train effectively.
In reply to TobyA:
Yes...
I've climbed some 7a's and toproped numerous, so prolly could climb harder. And I can do 9 pull-ups. However, I can do 9 pullups with about 15kg on my rucksack, so I'm beginning to wonder if I happen to have one bit counter for pull-ups or if it is a mental block.
Yes...
I've climbed some 7a's and toproped numerous, so prolly could climb harder. And I can do 9 pull-ups. However, I can do 9 pullups with about 15kg on my rucksack, so I'm beginning to wonder if I happen to have one bit counter for pull-ups or if it is a mental block.
1
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